Shams: KAT to the Knicks

[PushDaRock]

So now we get to see what package Randle fetches and can compare it to what we got for Siakam. Randle is quite possibly the closest player to Siakam in the entire NBA, in both value/cost and performance.....or a bunch of people extolling how this totally isn't the same.

As for the actual trade, I think it's great for both sides. The knicks without injuries would have easily been in the ECF and possibly the finals without Randle, losing Dante is a bigger hit to them than Randle. But adding KAT in will be huge. Minny obviously didn't want to pay him, same way that NYC didn't want to pay/lose Randle. I don't see this helping Minny from a W/L perspective, but they needed to do it, and I'm high on Reid.

I'm curious to see what the hornets get when everything is settled, and looking forward to hearing the myriad of excuses as to why we couldn't have been that 3rd team...yet again.

Does this make the Siakam return look better or worse?

Why wait? Just blame Masai anyways.

Pretty easy to do these days when you look at the crap product he's about to put on the court lol.

I'm confused at whether people want us to win or lose? Crap product = good for the tank?

[Tor_Raps]

Does this make the Siakam return look better or worse?

Why wait? Just blame Masai anyways.

Pretty easy to do these days when you look at the crap product he's about to put on the court lol.

I'm confused at whether people want us to win or lose? Crap product = good for the tank?

Crap product = we have no choice but to tank unless your definition of "winning" is a play-in exit lol.

[Wargreymon]

Masai is terrible now. Randle gets you KAT while Siakam gets you…Bruce Brown? Fire Ujiri please

[Raptors Realtor]

Masai is terrible now. Randle gets you KAT while Siakam gets you…Bruce Brown? Fire Ujiri please

You forgot the 3 1sts, Brown was just to match salary and maybe get another pick for him.

[WaltFrazier]

I'm not a huge fan of KAT but the fit seems tremendous. I like their starting unit, very balanced. Bridges and KAT should be able to provide more dynamic secondary creation than Knicks had previously. Spacing terrific. Perimeter defense should ease pressure on Kat on the interior.

Knicks have been my fav team to watch in recent years. I'm quite excited now.

They still have Robinson and Precious so their defense will solid. They might need another guard as insurance.

They do have Deuce McBride and Cam Payne as backup guards. Not sure if they can improve on that in this CBA

[WaltFrazier]

I'd like to hear the rational behind this trade for the wolves.

I think KAT wanted out, that would make the most sense

I read he was at a Timberwolves workout and was stunned by the news

But Kat is with CAA so there's that.

Randle was CAA, then left then returned to them last season, which some Knicks board posters thought it meant he was staying. So who knows

[nikster]

Masai is terrible now. Randle gets you KAT while Siakam gets you…Bruce Brown? Fire Ujiri please

You forgot the 3 1sts, Brown was just to match salary and maybe get another pick for him.

This is also ignoring Donte Divienczo plus a pick being added (although pick likely becomes a second). Donte is a great role player on a steal of a contract for 2 more years which makes him very valuable. And KAT is on a pretty bad contract, his contract makes him unappealing to most teams except ones like NYK that are going all in over the 2nd Apron. He's a flawed player at $50 million, the 8th highest paid player in the league this season, and is gonna be pushing $60 million by the end of his deal. The real gm player ranking didnt even have him listed on the poll for #30th best player.

That type of contract is exactly the reason why Masai (and most fans) wanted to deal Siakam (and Siakam is still a good deal relatively, getting paid less while being a better player).

[Tha Cynic]

Some of you are really underrating KAT. He has made some dumb plays and I feel like those highlights for some reason stick in people's minds. This guy is very good on offense and can be neutral on defense. He's also a a high usage guy who will easily be the second highest usage behind Brunson. Last season Brunson and a bunch of bench guys made some serious noise and only fizzled out when even those bench guys got injured.

Imo the Knicks overall are a better defensive team than the Celtics and to me the Celtics are a no superstar team. The Knicks can stop them (even if they have more ball handlers) and they have a better star than either of the Celtics' players. Imo Knicks if healthy are the best team in the East. But health is a huge issue with the Knicks.

[Potential]

Read on Twitter

[Scase]

I'd take that **** Piston's pick right now for Bruce Brown. I think we'll be lucky to come away with a second for him at the trade deadline. Way to go Masai. You paid $23 million for a second round pick.

So now we get to see what package Randle fetches and can compare it to what we got for Siakam. Randle is quite possibly the closest player to Siakam in the entire NBA, in both value/cost and performance.....or a bunch of people extolling how this totally isn't the same.

As for the actual trade, I think it's great for both sides. The knicks without injuries would have easily been in the ECF and possibly the finals without Randle, losing Dante is a bigger hit to them than Randle. But adding KAT in will be huge. Minny obviously didn't want to pay him, same way that NYC didn't want to pay/lose Randle. I don't see this helping Minny from a W/L perspective, but they needed to do it, and I'm high on Reid.

I'm curious to see what the hornets get when everything is settled, and looking forward to hearing the myriad of excuses as to why we couldn't have been that 3rd team...yet again.

We kind of see Randle’s value already. Had to attach DDV + a pick to him to get a quality though flawed starter on one of the worst contracts in the NBA.

With that said, I’ve always maintained that Pascal is a better player simply because he can blend into more offenses and doesn’t cap your ceiling, unlike Randle. But I know consensus sees them as similar players.

Calling KAT a quality though flawed starter is kinda wild. Randle is clearly a tier below KAT, so adding sweetner is pretty understandable. Evidently DDV wanted out and the pick is pretty worthless, so it's a pretty solid return.

[Los_29]

If we traded Pascal, a top 9 protected pick and a player similar to DDV for Towns this entire message board would explode.

The reality is Towns is on a terrible contract and his game has completely stagnated, if not gotten worse the past few years. He is no longer a good shot blocker and his rebounding has dropped considerably. He is also a guy that has a questionable motor, work ethic and can’t be trusted to deliver in the playoffs.

With that said, I still like this for the Knicks. They desperately needed size. Towns will be an important piece for them. Their team is looking very good.

[mademan]

Some of you are really underrating KAT. He has made some dumb plays and I feel like those highlights for some reason stick in people's minds. This guy is very good on offense and can be neutral on defense. He's also a a high usage guy who will easily be the second highest usage behind Brunson. Last season Brunson and a bunch of bench guys made some serious noise and only fizzled out when even those bench guys got injured.

Imo the Knicks overall are a better defensive team than the Celtics and to me the Celtics are a no superstar team. The Knicks can stop them (even if they have more ball handlers) and they have a better star than either of the Celtics' players. Imo Knicks if healthy are the best team in the East. But health is a huge issue with the Knicks.

Heavily disagree. C's play almost no defensive liabilities and certainly dont start any, and that goes a long way in the playoffs. In a series against eachother, there's no one for Brunson to attack. On the other side, guys are gonna be coming downhill against KAT getting him into foul trouble and spamming PnR with Brunson involved.

[Los_29]

Some of you are really underrating KAT. He has made some dumb plays and I feel like those highlights for some reason stick in people's minds. This guy is very good on offense and can be neutral on defense. He's also a a high usage guy who will easily be the second highest usage behind Brunson. Last season Brunson and a bunch of bench guys made some serious noise and only fizzled out when even those bench guys got injured.

Imo the Knicks overall are a better defensive team than the Celtics and to me the Celtics are a no superstar team. The Knicks can stop them (even if they have more ball handlers) and they have a better star than either of the Celtics' players. Imo Knicks if healthy are the best team in the East. But health is a huge issue with the Knicks.

Heavily disagree. C's play almost no defensive liabilities and certainly dont start any, and that goes a long way in the playoffs. In a series against eachother, there's no one for Brunson to attack. On the other side, guys are gonna be coming downhill against KAT getting him into foul trouble and spamming PnR with Brunson involved.

Yeah the Knicks have the better wing defenders but as a team, Celtics are a lot more complete defensively. Porzingis could get targeted out on the perimeter but at least he provides good shot blocking. KAT doesn’t even do that anymore. Brunson and KAT are two guys that can get hunted on defensively. Celtics don’t really have any.

[ForeverTFC]

So now we get to see what package Randle fetches and can compare it to what we got for Siakam. Randle is quite possibly the closest player to Siakam in the entire NBA, in both value/cost and performance.....or a bunch of people extolling how this totally isn't the same.

As for the actual trade, I think it's great for both sides. The knicks without injuries would have easily been in the ECF and possibly the finals without Randle, losing Dante is a bigger hit to them than Randle. But adding KAT in will be huge. Minny obviously didn't want to pay him, same way that NYC didn't want to pay/lose Randle. I don't see this helping Minny from a W/L perspective, but they needed to do it, and I'm high on Reid.

I'm curious to see what the hornets get when everything is settled, and looking forward to hearing the myriad of excuses as to why we couldn't have been that 3rd team...yet again.

We kind of see Randle’s value already. Had to attach DDV + a pick to him to get a quality though flawed starter on one of the worst contracts in the NBA.

With that said, I’ve always maintained that Pascal is a better player simply because he can blend into more offenses and doesn’t cap your ceiling, unlike Randle. But I know consensus sees them as similar players.

Calling KAT a quality though flawed starter is kinda wild. Randle is clearly a tier below KAT, so adding sweetner is pretty understandable. Evidently DDV wanted out and the pick is pretty worthless, so it's a pretty solid return.

Eh, I guess subjective. Neither KAT or Randle make the RealGM top 30 while Siakam has been a mainstay. I want to be clear that I think both are below Siakam and consensus on this forum (on the GB) agrees with me.

With that said, DDV wanting out is irrlevant. OG also wanted out. Point remains that KAT has a claim for the worst contract in the league. In my opinion, our return was “better”.

With that said, I will again say that I think Siakam is a more valuable player than both and therefore I still think we should have gotten more for Siakam.

[JB7]

Masai is terrible now. Randle gets you KAT while Siakam gets you…Bruce Brown? Fire Ujiri please

You forgot the 3 1sts, Brown was just to match salary and maybe get another pick for him.

The Raps traded Siakam for such a low return because they didn’t want to have to pay him.

No way they were bringing back a salary like Towns.

[NinjaBro]

Masai is terrible now. Randle gets you KAT while Siakam gets you…Bruce Brown? Fire Ujiri please

You forgot the 3 1sts, Brown was just to match salary and maybe get another pick for him.

Still a terrible value but Siakam tanked his value by leaking that he won't sign with any team because he wanted the supermax. Not a lot of teams going to gut themselves with such a risk.

"We need to trade Siakam for AJ Griffin before it's too late!" - PhilBlackson

[PushDaRock]

Pretty easy to do these days when you look at the crap product he's about to put on the court lol.

I'm confused at whether people want us to win or lose? Crap product = good for the tank?

Crap product = we have no choice but to tank unless your definition of "winning" is a play-in exit lol.

No, my definition of "winning" is the championship we won.

[PushDaRock]

If we traded Pascal, a top 9 protected pick and a player similar to DDV for Towns this entire message board would explode.

The reality is Towns is on a terrible contract and his game has completely stagnated, if not gotten worse the past few years. He is no longer a good shot blocker and his rebounding has dropped considerably. He is also a guy that has a questionable motor, work ethic and can’t be trusted to deliver in the playoffs.

With that said, I still like this for the Knicks. They desperately needed size. Towns will be an important piece for them. Their team is looking very good.

Yeah, this board would have killed Masai over that. I think Towns was a bit underrated before when he was putting up numbers on a bad team but the drop off the last 2 years is a bit of a concern not just in production but in advanced metrics where he went from excellent to about neutral. The massive contract as well for someone 29 with 4 years left and he's actually been kind of injury prone the last 5 years averaging just 50 games played.

The Knicks can afford to take a risk like this especially with not wanting to pay Randle anyways and it's very possible Towns with a change of scenery and in a role more well suited for him can end up reclaiming his form. Brunson and him is a potential dynamic 1-2 punch.

[PushDaRock]

We kind of see Randle’s value already. Had to attach DDV + a pick to him to get a quality though flawed starter on one of the worst contracts in the NBA.

With that said, I’ve always maintained that Pascal is a better player simply because he can blend into more offenses and doesn’t cap your ceiling, unlike Randle. But I know consensus sees them as similar players.

Calling KAT a quality though flawed starter is kinda wild. Randle is clearly a tier below KAT, so adding sweetner is pretty understandable. Evidently DDV wanted out and the pick is pretty worthless, so it's a pretty solid return.

Eh, I guess subjective. Neither KAT or Randle make the RealGM top 30 while Siakam has been a mainstay. I want to be clear that I think both are below Siakam and consensus on this forum (on the GB) agrees with me.

With that said, DDV wanting out is irrlevant. OG also wanted out. Point remains that KAT has a claim for the worst contract in the league. In my opinion, our return was “better”.

With that said, I will again say that I think Siakam is a more valuable player than both and therefore I still think we should have gotten more for Siakam.

I don't think Towns is as bad as a lot of people think but the drop off has been pretty noticeable the last 2 years. Then you have the massive contract along with his health being an issue, he's averaged 50 games a season the last 5 years. It's probably worth the risk for the Knicks though still and it's possible a move back to the 5 helps him reclaim his form.

The league never valued them that way though. Towns' draft pedigree, 3 point shooting and borderline superstar numbers always gave him the edge over Siakam even though Siakam is the more proven winner.

[kalel123]

Masai is terrible now. Randle gets you KAT while Siakam gets you…Bruce Brown? Fire Ujiri please

You forgot the 3 1sts, Brown was just to match salary and maybe get another pick for him.

Correct, you are. And those picks ended up being 19th pick in 2024, projected to be one of the worst draft in years! Late pick in 2024 that ended up being Isiah Collier, projected #1 pick at one point, for UTAH f'ing JAZZ! And we got Agbaji AND re-signed Olynyk both of whom bombed like none other during summer plays. And last-but-certain-to-be-the-least... A mystery mid-to-low pick in 2026!

Did I mention Ja'Kobe Walter is now injured alongside Bruce Brown? Both of them come from the great Siakam tree, the garbage that keeps on giving~!

What great returns they are. So worthless.