Official Raptors 2012 NBA Draft Thread, Part 9

[fredericklove]

If he measures at 6'10" with a 7'1" wingspan he goes 2nd overall, book it.

I am curious to see how he looks next to Kentucky's T.Jones; it will be a great indication

I'd imagine it's real close. Robinson looks a shade taller here, though.

I had a huge LOL

[ash_k]

If he measures at 6'10" with a 7'1" wingspan he goes 2nd overall, book it.

I am curious to see how he looks next to Kentucky's T.Jones; it will be a great indication

ash_k, weren't you the one who said TJ w/ shoes is 6'7.5 ? I'm sure T-Rob is well over that.

If he is way taller that T.Jones then it will be great indicator...T.Jones seems to have a thick body there; I am curious to see how those 2 measure up next to each other..

On TV, T.Rob does not look 6'10; I am looking forward to see those 2 battling one another

[ballislife]

OK, there's no need to talk about Robinson or Sullinger here... it's highly unlikely that we come out of the draft with either of them. We're taking a wing player or Davis... let's just talk about those guys.

I think we're coming out of this draft with one of either Beal, Barnes, MKG, or Lamb. I prefer it be Beal. He has success written all over him.

[fredericklove]

Don't jump to blindness conclusion. I don't think any or most of us say he'll be an all star. You heard maybe one guy or less saying he is one but I'm certainly not one of them. What we saying is if he is drafted by the Raptors, he'll be providing the toughness and rebounding that Bargnani couldn't bring in all 6 years, and with T-Rob's talent level, if he pans out, he'll be a great inside combo with Val. The tournament does get people excited but alot of us know T-Rob is a solid lottery pick. We're just discussing on what he can bring to us if he's on our team, I know you're scared that Bargnani could be replaced if we get a big this draft, its understandable. Right now we're just projecting what he can bring to us. This is the discussion we're all having here, or at least what I'm having here.

Talking about jumping to blindness conclusion, dont be so sure about me scared of Bargnani being replaced lol...I wanted him traded in the summer..some mentionning T.Rob as an All-Star means "some"..not all .cmon lets try to stay serious. I saw what I needed to see in those 13 games from Bargnani...He showed the toughness without a training camp...

For Val I would rather have a 5 hat could cover both 4 and 5 NExt to him.. ..twin tower combination..For example someone like Gortat is good enough of an athlete + the size to do that.... T.Rob doesnt fill that bill to me

Edit: Davis would fit that bill so perfectly with some added strength ...oh lottery

And now, we have a post-injury 12 game sample of him in which its telling us he's not able to get back to his "13 game sample" form. The problem I have with Bargs is his consistency level and his intensity level. He plays when he wants to, he doesn't give enough effort on both ends. For the 13 games, he has, but for the 12 games now, he hasn't. First 3-4 games back from an injury, he looks shaky sure. Some great players come back from injury and immediately play like a workhorse but Bargs is most certainly not this type.

I remember Bargs in the off-season last year said "we're in a losing season, I didn't try my best, I didn't give 100% effort", ....then goes and say "we look good in black jersey" ..., this guy really needs self-motivation. Right now he looks like he's going through the same phase again, a what? A losing season causes him to do this(?) A losing season or a winning season, to me, if a guy's mentality is THAT easily shaken, I won't stand that. You need appreciation. That's what Bargs really lacks.

If we happen to draft a big, and if it's a T-Rob guy, his intensity and effort level along with his talent are something I appreciate. And I'm not even a T-Rob guy too.

[fredericklove]

So you'd rather have Gortat than Robinson....facepalm tbh...i respect your opinion but a team with Bargnani or Gortat has no chance of winning anything substantial, how about we actually get some heart, leadership, strength, and talent on this team that rebounds and plays defense. The idea of Bargnani's skill set is great but when that skill set doesnt come with additives like defense and rebounding you can forget about it *Joe Pesci voice*

Actually yes, Gortat as a 15/10 physical/Athletic center(and still young) over T.Robinson anyday, sorry

How about taking Nash out of the equation, I'd like to see how Gortat does without him. In the suns' thread, you can go ask the posters there cos I read it from there and they watch more suns game than all of us. They said most of Gortat's production came from Nash, maybe he'll get alot of reb but no way in hell he could avg 15 pts without Nash.

[fredericklove]

OK, there's no need to talk about Robinson or Sullinger here... it's highly unlikely that we come out of the draft with either of them. We're taking a wing player or Davis... let's just talk about those guys.

I think we're coming out of this draft with one of either Beal, Barnes, MKG, or Lamb. I prefer it be Beal. He has success written all over him.

Well, this thread is pretty much dead but our discussions right now is due to the final four trend, so its nice to talk about "big" conversation. Alot of these discussion revolves around what the bigs will do for us, its a scenario. Who knows, maybe we happen to get a big, or not, or yes, who knows. We're not BC. Btw, my "wing" thread probably covers alot on the wings talent discussion. Although many favor MKG on that thread poll, which kind of got me interested, in a skeptical way.

[DA_SCOUT]

Just curious, but Fredericklove do you still think as highly of Barnes as you did before(Pre-tournament) ??

He had a pretty average tournament if you ask me. One thing about Beal I dislike is that he isn't an above the rim player, not that it makes him a bad player, but it would've been fun to watch...Maybe i'm getting greedy looking at all the freak athletes (PJIII, Drummond etc.)

[gojoorange]

OK, there's no need to talk about Robinson or Sullinger here... it's highly unlikely that we come out of the draft with either of them. We're taking a wing player or Davis... let's just talk about those guys.

I think we're coming out of this draft with one of either Beal, Barnes, MKG, or Lamb. I prefer it be Beal. He has success written all over him.

It is generally pretty difficult to predict what BC will do. Though I do think if he believes Robinson or Sullinger to be BPA at our pick, he will not hesitate to take them.

[ash_k]

So you'd rather have Gortat than Robinson....facepalm tbh...i respect your opinion but a team with Bargnani or Gortat has no chance of winning anything substantial, how about we actually get some heart, leadership, strength, and talent on this team that rebounds and plays defense. The idea of Bargnani's skill set is great but when that skill set doesnt come with additives like defense and rebounding you can forget about it *Joe Pesci voice*

Actually yes, Gortat as a 15/10 physical/Athletic center(and still young) over T.Robinson anyday, sorry

How about taking Nash out of the equation, I'd like to see how Gortat does without him. In the suns' thread, you can go ask the posters there cos I read it from there and they watch more suns game than all of us. They said most of Gortat's production came from Nash, maybe he'll get alot of reb but no way in hell he could avg 15 pts without Nash.

No doubt Nash gives him some "free" points, but we could see it in Orlando.. and on international tournament..the man has always been a talent, nice touch and great rebounder

I believe he was 10/10 in Orlando whenever D12 was out...

Dont think Nash "helps" him much with the rebounding aspect

[fredericklove]

Just curious, but Fredericklove do you still think as highly of Barnes as you did before(Pre-tournament) ??

He had a pretty average tournament if you ask me. One thing about Beal I dislike is that he isn't an above the rim player, not that it makes him a bad player, but it would've been fun to watch...Maybe i'm getting greedy looking at all the freak athletes (PJIII, Drummond etc.)

I still think of him highly because of his overall skillset, I think the catch&shoot/pull-up jumper/p&r ability will translate to the NBA level, before some of u guys whine at me using whole bunch of statistic, I'm just saying what could be translatable (but no surprise that I will see someone going to attack me again on this).

The things that I don't like about Barnes from this tournament is his inconsistency and low FG% shots attempt, he's gotta have to be smart about his shot selection. His inconsistency is not due to him not giving a crap, its more so have to do with his slowness to pick up on things. He'll go thru a stretch of making shots, then comes back with a stretch of missing alot, he's really have to choose his shots wisely. And yes, he sure struggles alot without Marshall operating the offensive flow for this team, but I still think he can do well in a well-organized team offensive flow (especially if there are numerous set screen/p&r plays specially designed for him to fully utilizing that catch&shoot and p&r ability). And like I said, his ability to pick up on things is quite slow, so in those two games without Marshall, he's not able to adjust to anything effectively. He has the ability to score, however in the NBA, it'll take him times to get used to, especially when he's a system guy.

Yeah, athleticism makes a player looks fancy but Beal's best at making good decisions with the ball, and does everything at an efficient level. With or without an above the rim ability, he's still good at attacking the lane, which is a good ability to have on our freaking team! Without above-the-rim ability, he'll have to adjust, especially learning how to absorb contact or draw foul better, so far that's what he needs to work on.

[fredericklove]

No doubt Nash gives him some "free" points, but we could see it in Orlando.. and on international tournament..the man has always been a talent, nice touch and great rebounder

I believe he was 10/10 in Orlando whenever D12 was out...

Dont think Nash "helps" him much with the rebounding aspect

Not some "free" points, every possession of his points is dictated by Nash, he's like a tall version of Amir, but a more talented one. He relies heavily on Nash's pick& roll str8 to the bucket way too much. Even in Orlando, he relies on guard's p&r. He's not one that can operate on his own, there's no shot-creating ability, and I don't want that type of guy at the 4 especially you have Val being that type at the 5 level.

[6Ft Under]

OK, there's no need to talk about Robinson or Sullinger here... it's highly unlikely that we come out of the draft with either of them. We're taking a wing player or Davis... let's just talk about those guys.

I think we're coming out of this draft with one of either Beal, Barnes, MKG, or Lamb. I prefer it be Beal. He has success written all over him.

+100000

sick of hearing about this t-rob guy he just not worth having at PF. We need to come out of this draft with another solid wing prospect or Davis

[Mr. Perfect]

Is there any way Beal could be a 1 in the NBA?

[Garmfay]

OK, there's no need to talk about Robinson or Sullinger here... it's highly unlikely that we come out of the draft with either of them. We're taking a wing player or Davis... let's just talk about those guys.

I think we're coming out of this draft with one of either Beal, Barnes, MKG, or Lamb. I prefer it be Beal. He has success written all over him.

+100000

sick of hearing about this t-rob guy he just not worth having at PF. We need to come out of this draft with another solid wing prospect or Davis

Couldn't agree more. We dont need like 6 PFs man

[SirHuey]

[fredericklove]

Is there any way Beal could be a 1 in the NBA?

I personally think he could, he can fit into any style you want. Just like he did in gator as a "SF" but of cos on a college level SF. But he can be a really good combo guard at 1, and he's good at attacking/passing, which are good assets for the 1, especially this position allows him to get the ball in his hand alot (what's not to like about that). And he has the quickness and footwork to guard the 1 too.

Being the 1 at Casey's system is really not that much of a big difference, its emphasize so much on ball movement thru p&r/screens, Beal can just bring the ball up, swing it around in early shot clock, or be the facilitator like he often does in gator system. Beal's so good at operating near the top of the key, that's pretty much what point guards do anyways. Instead of limiting Beal's minutes on the bench, why not have him play at 1? So we can keep Demar at 2 and whoever at 3. That's unless we're going to get a free agent point guard, if not, play Beal at the 1.

[_Choco_]

8-)

LOL Portland takes both Zellers in this scenario. Portland would burn on draft night if that were to occur.

If Portland still covets that big that they were robbed of, maybe a draft night deal could be arranged between Tor and Port, ie, if we get 4th, and ahead of NJ pick, take Drummond and deal him to Portland for their 2 firsts - provided they don't fall too far behind as I want Beal as the main piece. Kleiza could be used as a sweetener.

[BillyGM]

Thomas Robinson and Tyshawn Taylor in the NCAA final, as I said the best PG in the draft.

[Section 312]

The talent gap between Anthony Davis and the rest of the lottery is monumental.

Anthony Davis looks like the real deal & a rare franchise player.

Some of the the comments from NBA GMs to ESPN yesterday were:

Another old school GM just told me Davis reminds him of a young Olajuwan.

Everyone asking for Anthony Davis comps. Marcus Camby meets Kevin Garnett most common. But one GM insists he's Tim Duncan 2.0.

The rest of the field is worrisome. ESPN's Mock Draft 2.0

#2 - MHG is a stud but cannot create his own shot. He'll disappear offensively in some games.
#3 - Thomas Robinson - his upside as an NBA player will likely depend on how he improves his skill level on the offensive end
#3 - Brad Beal - smallish frame for 2 guard
#5- Andre Drummond - no offense
#6- Cody Zeller - too thin to defend NBAers (he's #2 on my board, though)
#7- Barnes - not assertive enough...disappeared in big games
#8- Perry Jones III - Rapstors already have one enigma
#9- Lilliard - good stats in poorer league (#3 on my board)
#10- McAdoo - small body of work to really know how he'll play
#11- Tyler Zeller - ok with limited upside
#12- Kendall Marshall - no D & poor athlete
#13- Sullinger - trouble with NBA length
#14 - Jeremy Lamb - low motor

[fredericklove]

You know we have the draft thread right?