Draft Thread Part 4

[hyper316]

I recall Enes Kanter having issues playing in Canada and need 'special permission' from the PM Trudeau. Would this create implications in drafting Sengun?

“I have a phone conversation with [Prime Minister] Justin Trudeau,” Kanter explained (via WBUR’s Shira Springer). “So, that’s gonna be very exciting … I’m literally gonna ask, like, ‘Hey, I’m coming to your country. Is it OK for me to come?'”

https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2019/12/20/nba-boston-celtics-enes-kanter-help-from-justin-trudeau/

“I want to thank Prime Minister Justin Trudeau’s government, U.S. and Canadian law enforcement, U.S. Senator Ed Markey, the Celtics, the NBA and my managers for working diligently to make my Christmas game against the Raptors possible and ensuring my safety there,” Kanter writes in the Globe. “And, on Christmas night, I will play in my first game as a Celtic outside the U.S. when I take the court against the Raptors.”

https://www.gazettenet.com/Celtics--Kanter-thanks-Trudeau-for-chance-to-play-in-Canada-31535325

Kanter had a bounty on his head because of his political stance against Turkish leadership and got his Turkish passport revoked.

I'm sure there were thousands of Turkish citizens flying in and out of Canada and USA pre-covid

[biglottoballs]

The two guys I am very interested in at the moment are Sengun and Giddy. Sengun is going to be an absolutely lethal big man. He is great at getting switched on a smaller guy, trapping him in the post and being physical against bigger centers too.

Sengun is a better prospect than Suggs and Kuminga he is getting criminally underrated. Giddey has real issues on defense and if he can show some form of defense in the FIBA exhibition games it would do him well and further my interest in him as a prospect.

Sengun cannot switch on a smaller guy, and he is not big enough against the NBA centers, which is most of the scouting report I read.

Watch on YouTube

On the perimeter he can be attacked but he is very good at decelerating and forcing the handler to go in the direction he wants. That usually turns into his chase down block attempts. The ability to decelerate also helps him when contesting pull ups. He has a strong base too and boxes out, hits outlet passes well, and he is able to grab-n-go.

I see his shooting, rebounding, physicality, footwork, mismatch potential, and playmaking as immediate impact skills. With Siakam, OG, and Fred you would assume he isn't going to be the primary defensive anchor. Fromt he 2 and 5 the Raptors need more offensive oriented players than defensive.

Combining Sengun with a pick and roll player like Lonzo. This creates for a 2 man game between Ball and Sengun. That causes a shift in the defense allowing Siakam, OG, and Fred to attack closeouts and improves their production and efficiency.

[garbagnani]

CBS has us taking Sengun at 7 in latest mock

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-mock-draft-2021-pistons-grab-cade-cunningham-at-no-1-jalen-green-goes-to-magic-over-evan-mobley/amp/

Alperen Sengun C
TURKEY • 6'10" / 240 LBS
PROJECTED TEAM
Toronto
PROSPECT RNK
24th
POSITION RNK
2nd
Sengun is racing up draft boards thanks to improvement he's shown with Besiktas, and the Raptors have a real need at the center position. He's a polished low-post scorer who has shown tremendous playmaking potential, and he possesses a rare combination of skill and toughness. His motor and mobility makes up for a lack of athleticism on the defensive end. He may need some time, but Sengun looks like a wise investment given his overseas accomplishments at just 18 years old.

This is not a real time solution for being thin up the middle. At least not anytime soon. He is an 18 year old. It could take him 5 years and he really is not any kind of player you build around so his timeline is whack with what we have. He's not the one for a pick 7 or 8. I think he is a 15th overall pick at best. I would take all of Moody, Mitchell, Keon and Giddey over him without batting an eye. I would also have to weigh if we think he projects better than Kai Jones.

He was MVP in a man's league.. This guy is as ready as it gets what do you even mean? Moody is a solid role player, Giddey is way more raw, Keon is an athletic prospect that needs to learn how to play basketball. Mitchell is ready but we solid at point guard and he's not even close to as talented as Sengun. I dunno, call me crazy i guess

I like sengun too.

[RaptorPride]

How would Sengun match up with guys like Giannis, Embiid, Ayton, Towns, Bam etc?
Could he be like Gasol on the perimeter? Someone who's a bit slow but can position him self well to still be decent.

I just want our future center to be a good defensive player. When Pascal was forced to play center last year it just never worked because he was to small and weak down low.

But everything thing about him seems great especially his playmaking. Which our offence relies on.

[Dalek]

How would Sengun match up with guys like Giannis, Embiid, Ayton, Towns, Bam etc?
Could he be like Gasol on the perimeter? Someone who's a bit slow but can position him self well to still be decent.

I just want our future center to be a good defensive player. When Pascal was forced to play center last year it just never worked because he was to small and weak down low.

But everything thing about him seems great especially his playmaking. Which our offence relies on.

I think Sengun is pure grit. He goes hard on his offense and defense when I have seen him which can make up for any athletic shortcomings. He has a tremendous skill base at age 18 which seemed to improve as his season went on. To me it is a good investment because he has a high enough floor coming in to at least score on putbacks and block a few shots or rebound.

The thing I don't get is that a number of people on this board can see value in signing guys like Daniel Theis and Richaun Holmes who are both smaller than Sengun. I guess the cost of a lottery pick is higher than $10 m annually it would take to sign these guys who have long since hit their ceiling.

[bon]

How would Sengun match up with guys like Giannis, Embiid, Ayton, Towns, Bam etc?
Could he be like Gasol on the perimeter? Someone who's a bit slow but can position him self well to still be decent.

I just want our future center to be a good defensive player. When Pascal was forced to play center last year it just never worked because he was to small and weak down low.

But everything thing about him seems great especially his playmaking. Which our offence relies on.

He would be fine against Bam and Ayton but Giannis/Embiid/Towns would go to work. They're All-NBA players after all

[Blood Orange]

2nd round anyone?

Watch on YouTube

[Steelo Green]

Problem with Segun is if he plays C, he has to either be an elite offensive player, or at the very least a good defender to go along with good O.

Your C can’t be a liability. Just too important.

He’s fine for a later pick but top 10 I am not a fan.

[Steelo Green]

How would Sengun match up with guys like Giannis, Embiid, Ayton, Towns, Bam etc?
Could he be like Gasol on the perimeter? Someone who's a bit slow but can position him self well to still be decent.

I just want our future center to be a good defensive player. When Pascal was forced to play center last year it just never worked because he was to small and weak down low.

But everything thing about him seems great especially his playmaking. Which our offence relies on.

I think Sengun is pure grit. He goes hard on his offense and defense when I have seen him which can make up for any athletic shortcomings. He has a tremendous skill base at age 18 which seemed to improve as his season went on. To me it is a good investment because he has a high enough floor coming in to at least score on putbacks and block a few shots or rebound.

The thing I don't get is that a number of people on this board can see value in signing guys like Daniel Theis and Richaun Holmes who are both smaller than Sengun. I guess the cost of a lottery pick is higher than $10 m annually it would take to sign these guys who have long since hit their ceiling.

We have a talent problem, not a positional one.

I am never a fan of going positional need.

[canada_dry]

How would Sengun match up with guys like Giannis, Embiid, Ayton, Towns, Bam etc?
Could he be like Gasol on the perimeter? Someone who's a bit slow but can position him self well to still be decent.

I just want our future center to be a good defensive player. When Pascal was forced to play center last year it just never worked because he was to small and weak down low.

But everything thing about him seems great especially his playmaking. Which our offence relies on.

I think Sengun is pure grit. He goes hard on his offense and defense when I have seen him which can make up for any athletic shortcomings. He has a tremendous skill base at age 18 which seemed to improve as his season went on. To me it is a good investment because he has a high enough floor coming in to at least score on putbacks and block a few shots or rebound.

The thing I don't get is that a number of people on this board can see value in signing guys like Daniel Theis and Richaun Holmes who are both smaller than Sengun. I guess the cost of a lottery pick is higher than $10 m annually it would take to sign these guys who have long since hit their ceiling.

We have a talent problem, not a positional one.

I am never a fan of going positional need.

He might be the most talented while also being a need.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

[Steelo Green]

I think Sengun is pure grit. He goes hard on his offense and defense when I have seen him which can make up for any athletic shortcomings. He has a tremendous skill base at age 18 which seemed to improve as his season went on. To me it is a good investment because he has a high enough floor coming in to at least score on putbacks and block a few shots or rebound.

The thing I don't get is that a number of people on this board can see value in signing guys like Daniel Theis and Richaun Holmes who are both smaller than Sengun. I guess the cost of a lottery pick is higher than $10 m annually it would take to sign these guys who have long since hit their ceiling.

We have a talent problem, not a positional one.

I am never a fan of going positional need.

He might be the most talented while also being a need.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

Maybe. The issue for me is his lack of D is going to be a huge problem.

Unlike the guard and wing spots which you can teach to be smart, the C spot is too important to F to just be okay.

All the best bigs are great at D: Giannis, Bam, AS, Embiid, Gobert, Ayton is starting to figure it out, Capella.

Look at KAT. Great player, Sengun will likely never be as good, but his poor D and he isn’t a winning player, so it’s tough for me to take a guy like that so high.

He doesn’t have range either. I am a big Sabonis fan but his lack of D even with his talent is a large reason a talented Indiana team doesn’t win.

[NoBias]

Anybody else get Pau Gasol vibes from Sengun?

[Steelo Green]

Anybody else get Pau Gasol vibes from Sengun?

Pau was a much better defender and 3 inches taller.

Height isn’t everything but makes a big difference at three C spot.

[OAKLEY_2]

CBS has us taking Sengun at 7 in latest mock

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-mock-draft-2021-pistons-grab-cade-cunningham-at-no-1-jalen-green-goes-to-magic-over-evan-mobley/amp/

Alperen Sengun C
TURKEY • 6'10" / 240 LBS
PROJECTED TEAM
Toronto
PROSPECT RNK
24th
POSITION RNK
2nd
Sengun is racing up draft boards thanks to improvement he's shown with Besiktas, and the Raptors have a real need at the center position. He's a polished low-post scorer who has shown tremendous playmaking potential, and he possesses a rare combination of skill and toughness. His motor and mobility makes up for a lack of athleticism on the defensive end. He may need some time, but Sengun looks like a wise investment given his overseas accomplishments at just 18 years old.

This is not a real time solution for being thin up the middle. At least not anytime soon. He is an 18 year old. It could take him 5 years and he really is not any kind of player you build around so his timeline is whack with what we have. He's not the one for a pick 7 or 8. I think he is a 15th overall pick at best. I would take all of Moody, Mitchell, Keon and Giddey over him without batting an eye. I would also have to weigh if we think he projects better than Kai Jones.

This isnt the time to go with Birch/Gillespie rotation. Team needs a major upgrade at the 5 and he shows promise. If he plays well at Olympics and measures good, he’s tops on our list at 7/8 with barnes, johnson.

You keep coming back to Birch-Gillespie which shows a single track mind. The point is trade or sign the player that will fill the role of starter - we have the money. They need to be able to contain or at least compete against Embiid. It is not a player you need to play every game or to play 36 minutes. It certainly is not a player from FIBA at 18 with our best pick since Poetl.

All Masai's picks since Bruno have been NCAA and it wasn't man's league at issue rather it was coaching, program and player progress. Above all else it was a defence first culture with motor.

Sengun might be Dan Tolzman's pick for all I know but we've never won anything building around a big. Molding around a tough strong 2-3 like number 2 who we had for one brief flash should have shown anyone paying attention where championships come from.

[WuTang_CMB]

This is not a real time solution for being thin up the middle. At least not anytime soon. He is an 18 year old. It could take him 5 years and he really is not any kind of player you build around so his timeline is whack with what we have. He's not the one for a pick 7 or 8. I think he is a 15th overall pick at best. I would take all of Moody, Mitchell, Keon and Giddey over him without batting an eye. I would also have to weigh if we think he projects better than Kai Jones.

This isnt the time to go with Birch/Gillespie rotation. Team needs a major upgrade at the 5 and he shows promise. If he plays well at Olympics and measures good, he’s tops on our list at 7/8 with barnes, johnson.

You keep coming back to Birch-Gillespie which shows a single track mind. The point is trade or sign the player that will fill the role of starter - we have the money. They need to be able to contain or at least compete against Embiid. It is not a player you need to play every game or to play 36 minutes. It certainly is not a player from FIBA at 18 with our best pick since Poetl.

All Masai's picks since Bruno have been NCAA and it wasn't man's league at issue rather it was coaching, program and player progress. Above all else it was a defence first culture with motor.

Sengun might be Dan Tolzman's pick for all I know but we've never won anything building around a big. Molding around a tough strong 2-3 like number 2 who we had for one brief flash should have shown anyone paying attention where championships come from.

I only bring up Birch because you said this isnt the time to be thin up the middle... hence why i am saying Sengun would be an intriguing pick for us. You continue to spin your wheels on this topic. Sengun has the skill at 18 and defensively will grow in our system.

[garbagnani]

We have a talent problem, not a positional one.

I am never a fan of going positional need.

He might be the most talented while also being a need.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

Maybe. The issue for me is his lack of D is going to be a huge problem.

Unlike the guard and wing spots which you can teach to be smart, the C spot is too important to F to just be okay.

All the best bigs are great at D: Giannis, Bam, AS, Embiid, Gobert, Ayton is starting to figure it out, Capella.

Look at KAT. Great player, Sengun will likely never be as good, but his poor D and he isn’t a winning player, so it’s tough for me to take a guy like that so high.

He doesn’t have range either. I am a big Sabonis fan but his lack of D even with his talent is a large reason a talented Indiana team doesn’t win.

Sengun’s videos show pretty good D. Good effort and hustle too.

[garbagnani]

This is not a real time solution for being thin up the middle. At least not anytime soon. He is an 18 year old. It could take him 5 years and he really is not any kind of player you build around so his timeline is whack with what we have. He's not the one for a pick 7 or 8. I think he is a 15th overall pick at best. I would take all of Moody, Mitchell, Keon and Giddey over him without batting an eye. I would also have to weigh if we think he projects better than Kai Jones.

This isnt the time to go with Birch/Gillespie rotation. Team needs a major upgrade at the 5 and he shows promise. If he plays well at Olympics and measures good, he’s tops on our list at 7/8 with barnes, johnson.

You keep coming back to Birch-Gillespie which shows a single track mind. The point is trade or sign the player that will fill the role of starter - we have the money. They need to be able to contain or at least compete against Embiid. It is not a player you need to play every game or to play 36 minutes. It certainly is not a player from FIBA at 18 with our best pick since Poetl.

All Masai's picks since Bruno have been NCAA and it wasn't man's league at issue rather it was coaching, program and player progress. Above all else it was a defence first culture with motor.

Sengun might be Dan Tolzman's pick for all I know but we've never won anything building around a big. Molding around a tough strong 2-3 like number 2 who we had for one brief flash should have shown anyone paying attention where championships come from.

If we don’t move up, we aren’t getting a player to build around. Hope to find a good starter, maybe an all star.

[ATLTimekeeper]

How is Sabonis not a winning player? They won high 40s and low 50s since he's been on the team with the sole exception of this injury-plagued year. And he just turned 25. Put better players around him and he'll win even more, most likely. Either way, it would be a home run to get a 20/12/7 guy at #7. Just like it would be a home run to draft KAT @#7.

The reason you take Sengun is that he's put up massive numbers at 18. You can like a whole bunch of wings and guards. I do, too, but none of them will come close to being as productive as Sengun and only a couple are the same age.

[Indeed]

The two guys I am very interested in at the moment are Sengun and Giddy. Sengun is going to be an absolutely lethal big man. He is great at getting switched on a smaller guy, trapping him in the post and being physical against bigger centers too.

Sengun is a better prospect than Suggs and Kuminga he is getting criminally underrated. Giddey has real issues on defense and if he can show some form of defense in the FIBA exhibition games it would do him well and further my interest in him as a prospect.

Sengun cannot switch on a smaller guy, and he is not big enough against the NBA centers, which is most of the scouting report I read.

Watch on YouTube

On the perimeter he can be attacked but he is very good at decelerating and forcing the handler to go in the direction he wants. That usually turns into his chase down block attempts. The ability to decelerate also helps him when contesting pull ups. He has a strong base too and boxes out, hits outlet passes well, and he is able to grab-n-go.

I see his shooting, rebounding, physicality, footwork, mismatch potential, and playmaking as immediate impact skills. With Siakam, OG, and Fred you would assume he isn't going to be the primary defensive anchor. Fromt he 2 and 5 the Raptors need more offensive oriented players than defensive.

Combining Sengun with a pick and roll player like Lonzo. This creates for a 2 man game between Ball and Sengun. That causes a shift in the defense allowing Siakam, OG, and Fred to attack closeouts and improves their production and efficiency.

I provided video evidence on him NOT able to stay in front of guards (struggle against guards who can change direction, and he cannot force the handler to go in the direction he wants), so I am not sure how you come up with the opposite conclusion.

This is another scouting report on his concern over perimeter defense.

Watch on YouTube

[Indeed]

He might be the most talented while also being a need.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

Maybe. The issue for me is his lack of D is going to be a huge problem.

Unlike the guard and wing spots which you can teach to be smart, the C spot is too important to F to just be okay.

All the best bigs are great at D: Giannis, Bam, AS, Embiid, Gobert, Ayton is starting to figure it out, Capella.

Look at KAT. Great player, Sengun will likely never be as good, but his poor D and he isn’t a winning player, so it’s tough for me to take a guy like that so high.

He doesn’t have range either. I am a big Sabonis fan but his lack of D even with his talent is a large reason a talented Indiana team doesn’t win.

Sengun’s videos show pretty good D. Good effort and hustle too.

Please see the scouting videos above or below that I provided, his perimeter defense might not be quick enough. Keep in mind that those videos I provided are not highlights that only shows the good side of things.