Thank Nation! Pre-Lottery: Denver 9th, NY pick 7th (PART 4)

[CoachJReturns]

Thon Maker won't be there when we are picking and Luwawu is nothing special ... At least Thon Maker has the highest potential in this draft, besides we drafted Bruno with the #20 pick and Thon Maker way better prospect and much more NBA ready then Bruno..

Sabonis a big man with T. rex arms, lacks athleticism, lacks shooting range.. Hmmm career in Europe or deep bench player ..

I have to agree with you here. Luwawu is not special by any means and taking him at 9 would be safe, but mediocre. This year we have a chance to truly swing for the fences for a guy ranked in the lottery. It's hit and miss, but you don't win championships with mediocre players. If I'm going safe at 9 I'd take Taurean Prince every time over Luwawu. Anyways, the point is to swing for the fences. You can't steal a base unless you don't fear being thrown out. Sure, Thon Maker or Skal Labissiere might be out of the NBA at the end of their rookie deals, and Luwawu might be a quality defender on a playoff team, but there's also the chance that Thon/Skal become defensive, shot blocking, floor stretching bigs while Luwawu is still just that solid defender. Screw that. You don't win championships by being safe and mediocre. Go hard or go home.

I'm not so sure Luwawu is mediocre. Excellent athlete, 3 point shot and good defender and excellent frame. I think his potential goes way beyond being just a quality defender.

The thing about Thon and Skal it they haven't shown anything yet. After combine and workouts I may warm up to them but right now they are about as Bruno as it gets. Complete high potential mysteries.

I don't believe you need to jump at every unknown to find high end talent. If we pick luwawu, Prince, Rabb, etc etc. it doesn't matter to me. I think we have a team in place that is very good at what it does.

If they pick Thon or Skal cool. But I'm not going to cheer for it without seeing something. At least with Luwawu and Sabonis I can see a body of work.

Agree completely. Skal and Maker are these big mysteries who could be special, but are more likely to disappoint. That's not a knock them. Most players don't live up to their potential, or become more than raw prospects. Guys like Luwawu and Rabb are likely to at least become solid rotation players as they've shown enough progress and production to expect as much. They have tools and potential to possibly become special as well, but are also much less likely to bust and be a complete waste of a pick.
I was hoping for us to get a pick in the 5-7 this year and land a star, but I think I'm changing my strategy. This team is making the playoffs. It still has glaring weaknesses at SF(Demarre is broken down) and PF. We don't need to win the lottery on this pick. We just need to get a good player, who projects to be a likely NBA starter and two way player.
If and when this team is ever dismantled in a few years time, after Lowry is past his prime and the winning has stopped, then we tank and go for the superstar pick. At the moment this team is not in that position. I'm not saying we can't draft an all-star with this pick, but I'd prefer it be someone who's at least shown they will be a good player and might take a step in the future toward stardom. I don't really want some long and skinny big who could be Garnett(unlikely) or could be Bender/Swift/Wood etc.

Draft a guy with two way potential who will likely be a solid player in two to three years. Just my opinion of course.

If Masai sees something in Maker that he likes, he can trade some of our MANY assets to grab him. These include Bruno(unlikely), Ross, Wright, Powell, Bebe, Joseph, 2016 Raptors pick, 2017 Raptors pick, 2017 Clippers pick.
None of these guys are major pieces, so Masai should be fine with pulling the trigger on a deal if Maker is his guy.

[kron100]

Can't imagine how tough were gonna be when Batum signs here

[JJ From Deep]

**** man can the Bucks, Kings, or Pelicans just win a **** game or two!? I get excited seeing the Nuggets dropping games just to see these other teams losing just as many

[artsncrafts]

**** man can the Bucks, Kings, or Pelicans just win a **** game or two!? I get excited seeing the Nuggets dropping games just to see these other teams losing just as many

Bucks are so bad its not even funny, they thought they were going to the finals in the off season.

[cammac]

Well this will be a interesting off season both in the draft and free agency. This is the year he needs to build the team to contender status. Powell was a great pick and seems ready with his confidence ready to replace Ross in the lineup. I totally disagreed with Masai extending Ross but I was totally wrong he basically is putting up Harrison Barnes numbers. See him moved for a draft pick teams like Houston, Chicago, Detroit & Memphis could certainly use him and give up there 2017 1st. or Philly giving up Saric for him when BC is GM.

[CoachJReturns]

Every draft theres at least 2 superstars that get drafted between 11-30 but I just don't see it this year.

I wouldn't say superstars. I'd say every few have one or two all-stars drafted outside the top 10. Mostly you're looking at role players, bench guys and a dozen players who will be out the league in a few years. And when there are star players outside of the top 10( heck outside of the top 5) nobody sees it. That's why they weren't drafted earlier in the first place.

The one thing I've learned, if I've learned anything, from the 20 plus years I've followed the draft is they never turn out as people expect down the road. Drafts projected as weak, or mediocre turn out to be good or great, great drafts usually disappoint.
The 1996 draft is arguably the greatest ever in terms of the number of all-stars and MVPs produced, but NOBODY made it out to be something special leading up to it. It was just another year. Then out of nowhere it seemed like the whole lottery became all-stars.

The best anyone can do is look at a players skills and physical tools and figure if those are usually effective at the next level. It also helps to have a team where guys accept their roles and are given roles that give them the opportunity to succeed. Still inevitably, someone comes along every draft or two who succeeds without fitting any of the typical molds and does well regardlesss of their situation. That's just the way it goes.

[CoachJReturns]

**** man can the Bucks, Kings, or Pelicans just win a **** game or two!? I get excited seeing the Nuggets dropping games just to see these other teams losing just as many

Bucks are so bad its not even funny, they thought they were going to the finals in the off season.

Yup. They need to regroup. The only positive developments are Parker coming back from injury to look like he could still be something and Giannis becoming an all-star in the second half of the season. They need to fill the rest of the roster with defenders and 3 point shooters. That means they have to somehow get rid of Monroe and his contract. They can't have Parker AND Monroe in the frontcourt together. It's an awful pairing defensively.

[kron100]

If we pick 10th i think we have at chance at Sabo

[Tortiglioni]

If we pick 10th i think we have at chance at Sabo

100% chance he is there. 0% chance we draft him (at 10).

[Brinbe]

Probably already been mentioned, but anyone else getting an Ivan Chiriaev-vibe from Thon Maker? He's just not good at all and he really should be going to school to develop. He's in danger of ruining his future, not being drafted till the 2nd round and potentially just washing out altogether.

[kron100]

If we pick 10th i think we have at chance at Sabo

100% chance he is there. 0% chance we draft him (at 10).

Let's just hope he's not taken with the 8th pick

[JJ From Deep]

If we pick 10th i think we have at chance at Sabo

A chance? I don't even see him being picked in the lottery at all, he's closer to an 18-20 range selection

[0 - 100]

If we pick 10th i think we have at chance at Sabo

100% chance he is there. 0% chance we draft him (at 10).

Let's just hope he's not taken with the 8th pick

Arvydas stop boosting your son. He won't get picked in the lottery.

[DreamTeam09]

Sabonis is a taller glorified Hansbrough. No athletic ability, kinda stiff. Definitely not a top 10 player.

[0 - 100]

Probably already been mentioned, but anyone else getting an Ivan Chiriaev-vibe from Thon Maker? He's just not good at all and he really should be going to school to develop. He's in danger of ruining his future, not being drafted till the 2nd round and potentially just washing out altogether.

Yeah, big mistake for him to be coming out this year. His game needs a lot of work, he is still very raw. He should have went to college this year and next to improve his game and play against real players and be in a proper system.

He would have struggled in college. The hype for this guy is what will make him get drafted late 1st

[kron100]

Sabonis is a taller glorified Hansbrough. No athletic ability, kinda stiff. Definitely not a top 10 player.

Nah sabonis can score

[DreamTeam09]

Sabonis is a taller glorified Hansbrough. No athletic ability, kinda stiff. Definitely not a top 10 player.

Nah sabonis can score

So could Tyler in college

[Throwback24]

If we pick 10th i think we have at chance at Sabo

100% chance he is there. 0% chance we draft him (at 10).

Don't care who we pick, just as long as Ujiri can find a suitable trading partner.

[kron100]

Dont even go comparing Sab to Hansbrough, Sabonis is all about his buisness.

[BoyzNTheHood]

Thon or Skal. Barf. We already have one of those 2 years away from being useful guys in the 905 that we wasted a first on. Yeah, you Bruno.

Prince over Luwawu? Hmmm, I'll assume you like Prince better because you know what level of competition he has played against in college. Otherwise... why? Very similar stats, same height, pogo stick jumping ability, I don't know about Prince, but Luwawu has huge hands. Don't know either player's wingspan off the top of my head. And Luwawu is a year younger playing against men right now. If you want to talk potential, give the edge to Luwawu.

The Nuggets pick, which will fall in the 8-11 range, isn't where you pick the players with the most potential. It is where you get a guy with a high floor that will definitely be able to contribute. Yes, getting a guy like Luwawu or Prince in this range is what we should be aiming for. Not the Skal or Thon types who are 99% potential at this point.

A) 7.9 TRB/40, .361 3pt%, .432 FG%, .514 eFG%, 20.8 Pts/40, 3.0 AST/40, 1.7 STL/40, 1.0 BLK/40, .551 TS%, 20.3 PER. Prince

B) 6.1 TRB/40, .372 3pt%, .398 FG%, .482 eFG%, 18.8 Pts/40, 3.6 AST/40, 2.2 STL/40, 0.5 BLK/40, .521 TS%, 16.8 PER Luwawu

Yup, very close. IF we pick one of these two SFs, are we doing it with the intention of trading Carroll within a year or so? Perhaps the following summer?

I think the following summer, we might have bigger needs. A decision will have to be made about Kyle then. He is already 30. He will be 31 when he opts out next summer. Does he have the kind of game that will last through another 5 year contract? Should Masai even be considering maxing Kyle for his 31st to 36th years? I've seen a lot of players have their game turn to mush once they turn 30. And a very few, like Nash, who can just keep chugging along at a high level for longer than most.

However,... Man, if we pass on Valentine just because he is an inch shorter than Prince and Luwawu, despite being better at almost every measurable game statistic, ... well that just might be something we live to regret. Drummondesq.

C) 9.1 TRB/40, .444 3pt%, .462 FG%, .579 eFG%, 23.3 Pts/40, 9.4 AST/40, 1.3 STL/40, 0.3 BLK/40, .608 TS%, 29.7 PER. Valentine

Don't complain to me about his D. It is excellent when taken in context. Because he was so much bigger than his starting SG and SF, he HAD to guard the opposing team's bigger faster SGs and SFs and not the usual tiny PGs you normally see in college. Remember, this is the guy that beat out Hield, Ingram, Simmons (well he was disqualified last minute) for college player of the year. I just do not get why mocks don't have him as a top ten pick - yet. He shoots almost as well as Hield, clearly rebounds better than the SF's getting all the talk above, even rebounds better than half of the PFs that will be in the lottery, has a higher assist/40 rate than ALL of the PGs in the draft, truly excellent TS% and a very high PER as well. Personally, I'd take him over anyone but Ingram, Simmons, Bender and Murray. This guy is like the slightly smaller version, 6'6", of what you'd get if you crossed Draymond Green, 6'7", and Magic Johnson, 6'9". When you see something like this in the draft, how can you possibly pass on it? He could be our new Kyle. He is already better than Wright and Joseph. He can sub in at PG and SG perfectly, and even SF if needed.

I'd really like to see Valentine, Powell, Bruno, and the PF we add in June, be our new young gunz. If JV keeps developing, he could be the C that grows up with these guys.

Also, the PF should be Brice Johnson. Excellent rebounder, high motor, plays above the rim, and a perfect fit for an excellent passing player like Valentine. Picture Griffin and a 5" taller version of CP3. That could be your future Valentine/Johnson pairing.

Or the PF could be Deyonta Davis. He might fall that far. Or Skal. Or Benj Bentil. All would be great fits with Valentine.

But we can't be locked in on anyone I suppose until we see what the other teams ahead of us do in the draft. Unfortunately, I think that was Masai's problem when he made the huge reach for Bruno. Tunnel Vision. He could have had Hood, then traded for Bruno when some other team saw how incredibly raw he actually was. I hope he learned from that mistake and goes BPA. Worry about the fit down the road. These rookie deals are practically free compared to some of the monster deals that will be handed out this summer. Don't trade your picks/rookies away. Trade away your high or over priced talent for more high draft picks.

Thon or Skal are potential picks like you said. Anyone on their bandwagons are going out on a limb, it's much easier to doubt them. Their success will be about the fit and the development they receive.

When it comes to Prince and Luwawu it's not about potential. I'd argue that Prince's contributions will be fairly well known. He'll be a DeMarre Carrol type in the NBA, whether it's a poor mans or a rich mans version is unknown.

Btw, I'm fine if we pick Valentine as well. But he will have to play SG/SF in the NBA. There's no way he's guarding NBA bigs with his 8'7" standing reach. They'll just shoot over him, and NBA guards will go past him. He's definitely a guy you'd have to hide on defense. That's probably the reason a lot of people jumped off his bandwagon, because Casey/Ujiri have focused on drafting for defense. This kid is not Paul Millsap, he's more of a smaller Boris Diaw. Still, with all of that said I'd be completely fine if he was our selection. Coming out with Valentine/Bentil on draft night would be a dream for me, although I have others ranked higher on my wishlist.