Official Scottie Barnes Thread

[Son Goku 25]

Scottie is a troll but I love it

[Johnny Bball]

So genius , who comes off the bench when Nurse decides he needs to start a 5? Sooner or later the team will need to fix the overlap problem. I think one guy is going to get traded because you cannot keep them all and Siakam and his bloated salary and ego makes the most sense.

Well genius.... he's not starting a 5 very likely, he's switching Pascal, OG and Barnes on the 5 spot (LIKE HE HAS BEEN, NOT JUST SIAKAM), but if he does have someone go to the bench its either Barnes or GTJ, and it ain't GTJ. Barnes is going to be a star but some of you are so petulant and don't really have patience in life.

And even if they trade Siakam, which they won't before the deadline, it would be summer and it won't be for a centre. Anyone wanting to trade one of you best players and build around the centre spot isn't paying attention to how the game has evolved.

I so sick of listening Siakam fanboys, always ready to make excuses after every choke job. 6-11 with him starting>.

The only stan here is you for Barnes. Siakam has played well this year with the exception of his three point shooting, and you just don't care to see it or can't. What choke job? He's not even playing lately. .

[God Squad]

Well genius.... he's not starting a 5 very likely, he's switching Pascal, OG and Barnes on the 5 spot (LIKE HE HAS BEEN, NOT JUST SIAKAM), but if he does have someone go to the bench its either Barnes or GTJ, and it ain't GTJ. Barnes is going to be a star but some of you are so petulant and don't really have patience in life.

And even if they trade Siakam, which they won't before the deadline, it would be summer and it won't be for a centre. Anyone wanting to trade one of you best players and build around the centre spot isn't paying attention to how the game has evolved.

I so sick of listening Siakam fanboys, always ready to make excuses after every choke job. 6-11 with him starting>.

The only stan here is you for Barnes. Siakam has played well this year with the exception of his three point shooting, and you just don't care to see it or can't. What choke job? He's not even playing lately. .

Devils Advocate : Better to be a Barnes stan than a Pascal Stan IMO. Barnes has quickly become a Toronto favorite and his stats would suggest he'll be better than Siakam fairly soon if given the same opportunity.

I have more faith in Barnes becoming "That guy" than I ever did with Pascal.

Spoiler:

Pascals ISO from the perimeter is still cringe inducing.

[Johnny Bball]

I so sick of listening Siakam fanboys, always ready to make excuses after every choke job. 6-11 with him starting>.

The only stan here is you for Barnes. Siakam has played well this year with the exception of his three point shooting, and you just don't care to see it or can't. What choke job? He's not even playing lately. .

Devils Advocate : Better to be a Barnes stan than a Pascal Stan IMO. Barnes has quickly become a Toronto favorite and his stats would suggest he'll be better than Siakam fairly soon if given the same opportunity.

I have more faith in Barnes becoming "That guy" than I ever did with Pascal.

Spoiler:

Pascals ISO from the perimeter is still cringe inducing.

Devils advocate; Maybe just be informed and don’t be a Stan of a man or boy younger than you. Oh and your suggestion makes me cringe.

I find it pretty hilarious that people think if pascal was traded all of his touches instantly go to Scotty. Like that’s all that holding him back. They won’t. And they didn’t. And it’s just getting annoying that people think it’s so simple and their geniuses. **** they’re really not. And of course he’s going to be better, it’s just not now.

[God Squad]

The only stan here is you for Barnes. Siakam has played well this year with the exception of his three point shooting, and you just don't care to see it or can't. What choke job? He's not even playing lately. .

Devils Advocate : Better to be a Barnes stan than a Pascal Stan IMO. Barnes has quickly become a Toronto favorite and his stats would suggest he'll be better than Siakam fairly soon if given the same opportunity.

I have more faith in Barnes becoming "That guy" than I ever did with Pascal.

Spoiler:

Pascals ISO from the perimeter is still cringe inducing.

Devils advocate; Maybe just be informed and don’t be a Stan of a man or boy younger than you. Oh and your suggestion makes me cringe.

I find it pretty hilarious that people think if pascal was traded all of his touches instantly go to Scotty. Like that’s all that holding him back. They won’t. And they didn’t. And it’s just getting annoying that people think it’s so simple and their geniuses. **** they’re really not. And of course he’s going to be better, it’s just not now.

Oh news to me we can't be a fan of a promising prospect that the league as a whole acknowledges is quite impressive. Especially because he's our best rookie since.... ever? In terms of Scottie surpassing Pascal fairly soon (not this year, maybe next) I'd even bet it. No I don't think if Pascal is traded it'd mean Scottie gets all his shots. They'd be distributed between FVV, Scottie, GTJ and likely whoever we receive.

No it isn't as simple as trade Pascal and it's solved. TBH I don't even think he's the problem per say, but the fit spacing wise could be better. It's clear as day that Scottie is and will be molded to be our guy. Nurse has insinuated since the beginning.

If any prospect in Raptors history deserves to be "stanned" it's Scottie Barnes. He's good good and not just Raptors hype machine.

[Johnny Bball]

Devils Advocate : Better to be a Barnes stan than a Pascal Stan IMO. Barnes has quickly become a Toronto favorite and his stats would suggest he'll be better than Siakam fairly soon if given the same opportunity.

I have more faith in Barnes becoming "That guy" than I ever did with Pascal.

Spoiler:

Pascals ISO from the perimeter is still cringe inducing.

Devils advocate; Maybe just be informed and don’t be a Stan of a man or boy younger than you. Oh and your suggestion makes me cringe.

I find it pretty hilarious that people think if pascal was traded all of his touches instantly go to Scotty. Like that’s all that holding him back. They won’t. And they didn’t. And it’s just getting annoying that people think it’s so simple and their geniuses. **** they’re really not. And of course he’s going to be better, it’s just not now.

Oh news to me we can't be a fan of a promising prospect that the league as a whole acknowledges is quite impressive. Especially because he's our best rookie since.... ever? In terms of Scottie surpassing Pascal fairly soon (not this year, maybe next) I'd even bet it. No I don't think if Pascal is traded it'd mean Scottie gets all his shots. They'd be distributed between FVV, Scottie, GTJ and likely whoever we receive.

No it isn't as simple as trade Pascal and it's solved. TBH I don't even think he's the problem per say, but the fit spacing wise could be better. It's clear as day that Scottie is and will be molded to be our guy. Nurse has insinuated since the beginning.

If any prospect in Raptors history deserves to be "stanned" it's Scottie Barnes. He's good good and not just Raptors hype machine.

And I didn't tell you that you can't be a fan or a stan, if you care to read. I just told you it makes me cringe when there's no logic behind any of it.

And no, it won't solve "the problem" because we don't have a spacing problem on offense with Siakam/Barnes/OG, rotating whoever they switch to on defence at the five, which is why we play them all together.

This thing that "he has to be the guy" from the first moment so everybody else needs to be traded is pretty childish and a horrible way to manage any young player. After Siakam it's FVV, after that it will be GTJ, then OG. It's the same trash we all heard with JV and he didn't ever earn any of it.

[God Squad]

Devils advocate; Maybe just be informed and don’t be a Stan of a man or boy younger than you. Oh and your suggestion makes me cringe.

I find it pretty hilarious that people think if pascal was traded all of his touches instantly go to Scotty. Like that’s all that holding him back. They won’t. And they didn’t. And it’s just getting annoying that people think it’s so simple and their geniuses. **** they’re really not. And of course he’s going to be better, it’s just not now.

Oh news to me we can't be a fan of a promising prospect that the league as a whole acknowledges is quite impressive. Especially because he's our best rookie since.... ever? In terms of Scottie surpassing Pascal fairly soon (not this year, maybe next) I'd even bet it. No I don't think if Pascal is traded it'd mean Scottie gets all his shots. They'd be distributed between FVV, Scottie, GTJ and likely whoever we receive.

No it isn't as simple as trade Pascal and it's solved. TBH I don't even think he's the problem per say, but the fit spacing wise could be better. It's clear as day that Scottie is and will be molded to be our guy. Nurse has insinuated since the beginning.

If any prospect in Raptors history deserves to be "stanned" it's Scottie Barnes. He's good good and not just Raptors hype machine.

And I didn't tell you that you can't be a fan or a stan, if you care to read. I just told you it makes me cringe when there's no logic behind any of it.

And no, it won't solve "the problem" because we don't have a spacing problem on offense with Siakam/Barnes/OG, rotating whoever they switch to on defence at the five, which is why we play them all together.

This thing that "he has to be the guy" from the first moment so everybody else needs to be traded is pretty childish and a horrible way to manage any young player. After Siakam it's FVV, after that it will be GTJ, then OG. It's the same trash we all heard with JV and he didn't ever earn any of it.

Your words.

Maybe just be informed and don’t be a Stan of a man or boy younger than you.

You literally say we can't/shouldn't be a stan of barnes because he's younger than us lol, Or we shouldn't stan in general, who knows?

You sound like an angry old man who doesn't know what he's upset about.


Isn't the "cringe" me suggesting Barnes will be better than Siakam very soon? Or is the "cringe" that people like Barnes more than Pascal and want him moved? (I didn't suggest this)

And I didn't tell you that you can't be a fan or a stan, if you care to read. I just told you it makes me cringe when there's no logic behind any of it.

I don't care about the topic of our lineups with barnes/pascal/fvv ect, I'm just going with the flow. I do take offense when you say we shouldn't Stan Barnes or they're (stans) part of the problem. Because it's clear as day he's our best prospect since ever and rightfully deserves the praise he's been getting.

[youngRAPZ]

Oh news to me we can't be a fan of a promising prospect that the league as a whole acknowledges is quite impressive. Especially because he's our best rookie since.... ever? In terms of Scottie surpassing Pascal fairly soon (not this year, maybe next) I'd even bet it. No I don't think if Pascal is traded it'd mean Scottie gets all his shots. They'd be distributed between FVV, Scottie, GTJ and likely whoever we receive.

No it isn't as simple as trade Pascal and it's solved. TBH I don't even think he's the problem per say, but the fit spacing wise could be better. It's clear as day that Scottie is and will be molded to be our guy. Nurse has insinuated since the beginning.

If any prospect in Raptors history deserves to be "stanned" it's Scottie Barnes. He's good good and not just Raptors hype machine.

And I didn't tell you that you can't be a fan or a stan, if you care to read. I just told you it makes me cringe when there's no logic behind any of it.

And no, it won't solve "the problem" because we don't have a spacing problem on offense with Siakam/Barnes/OG, rotating whoever they switch to on defence at the five, which is why we play them all together.

This thing that "he has to be the guy" from the first moment so everybody else needs to be traded is pretty childish and a horrible way to manage any young player. After Siakam it's FVV, after that it will be GTJ, then OG. It's the same trash we all heard with JV and he didn't ever earn any of it.

Your words.

Maybe just be informed and don’t be a Stan of a man or boy younger than you.

You literally say we can't/shouldn't be a stan of barnes because he's younger than us lol, Or we shouldn't stan in general, who knows?

You sound like an angry old man who doesn't know what he's upset about.


Isn't the "cringe" me suggesting Barnes will be better than Siakam very soon? Or is the "cringe" that people like Barnes more than Pascal and want him moved? (I didn't suggest this)

And I didn't tell you that you can't be a fan or a stan, if you care to read. I just told you it makes me cringe when there's no logic behind any of it.

I don't care about the topic of our lineups with barnes/pascal/fvv ect, I'm just going with the flow. I do take offense when you say we shouldn't Stan Barnes or they're (stans) part of the problem. Because it's clear as day he's our best prospect since ever and rightfully deserves the praise he's been getting.

I think his point is you can praise Barnes without making up bs about our other players. Not saying you are the one making it up, but some of these “Barnes Stan’s” takes such as pascal won’t defer because I can read his mind or fvv is jealous because I can also read his mind is kind of annoying.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[God Squad]

And I didn't tell you that you can't be a fan or a stan, if you care to read. I just told you it makes me cringe when there's no logic behind any of it.

And no, it won't solve "the problem" because we don't have a spacing problem on offense with Siakam/Barnes/OG, rotating whoever they switch to on defence at the five, which is why we play them all together.

This thing that "he has to be the guy" from the first moment so everybody else needs to be traded is pretty childish and a horrible way to manage any young player. After Siakam it's FVV, after that it will be GTJ, then OG. It's the same trash we all heard with JV and he didn't ever earn any of it.

Your words.

Maybe just be informed and don’t be a Stan of a man or boy younger than you.

You literally say we can't/shouldn't be a stan of barnes because he's younger than us lol, Or we shouldn't stan in general, who knows?

You sound like an angry old man who doesn't know what he's upset about.


Isn't the "cringe" me suggesting Barnes will be better than Siakam very soon? Or is the "cringe" that people like Barnes more than Pascal and want him moved? (I didn't suggest this)

And I didn't tell you that you can't be a fan or a stan, if you care to read. I just told you it makes me cringe when there's no logic behind any of it.

I don't care about the topic of our lineups with barnes/pascal/fvv ect, I'm just going with the flow. I do take offense when you say we shouldn't Stan Barnes or they're (stans) part of the problem. Because it's clear as day he's our best prospect since ever and rightfully deserves the praise he's been getting.

I think his point is you can praise Barnes without making up bs about our other players. Not saying you are the one making it up, but some of these “Barnes Stan’s” takes such as pascal won’t defer because I can read his mind or fvv is jealous because I can also read his mind is kind of annoying.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Oh if that's the case I agree with you guys. From my eye test a lot of Barnes assists are to FVV (specifically) and Pascal. It doesn't look like they're stepping on each others toes, especially since Scottie's been hitting the 3. I just think Barnes has been amazing and deserving of the praise.

My personal opinion on where we are as a team is simple. Continue adding talent by any means to the core until they either develop into a contender or have the necessary assets to trade for a star if one becomes available. Basically what we did with Lowry/DD core until an opportune trade became available. So I'm in favor of keeping both FVV and Pascal as I don't think it'll hamper Barnes development in the slightest. I think the shot distribution between the 3 are perfectly fine, how OG will affect it will be seen. But I would like to see Barnes either take on a larger play making role for his development.

[Dude-niagara]

Well genius.... he's not starting a 5 very likely, he's switching Pascal, OG and Barnes on the 5 spot (LIKE HE HAS BEEN, NOT JUST SIAKAM), but if he does have someone go to the bench its either Barnes or GTJ, and it ain't GTJ. Barnes is going to be a star but some of you are so petulant and don't really have patience in life.

And even if they trade Siakam, which they won't before the deadline, it would be summer and it won't be for a centre. Anyone wanting to trade one of you best players and build around the centre spot isn't paying attention to how the game has evolved.

I so sick of listening Siakam fanboys, always ready to make excuses after every choke job. 6-11 with him starting>.

The only stan here is you for Barnes. Siakam has played well this year with the exception of his three point shooting, and you just don't care to see it or can't. What choke job? He's not even playing lately. .

I guess you missed those second halves, choked late in Bucks win and Nets loss. Also missed shot late in Knicks game that if Randle makes open 3 we lose again. He is very good when we play the Kings, I will give him that. 3 games against Celtics this season, only game we won was with Siakam not playing. Beat Pacers twice without Siakam not playing and lost to them with him playing.

End of the day, everyone sees that the Raptors when healthy need to start a true 5. That leaves one of OG/SIAKAM or Trent going to the bench. It's a problem not just this season but going into next season, overlap issues. Siakam also insists on having the ball in his hands which really takes away from Scottie handling the ball. As for choking, I guess you missed the Celtics series and the dozen times he choked games late last season as the Raptors top option. He is more effective as a #2 or maybe a 2B and I don't see him accepting that lesser role with the Raptors. Time to move on and this is not about getting Scottie more touches, it about him developing more this season and getting ready to be a top option starting next season. Scottie still has plenty of areas to improve on, but he showed flashes and we just need to see him more involved and not just hanging out at the 3 point line while Siakam goes ISO which is great if we played the Kings every night.

[Dude-niagara]

I so sick of listening Siakam fanboys, always ready to make excuses after every choke job. 6-11 with him starting>.

The only stan here is you for Barnes. Siakam has played well this year with the exception of his three point shooting, and you just don't care to see it or can't. What choke job? He's not even playing lately. .

Devils Advocate : Better to be a Barnes stan than a Pascal Stan IMO. Barnes has quickly become a Toronto favorite and his stats would suggest he'll be better than Siakam fairly soon if given the same opportunity.

I have more faith in Barnes becoming "That guy" than I ever did with Pascal.

Spoiler:

Pascals ISO from the perimeter is still cringe inducing.

Fans need too decide, if they prefer seeing more of Scottie handling the ball and either scoring or getting easy baskets for his teammates or Siakam going ISO and only passing when he has a double team while Scottie hangs out at the 3 point. Siakam is a huge reason why this team almost never plays team sharing basketball. No reason why we're not moving the basketball more like the Warriors and pass & cut.

[Psubs]

The only stan here is you for Barnes. Siakam has played well this year with the exception of his three point shooting, and you just don't care to see it or can't. What choke job? He's not even playing lately. .

Devils Advocate : Better to be a Barnes stan than a Pascal Stan IMO. Barnes has quickly become a Toronto favorite and his stats would suggest he'll be better than Siakam fairly soon if given the same opportunity.

I have more faith in Barnes becoming "That guy" than I ever did with Pascal.

Spoiler:

Pascals ISO from the perimeter is still cringe inducing.

Fans need too decide, if they prefer seeing more of Scottie handling the ball and either scoring or getting easy baskets for his teammates or Siakam going ISO and only passing when he has a double team while Scottie hangs out at the 3 point. Siakam is a huge reason why this team almost never plays team sharing basketball. No reason why we're not moving the basketball more like the Warriors and pass & cut.

Derozan developed distributing skills after he was traded to San Antonio. Not sure if Siakam will later in his career.

[will]

Just get the ball in Scottie's hands....and everyone just start screening/cutting and moving around.

Oh yeah, keep your head on a swivel and be ready for a pass to come your way.

[Johnny Bball]

I so sick of listening Siakam fanboys, always ready to make excuses after every choke job. 6-11 with him starting>.

The only stan here is you for Barnes. Siakam has played well this year with the exception of his three point shooting, and you just don't care to see it or can't. What choke job? He's not even playing lately. .

I guess you missed those second halves, choked late in Bucks win and Nets loss. Also missed shot late in Knicks game that if Randle makes open 3 we lose again. He is very good when we play the Kings, I will give him that. 3 games against Celtics this season, only game we won was with Siakam not playing. Beat Pacers twice without Siakam not playing and lost to them with him playing.

End of the day, everyone sees that the Raptors when healthy need to start a true 5. That leaves one of OG/SIAKAM or Trent going to the bench. It's a problem not just this season but going into next season, overlap issues. Siakam also insists on having the ball in his hands which really takes away from Scottie handling the ball. As for choking, I guess you missed the Celtics series and the dozen times he choked games late last season as the Raptors top option. He is more effective as a #2 or maybe a 2B and I don't see him accepting that lesser role with the Raptors. Time to move on and this is not about getting Scottie more touches, it about him developing more this season and getting ready to be a top option starting next season. Scottie still has plenty of areas to improve on, but he showed flashes and we just need to see him more involved and not just hanging out at the 3 point line while Siakam goes ISO which is great if we played the Kings every night.

No, I just don’t carry around baggage of hate about players like it’s an anchor especially in a game where you fail more than half the time. Because to do so is **** waste of time, almost like quoting small and worthless sample sizes. Besides, being biased about players leads to bad decisions/opinions.

The raptors don’t need an old school five. That’s living in the past and a waste of assets. And if they need another PF to play the five, so be it, but I guarantee this team is not trading pascal for the type of five you want. Or. Mid-season even. Ever. Because it’s a useless exercise. You’re dreaming.

[youngRAPZ]

The only stan here is you for Barnes. Siakam has played well this year with the exception of his three point shooting, and you just don't care to see it or can't. What choke job? He's not even playing lately. .

Devils Advocate : Better to be a Barnes stan than a Pascal Stan IMO. Barnes has quickly become a Toronto favorite and his stats would suggest he'll be better than Siakam fairly soon if given the same opportunity.

I have more faith in Barnes becoming "That guy" than I ever did with Pascal.

Spoiler:

Pascals ISO from the perimeter is still cringe inducing.

Fans need too decide, if they prefer seeing more of Scottie handling the ball and either scoring or getting easy baskets for his teammates or Siakam going ISO and only passing when he has a double team while Scottie hangs out at the 3 point. Siakam is a huge reason why this team almost never plays team sharing basketball. No reason why we're not moving the basketball more like the Warriors and pass & cut.

Fans don’t need to decide anything because you have no decision power


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ConSarnit]

Your words.



You literally say we can't/shouldn't be a stan of barnes because he's younger than us lol, Or we shouldn't stan in general, who knows?

You sound like an angry old man who doesn't know what he's upset about.


Isn't the "cringe" me suggesting Barnes will be better than Siakam very soon? Or is the "cringe" that people like Barnes more than Pascal and want him moved? (I didn't suggest this)


I don't care about the topic of our lineups with barnes/pascal/fvv ect, I'm just going with the flow. I do take offense when you say we shouldn't Stan Barnes or they're (stans) part of the problem. Because it's clear as day he's our best prospect since ever and rightfully deserves the praise he's been getting.

I think his point is you can praise Barnes without making up bs about our other players. Not saying you are the one making it up, but some of these “Barnes Stan’s” takes such as pascal won’t defer because I can read his mind or fvv is jealous because I can also read his mind is kind of annoying.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Oh if that's the case I agree with you guys. From my eye test a lot of Barnes assists are to FVV (specifically) and Pascal. It doesn't look like they're stepping on each others toes, especially since Scottie's been hitting the 3. I just think Barnes has been amazing and deserving of the praise.

My personal opinion on where we are as a team is simple. Continue adding talent by any means to the core until they either develop into a contender or have the necessary assets to trade for a star if one becomes available. Basically what we did with Lowry/DD core until an opportune trade became available. So I'm in favor of keeping both FVV and Pascal as I don't think it'll hamper Barnes development in the slightest. I think the shot distribution between the 3 are perfectly fine, how OG will affect it will be seen. But I would like to see Barnes either take on a larger play making role for his development.

You’re right: Barnes top 2 assisted players are FVV (17) and Siakam (13).

Siakam’s top assisted player: Barnes. Seems like they’re fitting together pretty well.

Barnes, FVV and Siakam are all good passers for their positions. They aren’t the problem. OG’s passing needs work and Trent is a borderline black hole (usage vs assist%).

If Barnes can take another step next year we should be in very good shape. We know that FVV and Pascal can thrive in lesser offensive roles.

[Johnny Bball]

Devils Advocate : Better to be a Barnes stan than a Pascal Stan IMO. Barnes has quickly become a Toronto favorite and his stats would suggest he'll be better than Siakam fairly soon if given the same opportunity.

I have more faith in Barnes becoming "That guy" than I ever did with Pascal.

Spoiler:

Pascals ISO from the perimeter is still cringe inducing.

Fans need too decide, if they prefer seeing more of Scottie handling the ball and either scoring or getting easy baskets for his teammates or Siakam going ISO and only passing when he has a double team while Scottie hangs out at the 3 point. Siakam is a huge reason why this team almost never plays team sharing basketball. No reason why we're not moving the basketball more like the Warriors and pass & cut.

Derozan developed distributing skills after he was traded to San Antonio. Not sure if Siakam will later in his career.

No he did not, he fully started being the number one ball handler and learned most of it here. And that has sweet FA to do with Siakam.

[Los_29]

11 points to 8 points. Fred takes over at the end. Big deal. You don't see it, you read it and accept it as fact.

We have a losing record overall. As for them being just empty, that's entirely dumb.

I feel your pain.

Siakam has the best non-pg assist% of anyone on the team. He’s averaging 3.7ast from the pf/c slot. Those are very good numbers for a pf/c.

So we have a guy (Siakam) who provides good playmaking from pf/c. He creates far more opportunities for others than OG. He also has a +’ve plus/minus (+2, better than Scottie), yet somehow Siakam is the problem?

Honestly, the posters railing against Siakam in here are just embarrassing.

Nothing embarrassing about it. People want to force a lineup on themselves that's not going to work. Siakam at the 5 is a disaster, Barnes is not a 1 or 2 neither is OG.

But maybe you can show your lineup with Siakam and how it's going to work?

This is one of the biggest problems on here. People argue based too much on their feelings as opposed to actual facts. You think it’s a disaster because you want it to be a disaster because you don’t like Pascal. But the numbers suggest otherwise.

Pascal is one of our best players and the stats overwhelmingly go against your claims.

[HiJiNX]

I so sick of listening Siakam fanboys, always ready to make excuses after every choke job. 6-11 with him starting>.

The only stan here is you for Barnes. Siakam has played well this year with the exception of his three point shooting, and you just don't care to see it or can't. What choke job? He's not even playing lately. .

I guess you missed those second halves, choked late in Bucks win and Nets loss. Also missed shot late in Knicks game that if Randle makes open 3 we lose again. He is very good when we play the Kings, I will give him that. 3 games against Celtics this season, only game we won was with Siakam not playing. Beat Pacers twice without Siakam not playing and lost to them with him playing.

End of the day, everyone sees that the Raptors when healthy need to start a true 5. That leaves one of OG/SIAKAM or Trent going to the bench. It's a problem not just this season but going into next season, overlap issues. Siakam also insists on having the ball in his hands which really takes away from Scottie handling the ball. As for choking, I guess you missed the Celtics series and the dozen times he choked games late last season as the Raptors top option. He is more effective as a #2 or maybe a 2B and I don't see him accepting that lesser role with the Raptors. Time to move on and this is not about getting Scottie more touches, it about him developing more this season and getting ready to be a top option starting next season. Scottie still has plenty of areas to improve on, but he showed flashes and we just need to see him more involved and not just hanging out at the 3 point line while Siakam goes ISO which is great if we played the Kings every night.

Context bro. Context.

1. We are 5-2 in the last seven games that Siakam started and realistically could be 7-0 in that stretch if Fred doesn’t make some awful decisions against BKN and we don’t throw away the OKC game.

2. What else was happening when Siakam came back? Weren’t we on the longest road trip of the season? We also had one or no centre’s available during that time. Oh we also lost one of our better rebounders and defenders in OG. And Yuta was either not playing or getting reacclimated. Boucher was working his way back (and has been mostly bad all year). But let’s put all the blame on Siakam.

3. Siakam missed training camp and had no preseason. Maybe he was fading in second halves because he wasn’t in game shape yet?

4. Siakam, interestingly enough, was one of the most efficient clutch players in the league in 2020 before the league shut down for covid. Go look it up if you think I’m lying. Also, Siakam has consistently been making winning plays beyond shot making for us this year in the clutch once he has gotten into shape.

5. Siakam has been quite a good distributor over the last ten games or so.

I actually think that if Siakam’s three ball starts to fall at around 36% again that he becomes a top 20 player in the league with the way the rest of his game has evolved.

Yeah, I get that Siakam is old in chronological years but he’s still developing. This year has made me feel optimistic about him in that he’s clearly dedicated to the intangibles this year and not thinking being a good player means just scoring a lot. He’s shown some flashes this year that there’s one more level for him to get to and that level has looked really good. He still has to work out the shot selection and let the ball stick a little less, but I can’t find anything else about him to be mad about, unless you want to be mad that he’s not shooting the three well.

Otherwise you’re just being mad at Pascal for being out of shape and working his way back while a bunch of other important pieces were out or working their way back at the same time.

[Madhouse]

I feel your pain.

Siakam has the best non-pg assist% of anyone on the team. He’s averaging 3.7ast from the pf/c slot. Those are very good numbers for a pf/c.

So we have a guy (Siakam) who provides good playmaking from pf/c. He creates far more opportunities for others than OG. He also has a +’ve plus/minus (+2, better than Scottie), yet somehow Siakam is the problem?

Honestly, the posters railing against Siakam in here are just embarrassing.

Nothing embarrassing about it. People want to force a lineup on themselves that's not going to work. Siakam at the 5 is a disaster, Barnes is not a 1 or 2 neither is OG.

But maybe you can show your lineup with Siakam and how it's going to work?

This is one of the biggest problems on here. People argue based too much on their feelings as opposed to actual facts. You think it’s a disaster because you want it to be a disaster because you don’t like Pascal. But the numbers suggest otherwise.

Pascal is one of our best players and the stats overwhelmingly go against your claims.

Actually I don't hate him. What I'm questioning is his longterm fit with the Raptors and how our starting lineup would even look like and I very much question that it's going to work out.

Now if you could show me how we are going to play longterm, how the lineup would look like and how it's a good fit despite the lack of spacing, then yes.

Pascal is a good player that's not the point.

Although a player with RAPTOR scores of
0.7 in 2019/20
0.4 in 2020/21
-1.5 in 2021/22

is very much not worth the money he is making.