Raptors attempting to trade up in the draft

[mtcan]

mocks aren't always accurate

Yep that is true but idk if Edey is the guy Masai is trading up for....Its not that i don't like Edey and wouldn't mind it i just look at Masai track record in guys he likes....Hes going for Salaun if i were to put my money on it.

Friendly reminder that we drafted Bruno 20th when he was a forecasted to go #50-60 or undrafted. Masai doesn’t think like us.


Also, if you google Bruno Caboclo, it auto fills “Bruno Caboclo two years away”

Masai doesn't care about you or your favourites.
Bruno certainly was a reach.
Pascal was a reach.
I'd argue that Barnes was a reach since everyone thought that Suggs was the right pick at #4.

[SpezNc]

But Darko said in an interview that they were happy the pick conveyed because it's a weak draft and next year will be better. Now all of a sudden they want to trade up into the lottery?

we had a lottery pick. oh wait...

I think we are reading way too much into Darko’s comment. The FO was fine with both outcome . Obviously he is going to give the argument of conveying. Also I suspect he is happy to close the chapter of “should we keep the pick or not”.

The argument with conveying does not mean that you can not trying to trade up in the lottery .

Both aren’t mutually exclusive IMO

[SpezNc]

I don't think we should read too much into this kind of rumour. First of all, we have no idea who KOC's source is, especially when we know that the Raps rarely leak and commentators like KOC often talk about how they have no idea what's going on behind the scenes with the Raptors.

We also don't know the context for the rumour. For instance, maybe the Raps are in discussions with teams (like OKC or Sac) on moving Bruce Brown, and in the context of that discussion the idea of the Raps brining back their 1st picks this year came up, which would technically be moving into the lottery from 19, but could be more about trying to get value for Brown. Then that gets aggregated with some rumours about the Blazers and the Cavs into "there are a few teams trying to move up in the draft".

I could not agree more . Context matters . And often the way the rumours is presented overstated his importance.

[dTox]

I think this is an aggregator, KOC and Vernon were spit balling trade scenarios on the mismatch pod and this was one of them, I don't believe KOC said this is a legit trade rumor. The tweet is misleading it.

[NBA Sheady]

With this being such a weak draft it's *slightly* more conceivable someone wants to trade their pick.

[Merit]

In an ideal world:

Kennard + flotsam + 9

for

Poeltl + 31

-soft reset on the Poeltl trade

-get our draft target at #9

-take step back next year to get top 5 pick

-possibly address C of the future with 9/19 or ‘25 1st

-if we still desire a somewhat competent C then overpay Goga Bitadze at 2/20. He looked solid in ORL this past season but got pushed out of the rotation behind WCJ and Isaac

I agree that I probably wouldn’t want to give up 19 to get to 9 but there are possible downstream upsides like making our 2025 pick better by getting rid of Poeltl. Basically it’s Poeltl, 19th and 10th (‘25 1st) vs 9 and top 5 in ‘25. In a vacuum it’s not terrible considering moving from 19 > 9 probably costs another pick between 17-23 (which is probably Poeltl’s value). If we have to take back salary that changes the equation though.

I think if we get Kennard/Clarke/Aldama for Jak we would be set in terms of depth across our roster. Clarke is still solid, and he’s also Canadian. Aldama imo is a decent rotational player. Kennard is our GTJ replacement. In this scenario we also move Bruce Brown and McDaniels for Wiggins. No picks.


IQ/
RJ/Kennard
Wiggins/Gradey
Scottie/Clarke
Aldama/

We still have Boucher and Kennard to trade at the deadline, plus the MLE, LLE, 9, 19.

I don’t know, it seems like trading Poeltl is a clear tanking move. Making win-now follow up moves like Wiggins doesn’t make a lot of sense. If we trade Poeltl our defense falls apart and we’re a bottom 7 team so what’s the point of Wiggins? If we are rolling with Olynyk and Aldama as our centers we will be terrible defensively. Combine that with a middling offense and that’s a recipe for a bottom 5 team.

I think I’m looking longer term than you and feel we will be bad enough even with wiggins if we move Jak. I doubt we are able to get wiggins next year, so now is the time. You’re right though - I’m more about team win now/team stealth tank than team outright tank.

I’d rather we keep Jak and get wiggins and see where the chips fall. I’m confident that we can get inexpensive depth through the draft, and I’m hopeful for better than that. The draft has historically been our strength.

I also feel we can still fleece a team. I happen to think Wiggins + 2025 pick for Brown + 2026 Indy pick makes some sense. I can see the warriors flopping hard and that 2025 pick of theirs having a fair bit of value.

[OAKLEY_2]

Alot think if we trade up its for Edey...I don't think thats the reason we would be trading up though....Edey is a 15-25 projected atm...We wouldn't need to move up that high to get Edey....

Knowing Masai track record and players he likes to target Salaun makes the most logical sense...I actually like Edey but the chances Masai trying to move into the top 10 to draft him makes little sense to me.

mocks aren't always accurate

Yep that is true but idk if Edey is the guy Masai is trading up for....Its not that i don't like Edey and wouldn't mind it i just look at Masai track record in guys he likes....Hes going for Salaun if i were to put my money on it.

That is what Sam Vecenie proposed in his latest Mocking game of draft speculation. Poetl 19 plus 31 for 9 and Kennard. All done for Salaun. I can see it but more as the work of Presti or Pritchard not Masai. I always thought we'd make moves to get Cason Wallace vs. just hang and wait for a drop like Whitmore which ended up being Gradey stand pat at 13.

[ForeverTFC]

With this being such a weak draft it's *slightly* more conceivable someone wants to trade their pick.

The word is that there are teams willing to move off of lottery picks but that their counterparts aren't willing to pay the asking price.

In a recent pod with Simmons, Russillo mentioned that the value of a late lottery pick in this draft seems to be the 7th man on a roster based on front office guys he's spoken to. If you're willing to give up a starter, you can move up but sounds like no one is valuing these picks to that level. In turn, If I'm a team with number 11 for example, I'd rather make the pick than take a bench piece back if that's all I'm getting offered to me.

[RoteSchroder]

Yep that is true but idk if Edey is the guy Masai is trading up for....Its not that i don't like Edey and wouldn't mind it i just look at Masai track record in guys he likes....Hes going for Salaun if i were to put my money on it.

Friendly reminder that we drafted Bruno 20th when he was a forecasted to go #50-60 or undrafted. Masai doesn’t think like us.


Also, if you google Bruno Caboclo, it auto fills “Bruno Caboclo two years away”

Masai doesn't care about you or your favourites.
Bruno certainly was a reach.
Pascal was a reach.
I'd argue that Barnes was a reach since everyone thought that Suggs was the right pick at #4.

After the Bruno disaster, he used IBM's Watson and started going after prospects with good advanced metrics + on-court performance

Pascal wasn't really a reach, it's just that a lot of losers wanted two obvious bums in Skal and Davis, comparable to Salaun and KyShawn in this draft. Siakam was mocked at #25, 28, 30, 33, 54 pre-draft, so getting drafted at 27 was fairly reasonable. Bruno on the other hand...

In terms of him specifically going after forwards, here's his draft history:

Delon Wright, Norman Powell, Jakob Poeltl, Dalano Banton, Christian Koloko, Evan Fournier, Izzet Turkyilmaz, Xavier Thames, Malachi Flynn, David Johnson, Jalen Harris, Gradey Dick

OG, Siakam, Bruno, Scottie, Faried, Quincy Miller, DeAndre Daniels, Dewan Hernandez

So 8 out of 20 of his picks have been forwards (40%). Two out of 5 positions is 40%

[seanbig]

Raptors trying and failing to move up in the draft - rinse and repeat

It’s like trading core players before their value tanks lol

[XTC]

Raptors trying and failing to move up in the draft - rinse and repeat

It’s like trading core players before their value tanks lol

Has Masai EVER moved up in the draft?

I just don't buy it.

[metafisical]

Raptors trying and failing to move up in the draft - rinse and repeat

It’s like trading core players before their value tanks lol

Has Masai EVER moved up in the draft?

I just don't buy it.

Me neither. Masai probably turned off his work phone when the regular season ended and won't turn it back on until after the draft finishes. He isn't going to do any trades. However, I hope to be proven wrong.

[canada_dry]

Getting the #9 for Poeltl would be hilarious. We drop 1 pick for year and a half of Poeltl.

It would have to be for a brandon clarke and Zaire added too though. Another big and a young guy with potential added to the pick is fine with me. Even one of the 2. No problem there.

Poetl for 9+ garbage for contract purposes straight up is a lot less palatable.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

Doubt we get anything extra from the Grizz for Yak....That would be a better package than what we got for all NBA Siakam.

Honestly i don't think brandon clarke off an Achilles is too much of a reach. I saw someone including zaire Williams on top of that lol. That might be a bit much. But maybe not if they really want that 5 on the roster to truly compete.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

[OAKLEY_2]

Friendly reminder that we drafted Bruno 20th when he was a forecasted to go #50-60 or undrafted. Masai doesn’t think like us.


Also, if you google Bruno Caboclo, it auto fills “Bruno Caboclo two years away”

Masai doesn't care about you or your favourites.
Bruno certainly was a reach.
Pascal was a reach.
I'd argue that Barnes was a reach since everyone thought that Suggs was the right pick at #4.

After the Bruno disaster, he used IBM's Watson and started going after prospects with good advanced metrics + on-court performance

Pascal wasn't really a reach, it's just that a lot of losers wanted two obvious bums in Skal and Davis, comparable to Salaun and KyShawn in this draft. Siakam was mocked at #25, 28, 30, 33, 54 pre-draft, so getting drafted at 27 was fairly reasonable. Bruno on the other hand...

In terms of him specifically going after forwards, here's his draft history:

Delon Wright, Norman Powell, Jakob Poeltl, Dalano Banton, Christian Koloko, Evan Fournier, Izzet Turkyilmaz, Xavier Thames, Malachi Flynn, David Johnson, Jalen Harris, Gradey Dick

OG, Siakam, Bruno, Scottie, Faried, Quincy Miller, DeAndre Daniels, Dewan Hernandez

So 8 out of 20 of his picks have been forwards (40%). Two out of 5 positions is 40%

There were many on here enamoured with Skal and Davis. Bigs bust bigger than other positions and should always be a cautionary tale. People throwing around Missi and others as priority positional suggestions fail to realize they are traveling in bust country.

[OAKLEY_2]

It would have to be for a brandon clarke and Zaire added too though. Another big and a young guy with potential added to the pick is fine with me. Even one of the 2. No problem there.

Poetl for 9+ garbage for contract purposes straight up is a lot less palatable.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

Doubt we get anything extra from the Grizz for Yak....That would be a better package than what we got for all NBA Siakam.

Honestly i don't think brandon clarke off an Achilles is too much of a reach. I saw someone including zaire Williams on top of that lol. That might be a bit much. But maybe not if they really want that 5 on the roster to truly compete.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

True. But the narrative switches from Poetl bad trade to why did we get Poetl again if we only dumped him for ironically a #9 pick in a B- draft class... i hope we do that deal and Poetl prob likes it too.

[ArthurVandelay]

It would have to be for a brandon clarke and Zaire added too though. Another big and a young guy with potential added to the pick is fine with me. Even one of the 2. No problem there.

Poetl for 9+ garbage for contract purposes straight up is a lot less palatable.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

Doubt we get anything extra from the Grizz for Yak....That would be a better package than what we got for all NBA Siakam.

Honestly i don't think brandon clarke off an Achilles is too much of a reach. I saw someone including zaire Williams on top of that lol. That might be a bit much. But maybe not if they really want that 5 on the roster to truly compete.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

Assuming the Grizz don't pick up Kennard's option, the Raptors could provide them a starting C and get them out of their luxury tax predicament by either taking Clarke or Konchar/Williams along with #9 for Poeltl.

That deal just makes too much sense imo.

[JRoy]

I could be wrong but I DON'T think it's for Edey.

We have a solid enough big man rotation, on the otherhand go listen to Masai's presser again, he states multiple times that a BIGGER wing is THE top of his list to improve the roster which imo means we're targeting...

TIDJANE SALUAN.

We've already scouted him on multiple occasions, his physical profile screams Masai prototype and he's the one kid you heard a couple weeks ago has skyrocketed up draft boards and many believe he's going top 10. POR hired Schmidtz and since then have taken on higher upside prospects (ie/ Shaedon & Scoot), they also already have 2 decent bigmen in place (Ayton, RGIII). They likely want to take a safer prospect with their own pick then secure Tidj to develop long term when they inevitably try to move Grant who doesn't fit the timeline of their young guys.

CLE is the only one who I don't think is in that race and is actually just trying to move up to secure a better PG prospect ie/ Dillingham or McCain, so that they can move on from Garland.

It's reported now so a late riser. It's gotta be Carlton Carrington, who rose from mid 2nd to early 2nd/late 1st. After the combine, he's potentially leaped ahead of #19.

Portland needs players and Boucher played at Oregon.

#14 and Malcolm Brogdon for #19, Chris Boucher and Ochai Agbaji.

#14 Carlton Carrington (play a lot with the 905 in his 1st season)

Bruce Brown for Wiggins and Moody

PG IQ - Brogdon - JFL
SG Dick - Moody - Carrington
SF Barrett - Wiggins - McDaniels
PF Barnes - Wiggins/Olynyk
C Poeltl - Olynyk - Chomche

POR isnt downgrading picks for scrubs.

[JRoy]

If we're going to trade up in the draft using Yak, the most likely targets are probably going to be:

Memphis: Yak + #31 for #9 + Kennard or Clarke + one of Vezenkov/Aldama/LaRavia/Williams Jr/Williams
Chicago: Yak + #31 for #11 + Vucevic
Portland: Yak + #19 + #31 for #7 + #14 + Brogdon

POR gives up both lotto picks for a backup center?

Good God, man.

POR is rebuilding.

[Tortiglioni]

I look forward to the Doug Smith articles 5 years after the draft, telling us how Masai tried to trade up for [insert name of player who turns out to be a star].

[ForeverTFC]

I look forward to the Doug Smith articles 5 years after the draft, telling us how Masai tried to trade up for [insert name of player who turns out to be a star].

Masai ain’t Ainge. We have footage of him going after Giannis on draft night and we have reports of him trying to trade for SGA well before the draft.