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2023 Draft Discussion Part 5

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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1001 » by Kevin Willis » Fri May 26, 2023 2:14 pm

Syd-TK3 wrote:
Read on Twitter
?t=TTJjkTz_v_CXl0yQFbjNgw&s=19


If Nick Smith Jr. shot like this he would be obvious at our pick as a replacement / backup for FVV. However if he played like this he would be a top 5 pick. If we do decide to take a chance on him, I think this board would implode though.


Toronto Raptors (13th pick)
There are going to be several needs for Toronto after a down .500 season. Obviously, a lot of that will be dependent on whether front office head Masai Ujiri blows up the roster by trading forwards Pascal Siakam and OG Anunoby.

One obvious need here is getting more length in the backcourt. Fred VanVleet is smallish. He’s also set to become a free agent in July. Adding Smith to the mix with the 13th selection would just make too much sense given his skillset, frame and the Raptors’ overall needs.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1002 » by HumbleRen » Fri May 26, 2023 2:15 pm

Results from the most recent playoff game that they played yesterday.

Victor Wembanyama: 19 Points|9 Rebounds|4 Assists|2 Blocks | 8/16 FG|0/1 3PT|3/3 FT in 34 minutes.

Bilal Coulibaly: 5 Points|5 Rebounds|0 Assists|2 Steals|2 Blocks | 2/4 FG|2/4 3PT|0 FT in 30 minutes.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1003 » by gbball » Fri May 26, 2023 2:21 pm

Raptorfan2012 wrote:
gbball wrote:
Kevin Willis wrote:;ab_channel=LNBOfficiel


Coulibaly has to be our pick at 13 if he's there. He looked good here offence and defence. Coach trusted him on the court to close things out in a playoff game. I wouldn't be surprised if he goes before we pick.


Hmm? I don’t see him involved that much in these highlights. He is like the 4-5th option on the floor whenever he plays. Big mystery box (which I get some people like).


The fact that he's featured a bit in a team with Wembanyama is these highlights is interesting. It's just highlights, but it looks he's doing it despite being a bit frozen out. I also get Fred VanVleet vibes from their guard, number 3. Again, just highlights. Who knows how the whole game went, but Coulibaly made some nice plays on offense and defense and was trusted to play important minutes as an 18 year old in a playoff win. I can see him playing a limited first year OG like role on an NBA team on offense as he is here and on defense he guarding one of the other teams better players.

With clear upside as a slasher and creator as he's shown at the jr level where he has more responsibility.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1004 » by UnbelievablyRAW » Fri May 26, 2023 2:38 pm

HumbleRen wrote:Results from the most recent playoff game that they played yesterday.

Victor Wembanyama: 19 Points|9 Rebounds|4 Assists|2 Blocks | 8/16 FG|0/1 3PT|3/3 FT in 34 minutes.

Bilal Coulibaly: 5 Points|5 Rebounds|0 Assists|2 Steals|2 Blocks | 2/4 FG|2/4 3PT|0 FT in 30 minutes.


Even though I have a gut feeling we're taking him I hate how much of a reach itll be for 13. Like I'd even rather we take Leonard Miller that soon over Bilal because I don't think anyone outside of OKC will reach for him that early.

S&T Fred for a late FRP and do it then (although I'd rather we grab Whitehead who looks like he could be a lowkey steal like OG was)
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1005 » by OakleyDokely » Fri May 26, 2023 2:45 pm

Not sure Bilal would be a reach at 13. He's put up solid numbers in a strong professional league at a young age.

Guys like Nick Smith, Keyonte, GG shot under 40% in the NCAA and they're discussed as potential lottery picks.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1006 » by REJECTEDBYCLARK » Fri May 26, 2023 2:46 pm

Kevin Willis wrote:
Syd-TK3 wrote:
Read on Twitter
?t=TTJjkTz_v_CXl0yQFbjNgw&s=19


If Nick Smith Jr. shot like this he would be obvious at our pick as a replacement / backup for FVV. However if he played like this he would be a top 5 pick. If we do decide to take a chance on him, I think this board would implode though.


Toronto Raptors (13th pick)
There are going to be several needs for Toronto after a down .500 season. Obviously, a lot of that will be dependent on whether front office head Masai Ujiri blows up the roster by trading forwards Pascal Siakam and OG Anunoby.

One obvious need here is getting more length in the backcourt. Fred VanVleet is smallish. He’s also set to become a free agent in July. Adding Smith to the mix with the 13th selection would just make too much sense given his skillset, frame and the Raptors’ overall needs.


Even if NSJ shot 45/40/85 in college I still wouldn't take him anywhere near the top 5. The passing was atrocious and he put up 0's all across the stat board in key areas constantly. This guy went full games where he put up 0-1 rebounds 0-1 assists and 0 steals.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1007 » by gbball » Fri May 26, 2023 2:49 pm

UnbelievablyRAW wrote:
HumbleRen wrote:Results from the most recent playoff game that they played yesterday.

Victor Wembanyama: 19 Points|9 Rebounds|4 Assists|2 Blocks | 8/16 FG|0/1 3PT|3/3 FT in 34 minutes.

Bilal Coulibaly: 5 Points|5 Rebounds|0 Assists|2 Steals|2 Blocks | 2/4 FG|2/4 3PT|0 FT in 30 minutes.


Even though I have a gut feeling we're taking him I hate how much of a reach itll be for 13. Like I'd even rather we take Leonard Miller that soon over Bilal because I don't think anyone outside of OKC will reach for him that early.

S&T Fred for a late FRP and do it then (although I'd rather we grab Whitehead who looks like he could be a lowkey steal like OG was)


I don't see any uncorrectable weaknesses in him. Combine that with his current age, incredible tools, relatively late start to the game, late growth spurt and his ability to dominate at the jr level and be a main contributor at the sr level all project to player on their way up. He's playing at a level way higher than college basketball or g league and contributing as an 18 year old.

He has a high floor and a really high ceiling.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1008 » by DreamTeam09 » Fri May 26, 2023 2:52 pm

UnbelievablyRAW wrote:
HumbleRen wrote:Results from the most recent playoff game that they played yesterday.

Victor Wembanyama: 19 Points|9 Rebounds|4 Assists|2 Blocks | 8/16 FG|0/1 3PT|3/3 FT in 34 minutes.

Bilal Coulibaly: 5 Points|5 Rebounds|0 Assists|2 Steals|2 Blocks | 2/4 FG|2/4 3PT|0 FT in 30 minutes.


Even though I have a gut feeling we're taking him I hate how much of a reach itll be for 13. Like I'd even rather we take Leonard Miller that soon over Bilal because I don't think anyone outside of OKC will reach for him that early.

S&T Fred for a late FRP and do it then (although I'd rather we grab Whitehead who looks like he could be a lowkey steal like OG was)


Leonard and Bilal are as equally as raw of a prospect as the other imo. Prior to this season Miller was playing Canadian prep while Bilal was probably high level minor leagues. I like Bilal cuz you can see he has more guard mobility and fluidity
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1009 » by HumbleRen » Fri May 26, 2023 2:56 pm

I’m cool on both Bilal and Leonard Miller lol.

I just spent a year of watching pathetic wings trying to score in a 3 point heavy league, not trying to go thru that again lol.

That being said, I don’t think Bilal or Miller are a reach with the 13th pick. I’m cool with either of them if we do that Portland trade to get Simons and the #3.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1010 » by Syd-TK3 » Fri May 26, 2023 2:58 pm

Kevin Willis wrote:
Syd-TK3 wrote:
Read on Twitter
?t=TTJjkTz_v_CXl0yQFbjNgw&s=19


If Nick Smith Jr. shot like this he would be obvious at our pick as a replacement / backup for FVV. However if he played like this he would be a top 5 pick. If we do decide to take a chance on him, I think this board would implode though.


Toronto Raptors (13th pick)
There are going to be several needs for Toronto after a down .500 season. Obviously, a lot of that will be dependent on whether front office head Masai Ujiri blows up the roster by trading forwards Pascal Siakam and OG Anunoby.

One obvious need here is getting more length in the backcourt. Fred VanVleet is smallish. He’s also set to become a free agent in July. Adding Smith to the mix with the 13th selection would just make too much sense given his skillset, frame and the Raptors’ overall needs.

If i was following him closely before college I could see myself being convinced that maybe it was just a down year and injuries but I'm honestly not a Nick Smith fan despite my love for Maxey and that typa player. Hopefully he can build up his stock again quickly in this pre draft process and convince another team before us.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1011 » by UnbelievablyRAW » Fri May 26, 2023 2:59 pm

OakleyDokely wrote:Not sure Bilal would be a reach at 13. He's put up solid numbers in a strong professional league at a young age.

Guys like Nick Smith, Keyonte, GG shot under 40% in the NCAA and they're discussed as potential lottery picks.


Only in terms of him being available after 13. I think we can get him in the early 20's because a lot of the teams behind us are probably gonna want someone further along. Maybe Utah or Houston in the late teens but the other teams are probably gonna want someone that can fill a need and/or contribute now (Atl, Miami, Por, Brk, GSW, LAL)

Maybe BRK takes him with one of their 2 picks but I doubt it given their log jam of similar proportioned players
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1012 » by Reeko » Fri May 26, 2023 3:00 pm

You can never trust a Smith (within the context of the NBA draft).
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1013 » by HumbleRen » Fri May 26, 2023 3:00 pm

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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1014 » by Yallbecrazy » Fri May 26, 2023 3:01 pm

REJECTEDBYCLARK wrote:
Kevin Willis wrote:
Syd-TK3 wrote:
Read on Twitter
?t=TTJjkTz_v_CXl0yQFbjNgw&s=19


If Nick Smith Jr. shot like this he would be obvious at our pick as a replacement / backup for FVV. However if he played like this he would be a top 5 pick. If we do decide to take a chance on him, I think this board would implode though.


Toronto Raptors (13th pick)
There are going to be several needs for Toronto after a down .500 season. Obviously, a lot of that will be dependent on whether front office head Masai Ujiri blows up the roster by trading forwards Pascal Siakam and OG Anunoby.

One obvious need here is getting more length in the backcourt. Fred VanVleet is smallish. He’s also set to become a free agent in July. Adding Smith to the mix with the 13th selection would just make too much sense given his skillset, frame and the Raptors’ overall needs.


Even if NSJ shot 45/40/85 in college I still wouldn't take him anywhere near the top 5. The passing was atrocious and he put up 0's all across the stat board in key areas constantly. This guy went full games where he put up 0-1 rebounds 0-1 assists and 0 steals.


You're missing the other stats though, he tended to balance out those 0 / 1 stats with a high number of turnovers.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1015 » by OakleyDokely » Fri May 26, 2023 3:02 pm

UnbelievablyRAW wrote:
OakleyDokely wrote:Not sure Bilal would be a reach at 13. He's put up solid numbers in a strong professional league at a young age.

Guys like Nick Smith, Keyonte, GG shot under 40% in the NCAA and they're discussed as potential lottery picks.


Only in terms of him being available after 13. I think we can get him in the early 20's because a lot of the teams behind us are probably gonna want someone further along. Maybe Utah or Houston in the late teens but the other teams are probably gonna want someone that can fill a need and/or contribute now (Atl, Miami, Por, Brk, GSW, LAL)

Maybe BRK takes him with one of their 2 picks but I doubt it given their log jam of similar proportioned players


It's hard to predict because teams draft boards will vary widely. I'm almost certain at least 2 or 3 guys will sneak into the lottery that nobody expected.

If you believe in Bilal's long term ability and potential, does it really matter if you take a few spots earlier than the consensus?
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1016 » by Reeko » Fri May 26, 2023 3:02 pm

HumbleRen wrote:
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I don't see how he's anything more than 6th man type of player on a good team in the NBA.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1017 » by Yallbecrazy » Fri May 26, 2023 3:03 pm

Does anyone have those stats that were posted a while back with the volume and points per possession based on the shot type?
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1018 » by REJECTEDBYCLARK » Fri May 26, 2023 3:07 pm

Yallbecrazy wrote:
REJECTEDBYCLARK wrote:
Kevin Willis wrote:
If Nick Smith Jr. shot like this he would be obvious at our pick as a replacement / backup for FVV. However if he played like this he would be a top 5 pick. If we do decide to take a chance on him, I think this board would implode though.



Even if NSJ shot 45/40/85 in college I still wouldn't take him anywhere near the top 5. The passing was atrocious and he put up 0's all across the stat board in key areas constantly. This guy went full games where he put up 0-1 rebounds 0-1 assists and 0 steals.


You're missing the other stats though, he tended to balance out those 0 / 1 stats with a high number of turnovers.


I mean I can accept the whole he was playing injured argument but even if that was the case the numbers shouldn't be THAT low. At least people caught on to the lies that were being spread about him and his "deadly floater".... all the merit he has is essentially from his high school gameplay but there are tons of players who dominated in high school who are now considered 2nd round picks or UDFA even.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1019 » by Lord_Zedd » Fri May 26, 2023 3:08 pm

HumbleRen wrote:
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Just like with Keyonte, when was Nick Smith Jr injured? Injuries don't make a guy chuck up 20+ shots to only score 20pts, or not pass the ball whatsoever.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 5 

Post#1020 » by OAKLEY_2 » Fri May 26, 2023 3:11 pm

PhilBlackson wrote:Most of the "lure" for me about Bufkin is his shooting because I'm really not that wowed about what he can do off the dribble without it being in a PnR...and with that in mind, if it's mainly shooting as a draw for him, I'm not so sure I'd have him ahead of Jordan Hawkins just because I like the WAY Hawkins gets those 3s more because I'd actually prefer a guy who doesn't need the ball in his hands and to run PnRs to better get his shot off.

Hawkins might be ahead of Bufkin for me...

I like the way Hawkins moves so well off the ball which ofc makes sense since he models his game after Klay & Rip Hamilton. But I just think like Klay playing off Dray, that Hawkins would be a really nice fit with Scottie in the same way and allows Scottie to be more useful with the ball in his hands when he knows there's a moving target (actually noticed some minor chemistry with Yuta from that reason but they didn't get to run actions that often together). I also think that kind of motion shooting shifts a defence so much because everyone knows as Hawkins is running, cutting and zig zagging all over the court, they know they gotta watch him and throws a defence way off when they need to track one guy everywhere he goes while other things are going on in the sets but especially when you have a great passer Scottie that can throw passes to spots almost ahead of time or into small pockets. It's just an enticing combo. Not enough to leap frog my top 3 for our pick but he miiiiight be ahead of Bufkin for me, the more I think about his fit & effect could be on an opposing defence.

I'd love to trade Gary to the Lakers (*ahem they were rumored to be interested in him ALL year) for Beasley + 17 and draft Hawkins, assuming he's still there. If not shout out to Marcus Sasser as back up plan lol but heck who knows maybe Bufkin falls to 17, if Hawkins goes ahead of him.


Lakers won't give up a first in a sign and trade. Still trying to guage if there is a cap space market for Fred consistent with bet on self and if he truly leaves. Bobby Marks says anyone giving Fred 25+ might get value for two of four years. High mileade subcompact with sport package. Of the Raps three best shooters two are UFAs and one is the best trade asset. Guard-point guard is a serious need.

Would OKC deal us Tre Mann, Aleksej Pokusevski, Dario Saric and number 12 for OG? If they had 12 and 13 those picks might be ammunition to move up or stay put and get Wallace/Bufkin or Wallace/Hawkins or Wallace/Howard or... Michigan x 2 Bufkin/Howard. Max Lewis may sneak in there as well.. That would be 5 new roster players. Deletions w/be OG in trade, (retaining Trent allows them to transition from) Fred gone, Thad Young gone, Weiskamp blink gone, and no QO for Banton gone.

Paskal, Poetl, Scottie, Tre Mann, Aleksej Pokusevski Dario Saric, Precious, Cason Wallace, Max Lewis, Chris Boucher, Otto Porter Jr., Jeff Dowtin, Christian Koloko, Gary Trent Jr., Donte diVincenzo, Ron Harper Jr.

One of the coaches like Fernandez, Adelman, Quinn or Darko is getting this job.

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