Team Canada Basketball Thread V2.0

Mattd97 · Post #1061 » by **Mattd97** » Sun Mar 24, 2019 6:50 pm

Age matters more than accomplishment for many, if not most, NBA scouts unfortunately

Mirotic12 · Post #1062 » by **Mirotic12** » Sun Mar 24, 2019 6:51 pm

Canada is lucky Blatt turned them down supposedly. He's very overrated for some reason by almost everyone in NBA and US sports media. He did an awful job two years ago in EuroLeague with Darussafaka, and he is doing an even worse job this year with Olympiacos...with the club's fans and media really calling for him to be fired.

I think Messina is a better choice than Kokoskov. Kokoskov's style doesn't seem like a good fit for Canada, and he's pretty much a one trick pny type of coach. With that being said...Messina is also really overrated in US sports media for some reason. He's a good coach, but nowhere close to what NBA circles seem to think.

I would go with Jeff Van Gundy or Mike Fratello instead. Fratello did a good job with Ukraine and Van Gundy did a good job with USA. They were able to use an American / Canadian style well in FIBA. I'm not sure if a purely European style coach like Messina is a good fit for a Canadian team.

UcanUwill wrote:Pangos having a very down year, but his first year in Kaunas wasnt all that amazing either, and then he formed into Zalgiris star. If you get that version of Pangos, he must be on a team.

Pangos is a good player, and if I was Canada I would take him over someone like Brady Heslip. But he got really overrated over that one season with Zalgiris. Zalgiris' entire offense was designed for get Pangos easy passes and open shots. In a normal offense, he can do that. In Canada's national team he can't do that.

It's also a little bit suspicious that Zalgiris and their players got much worse after they got caught taping the other team's practice and EuroLeague put in that new rule blocking them access to video monitoring of the other team's practices. From that moment almost exactly, their whole offense system became much worse. So i'm not even sure how much of what they did last season was legit.

Pangos is a good ball handler, a very good shooter, and he's creative and can pass. But in overall quality as an all around player...Canada has some better lead guards in Europe like Dylan Ennis and Phil Scrubb. I think they are both better all around players than Pangos is.

Hair Canada · Post #1063 » by **Hair Canada** » Sun Mar 24, 2019 9:17 pm

Mirotic12 wrote:Canada is lucky Blatt turned them down supposedly. He's very overrated for some reason by almost everyone in NBA and US sports media. He did an awful job two years ago in EuroLeague with Darussafaka, and he is doing an even worse job this year with Olympiacos...with the club's fans and media really calling for him to be fired.

I disagree. Every coach has weaker seasons where things don't quite work out (well, maybe except Popovic). But luckily, if you're not short-sighted, you can look at one's accomplishments over the years. And Blatt's resume as an international coach is unparalleled in terms of the diversity of his achievements. Just to name a few of the more obvious ones:

* With Cleveland in the NBA, many remember that he eventually got sacked, but forget that he (and LeBron of course) led one of the weaker teams even to reach the NBA finals (Love and Irving were injured; the best players except for LeBron were Dellavedova, TT, and Timofey Mozgov...) to a 2:1 lead over the mighty Golden State before eventually losing the series. Over-achiever.

* With national teams, he has a European championship (with a very surprising win in the final over the home-team, Spain, with Gasol) and an Olympic bronze medal. Both were with a very mediocre Russian team, which in both cases clearly over-achieved. No other coach before or after him (or between his two campaigns with Russia) took the Russian team even close to these achievements.

* He led a very mediocre Maccabi Tel-Aviv to a Euroleague title, although they were not even supposed to reach the final-4. And in the final-4, he led them to two very surprising wins over CSKA and Real Madrid (there's a reason he was the first European coach to get an NBA head-coaching position). One of the bigger upsets in Euroleague history. So again, clearly over-achieving.

* He also won a few other European titles (lower leagues that the Euroleague). In the last of these, in 2017 with Darussafaka, he once again led a team that was by no means the leading candidate for the title to pretty surprising wins in the semi-final and final.

* He also won multiple local championships in Israel and in Italy and his teams were generally considered to play very good basketball over the years.

Again, naturally, he also had weaker seasons, as just about any other European coach has (maybe except for Zeljko Obradovic).

In short, if all he has is luck, then he's the luckiest man ever. He's a proven over-achiever and I think it's too bad he turned team Canada down (if that's indeed the case).

DreamTeam09 · Post #1064 » by **DreamTeam09** » Sun Mar 24, 2019 9:19 pm

Is Brandon Clarke Canadian??

SharoneWright · Post #1065 » by **SharoneWright** » Sun Mar 24, 2019 11:14 pm

DreamTeam09 wrote:Is Brandon Clarke Canadian??

People seem to think so, but I’m not sure even Brandon Clarke knows…

TrueNorth31 · Post #1066 » by **TrueNorth31** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 1:44 am

Per Grange

Read on Twitter

TrueNorth31 · Post #1067 » by **TrueNorth31** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 1:49 am

More

Read on Twitter

And1Skip · Post #1068 » by **And1Skip** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 1:50 am

TrueNorth31 wrote:Per Grange

Read on Twitter

Seems a lot of people are implying this as a bigger issue with the internal politics but could it just be as easy as Charlotte “prefers” him to spend more time as their lead assistant to prepping for training camp next season? Yeah Raptors let Scariolo do his thing but he’s the 3rd assistant on the Raps bench. And if course likely Barret and Grunwald may “prefer” someone else too

Young_Buc · Post #1069 » by **Young_Buc** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 1:56 am

Messina would be amazing. Roy Rana I guess deserves a chance, but still

TrueNorth31 · Post #1070 » by **TrueNorth31** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 1:57 am

Doug Smith is not pleased.

He's a huge Triano guy - both are from Niagara Falls, both from same high school- relatively same age, played baseball together.

Read on Twitter

TrueNorth31 · Post #1071 » by **TrueNorth31** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 2:11 am

Grange is also close to Triano to as he was the ghost writer for Triano's latest book. Grange seems close to Rowan Barrett as well. It must be hard for these writers to remain objective.

Somehow having both Rana and Messina seems the best option.

Not sure it can be done though ?

TrueNorth31 · Post #1072 » by **TrueNorth31** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 2:42 am

Grange has a story up now about the situation.

https://www.sportsnet.ca/basketball/nba/triano-stepping-away-canadian-mens-national-team-coaching-role/

frumble · Post #1073 » by **frumble** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 3:23 am

Any thoughts on how much this increases the chances of Wiggins playing?

mojo13 · Post #1074 » by **mojo13** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 4:25 am

And1Skip wrote:
TrueNorth31 wrote:Per Grange

Read on Twitter

Seems a lot of people are implying this as a bigger issue with the internal politics but could it just be as easy as Charlotte “prefers” him to spend more time as their lead assistant to prepping for training camp next season? Yeah Raptors let Scariolo do his thing but he’s the 3rd assistant on the Raps bench. And if course likely Barret and Grunwald may “prefer” someone else too

I find the regular posters in here far more informed than the typical rift raft on Twitter. So you are probably more right about Charlotte than some internal power struggle going on. Barrett been the acting GM for years now anyways.

Anyone butthurt about Trianos departure is likely more a casual fan not really following what’s really going on.

Hair Canada · Post #1075 » by **Hair Canada** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 2:19 pm

ESPN with a new mock draft. for the first time, they project 5 Canadians in the first round: Barrett (#3), Clarke (#14), NAW (#22), Dort (#26), and finally also Kabengele at #30 (I think he can still go up). Shayok, Simi, and Iggy are also on their big board (top-100). Iggy will likely stay, but Simi said there's 50% that he'll enter the draft (will likely be a second rounder if he does) and Shayok will also be there as a borderline second-rounder once it's all said and done.

SharoneWright · Post #1076 » by **SharoneWright** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 5:37 pm

TrueNorth31 wrote:Grange is also close to Triano to as he was the ghost writer for Triano's latest book. Grange seems close to Rowan Barrett as well. It must be hard for these writers to remain objective.

Somehow having both Rana and Messina seems the best option.

Not sure it can be done though ?

That's why it's finally time to break up the cabal at the top. Personal feelings should never have to get in the way of making the right personnel decisions. Between Nash, Triano, and Barrett Sr., only 1 should really be involved. More than that and you get issues of nepotism. With Jay Triano finally out of the way, and with Nash's demotion, we are finally getting a more functional model without the incestuous baggage. Winning and excellence are going to over-rule reputation and nostalgia.

mojo13 · Post #1077 » by **mojo13** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 5:48 pm

Hair Canada wrote:ESPN with a new mock draft. for the first time, they project 5 Canadians in the first round: Barrett (#3), Clarke (#14), NAW (#22), Dort (#26), and finally also Kabengele at #30 (I think he can still go up). Shayok, Simi, and Iggy are also on their big board (top-100). Iggy will likely stay, but Simi said there's 50% that he'll enter the draft (will likely be a second rounder if he does) and Shayok will also be there as a borderline second-rounder once it's all said and done.

I see Givony finally came in here and read our stuff on Mfiondu Kabengele and Brandon Clarke - both way under ranked on previous mocks. I expect both go somewhat higher than 14 and 30 respectively.

We do have a serious possibility of Luguentz Dort staying another year (he has much to work on). Kabengele for that matter could easily stay as well.

Mattd97 · Post #1078 » by **Mattd97** » Mon Mar 25, 2019 5:49 pm

Gotta love douggie pulling a Casey. Triano was incredible! Good luck replacing him when you've been terrible for years!
Um....

frumble · Post #1079 » by **frumble** » Tue Mar 26, 2019 3:40 pm

Alexander-Moncrieffe the only Canadian on the world roster for the Nike Hoop Summit. Rana the coach again.

https://www.usab.com/news-events/news/2019/03/world-team-roster.aspx

Hair Canada · Post #1080 » by **Hair Canada** » Tue Mar 26, 2019 4:49 pm

frumble wrote:Alexander-Moncrieffe the only Canadian on the world roster for the Nike Hoop Summit. Rana the coach again.

https://www.usab.com/news-events/news/2019/03/world-team-roster.aspx

Yes, and Moncrieff is even a 2020 prospect (at least for now). Meaning that there's no one from the 2019 class. I actually agree with this, as this is one of our weaker classes in years. Addison Patterson (who may also re-class to 2019) should have probably also been there though. Overall, not a very strong roster for the world team. A bit strange that none of the very gifted prospects from the 2020 international class was invited (e.g. Avdija, Hayes, Maledon, or Wagner).