Pascal Siakam Trade Speculation Thread

[gerrit4]

Which FA signs with Toronto that has been really good in our entire history?

We have not been in a position of going after a YOUNG top free Agent like we could be with such a trade.

We have and we failed. LMA wouldn't even meet with us, KD wouldn't even meet with us. I could go on.

Look throughout our history, our best FA signings are some amalgamation of:

Rafer Alston
Anthony Parker
A washed Hakeem
A huge miss in Hedo
Jose Calderon
Bismack Biyombo

You can include Fred if it fits your narrative but he was a nobody rookie.

We have nothing to prove we will ever be a FA destination. We have to build via the draft and trades.

I wouldn't include Fred - I'd consider Fred and even Boucher as more like draft picks, more of a testament to our scouting/development than our ability to attract good free agents.

I would add Dennis to the list, as well as Garbo and Corey Joseph. Carroll was kind of a big signing, even though it was a flop, more or less. Kleiza seemed like a pretty big signing at the time (he was coming off of some really good european success), but that flopped too.

As with most markets that don't attract free agents, we typically can attract free agents by either paying more than anyone else (Schroeder, Carroll, etc) or the opportunity of more playing time (Biz, Rafer, Schroeder). The only players who seem to pick Toronto are the Euros (Hedo, Kleiza, Garbo, Jose, Parker (not a euro, but from euro league). I actually thought that was the smartest idea BC had, even though it had middling success.

I would say that cap space has some value for us, but usually it ends up biting us. A team like Miami, LA, etc can really do well with cap space.

[tecumseh18]

Man, this thread is moving quickly. Has this latest from Jake Fischer (who has connections to the Pacers front office) been posted?

A trade can certainly be reached over the coming weeks. But for all those complications, rival executives are prepared for the possibility that Siakam could remain in Toronto, where the Raptors would have to consider extending him. The parameters surrounding a Siakam trade aren’t going to change. Why should any team risk sending out valuable rotation players and draft capital for a veteran who could simply net out as a half-season rental? And why should a team projected to have cap space, that believes it can be the lucky bidder to land Siakam come June 30, sacrifice anything similar? Both Indiana and Detroit will have serious room to play with this summer. So will Philadelphia, with Siakam’s former Raptors head coach, Nick Nurse, manning the bench, and that has league personnel pinning the Sixers as another potential free-agency bogeyman to scare off Siakam trade-deadline bids.

https://sports.yahoo.com/dejounte-murray-emerging-as-perhaps-the-most-likely-all-star-caliber-talent-to-be-moved-174205743.html

Fischer's sources are madly trying to beat down the price for Siakam. Expect more of this.

[ArthurVandelay]

If Indy doesn't get any assurances he signs which is likely the case, the most I can see them offering is Brown, Nesmith + one of Math,Walker,Nembhard

Any package that includes Nesmith and Walker is an automatic accept for me.

Yep. Problem is I think Hield is for sure the salary and not Brown. Nesmith is the Hield copycat replacement. I'm betting they are stuck with Indy at Hield, Walker, Nwora with Raps wanting Mathurin and Nesmith off the table just because Hield is in it. Raptors have to re-route Hield to a third team too.

What about to Orlando for WCJr?

[Johnny Bball]

Any package that includes Nesmith and Walker is an automatic accept for me.

Yep. Problem is I think Hield is for sure the salary and not Brown. Nesmith is the Hield copycat replacement. I'm betting they are stuck with Indy at Hield, Walker, Nwora with Raps wanting Mathurin and Nesmith off the table just because Hield is in it. Raptors have to re-route Hield to a third team too.

If you came reroute Hield to a team like the Lakers for a young player or pick...that is fine. Otherwise...he can help us to win some games and hopefully get to play-in or playoffs and make that San Antonio pick as bad as it came be. I'd have no problem hanging on to Buddy and let his contract expire.

Yeah its not the end of the world, but I'm sure they would prefer to trade him (Hield as well), since that that point you are going to be wanting to free up minutes for other players that just arrived. I could see him just being waived if you cant find something like expiring salary to waive and a pair of SRPs, depending on who comes with him.

[Steelo Green]

We have not been in a position of going after a YOUNG top free Agent like we could be with such a trade.

We have and we failed. LMA wouldn't even meet with us, KD wouldn't even meet with us. I could go on.

Look throughout our history, our best FA signings are some amalgamation of:

Rafer Alston
Anthony Parker
A washed Hakeem
A huge miss in Hedo
Jose Calderon
Bismack Biyombo

You can include Fred if it fits your narrative but he was a nobody rookie.

We have nothing to prove we will ever be a FA destination. We have to build via the draft and trades.

I wouldn't include Fred - I'd consider Fred and even Boucher as more like draft picks, more of a testament to our scouting/development than our ability to attract good free agents.

I would add Dennis to the list, as well as Garbo and Corey Joseph. Carroll was kind of a big signing, even though it was a flop, more or less. Kleiza seemed like a pretty big signing at the time (he was coming off of some really good european success), but that flopped too.

As with most markets that don't attract free agents, we typically can attract free agents by either paying more than anyone else (Schroeder, Carroll, etc) or the opportunity of more playing time (Biz, Rafer, Schroeder). The only players who seem to pick Toronto are the Euros (Hedo, Kleiza, Garbo, Jose, Parker (not a euro, but from euro league). I actually thought that was the smartest idea BC had, even though it had middling success.

I would say that cap space has some value for us, but usually it ends up biting us. A team like Miami, LA, etc can really do well with cap space.

Yeah we were best with international signings that had decent careers, or the random signing of Jamario. All of which were non all-star caliber players, and all of which weren't really cap required moves.

The cap is a means to make trades for salary and to re-sign our own guys. Schroeder was an MLE so again not really a cap related deal.

[Johnny Bball]

Man, this thread is moving quickly. Has this latest from Jake Fischer (who has connections to the Pacers office) been posted?

A trade can certainly be reached over the coming weeks. But for all those complications, rival executives are prepared for the possibility that Siakam could remain in Toronto, where the Raptors would have to consider extending him. The parameters surrounding a Siakam trade aren’t going to change. Why should any team risk sending out valuable rotation players and draft capital for a veteran who could simply net out as a half-season rental? And why should a team projected to have cap space, that believes it can be the lucky bidder to land Siakam come June 30, sacrifice anything similar? Both Indiana and Detroit will have serious room to play with this summer. So will Philadelphia, with Siakam’s former Raptors head coach, Nick Nurse, manning the bench, and that has league personnel pinning the Sixers as another potential free-agency bogeyman to scare off Siakam trade-deadline bids.

https://sports.yahoo.com/dejounte-murray-emerging-as-perhaps-the-most-likely-all-star-caliber-talent-to-be-moved-174205743.html

Fischer's sources are madly trying to beat down the price for Siakam. Expect more of this.

The answer to the question in the quote seems pretty easy for me to answer. Because Siakam is going to take the most money from whoever offers it. He will take the 5 year max over the 4 year offer every time, because that's what he wants most. As long as the team isn't trash, e.g. Detroit.

[ArthurVandelay]

We have not been in a position of going after a YOUNG top free Agent like we could be with such a trade.

We have and we failed. LMA wouldn't even meet with us, KD wouldn't even meet with us. I could go on.

Look throughout our history, our best FA signings are some amalgamation of:

Rafer Alston
Anthony Parker
A washed Hakeem
A huge miss in Hedo
Jose Calderon
Bismack Biyombo

You can include Fred if it fits your narrative but he was a nobody rookie.

We have nothing to prove we will ever be a FA destination. We have to build via the draft and trades.

We have not. You have missed the YOUNG Part : For example if we go after a Nic Claxton (same age as IQ) in the summer. We have never gone after such a player. Let's say IQ was still on the Knicks and would have submitted an offer to him in the summer. We have just not gone after such Young players with HIGH potential .

Claxton starting with IQ, RJ, and Scottie would be pretty fun to watch. Get someone who can shoot the 3 at the 4. Then you have Schroder and Poeltl coming off the bench who would feast on most second lineups.

[mtcan]

We have and we failed. LMA wouldn't even meet with us, KD wouldn't even meet with us. I could go on.

Look throughout our history, our best FA signings are some amalgamation of:

Rafer Alston
Anthony Parker
A washed Hakeem
A huge miss in Hedo
Jose Calderon
Bismack Biyombo

You can include Fred if it fits your narrative but he was a nobody rookie.

We have nothing to prove we will ever be a FA destination. We have to build via the draft and trades.

We have not. You have missed the YOUNG Part : For example if we go after a Nic Claxton (same age as IQ) in the summer. We have never gone after such a player. Let's say IQ was still on the Knicks and would have submitted an offer to him in the summer. We have just not gone after such Young players with HIGH potential .

Claxton starting with IQ, RJ, and Scottie would be pretty fun to watch. Get someone who can shoot the 3 at the 4. Then you have Schroder and Poeltl coming off the bench who would feast on most second lineups.

Claxton would probably be asking for Jakob type money when he is a free agent...that is a lot of money to dedicate to the 5 position.

[ArthurVandelay]

Boy, that Wiggins contract is absolutely brutal. Would need a lot of inducements to be okay with taking that on. He's been one of the worst players in the entire association. This isn't like a RJ just turning it on now that's he's home situation. Wiggins is an aging player with declining athleticism who doesn't do anything except hoist shots about to get massive money lol.

Also why would the nets just let Claxton leave?

26-30 for the next 3 years for Wiggins? Yikes no.

Chris Paul expiring? Yes.

Claxton is a UFA, so maybe they're worried? though by all accounts, it seems like Claxton likes it there.

Vaughn recently benched him and called him soft.

Maybe Claxton responds to old school? Who knows.

But Brooklyn isn't going anywhere fast so maybe he wants to move on? Or maybe Brooklyn doensn't want to pay him $20m?

[ArthurVandelay]

We have not. You have missed the YOUNG Part : For example if we go after a Nic Claxton (same age as IQ) in the summer. We have never gone after such a player. Let's say IQ was still on the Knicks and would have submitted an offer to him in the summer. We have just not gone after such Young players with HIGH potential .

Claxton starting with IQ, RJ, and Scottie would be pretty fun to watch. Get someone who can shoot the 3 at the 4. Then you have Schroder and Poeltl coming off the bench who would feast on most second lineups.

Claxton would probably be asking for Jakob type money when he is a free agent...that is a lot of money to dedicate to the 5 position.

Very true. But they just dedicated a lot of money to Porter, Young, Temple, and McDaniels too.

[Yallbecrazy]

Boy, that Wiggins contract is absolutely brutal. Would need a lot of inducements to be okay with taking that on. He's been one of the worst players in the entire association. This isn't like a RJ just turning it on now that's he's home situation. Wiggins is an aging player with declining athleticism who doesn't do anything except hoist shots about to get massive money lol.

Also why would the nets just let Claxton leave?

The thing with Wiggins is that even if GS pays you enough to take him, no self-respecting team can insert him into their rotation. I would not want him anywhere near our young guys. The dude just doesn't give a damn.

On one hand we already have RJ who plays the same position as Wiggins and we have Barnes too which blocks Wiggins somewhat as well so we will be paying $25-30 million for a bench player and $51-60 million for our SGs, both of which are currently considered bad contracts.

On the other hand I do truly believe playing for Toronto would wake up Wiggins to be more motivated. It was always his dream to play for Toronto, he came out and said so in high school and college.

That being said it's still a no for me (unless we are heavily compensated- Podz, Moody, Kuminga, and a pick for Siakam. We would then have to trade Kuminga for more assets) as even if Wiggins plays well for us he's not going to be an all star calibre player and Barrett is blocking his position so we would have super max salary tied up in those two and other teams would be very wary of trading for Wiggins, unsure what version they would get.

[WuTang_CMB]

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[nivisi9]

so I guess might not have been much to all that smoke last couple days...

remember last Friday it seemed Siakam was about to get traded to Sac?

wonder what today might bring

[mtcan]

Claxton starting with IQ, RJ, and Scottie would be pretty fun to watch. Get someone who can shoot the 3 at the 4. Then you have Schroder and Poeltl coming off the bench who would feast on most second lineups.

Claxton would probably be asking for Jakob type money when he is a free agent...that is a lot of money to dedicate to the 5 position.

Very true. But they just dedicated a lot of money to Porter, Young, Temple, and McDaniels too.

Porter, Young and Temple are probably gone after this season.

But Jak and Claxton signed long term...hmm...maybe not the best use of cap.

Honestly I think the center position is the least of our needs. Jak is the mainstay and I'm loving what Porter is providing and believe that his play is not only sustainable but has potential for a little more. Koloko may or may not work out in the long term but having Jontay showing he is NBA ready is enough to suck up some backup minutes.

[WuTang_CMB]

Scotto: Do you think Golden State can trade Chris Paul in a package and get value for him? When you talk to executives around the league, Andrew Wiggins is the guy they’re looking at who could be the guy moved there, given the way he’s moved to the bench and how he’s played since his All-Star season. Lastly, Jonathan Kuminga is a guy they want to keep. They don’t want him going anywhere because he’s gotten better, and more importantly, because he’s affordable, given their luxury tax concerns with their core, and having to keep Klay Thompson this summer.

Marks: Regarding Pascal Siakam, I think there’s a blueprint in Toronto as far as what Masai Ujiri is looking for. He wants guys that can help like RJ Barrett and Immanuel Quickley, and draft capital and creating cap space isn’t as important. When Paul broke his hand, some Warriors fans wondered what was going to happen to his trade value. It has nothing to do with him on the court. It’s because he has a $30.8 million contract this year that’s non-guaranteed next year. That’s his trade value. I think it’s all dependent on how much ownership wants to spend. They’ve spent $690 million, I think, since 2014-15 in luxury tax penalties. They bought the team for $350 million, and I know they’re printing money out in this and Joe Lacob has been out in front of these new rules saying they’ll figure it out and they’re a championship team.

You don’t need to be a math major to know what’s coming here. You’ve got $174 million in contracts next year that doesn’t include Paul’s $30 million nor re-signing Klay Thompson. The luxury tax is $172 million and the apron is $190 million. If the goal is to re-sign Thompson, are you comfortable moving Paul and draft picks for a player who’s owed money next year? Or do you acquire Siakam and pay him? If they are, great. You’d just have to deal with the rules and the penalties. That’s what they have to figure out. I think the ultimate move would be to move Wiggins before Paul because if you trade that number for a comparable salary in the $23-24 million range that can help because the Wiggins and Kuminga grouping numbers aren’t good. Steve Kerr has come out and said it. Then you can do something where you release Paul, and then you’re in pretty good financial shape.

Pascal Siakam



Scotto: For Pascal Siakam, let’s look at the teams mentioned. Sacramento, without Keegan Murray, I don’t see it.

Marks: If you’re going to trade Murray in a Siakam deal you’d have De’Aaron Fox, who’s going to be supermax eligible this offseason All-NBA, Domantas Sabonis, and then you’d have Siakam on a max.

Scotto: I just talked about this with James Ham on a recent HoopsHype podcast. He said Sacramento thinks Murray is going to be better than Lauri Markkanen.

Marks: That’s fair.

Scotto: The Kings, Hawks, and Pacers have been talked about. Indiana has the best packages (to offer).

Marks: I’m not basing this off sources, this is looking at it from being in a front office, I think Indiana would be the perfect team.

Scotto: The Pacers had extensive conversations at the G League Showcase in Orlando about this (trading for Siakam). I think Indiana has some of the best assets to offer. Atlanta doesn’t want to move Jalen Johnson. The Kings don’t want to move Murray. Well, the Pacers have Jarace Walker, and Buddy Hield who can shoot and is on an expiring contract, they’ve got their picks, and if they want to they can put Bennedict Mathurin in there – not saying they’d want to – as a Canadian guy. You know how Masai (Ujiri) is about those guys. Look at the RJ Barrett acquisition. To me, it would come down to whether Siakam would want to stay there and if they want to pay him. All the talk about Siakam not wanting to go here or there is like a leverage play. He wants his money.

Marks: How many high-level free agents have switched teams in the offseason besides the 2019 Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving summer? Fred VanVleet last offseason went from Toronto to Houston and Jalen Brunson in 2022 went from Dallas to New York. Guys don’t switch teams, especially if Indiana says they’ll give him five years, $230 million, or four years, $200 million with his Bird Rights.

We can say that Indiana’s got flexibility. They could, but here’s what happens. You’ve basically got to not exercise the team option of Bruce Brown, renounce Buddy Hield, and waive TJ McConnell. It’s a lot. From a trade standpoint, that’s where you’ve got to capitalize on.

Scotto: Do you think Siakam gets a max contract? What do you think his value is in free agency?

Marks: It’s all based on circumstances. There could be 10 teams that have significant room. Then, it’s the process of elimination. Does Oklahoma City need him? I don’t think so. Does Orlando need him? They’ve got Paolo Banchero. Does Philadelphia need him? They could. Him being on the Raptors at 5:01 PM ET on February 8th wouldn’t surprise me because you could always put him in a sign-and-trade if you wanted. You could always re-sign him. His number is based on what the market will be.

https://hoopshype.com/lists/nba-trade-deadline-preview-knicks-lakers-warriors-nets-rockets-raptors-hawks-pistons/

[LoveMyRaps]

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WE DONT NEED MURRAY.

[ash_k]

Claxton starting with IQ, RJ, and Scottie would be pretty fun to watch. Get someone who can shoot the 3 at the 4. Then you have Schroder and Poeltl coming off the bench who would feast on most second lineups.

Claxton would probably be asking for Jakob type money when he is a free agent...that is a lot of money to dedicate to the 5 position.

Very true. But they just dedicated a lot of money to Porter, Young, Temple, and McDaniels too.

Yak would become a valuable asset to trade with Claxton "on-board"

[byp870720]

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WE DONT NEED MURRAY.

Murray is terrible for this team.
IQ loses confidence as main PG and Murray plays with another undersize trae-like pg in IQ.
I'll cancel my sportsnet+ subscription if we do this.

[tecumseh18]

Boy, that Wiggins contract is absolutely brutal. Would need a lot of inducements to be okay with taking that on. He's been one of the worst players in the entire association. This isn't like a RJ just turning it on now that's he's home situation. Wiggins is an aging player with declining athleticism who doesn't do anything except hoist shots about to get massive money lol.

Also why would the nets just let Claxton leave?

The thing with Wiggins is that even if GS pays you enough to take him, no self-respecting team can insert him into their rotation. I would not want him anywhere near our young guys. The dude just doesn't give a damn.

On one hand we already have RJ who plays the same position as Wiggins and we have Barnes too which blocks Wiggins somewhat as well so we will be paying $25-30 million for a bench player and $51-60 million for our SGs, both of which are currently considered bad contracts.

On the other hand I do truly believe playing for Toronto would wake up Wiggins to be more motivated. It was always his dream to play for Toronto, he came out and said so in high school and college.

That being said it's still a no for me (unless we are heavily compensated- Podz, Moody, Kuminga, and a pick for Siakam. We would then have to trade Kuminga for more assets) as even if Wiggins plays well for us he's not going to be an all star calibre player and Barrett is blocking his position so we would have super max salary tied up in those two and other teams would be very wary of trading for Wiggins, unsure what version they would get.

It would really, really help the Warrior's cap situation going forward by taking Wiggins off their hands. But yeah, they'd have to give us all three of the youngsters to entice the Raptors to do it. If Pacers really want Kuminga, we can flip him to them for Walker.

It's kinda neat how the combined salaries of Wiggins, Paul, JK, Moody and Podz add up EXACTLY to the combined salaries of Siakam, Gary and Dennis. But we'd be giving them a big win-now assist, so at least another pick coming our way is warranted.

Wiggins is apparently going through some things with his father's illness. But if could get his head turned around with us, that would be a huge springboard towards contention, or at least another tradeable asset.

[mademan]

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WE DONT NEED MURRAY.

Only reason we'd be involved is to make it a 3 teamer. Reaves is a highly efficient SG who can play some point (and is under contract relatively cheaply for 4 years), Christie is an athletic 3+D guard and they have some picks. I actually really like the fit of Christie/Reaves beside our new core 3.

Siakam to ATL
DJM to LAL
Christie/Reaves/1st to TOR

how close is that?