Stein/Fischer: Toronto willing to deal RJ Barrett, IQ, Poeltl for Significant Upgrades // #9 Available

[LoveMyRaps]

If KD wants to come here that would help our chances to get him...

i read that as houston is the spot durant wants the most and that we are involved at 9. it was worded oddly.

I just don't understand why Durant wants to go to Houston. Usually he wants to team up with someone like Irving and Booker. Durant wants to go to Houston to team up with... FVV? Sengun??

FVV
Brooks
Amen
Durant
Sengun

That's a pretty sweet lineup.

[tsherkin]

Get er done

No offense, but that has us trading FOR Jalen Green?

That's hilariously dumb on our part.

[ATLTimekeeper]

To BRK: IQ
To TOR: KD
TO PHX: Claxton / RJ

Iq is worth a lot more than claxton

You'd have to add picks/prospects to this probably. But this core structure works from a cap perspective.

That would likely be the #9 and late Brooklyn pick swap scenario.

[Raptors Realtor]

IQ + RJ for KD

Doesn't sound tooooooooo bad.

To what end, though?

Losing those two for one year of KD which won't end in a title... and we do that because?

i think that's such an awful and sorry, just a dumb way of evaluating things. 99.99% of all moves won't end in a title. because you know, winning a title is almost impossible.

but you keep making moves to try and get better and things may break the right way. that goes for any trade. there will be more moves after this one.

secondly, you have no clue how things will play out if we get him. what if KD actually likes his time here and decides to extend? because the chance of having a player like that, for a team in canada, can only happen if you get him now because there is no way to get him later. raptors have to play the pre-agency card and hope they can convince him to stay.

I'd be on board with your take, if he wasn't 37, a UFA at the end of the season and didn't notoriously grow tired of teams he's been dealt to before his contract was up.

[Raptorfan2012]

Get er done

I rather have Sheppard and Jabari than Green. Green is pretty bad right now.

[LoveMyRaps]

Get er done

No offense, but that has us trading FOR Jalen Green?

That's hilariously dumb on our part.

RJ for Green swap basically.

I wouldn't be opposed to it.

Either you pay RJ 30-35mil AAV next summer OR you work with Green (w/ 3 years of control) to unlock his full potential.

Green hate is kind of overblown, he's had ridiculously hot stretches where he's played like a bonafide star. His numbers have been getting better each season.

[LoveMyRaps]

Get er done

I rather have Sheppard and Jabari than Green. Green is pretty bad right now.

ya unfortunately we have an RJ Barrett to offer, not a Kevin Durant

[OakleyDokely]

Is there any move we can make that would end in a title though?

No, I wouldn't think so.

But renting KD for a year before he bails for somewhere more interesting after we've given up assets for him isn't an appealing notion to me. I'd like to build for a little longer-term a plan here.

I think it's just comes down to taking a step closer to being being a contending team. KD gives us a better shot than RJ/IQ. Additional moves would need to be made to make another step forward. I don't think it would end with KD either, if that's the direction they go in.

Maybe it fails and KD leaves after a year, but maybe KD likes it here, he likes the attention, the team wins 50 games and gets to the 2nd/3rd round and he extends. Given the state of the east, taking a risk like this isn't the worst idea in the world. If the east were stronger, or there were superteams out there, it wouldn't make much sense, but that isn't the case currently. IND is one game away from winning the title and if you said that would happen a year ago you'd be called crazy.

I look at the roster currently and what exactly do they have to lose? If it fails spectacularly, they can deal everyone and tank since they control all their future picks.

[Tor_Raps]

Its ok to trade for a "medium star" even if it means we don't become championship contenders right away was my point.

Sure.. if it makes sense. Giving up young assets for a short-term rental that doesn't build your future, though, doesn't make any sense.

And that's what we'd be doing with Durant.

We'd be losing heavily at the point, creating an even LARGER logjam in our forward slots. We'd have an excellent scorer who is a frequently injured, a mediocre defender and playmaker, sort of like a super Ingram.

And then what do we do when he doesn't re-sign, or wants $70+ million for 2 or 3 years?

Again... why are you quoting me when I want nothing to do with Durant loll.

We are just beginning our contention window next year, im happy with a player who will build on that for the next several years and not just 1 season...

[ATLTimekeeper]

Is there any move we can make that would end in a title though?

No, I wouldn't think so.

But renting KD for a year before he bails for somewhere more interesting after we've given up assets for him isn't an appealing notion to me. I'd like to build for a little longer-term a plan here.

I think it's just comes down to taking a step closer to being being a contending team. KD gives us a better shot than RJ/IQ. Additional moves would need to be made to make another step forward. I don't think it would end with KD either, if that's the direction they go in.

Maybe it fails and KD leaves after a year, but maybe KD likes it here, he likes the attention, the team wins 50 games and gets to the 2nd/3rd round and he extends. Given the state of the east, taking a risk like this isn't the worst idea in the world. If the east were stronger, or there were superteams out there, it wouldn't make much sense, but that isn't the case currently. IND is one game away from winning the title and if you said that would happen a year ago you'd be called crazy.

A year ago they were in the Eastern Conference Finals, though. It is less crazy than the Raptors going from 30 wins to even the Eastern Conference Finals next year. It helps Larry's sticker price, but it doesn't make a lot of sense otherwise.

[tsherkin]

RJ for Green swap basically.

I wouldn't be opposed to it.

Either you pay RJ 30-35mil AAV next summer OR you work with Green (w/ 3 years of control) to unlock his full potential.

Green hate is kind of overblown, he's had ridiculously hot stretches where he's played like a bonafide star. His numbers have been getting better each season.

Super opposed. Barrett has similar hot stretches. Green is 4 years in and literally nothing more than an inefficient volume chucker. I have no desire for such a player. He doesn't even provide rim and foul pressure like RJ does. That's a wasted asset move right there.

I think it's just comes down to taking a step closer to being being a contending team. KD gives us a better shot than RJ/IQ. Additional moves would need to be made to make another step forward. I don't think it would end with KD either, if that's the direction they go in.

Maybe it fails and KD leaves after a year, but maybe KD likes it here, he likes the attention, the team wins 50 games and gets to the 2nd/3rd round and he extends. Given the state of the east, taking a risk like this isn't the worst idea in the world. If the east were stronger, or there were superteams out there, it wouldn't make much sense, but that isn't the case currently. IND is one game away from winning the title and if you said that would happen a year ago you'd be called crazy.

I doubt he likes it here enough to take a STEEP discount so that he doesn't blow our cap situation to remain while he declines as he gets closer to 40.

I don't like it. I think it's basically all risk and a very miniscule chance of reward, and very much the antithesis of a "building for an extended future" kind of move.

I'd love to see KD play, he's fun to watch and he's an amazing scorer, it just seems horrifically short-sighted. Like, if we were gonna pull that sort of BS, we shouldn't have tanked in the first place.

[OakleyDokely]

No, I wouldn't think so.

But renting KD for a year before he bails for somewhere more interesting after we've given up assets for him isn't an appealing notion to me. I'd like to build for a little longer-term a plan here.

I think it's just comes down to taking a step closer to being being a contending team. KD gives us a better shot than RJ/IQ. Additional moves would need to be made to make another step forward. I don't think it would end with KD either, if that's the direction they go in.

Maybe it fails and KD leaves after a year, but maybe KD likes it here, he likes the attention, the team wins 50 games and gets to the 2nd/3rd round and he extends. Given the state of the east, taking a risk like this isn't the worst idea in the world. If the east were stronger, or there were superteams out there, it wouldn't make much sense, but that isn't the case currently. IND is one game away from winning the title and if you said that would happen a year ago you'd be called crazy.

A year ago they were in the Eastern Conference Finals, though. It is less crazy than the Raptors going from 30 wins to even the Eastern Conference Finals next year. It helps Larry's sticker price, but it doesn't make a lot of sense otherwise.

The Pacers went from 35 wins to the ECF in a season. Big leaps aren't impossible.

[ciueli]

Has anyone else thought that maybe one of the reasons Masai is trying to trade for a star is as a consolidation move to avoid us losing a useful player in an expansion draft? This thought just occurred to me today with this renewed enthusiasm for expansion in light of the Celtics and Lakers sales.

I know there was a thread on this topic a few months ago, but I'm assuming the players we would want to protect in an expansion draft would be:

Scottie Barnes
Brandon Ingram
Immanuel Quickley
RJ Barrett
Jakob Poeltl
Gradey Dick
Ochai Agbaji
Ja'Kobe Walter
Jamal Shead
Jonathan Mogbo
This year's first round pick

The issue is that is 11 players, so we would be risking 3 of them in an expansion draft if we could only protect 8 players. Mogbo is obvious, the next two are less so, to me it looks like we'd end up losing one of our young players, probably Shead, Ja'Kobe, Dick, or Ochai.

The point is, if we do a consolidation trade now, it removes this as an issue for a while, might be something the front office is thinking about going forward.

EDIT: the rules last time were only one player of any single team so it's less bad than I thought (no losing 3 players) but it still could result in us losing a player we'd like to keep.

[ATLTimekeeper]

I think it's just comes down to taking a step closer to being being a contending team. KD gives us a better shot than RJ/IQ. Additional moves would need to be made to make another step forward. I don't think it would end with KD either, if that's the direction they go in.

Maybe it fails and KD leaves after a year, but maybe KD likes it here, he likes the attention, the team wins 50 games and gets to the 2nd/3rd round and he extends. Given the state of the east, taking a risk like this isn't the worst idea in the world. If the east were stronger, or there were superteams out there, it wouldn't make much sense, but that isn't the case currently. IND is one game away from winning the title and if you said that would happen a year ago you'd be called crazy.

A year ago they were in the Eastern Conference Finals, though. It is less crazy than the Raptors going from 30 wins to even the Eastern Conference Finals next year. It helps Larry's sticker price, but it doesn't make a lot of sense otherwise.

The Pacers went from 35 wins to the ECF in a season. Big leaps aren't impossible.

Very true. They weren't relying on 37 year olds to get them there, though.

[Jerry Lucas]

To BRK: IQ
To TOR: KD
TO PHX: Claxton / RJ

TOR gets
KD
Time Lord

PHX gets
IQ
Thybulle
Pick 9

POR gets
RJ

[tsherkin]

I think it's just comes down to taking a step closer to being being a contending team. KD gives us a better shot than RJ/IQ. Additional moves would need to be made to make another step forward. I don't think it would end with KD either, if that's the direction they go in.

Maybe it fails and KD leaves after a year, but maybe KD likes it here, he likes the attention, the team wins 50 games and gets to the 2nd/3rd round and he extends. Given the state of the east, taking a risk like this isn't the worst idea in the world. If the east were stronger, or there were superteams out there, it wouldn't make much sense, but that isn't the case currently. IND is one game away from winning the title and if you said that would happen a year ago you'd be called crazy.

A year ago they were in the Eastern Conference Finals, though. It is less crazy than the Raptors going from 30 wins to even the Eastern Conference Finals next year. It helps Larry's sticker price, but it doesn't make a lot of sense otherwise.

The Pacers went from 35 wins to the ECF in a season. Big leaps aren't impossible.

Yeah, I mean, it's entirely possible depending on the details of what they do in the offseason and why they were so bad in the first place, no doubt.

Health, for example, is a fast way to make a large turnaround. A major conference contender being potentially out of the picture is another big one, too, opening the way.

[sidsid]

Is there any move we can make that would end in a title though?

No, I wouldn't think so.

But renting KD for a year before he bails for somewhere more interesting after we've given up assets for him isn't an appealing notion to me. I'd like to build for a little longer-term a plan here.

The KD lure to get Giannis here is the "chip and a chair" scenario. Two superstars plus BI or whatever he's turned into gets you at the table.

[tsherkin]

Is there any move we can make that would end in a title though?

No, I wouldn't think so.

But renting KD for a year before he bails for somewhere more interesting after we've given up assets for him isn't an appealing notion to me. I'd like to build for a little longer-term a plan here.

The KD lure to get Giannis here is the "chip and a chair" scenario. Two superstars plus BI or whatever he's turned into gets you at the table.

That isn't happening, lol.

Though if it did, I would CHEERILY eat all the crow, because that would be amazing, of course.

[WWSRD]

I would try and buy low on Green.

Humbling experience by getting traded + getting a better 3pointer, could turn him into a very nice starter. But it's a move you make if you're not serious about winning the short term....which apparently the Raps are.

[Raptors Realtor]

Is there any move we can make that would end in a title though?

No, I wouldn't think so.

But renting KD for a year before he bails for somewhere more interesting after we've given up assets for him isn't an appealing notion to me. I'd like to build for a little longer-term a plan here.

The KD lure to get Giannis here is the "chip and a chair" scenario. Two superstars plus BI or whatever he's turned into gets you at the table.

Ya except KD, Giannis and Ingram alone would be around $150M... There's no way to fill out the roster enough with serviceable starting PG, C and rotation pieces.