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2023 Draft Discussion Part 6

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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1781 » by HumbleRen » Fri Jun 16, 2023 4:41 pm

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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1782 » by God Squad » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:04 pm

HumbleRen wrote:
REJECTEDBYCLARK wrote:
HumbleRen wrote:
The teams in the 5-17 range that report workouts have not mentioned Bufkin at all.


That's so bizarre. Why do you think that is? Bufkin has risen all year and when you go back to the tape and consider his age you keep liking what you see more and more and more. It's a depressing thought to have this guy who we identified at the end of the college season where he was widely regarded as a late 1st round pick as a serious candidate for us and now he's a mid lottery pick? :(


He’s got a promise from a team that he really wants to go to.

That’s the only reason why he would not do any workouts for teams.

Seems obvious, no? People are mocking Coulibaly and LMiller to OKC, but maybe it's all smoke.

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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1783 » by ItsDanger » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:08 pm

Lot of these draft guys are just promoters at this point. Half of these prospects don't pan out in top range. So when they like every player's potential, it dilutes whatever good opinion they may have on all these prospects. They should take a stand and stop following the crowd in their analysis.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1784 » by HumbleRen » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:12 pm

God Squad wrote:
HumbleRen wrote:
REJECTEDBYCLARK wrote:
That's so bizarre. Why do you think that is? Bufkin has risen all year and when you go back to the tape and consider his age you keep liking what you see more and more and more. It's a depressing thought to have this guy who we identified at the end of the college season where he was widely regarded as a late 1st round pick as a serious candidate for us and now he's a mid lottery pick? :(


He’s got a promise from a team that he really wants to go to.

That’s the only reason why he would not do any workouts for teams.

Seems obvious, no? People are mocking Coulibaly and LMiller to OKC, but maybe it's all smoke.

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A week before draft day is peak smoke. We won't truly know until the day of.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1785 » by InfraRedshaw » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:14 pm

it's wildfire szn and the smoke is THICC
Just 8* years ago Andrea Bargnani was my franchise player, you MF'ers can't rain on my parade
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1786 » by Psubs » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:15 pm

HumbleRen wrote:
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I'd rather sign DD with the MLE.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1787 » by Psubs » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:20 pm

REJECTEDBYCLARK wrote:If Raps move up really high in this draft and are planning on dumping OG I would hope they target Cam Whitmore.

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Extremely small sample but 94th percentile scoring efficiency as a cutter, 88th percentile in isolation and 88th as a spot up shooter as an 18 year old playing tough college competition.


Isn't he Miles Bridges 2.0? Do we need Miles Bridges 2.0? I don't think so.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1788 » by OakleyDokely » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:24 pm

Most drafts produce 2-3 consistent allstar level players, a handful of guys that maybe make 1 allstar game (or get close to making one) and about 15-20 solid starters or rotation players. The rest are end of the bench guys or are out of the league soon after their first contract.

I wish the draft guys would actually project who they think won't make it, especially among the guys discussed in the first half of the draft. If you make every prospect out to be a quality NBA player, it's hard to be wrong anything because some of them will be good.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1789 » by HumbleRen » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:29 pm

I wonder if Raps just trade 13 for Jazz's 16 & 28.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1790 » by REJECTEDBYCLARK » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:35 pm

alpngso wrote:
REJECTEDBYCLARK wrote:If Raps move up really high in this draft and are planning on dumping OG I would hope they target Cam Whitmore.

Read on Twitter


Extremely small sample but 94th percentile scoring efficiency as a cutter, 88th percentile in isolation and 88th as a spot up shooter as an 18 year old playing tough college competition.


I loved Whitmore before going into season, thought he was going to be top 3. Combination of power and athleticism is really intriguing. But the dude does not pass at all. If he goes to Houston, that team will self-destruct with KPJ, Green and him on the court. Jabari's career will just die.

On the Raptors, it might be interesting.


If you're in the 88th percentile in iso PPP why would you pass :lol:

Give him to Darko and let him mold him
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1791 » by douggood » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:38 pm

kevin pelton stats based projections\

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/insider/story/_/id/37847803/nba-draft-2023-breaking-30-best-prospects

1. Victor Wembanyama : 3.9 WARP
2. Brandon Miller : 3.5 WARP
3. Cam Whitmore : 3.2 WARP
4. Taylor Hendricks 2.7 WARP
5. Gradey Dick 2.6 WARP
6. Cason Wallace 2.6 WARP
7. Dereck Lively II 2.4 WARP
8. Jarace Walker 2.3 WARP
9. Brandin Podziemski 2.3 WARP
10. Brice Sensabaugh 2.2 WARP
11. Dariq Whitehead 2.1 WARP
12. Keyonte George 2.1 WARP
13. Scoot Henderson 2.1 WARP
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1792 » by REJECTEDBYCLARK » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:55 pm

If Podziemski were like 15% more athletic than he is (who is to say with NBA training he can't improve as an athlete) what is holding him back from being the #1 guard in the entire class? He is there in the conversation at 13 for me.

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look at this filthy pass

the kid is unreal and still being undervalued. SIX YEARS playing competitive basketball.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1793 » by DG88 » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:56 pm

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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1794 » by Psubs » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:57 pm

REJECTEDBYCLARK wrote:If Podziemski were like 15% more athletic than he is (who is to say with NBA training he can't improve as an athlete) what is holding him back from being the #1 guard in the entire class? He is there in the conversation at 13 for me.

Read on Twitter


look at this filthy pass

the kid is unreal and still being undervalued. SIX YEARS playing competitive basketball.


Cissoko makes the same passes, in an OG frame.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1795 » by Sandman88 » Fri Jun 16, 2023 5:57 pm

We’d be lucky if Kobe is still on the board at 13
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1796 » by niQ » Fri Jun 16, 2023 6:00 pm

Would you guys consider any of Bufkin, Wallace, or George to be Raptors-y players? Probably not right? Unless you consider Cason's 6'8.5 wingspan big for a PG his size.

Really want one of those 3. Can only hope it was a smokescreen from Webster...
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1797 » by HumbleRen » Fri Jun 16, 2023 6:01 pm

Psubs wrote:
REJECTEDBYCLARK wrote:If Podziemski were like 15% more athletic than he is (who is to say with NBA training he can't improve as an athlete) what is holding him back from being the #1 guard in the entire class? He is there in the conversation at 13 for me.

Read on Twitter


look at this filthy pass

the kid is unreal and still being undervalued. SIX YEARS playing competitive basketball.


Cissoko makes the same passes, in an OG frame.


I prefer Cissoko too but the difference is, Pod can actually shoot which opens up even more passing lanes lol.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1798 » by Psubs » Fri Jun 16, 2023 6:09 pm

niQ wrote:Would you guys consider any of Bufkin, Wallace, or George to be Raptors-y players? Probably not right? Unless you consider Cason's 6'8.5 wingspan big for a PG his size.

Really want one of those 3. Can only hope it was a smokescreen from Webster...


After drafting Flynn, what's a Raptors-y pick? Analytics with IBM Watson?

The eye test had me seeing Desmond Bane being jacked but not negatively affecting his shooting and he shot from NBA range. His arms might've meant less stocks but he was able to be a secondary playmaker in the NBA running the offense at TCU. I would argue that Memphis is better with Bane and not Ja, than with Ja and not Bane.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1799 » by Dalek » Fri Jun 16, 2023 6:10 pm

douggood wrote:kevin pelton stats based projections\

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/insider/story/_/id/37847803/nba-draft-2023-breaking-30-best-prospects

1. Victor Wembanyama : 3.9 WARP
2. Brandon Miller : 3.5 WARP
3. Cam Whitmore : 3.2 WARP
4. Taylor Hendricks 2.7 WARP
5. Gradey Dick 2.6 WARP
6. Cason Wallace 2.6 WARP
7. Dereck Lively II 2.4 WARP
8. Jarace Walker 2.3 WARP
9. Brandin Podziemski 2.3 WARP
10. Brice Sensabaugh 2.2 WARP
11. Dariq Whitehead 2.1 WARP
12. Keyonte George 2.1 WARP
13. Scoot Henderson 2.1 WARP


These are fun projections, but without knowing which team they are going to and their role, it is hard think these have value. He doesn't even look at Overtime Elite so no idea on the Thompson Twins.

I don't think Scoot's WARP will dissuade anyone from taking him no. 2. You work him out, check his leadership and star potential, and you just do the draft. Analytics have nothing to do with that pick.

Anthony Black is 14th valued in this model. He is the guy I think teams will struggle with. Do I take Anthony Black knowing he does a lot of things well but is a weak scorer, or do I take Kobe Bufkin who is much more dynamic? Bufkin is 23rd on this model which seems bizarre since most of the time he pops in advanced analytics.

Derek Lively at top ten value is another guy I debate his worth. Great shotblocker but is he better than Walker Kessler? He doesn't offer a lot more potential being so limited offensively, but Dallas could use a big and Luka could unlock really good value out of him.
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Re: 2023 Draft Discussion Part 6 

Post#1800 » by TronoWrappers » Fri Jun 16, 2023 6:11 pm

For the analytics crowd:

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Leonard Miller grading extremely well with this model.

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