Shams: Cleveland and Boston have agreement on deal to send Kyrie Irving to the Celtics for Isaiah Thomas package to Cavs

[OAKLEY_2]

IT was basically the blue collar, low cost version of Kyrie Irving's all offence/no defence impact.

To basically get the better version of that (with way less heart and fight and grit) while sacrificing your poor man's version + Jae Crowder + a top 3 pick in a great draft + Zizic is pretty insane. I wasn't super high on Thomas as a primary guy but on the Cavs he can slot right into that Kyrie role.

Boston moves from being possibly the next great dynasty to a position of some NBA finals appearances in the post Lebron era. They lost insane defense. Avery Bradley and Jae Crowder both out. Crazy.

The Cavs get a great haul to build with if Lebron leaves.

Raptors lose by both of our biggest rivals working together. The bright side is that when we next rebuild we'll be rebuilding more to rise up when the 76ers begin to fade than the Celtics.

I'm not huge on Brown or Tatum. I think there's a chance that the top 4 pick next year could be better than either. I also think Smart is overrated.

Raptors win here imo. Cavs get better (but we weren't winning against them anyways. Boston potentially get worse today (could see it either way) and they definitely get worse in the future and approach topping out. Celtics shouldn't have given up that pick

While the Celtics lost, the Raptors are definitely not winners lol they're irrelevant.

CLE is even more stacked than before so no chance we beat them n likewise have greatly improved their odds of keeping LBJ because they also have a pick to dangle to add yet another star to their already LOADED team.

We have a fake "3 year window" but we didn't filly commit to it. We took a HALF MEASURE. We brought back the MEDIUM 3 and won't use our young guys in a trade to try and find a star and pissed away a pick to dump a crappy contract Masai made...although likely that roleplaying youth likely isn't good enough to get an all star back in a trade and equally unable to help propel us by the Cavs and Celtics. Kyrie, Hayward, Tatum etc will only be getting better with time where as old ass Lowry n Ibaka will be declining. Least we forget D Wade will likely join CLE so yeah we're just EC fodder like the rest of it.

Anyone else think KL is trade bait once January comes around? Clippers?

[YogurtProducer]

I have a feeling the Cavs still might try to keep Lebron and flip Zizic and the Brooklyn pick for a 4th star to compete with the Warriors. Let's say Shumpert, Zizic and the Nets pick for Marc Gasol.

The player would be Tristan for contract reasons n LBJ hate for Khloe.

Also if they got Gasol they don't "compete" they unbelievably found a way to surpass GSW to create the most insanely stacked team I've seen.

IT/Smith/LBJ/Love/Gasoline isn't even the most insane stacked team in the NBA today let alone what I've ever seen that team gets spanked by GSW still. Jesus man you are so out of the loop

[dTox]

This was a big time move from a rookie GM, the Cavs came out like bandits. Now they can flip that pick for another star, should one become available

Sent from my SM-G935W8 using Tapatalk

[Throwback24]

Betting the Cavs are going to use that pick to trade for a veteran all star at the deadline in a last ditch effort to convince LeBron to stay and win a championship.

That's their smartest move n would be his. IT vs Curry is kinda a wash n Crowder helps tighten up defensively especially on Klay n Draymond. Not to mention they swapped out Deron Williams for Derrick Rose as their back up. Unbelievably the Cavs just got even better and even more unbelievable if they can flip that pick n say Tristan for an all star/borderline all star they actually become even more stacked than GState imo n have done the seemingly impossible all thanks to Ainge's incompetence.

in what world? curry is FAR superior.

Folks are also severely overrating Crowders abilities.

[Zeno]

The trade benefits both teams but I think the Cavs won this trade. They replaced kyrie with another allstar PG and got even more icing on the cake. Either way both these teams are better than us. The race in the East is clearly between the celtics and The cavs.

I agree but there is a slight blow up in your face angle in the short-term for both teams too. Losing Crowder isn't great and Irving still hasn't actually been able to be a net positive on the court when leading a team. For the Cavs, if IT's hip isn't good to go, they've taken a step back.

[Rapcity_11]

Betting the Cavs are going to use that pick to trade for a veteran all star at the deadline in a last ditch effort to convince LeBron to stay and win a championship.

That's their smartest move n would be his. IT vs Curry is kinda a wash n Crowder helps tighten up defensively especially on Klay n Draymond. Not to mention they swapped out Deron Williams for Derrick Rose as their back up. Unbelievably the Cavs just got even better and even more unbelievable if they can flip that pick n say Tristan for an all star/borderline all star they actually become even more stacked than GState imo n have done the seemingly impossible all thanks to Ainge's incompetence.

Nah, the smart move is telling LeBron you'll trade the pick next offseason to see if he sticks around. It he decides to stay you make the deal then. If not, you hold the pick.

[hankscorpioLA]

To basically get the better version of that (with way less heart and fight and grit) while sacrificing your poor man's version + Jae Crowder + a top 3 pick in a great draft + Zizic is pretty insane. I wasn't super high on Thomas as a primary guy but on the Cavs he can slot right into that Kyrie role.

While I agree that Cleveland got the better of the deal, the fact is that the best individual player in the deal is going to Boston.

And the fact is that the main piece going to Cleveland is a player with a significant limitation due to his size. While he overcame that last year, at least on offense, it remains an issue - especially when he is looking to get paid like an elite player.

Also - I will be very surprised if the Nets finish in the bottom 3.

[CeltsfanSinceBirth]

Boston in shambles and feels good

Says who? I'm pretty happy about the deal. Especially when the Lakers pick conveys and ends up being higher than the Nets pick.

The only way Ainge looks semi-competent is if he has knowledge that IT2's hip problems are serious enough to lower his value drastically. Still not enough to make it a good trade. Celtics fans will be hoping all year that the Nets pick falls to like 7-8.

Also, Irving could very easily leave in two years. Not much of a "for the future" type of trade when you're potentially trading away a potential 2018 unprotected top 5 pick for two years of slight upgrade at PG.

Honestly, if I was a Celtics fan I’d be pissed off to think all those assets accumulated along the years could potentially turn into two years of Irving/Heyward/Horford as the nucleus. That’s it?!

Isaiah is due for a good contract. He wants the max. Ainge didn't want to pay him. He's also got a bad hip that even people in Boston aren't sure about. Brad Stevens said he had to undergo one more test in September. NBA history also shows that smallish PGs don't do too well once they hit 30. It would have been a disaster to sign IT to a Kyle Lowry type contract, only to have him break down in the 1st year of his new deal.

Kyrie is 3 years younger, is on contract for 2 more seasons (3 if you count his player option), and is getting paid $18-20 million/year. Celtics save money so they can re-sign Marcus Smart next summer, clear up playing time for Brown and Tatum, and get a younger, bigger version of Isaiah Thomas. That Nets pick, if it turns out to be top 3, could turn the tides in Cleveland's favor. However, Ainge has held on to previous Nets picks with a death grip. Could have gotten Butler or George and wouldn't have lost Thomas in either deal. But today, he just decides to throw in that Nets pick instead of insisting on giving the Cavs the Lakers pick, plus more picks (Cs still own 1st rounders from the Clips, Grizz, as well as all of their picks)? I'm telling you right now - Ainge values that Lakers pick more than he does that Nets pick. We'll see how it plays out.

The fact that Kyrie is 3 years younger than IT helps to extend the Celtics window. By the time Brown and Tatum are able to start on a full-time basis (maybe in 2-3 years), IT would have been on the downside of his career. Kyrie will still be in his prime.

[PhilBlackson]

I have a feeling the Cavs still might try to keep Lebron and flip Zizic and the Brooklyn pick for a 4th star to compete with the Warriors. Let's say Shumpert, Zizic and the Nets pick for Marc Gasol.

The player would be Tristan for contract reasons n LBJ hate for Khloe.

Also if they got Gasol they don't "compete" they unbelievably found a way to surpass GSW to create the most insanely stacked team I've seen.

IT/Smith/LBJ/Love/Gasoline isn't even the most insane stacked team in the NBA today let alone what I've ever seen that team gets spanked by GSW still. Jesus man you are so out of the loop

If you're so confident I will bet you my account versus yours that if CLE gets Gasol while retaining IT, Crowder and Love they will beat GS. Put your money where your mouth is

[Vee-Rex]

This deal gives the Cavs a TON more flexibility. How? Because now we can decide to either go all in should LeBron commit and stay by:

1. Resigning Isaiah and
2. Packaging the Brk pick (with a combination of Shump/Frye/TT/whoever else) for a vet/all-star that could help us compete with GS

OR, letting Isaiah walk (and not maxing him) and starting our rebuild via Brooklyn's pick should Bron leave or refrain from committing.

We're far more flexible right now as a result of that deal.

Not to mention:

I think the IT/LeBron PnR is gonna flourish.

It's very telling how the two best Cavs players (LeBron/Kyrie) weren't able to dominate in the PnR. Because Kyrie's vision wasn't good. However, IT would dominate running the PnR with LeBron.

And if he's surrounded by shooters in Korver, JR, Frye, etc... (depending on future trades), he'll rack up assists in a way Kyrie just wasn't good enough to do.

The deal isn't as bad for Boston as people are saying, because it made sense for them to give up the pieces that they did for the direction they're going. But it was a FANTASTIC deal for Cleveland.

[peralta]

now that Celtics got fleeced...is the Atlantic Div ours for the taking again?

[LJKO]

Boston in shambles and feels good

Says who? I'm pretty happy about the deal. Especially when the Lakers pick conveys and ends up being higher than the Nets pick.

Forget about the pick and think about it; IT+Crowder for Irving. Irving is good and all but your taking Lebron out of the equation here and if you look back at the days before lebron return the Cavs are trash run by Irving. If Masai was Ainge and he did that trade all the Raptors Fan would be gunning for his head

[Rapcity_11]

The issue you guys are projecting the Nets as one of the worst teams in the lg when they are not.

Terrible teams that trade their best player usually stay terrible. The Nets suck.

[Steelo Green]

Calling it now. Nets pick won't even be top 5 unless they got lucky through the lottery.

They likely have the worst record in the NBA so at worst it's the 4th pick in the draft.

Dude.... LeBron is leaving and its the Cavs.. they will WIN the lottery.. It's how the universe works.

I'm not sure what your point had to do with anything. I was saying that this pick is going to be great regardless of anything. It could very well be the number one pick.

[Primoz_Brezec]

Is

IT-Wade-LeBron-Love-Gasol

Rose-Korver-Crowder

Possible?

[YogurtProducer]

The player would be Tristan for contract reasons n LBJ hate for Khloe.

Also if they got Gasol they don't "compete" they unbelievably found a way to surpass GSW to create the most insanely stacked team I've seen.

IT/Smith/LBJ/Love/Gasoline isn't even the most insane stacked team in the NBA today let alone what I've ever seen that team gets spanked by GSW still. Jesus man you are so out of the loop

If you're so confident I will bet you my account versus yours that if CLE gets Gasol while retaining IT, Crowder and Love they will beat GS. Put your money where your mouth is

I would gladly make that bet except not for my account as I do not see why I would want your account? Lmao I never understood account bets

[PhilBlackson]

Raptors win here imo. Cavs get better (but we weren't winning against them anyways. Boston potentially get worse today (could see it either way) and they definitely get worse in the future and approach topping out. Celtics shouldn't have given up that pick

While the Celtics lost, the Raptors are definitely not winners lol they're irrelevant.

CLE is even more stacked than before so no chance we beat them n likewise have greatly improved their odds of keeping LBJ because they also have a pick to dangle to add yet another star to their already LOADED team.

We have a fake "3 year window" but we didn't filly commit to it. We took a HALF MEASURE. We brought back the MEDIUM 3 and won't use our young guys in a trade to try and find a star and pissed away a pick to dump a crappy contract Masai made...although likely that roleplaying youth likely isn't good enough to get an all star back in a trade and equally unable to help propel us by the Cavs and Celtics. Kyrie, Hayward, Tatum etc will only be getting better with time where as old ass Lowry n Ibaka will be declining. Least we forget D Wade will likely join CLE so yeah we're just EC fodder like the rest of it.

Cavs don't change. It Still all comes down to LBJs performance as he is the only one who matters in that series. If he's hurt we win.

They also didn't add a star.. they downgraded to IT and added Crowder while losing Kyrie. Where is this other star coming from?

What package was Masai to make again to get another star..? I fail to see what deal he missed out on.

Regarding Boston, Horford is already north of 30, and Kyrie is not a true star. I like Hayward a love, but that teams ceiling isn't better than last years Cavaliers that got killed in the finals and only won 51 games. Hayward isn't better then Lebron. Kyrie is Kyrie. Horford isn't better than Love. Plus Cleveland had TT, Smith, Frye, etc. Sure Boston has Tatum and Brown, but odds are they don't pan out and by the time they actually contribute Horford will he nearly done and Kyrie/Gordon will be on the decline.

Raptors could easily beat out Boston next year. The only elite team in the East continues to be Cleveland

Wrong.

They have changed.

CLE only needs Kyrie to score in bunches and the clutch....which is exactly what Thomas can and does do...it an even higher clip than Kyrie but let's say it evens out now that they swapped places. Crowder is a BIG upgrade over anyone they had at SG. He's a strong, physical defender that can help LBJ not over expend his energy defensively by being able to take on any of Klay, Durant and Green much better than anyone they presently have (not to mention throughout the season) AND....they dumped the carcass of Deron Williams in exchange for Derrick Rose who yes certainly is pre-injury Rose but he is a HUGE upgrade over Deron as a back up PG.

Also I'm not saying BOS is much better NOW but that they secured the later while also likely being near our level now too lol and in the future when Kyrie, Hayward, Tatum, Brown etc start coming into their own do surpass us. Because after this next year that's a wash AND you're forgetting CLE has a pick to add yet another star now that they could actually have the best situation for LBJ in the league....at absolute best an already old looking Ibaka ages another year and Kyle puts further pounding on an unreliable body come Playoff time in addition to aging himself....so no we're no better off now or the future.

The only team that didn't change their projection is us, hence being irrelevant.

[dalton749]

Danny might have made a smart move by doing this because it could possibly dismantle the Cav's next year with Isaiah and lebron expiring, and Boston will have as good a chance as any team in the east to make the finals the year after.

It'll be a fun matchup playing Boston this year though

Kyle v Kyrie
Demar v Hayward
ibaka v horford
Powell v brown

[SharoneWright]

Pick makes this a great deal for the Cavs. Plus with IT coming off the books at the same time LeBron might leave, it gives them a heck of a lot of control.

[Double Helix]

Kyrie has been in the league 6 years. In half of them he did not exceed 59 games played due to injuries.

He's a great talent but based on the little injury stuff he's had already at a young age I'm surprised they felt the need to overpay this much to get him.