Official Raptors 2011 NBA Draft Thread, Part 3

Post #1441 » by **FluLikeSymptoms** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:45 pm

raptorsnation_5 wrote:Is Perry Jones strictly a 4 ? or can he play the 3?

I'm sure this article has been posted on here x10 but since the convo has swung to Perry, here it is again. A big NYT piece from March 10th.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/13/magaz ... f=magazine

bboyskinnylegs · Post #1442 » by **bboyskinnylegs** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:49 pm

Perry's potential is probably higher than anyone else in this draft, the question is whether he has the mentality to utilize those talents to their fullest to go out and destroy people. Sometimes he seems content to take a backseat to others (which can fit in well as part of a team concept, although in a potential star prospect you want to see more assertiveness (kind of like how DeMar was somewhat passive in his first one-and-a-half seasons, before really turning it up and showing more of a killer instinct since the new year). If the Raps staff really feels like he can play the 3 full-time, and are committed to playing him through his mistakes, then I would definitely be happy with swinging for the fences and taking him--it would be the opposite of the mistake we've made with Bargnani, whose mentality has always been that of a wing player, and trying to make him something he's not (a 5) has left him being clearly inadequate. Of course you run the risk of him never really reaching his full potential though, like Anthony Randolph (although he doesn't come off as the type to try to do too much with the ball the way Randolph does).

Dr Positivity · Post #1443 » by **Dr Positivity** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:57 pm

Great Sullinger article: http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball ... nger020111

More and more I'm thinking he's the best prospect in this draft

Marlowe · Post #1444 » by **Marlowe** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:05 pm

I watched Sullinger over the weekend. He seems to have excellent post moves, strong phyiscally and seems to be very astute. I worry about his atheleticism and length relative to what he'd go up against in the NBA.

WhatsaTDot · Post #1445 » by **WhatsaTDot** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:10 pm

I dont want Sullinger at all so I'm glad his stock is rising.

Dr Positivity · Post #1446 » by **Dr Positivity** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:15 pm

To me the most important thing is basketball IQ and the two guys who have that in spades are Irving and Sullinger. And I care far more about weight than height for big men. I'd rather have 6'8 and winning the war of position than 7'0 and losing it

The part I love about the Sullinger pick is he seems like another Derozan in terms of a guy who'll do everything in his power to correct his flaws. You win with guys like Derozan and Sullinger. If Demar is a 20/4/4 wing and Sullinger is an 18/11 big and both guys are A++ in terms as teammates, in work ethic, unselfishness to win, etc. - that's a serious combo.

Would be complete opposite of Vince and Tmac really.

Yeezus_ · Post #1447 » by **Yeezus_** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:20 pm

Dr Mufasa wrote:To me the most important thing is basketball IQ and the two guys who have that in spades are Irving and Sullinger. And I care far more about weight than height for big men. I'd rather have 6'8 and winning the war of position than 7'0 and losing it

The part I love about the Sullinger pick is he seems like another Derozan in terms of a guy who'll do everything in his power to correct his flaws. You win with guys like Derozan and Sullinger. If Demar is a 20/4/4 wing and Sullinger is an 18/11 big and both guys are A++ in terms as teammates, in work ethic, unselfishness to win, etc. - that's a serious combo.

Would be complete opposite of Vince and Tmac really.

I dont mind drafting sullinger but we will have some serious decisions to make with ED/Amir/AB if we do. Im hoping AB and ED will be gone in that case..for an up and coming PG or C

ATLTimekeeper · Post #1448 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:21 pm

SDM wrote:
That's dependent on moving Bargs, which I don't think will happen. If Kantar's the BPA when we draft and we're moving ahead without Bargs, sure, why not. With the way the roster is constructed right now, the last thing we need is an undersized center who can't get off the ground, especially if we're pairing him with Bargnani.

I'm in full BPA mode. Hopefully we're drafting what will eventually be our best player (not necessarily the one we build around, but someone that will trump what we have at whatever position).

I have no problem if Kanter has little lift. As long as he knows where to be on rotations that's all I give a damn about. Of course, I don't have any evidence to back up that he does, but DX seemed to think he was quite active on defense and very competitive, so I'm interested.

This happens every year where the athleticism of a big gets questioned, but I find it almost never matters if the kid knows how to play and keeps his weight down.

ATLTimekeeper · Post #1449 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:24 pm

Reignman wrote:Just so everyone knows, Kanter had tendonitis issues in his knees. Now it might not sound like much but tendonitis for a big man in the NBA is the equivalent of arthritis for an elderly person.

The good news is that it's being reported that those tendonitis issues cleared up well before last summer and considering Kanter hasn't played any competitive ball this season outside of practising with the UK squad i think it has given him more than enough time to let it heal a bit.

I had Kanter really high on board in the summer and I've kept him in my top 5 or 6 but I think I'm going to give JV the slight edge right now based on his aggresiveness on D, his length and the fact that he seems to have a higher ceiling.

I wouldn't be upset with picking Kanter but I have Irving/Barnes/Jones/Jonas ahead of him.

From what I read it was something that occurred when he was 16 and hasn't been present in years. But, we'll see in the testing. Is that something that can show up on a test? Any physiotherapists out there that can answer this?

Prestige · Post #1450 » by **Prestige** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:25 pm

Dr Mufasa wrote:To me the most important thing is basketball IQ and the two guys who have that in spades are Irving and Sullinger. And I care far more about weight than height for big men. I'd rather have 6'8 and winning the war of position than 7'0 and losing it

The part I love about the Sullinger pick is he seems like another Derozan in terms of a guy who'll do everything in his power to correct his flaws. You win with guys like Derozan and Sullinger. If Demar is a 20/4/4 wing and Sullinger is an 18/11 big and both guys are A++ in terms as teammates, in work ethic, unselfishness to win, etc. - that's a serious combo.

Would be complete opposite of Vince and Tmac really.

Sullinger isn't going to dominate the NBA the same way he is the NCAA. The 'great character' guys who have success on the college level and win all those awards don't always have the same success in the pros. Evan Turner just last year is an example.

I care more about the potential to become a high caliber NBA player. If Sullinger was 7-ft, I would be more inclined to want to draft him. Right now he's undersized and without the athleticism and strength to dominate NBA guys. With those types of guys its a roll of the dice. He could become Mike Sweetney just as easily as he could become Dejuan Blair. Or just average like Chuck Hayes.

Reignman · Post #1451 » by **Reignman** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:46 pm

When I watch Sullinger play in college I try to envision him doing those same things against NBA bigs and I just don't see the upside.

Now his rebounding might carry over because the guy clearly knows how to track the ball and understands angles and positioning very well. On the flip side, I don't see any of his other skills translating like it has in college. His shot is going to get blocked and his defense is already mediocre to begin with so it's only going to look worse in the L.

To be honest, I'd be fairly upset if we drafted Sullinger. If he is BPA then I hope we trade down. Amir/Ed excite me a lot more than JS at the PF spot.

peZt · Post #1452 » by **peZt** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:55 pm

Enes Kanter was injured October or November 2008 and I think he missed 3 or 4 months. But thats all. He didn't have these issues for years or so. So i dont think that this will be a big problem for his draft stock.

He really reminds me of a bigger and better Luis Scola. I am sure that he will be a great player for many years in the nba.

Silk Wilkes · Post #1453 » by **Silk Wilkes** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:09 pm

peZt wrote:Enes Kanter was injured October or November 2008 and I think he missed 3 or 4 months. But thats all. He didn't have these issues for years or so. So i dont think that this will be a big problem for his draft stock.

He really reminds me of a bigger and better Luis Scola. I am sure that he will be a great player for many years in the nba.

Why does he remind you of Scola? Luis has an amazing post game, does Enes have one too? I think he looks like a less athletic Al Horford.

Steve Urkel · Post #1454 » by **Steve Urkel** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:10 pm

With the pieces we have right now AJ and ED, I would be upset if we drafted Sullinger, unless of course he was used in some kind of draft day deal to acquire some other prospect. I'm very concerned about how his game will translate to the NBA. I would like us to pick up one of the SF's if Irving isn't available and for whatever reason i'm leaning towards Barnes. I have concerns with Perry Jones and as I'm sure that this has been brought up before in this thread, I see some similarities between him and Marvin Williams.

ATLTimekeeper · Post #1455 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:10 pm

Sullinger reminds me of Boris Diaw with heart. Same as Kanter I have no qualms with a guy getting his shot blocked a lot. That has no bearing on whether you're a good player or not. I think the biggest knock on Sully is, like Blair, like Big Baby, he's going to struggle to defend guys.

666 · Post #1456 » by **666** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:22 pm

Lets start a professional Horse league and we can draft Jimmer Fredette with the #1 pick.

peZt · Post #1457 » by **peZt** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:39 pm

Youngblood wrote:
peZt wrote:Enes Kanter was injured October or November 2008 and I think he missed 3 or 4 months. But thats all. He didn't have these issues for years or so. So i dont think that this will be a big problem for his draft stock.

He really reminds me of a bigger and better Luis Scola. I am sure that he will be a great player for many years in the nba.

Why does he remind you of Scola? Luis has an amazing post game, does Enes have one too? I think he looks like a less athletic Al Horford.

Kanter absolutely has a post game. Actually its his biggest strength and the best part of his game. But he can shoot too from midrange.

ATLTimekeeper · Post #1458 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 12:45 pm

peZt wrote:
Youngblood wrote:
peZt wrote:Enes Kanter was injured October or November 2008 and I think he missed 3 or 4 months. But thats all. He didn't have these issues for years or so. So i dont think that this will be a big problem for his draft stock.

He really reminds me of a bigger and better Luis Scola. I am sure that he will be a great player for many years in the nba.

Why does he remind you of Scola? Luis has an amazing post game, does Enes have one too? I think he looks like a less athletic Al Horford.

Kanter absolutely has a post game. Actually its his biggest strength and the best part of his game. But he can shoot too from midrange.

Do you know what he's been doing all year? Has been working out with any teams or coaches?

Consequence · Post #1459 » by **Consequence** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 1:03 pm

ATLTimekeeper wrote:
Do you know what he's been doing all year? Has been working out with any teams or coaches?

He's an undergraduate coach with Kentucky; he gets to work out and practice with the team still.

Comeatme_Bro · Post #1460 » by **Comeatme_Bro** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 2:15 pm

Please no. We did not endure this hell of a season just to take Kanter. I'd rather have Val.