Chris Bosh budding SUPERSTAR

[basketball420]

I personally would not take 20 - 25 players ahead of him if we are talking character, willingness to learn, competitiveness, and overall skill.

[HiJiNX]

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vince carter was a "superstar" before the raps actually did any playoff damage. same with mcgrady and orlando. kg in minnesota. and even lebron before the cavs started making their recent playoff runs. a lot of it is image.

True. Image or playoff success will garner you superstar status I guess.

[Big_Dub]

as long as Sheed still plays, Bosh will always be one spot behind him!

Huh....

Speaking of Sheed, he has to be 1 of the biggest waste of talant ever to play in the NBA. Dude probably has top 5 talent in the league, he should be up there with KG and Duncan...

[davkad]

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If Wade is soo great, why can';t he carry his team to wins? I mean someone of his caliber as you claim, should have no problems carrying his to theplayoffs, so why isn't he doing that now?

the fact that you blame miami's failures on Wade shows that you must not watch the NBA on the whole, and only focus on the raptors. He just came back off of reconstructive knee surgery, and again he's the only real bright spot on the team. Their biggest moves of the year (beside the retirement or expiration of many rotational players) was to trade for Ricky Davis and sign Smush Parker who hasn't played for them at all - the bottom line is the team was riding Wade too hard, (even Shaq is just a waste of space now) and even a player of his caliber can't take the worst assembled roster in the league to the playoffs...

[REM]

He finally has his blow by first step. I remember at times last year he had to use the spin move so much because he couldn't blow by his man due to the P.F. This season he still uses the spin but as a last means. He's getting past people like we saw in his first all-star season.

[fimslim3]

You guys just realized Chris Bosh is one of the top 10 players in the NBA?

Are you serious? In no particular order (numbers are just for counting the number of players, not a ranking), players who are definitely better than Bosh (when healthy):
1. Kobe
2. Lebron
3. KG
4. Duncan
5. Nash
6. Paul
7. Amare
8. Dirk
9. Wade
10. Yao
11. Dwight
12. TMac

And players who are roughly on par with Bosh (when healthy):
1. Iverson
2. Melo
3. Kaman
4. Gasol
5. Big Al
6. Roy
7. Ginobili
8. Butler
9. Jamison
10. Arenas
11. Chauncey
12. Sheed
13. Pierce
14. Allen
15. Joe Johnson
16. Redd
17. Kidd
18. Carter
19. Richard Jefferson
20. Josh Howard
21. Marcus Camby
22. Baron Davis
23. Elton Brand
24. Iguodala
25. Shawn Marion
26. Kevin Martin
27. Boozer
28. DWill
29. Shard
30. Deng

Bosh is at best the 13th best player in the league, I'd probably put him around 15th-20th. For him to be top 10, you'd have to put him ahead of 3 of my top 12.
15th-20th in the league is still a great player, and he's young and can still get better and climb above that. But let's not overhype Bosh just cause he's on a hot streak.

I'm an unbiased Knick fan praising Bosh, let's take a look from the players I'd rather have ahead of Bosh...

1. Kobe
2. Lebron
4. Duncan
6. Paul
11. Dwight

Now, see who I took out? I took out KG, Nash, T-mac, Dirk, Yao, Wade, and Amare. Why? Sure KG and Dirk are better then Bosh at the moment. But you have a franchise player on your hands who is much much younger then the two of them the same goes for Nash. Are you telling me you would trade Bosh for Nash at the moment? NO, Bosh has many more seasons in the league. So you'd rather have him. I took out Wade because of his injuries, his play has also slipped recently, granted Shaq is no longer there but this isn't the Wade of two seasons ago. He looks so much more human. T-Mac is a loser, also older, not going to go into depth with him. Yao and Amare belong on the players on Par with Bosh, let's take a look at who I take out.

2. Melo
24. Iguodala
28. DWill
Adding: Amare and Yao (to be explain)

Again, any player drafted past the year 2000, I wont go into depth because I'd take Bosh over them because of the age difference. So we have Al Jefferson, whose put up good numbers on bad teams. Granted, it isn't his fault but what makes Jefferson better then Bosh? As for Roy, he's a two guard, good player, would you rather have a center or a shooting guard as your franchise player? How many good big men are there in the league? Not as many shooting guards, moving on. Caron Butler is having a fantastic season, but again, I play it by position. I wont start on Arenas, some team will give him a huge deal and overpay him, he has ego issues, he's a nice guy and all, he's just too much talk. I'll take the humble Bosh over him. Josh Howard, let's see him not on the mavericks. Joe Johnson, same position argument, unless I am getting a sure-fire hall of famer, alal MJ or Kobe, I'd want my franchise player to be a center or point guard. RJ, is a nice second option, but let's not get ahead of ourselves. Brand is hurt, Kevin Martin, nice shooter, but no where near the level of Bosh, reminds me of a poor man's Alan Houston. Boozer, nice offensive game and gets you rebounds, I question his defense. Shard, overpaid tremendously.

So now we are down to eleven players...

1. Kobe
2. Lebron
3. Duncan
4. Paul
5. Dwight Howard
6. Carmelo
7. Iggy
8. Deron
9. Amare
10. Yao Ming

Let's move Bosh into the top 10...
The above ten players and Bosh are the most appealing players in the league, considering the position they play, their current age, and the determination they have toward success. Why is KG not on the list you ask? As I've said before he's on the outside looking in on this list because he's no spring chicken. The Celtics would move KG for Bosh in a heart beat considering his age.

Take the ideal franchise players in the 90's; Hakeem, Ewing, Robinson, Shaq, Mourning...what do they all have in common? They all played the center position, they've all experienced major success, they all carried their teams through trials and tribulations but they also had a charisma about them, something unique..I don't see that in Deron Williams or Iggy. They are both talented players, but I don't see that personality in them.

As for Carmelo, he's not the greatest defender out there but a franchise player should have the ability to make the players around you better. I really don't see that with him. He's a great athlete and very talented, but he needs a good supporting cast to succeed.

As for Kobe, he comes with a lot of baggage, you can't question his work ethic, he has the ability to make players better and he's a scoring machine. If he was a bit more level-headed, perhaps I write him off that quickly.

As for Duncan, I have a question for those who'd take Duncan over Bosh as a franchise player. Would you trade Chris Bosh for Tim Duncan in five years? No, Bosh has many more season then Duncan in the league.

I can break down some more, but it is getting late here in New York City.

[ponder276]

re: the above post, my list is based on current performance, ignoring injuries, not potential/trade value.
Also re: most other people, I'm not saying guys like Kaman and Kevin Martin are better than Bosh, but "roughly on par." I put Bosh at 15th-20th in the league, so above the majority of the guys on that list (I put him at 3rd-7th out of that second list of 30 second tier stars).

edit: my main point was that people should remember that Bosh is currently on a hot streak, and will not be playing this well for the rest of the season. When he's on a hot streak like this people call him an MVP candidate, and when he's on a cold streak (i.e. about 2 weeks ago) people constantly rip on him for being soft, and not a good first scoring option. The truth is somewhere in the middle - he's a very good player, would be the best player on many teams in the league, but is not really a top 10 player in the league.

[fimslim3]

re: the above post, my list is based on current performance, ignoring injuries, not potential/trade value.
Also re: most other people, I'm not saying guys like Kaman and Kevin Martin are better than Bosh, but "roughly on par." I put Bosh at 15th-20th in the league, so above the majority of the guys on that list (I put him at 3rd-7th out of that second list of 30 second tier stars).

edit: my main point was that people should remember that Bosh is currently on a hot streak, and will not be playing this well for the rest of the season. When he's on a hot streak like this people call him an MVP candidate, and when he's on a cold streak (i.e. about 2 weeks ago) people constantly rip on him for being soft, and not a good first scoring option. The truth is somewhere in the middle - he's a very good player, would be the best player on many teams in the league, but is not really a top 10 player in the league.

But what players in the league would you want to build your team around? Everyone has flaws, Bosh is still young, he'll improve.

[ponder276]

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But what players in the league would you want to build your team around? Everyone has flaws, Bosh is still young, he'll improve.

I love Bosh and think he's a great player to build around. But my original post wasn't about building a team, just about what players are currently the best, ignoring injury.

[cdel00]

Three weeks ago, you would've been flamed for this thread.

I believe i was flamed for this . . . 2 weeks ago . . . memory is short