2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2

[tecumseh18]

Posted this in the draft thread but then realized that it should probably go here...

A very hypothetical trade scenerio...

Assuming we are 7th pre-lottery...
Would you trade our pre-lottery draft position for Houston's?
So Houston would get our 7th pick and our decreased odds to move up but the security of knowing they are getting a top 7-10 pick at worst, and we would be getting the increased odds of moving up but if it didn't happen would end up with Miami's pick(through OKC) which is probably around 17th. I don't believe either team would do this trade in reality because the downside risk is too great, but it is interesting to consider.

In the worst case scenerio, we'd be trading the number 1 pick for the 17th pick. I don't believe any real life gm would make take that chance, however slim. However our chance at top 4 would be going up from 32% to 51% and our chances at Cade would nearly double from 7.5 to 14%. Are those increased odds worth the potential drop all the way to 17th?

Wow, that would be a ballsy move. I think it's always worth gambling for more chance at upside, but it would largely depend on whether Raps thought they could get someone at #17 who wasn't much worse than the Barnes, Keons and Moody's in the 6-10 range. I've seen Bouknight at #17. I'd prefer Ziaire Williams. Or maybe then take a chance on Jalen Johnson.

[Zeno]

Posted this in the draft thread but then realized that it should probably go here...

A very hypothetical trade scenerio...

Assuming we are 7th pre-lottery...
Would you trade our pre-lottery draft position for Houston's?
So Houston would get our 7th pick and our decreased odds to move up but the security of knowing they are getting a top 7-10 pick at worst, and we would be getting the increased odds of moving up but if it didn't happen would end up with Miami's pick(through OKC) which is probably around 17th. I don't believe either team would do this trade in reality because the downside risk is too great, but it is interesting to consider.

In the worst case scenerio, we'd be trading the number 1 pick for the 17th pick. I don't believe any real life gm would make take that chance, however slim. However our chance at top 4 would be going up from 32% to 51% and our chances at Cade would nearly double from 7.5 to 14%. Are those increased odds worth the potential drop all the way to 17th?

Wow, that would be a ballsy move. I think it's always worth gambling for more chance at upside, but it would largely depend on whether Raps thought they could get someone at #17 who wasn't much worse than the Barnes, Keons and Moody's in the 6-10 range. I've seen Bouknight at #17. I'd prefer Ziaire Williams. Or maybe then take a chance on Jalen Johnson.

Yeah it would be ballsy for both sides which makes me think value-wise it might be fair. But as I said it would create a definite loser in the trade and likely look pretty horrible for someone. So not happening. It is straight up gambling on the lottery like you are at a roulette table. Even if Masai loved someone who may look like they may fall to 17, he’d be making this trade more than a month before the draft and player’s draft stock can really rise and fall.

[Mark_83]

Anyone know where we can get percentages for shots off the dribble for the prospects from this draft?

[UnbelievablyRAW]

I was overlooking the Denver Nuggets trade board and they were entertaining a deal centred around of J.Murray + for FVV +? Their reasoning is that they don't believe Murray will be back until 2022 Feb. or so and they don't believe he will be the same player. Would you guys consider a swap of Murray for FVV straight up?

The Denver GM wouldn’t even be able to finish the sentence before the trade got called into the league office. Realistically, Fred would be perfect for them because he doesn’t need to play make and can play off ball but create in a pinch if needed. Also an excellent defender

Jamal gives us a real scorer at the guard that would probably resign given he’s a kid from the GTA and would be the face of the franchise pretty much

[hyper316]

I was overlooking the Denver Nuggets trade board and they were entertaining a deal centred around of J.Murray + for FVV +? Their reasoning is that they don't believe Murray will be back until 2022 Feb. or so and they don't believe he will be the same player. Would you guys consider a swap of Murray for FVV straight up?

The Denver GM wouldn’t even be able to finish the sentence before the trade got called into the league office. Realistically, Fred would be perfect for them because he doesn’t need to play make and can play off ball but create in a pinch if needed. Also an excellent defender

Jamal gives us a real scorer at the guard that would probably resign given he’s a kid from the GTA and would be the face of the franchise pretty much

Kitchener is in the GTA now?

[Jerry Lucas]

I need a bit of an explanation on Trent Jr's Bird Rights. Do we have his Full Bird rights or Early Bird, because I see a bunch of people like Dan Hackett and Grange mentioning how we have Full Bird, but don't you have to spend 3 seasons with the same team? Or does the half season in Portland this year count as season 3? Very confusing stuff lol.

[UnbelievablyRAW]

I was overlooking the Denver Nuggets trade board and they were entertaining a deal centred around of J.Murray + for FVV +? Their reasoning is that they don't believe Murray will be back until 2022 Feb. or so and they don't believe he will be the same player. Would you guys consider a swap of Murray for FVV straight up?

The Denver GM wouldn’t even be able to finish the sentence before the trade got called into the league office. Realistically, Fred would be perfect for them because he doesn’t need to play make and can play off ball but create in a pinch if needed. Also an excellent defender

Jamal gives us a real scorer at the guard that would probably resign given he’s a kid from the GTA and would be the face of the franchise pretty much

Kitchener is in the GTA now?

Oh my bad I thought he was from somewhere closer. Still close enough to know about Toronto culture though. Im sure he played ball a lot in the GTA rather than in Kitchener

[skywalker33]

I was overlooking the Denver Nuggets trade board and they were entertaining a deal centred around of J.Murray + for FVV +? Their reasoning is that they don't believe Murray will be back until 2022 Feb. or so and they don't believe he will be the same player. Would you guys consider a swap of Murray for FVV straight up?

What a joke, you or someone may have proposed that deal, but as a long-time Nuggets fan, I refuse to believe this was "entertained" or even received well. Most ACL injuries take 8-9mos and we're still going alright without Jamal, gives MPJ a chance to step up and develop further into a superstar. When Murray does return, we'll have an even more formidable offensive attack that already has chemistry. One Nuggets fan was open to conversation but not one endorsed it as a great idea....feels like someone here was embellishing the idea to get some responses, pretty pathetic IMO. Feel free to venture over to look in the Nuggets forum, Trade thread page 101/102, see if you feel the accuracy.

LMAO

[jimmy keys]

I was overlooking the Denver Nuggets trade board and they were entertaining a deal centred around of J.Murray + for FVV +? Their reasoning is that they don't believe Murray will be back until 2022 Feb. or so and they don't believe he will be the same player. Would you guys consider a swap of Murray for FVV straight up?

What a joke, you or someone may have proposed that deal, but as a long-time Nuggets fan, I refuse to believe this was "entertained" or even received well. Most ACL injuries take 8-9mos and we're still going alright without Jamal, gives MPJ a chance to step up and develop further into a superstar. When Murray does return, we'll have an even more formidable offensive attack that already has chemistry. One Nuggets fan was open to conversation but not one endorsed it as a great idea....feels like someone here was embellishing the idea to get some responses, pretty pathetic IMO. Feel free to venture over to look in the Nuggets forum, Trade thread page 101/102, see if you feel the accuracy.

LMAO

I threw out Vanvleet + Boucher + 2023 FRP for Murray as an idea on both the Denver & Trade boards. It wasn't ridiculed. Some people liked it, some didn't, some thought Denver was overpaying, some thought Toronto was overpaying. Opinions were pretty split. Not sure why you posted this here, but home fan base values home player more than other fans isn't exactly news worthy.

[skywalker33]

I was overlooking the Denver Nuggets trade board and they were entertaining a deal centred around of J.Murray + for FVV +? Their reasoning is that they don't believe Murray will be back until 2022 Feb. or so and they don't believe he will be the same player. Would you guys consider a swap of Murray for FVV straight up?

What a joke, you or someone may have proposed that deal, but as a long-time Nuggets fan, I refuse to believe this was "entertained" or even received well. Most ACL injuries take 8-9mos and we're still going alright without Jamal, gives MPJ a chance to step up and develop further into a superstar. When Murray does return, we'll have an even more formidable offensive attack that already has chemistry. One Nuggets fan was open to conversation but not one endorsed it as a great idea....feels like someone here was embellishing the idea to get some responses, pretty pathetic IMO. Feel free to venture over to look in the Nuggets forum, Trade thread page 101/102, see if you feel the accuracy.

LMAO

I threw out Vanvleet + Boucher + 2023 FRP for Murray as an idea on both the Denver & Trade boards. It wasn't ridiculed. Some people liked it, some didn't, some thought Denver was overpaying, some thought Toronto was overpaying. Opinions were pretty split. Not sure why you posted this here, but home fan base values home player more than other fans isn't exactly news worthy.

Easy pass for me, and I doubt the Nuggets even consider it.

VanVleet is a large downgrade, and all we get out of it is a protected pick and a backup big? NO thanks.

This was the most adamant voice regarding your trade IMO and one I agree with. The other was one of our Mods, who always tries to "keep the peace" and "not offend anyone", take that for what it's worth, his favorite fence-straddling line is "But I've been known to be wrong before". If you consider that "entertaining the idea", your idea of that is different than mine.

This offer isn't an insult by any means but it clearly appears to be what TOR/fans would want, not what DEN/fans would want.

And for clarification purposes, it was a 2022 lottery-protected 1st you offered but since the Raps are clearly not a playoff team, it would end up as a 2023 FRP.

[jimmy keys]

What a joke, you or someone may have proposed that deal, but as a long-time Nuggets fan, I refuse to believe this was "entertained" or even received well. Most ACL injuries take 8-9mos and we're still going alright without Jamal, gives MPJ a chance to step up and develop further into a superstar. When Murray does return, we'll have an even more formidable offensive attack that already has chemistry. One Nuggets fan was open to conversation but not one endorsed it as a great idea....feels like someone here was embellishing the idea to get some responses, pretty pathetic IMO. Feel free to venture over to look in the Nuggets forum, Trade thread page 101/102, see if you feel the accuracy.

LMAO

I threw out Vanvleet + Boucher + 2023 FRP for Murray as an idea on both the Denver & Trade boards. It wasn't ridiculed. Some people liked it, some didn't, some thought Denver was overpaying, some thought Toronto was overpaying. Opinions were pretty split. Not sure why you posted this here, but home fan base values home player more than other fans isn't exactly news worthy.

Easy pass for me, and I doubt the Nuggets even consider it.

VanVleet is a large downgrade, and all we get out of it is a protected pick and a backup big? NO thanks.

This was the most adamant voice regarding your trade IMO and one I agree with. The other was one of our Mods, who always tries to "keep the peace" and "not offend anyone", take that for what it's worth, his favorite fence-straddling line is "But I've been known to be wrong before". If you consider that "entertaining the idea", your idea of that is different than mine.

This offer isn't an insult by any means but it clearly appears to be what TOR/fans would want, not what DEN/fans would want.

And for clarification purposes, it was a 2022 lottery-protected 1st you offered but since the Raps are clearly not a playoff team, it would end up as a 2023 FRP.

I said I would offer FVV + Boucher + (basically a 2023) FRP for Murray, not that Denver would accept it.

[Spida888]

I need a bit of an explanation on Trent Jr's Bird Rights. Do we have his Full Bird rights or Early Bird, because I see a bunch of people like Dan Hackett and Grange mentioning how we have Full Bird, but don't you have to spend 3 seasons with the same team? Or does the half season in Portland this year count as season 3? Very confusing stuff lol.

Should be full bird rights because that gets transferred over via trade as I understand it. Just like had we traded Lowry, the new team would get his full bird rights to go over the cap to re-sign him if need be.

Also, Trent's current contract is 3 years, not 2 years so it should be full bird rights, as opposed to early bird.

source: https://www.nba.com/news/free-agency-explained

Qualifying Veteran Free Agent Exception (aka the “Bird” Exception): A team may re-sign its own free agent to a contract with a first-year salary of up to the maximum player salary if he played for the team for some or all of each of the prior three consecutive seasons (or, if he changed teams, he did so by trade or by assignment via the NBA’s waiver procedures during the first of the three seasons).

[Psubs]

I need a bit of an explanation on Trent Jr's Bird Rights. Do we have his Full Bird rights or Early Bird, because I see a bunch of people like Dan Hackett and Grange mentioning how we have Full Bird, but don't you have to spend 3 seasons with the same team? Or does the half season in Portland this year count as season 3? Very confusing stuff lol.

Should be full bird rights because that gets transferred over via trade as I understand it. Just like had we traded Lowry, the new team would get his full bird rights to go over the cap to re-sign him if need be.

Also, Trent's current contract is 3 years, not 2 years so it should be full bird rights, as opposed to early bird.

source: https://www.nba.com/news/free-agency-explained

Qualifying Veteran Free Agent Exception (aka the “Bird” Exception): A team may re-sign its own free agent to a contract with a first-year salary of up to the maximum player salary if he played for the team for some or all of each of the prior three consecutive seasons (or, if he changed teams, he did so by trade or by assignment via the NBA’s waiver procedures during the first of the three seasons).

That's why teams give 2nd round picks 3 year contracts, guarantee them a little more money early so can get full Bird rights later.

[MikeG]

What a joke, you or someone may have proposed that deal, but as a long-time Nuggets fan, I refuse to believe this was "entertained" or even received well. Most ACL injuries take 8-9mos and we're still going alright without Jamal, gives MPJ a chance to step up and develop further into a superstar. When Murray does return, we'll have an even more formidable offensive attack that already has chemistry. One Nuggets fan was open to conversation but not one endorsed it as a great idea....feels like someone here was embellishing the idea to get some responses, pretty pathetic IMO. Feel free to venture over to look in the Nuggets forum, Trade thread page 101/102, see if you feel the accuracy.

LMAO

I threw out Vanvleet + Boucher + 2023 FRP for Murray as an idea on both the Denver & Trade boards. It wasn't ridiculed. Some people liked it, some didn't, some thought Denver was overpaying, some thought Toronto was overpaying. Opinions were pretty split. Not sure why you posted this here, but home fan base values home player more than other fans isn't exactly news worthy.

Easy pass for me, and I doubt the Nuggets even consider it.

VanVleet is a large downgrade, and all we get out of it is a protected pick and a backup big? NO thanks.

This was the most adamant voice regarding your trade IMO and one I agree with. The other was one of our Mods, who always tries to "keep the peace" and "not offend anyone", take that for what it's worth, his favorite fence-straddling line is "But I've been known to be wrong before". If you consider that "entertaining the idea", your idea of that is different than mine.

This offer isn't an insult by any means but it clearly appears to be what TOR/fans would want, not what DEN/fans would want.

And for clarification purposes, it was a 2022 lottery-protected 1st you offered but since the Raps are clearly not a playoff team, it would end up as a 2023 FRP.

Raptors make the playoffs 7 straight years, with 6 division titles -- But play a season out of a hotel in Tampa for a year while their stars battle an international virus, and clowns over the internet write things like "clearly not a playoff team in 2022". Cant tell if just this troll is that dumb, or muricans in general. But overall, its just sad.

[LBJKB24MJ23]

I threw out Vanvleet + Boucher + 2023 FRP for Murray as an idea on both the Denver & Trade boards. It wasn't ridiculed. Some people liked it, some didn't, some thought Denver was overpaying, some thought Toronto was overpaying. Opinions were pretty split. Not sure why you posted this here, but home fan base values home player more than other fans isn't exactly news worthy.

Easy pass for me, and I doubt the Nuggets even consider it.

VanVleet is a large downgrade, and all we get out of it is a protected pick and a backup big? NO thanks.

This was the most adamant voice regarding your trade IMO and one I agree with. The other was one of our Mods, who always tries to "keep the peace" and "not offend anyone", take that for what it's worth, his favorite fence-straddling line is "But I've been known to be wrong before". If you consider that "entertaining the idea", your idea of that is different than mine.

This offer isn't an insult by any means but it clearly appears to be what TOR/fans would want, not what DEN/fans would want.

And for clarification purposes, it was a 2022 lottery-protected 1st you offered but since the Raps are clearly not a playoff team, it would end up as a 2023 FRP.

Raptors make the playoffs 7 straight years, with 6 division titles -- But play a season out of a hotel in Tampa for a year while their stars battle an international virus, and clowns over the internet write things like "clearly not a playoff team in 2022". Cant tell if just this troll is that dumb, or muricans in general. But overall, its just sad.

its obvious they will be a playoff team if they back at home in familiar surroundings, with their own crowd behind them. playing in TB - they got a mixed bag of fans.

they will be better with a lottery pick in their back pocket going into next year.

[bballsparkin]

[
Yeah it would be ballsy for both sides which makes me think value-wise it might be fair. But as I said it would create a definite loser in the trade and likely look pretty horrible for someone. So not happening. It is straight up gambling on the lottery like you are at a roulette table. Even if Masai loved someone who may look like they may fall to 17, he’d be making this trade more than a month before the draft and player’s draft stock can really rise and fall.

Imagine Houston wins the lottery with our pick while we moved back to 17? Tears would be shed. That would be utterly devastating.

[Morris_Shatford]

Nerlens Noel has bounced around more than I thought he would. I remember back in college he was close to the defensive numbers AD put up at Kentucky. Now his time has come in the NBA:

Raps need to sign this guy. I watcha ton of Knicks and he challenges every shot with no fear of being dunked on. He is like Birch but that just better on defense.

I think this is likely the summer where Noel finally gets a deal for more than two years;
I am just not sure I want to be the team to do it.

He has looked fantastic this season at times but he didn't look too bad in OKC and ended up settling for a 1/5;
Is there a locker room issue? A maturity issue? Whats the deal.

[Psubs]

[
Yeah it would be ballsy for both sides which makes me think value-wise it might be fair. But as I said it would create a definite loser in the trade and likely look pretty horrible for someone. So not happening. It is straight up gambling on the lottery like you are at a roulette table. Even if Masai loved someone who may look like they may fall to 17, he’d be making this trade more than a month before the draft and player’s draft stock can really rise and fall.

Imagine Houston wins the lottery with our pick while we moved back to 17? Tears would be shed. That would be utterly devastating.

I don't think any trades are allowed between the trade deadline and the draft.

[Psubs]

Nerlens Noel has bounced around more than I thought he would. I remember back in college he was close to the defensive numbers AD put up at Kentucky. Now his time has come in the NBA:

Raps need to sign this guy. I watcha ton of Knicks and he challenges every shot with no fear of being dunked on. He is like Birch but that just better on defense.

I think this is likely the summer where Noel finally gets a deal for more than two years;
I am just not sure I want to be the team to do it.

He has looked fantastic this season at times but he didn't look too bad in OKC and ended up settling for a 1/5;
Is there a locker room issue? A maturity issue? Whats the deal.

Would he sign for $1 million over the Tax-Payer MLE for 3 years with a player option 3rd?

[skywalker33]

I threw out Vanvleet + Boucher + 2023 FRP for Murray as an idea on both the Denver & Trade boards. It wasn't ridiculed. Some people liked it, some didn't, some thought Denver was overpaying, some thought Toronto was overpaying. Opinions were pretty split. Not sure why you posted this here, but home fan base values home player more than other fans isn't exactly news worthy.

Easy pass for me, and I doubt the Nuggets even consider it.

VanVleet is a large downgrade, and all we get out of it is a protected pick and a backup big? NO thanks.

This was the most adamant voice regarding your trade IMO and one I agree with. The other was one of our Mods, who always tries to "keep the peace" and "not offend anyone", take that for what it's worth, his favorite fence-straddling line is "But I've been known to be wrong before". If you consider that "entertaining the idea", your idea of that is different than mine.

This offer isn't an insult by any means but it clearly appears to be what TOR/fans would want, not what DEN/fans would want.

And for clarification purposes, it was a 2022 lottery-protected 1st you offered but since the Raps are clearly not a playoff team, it would end up as a 2023 FRP.

Raptors make the playoffs 7 straight years, with 6 division titles -- But play a season out of a hotel in Tampa for a year while their stars battle an international virus, and clowns over the internet write things like "clearly not a playoff team in 2022". Cant tell if just this troll is that dumb, or muricans in general. But overall, its just sad.

What, you can't handle the truth MikeG ??? I'm just responding to the intended offer, clarifying it to be presented as less ambiguous and conveying the true response the Nuggets fans had rather than allowing you TOR fans to mislead into believeing it was viable. And guess what, MikeG, EVERYONE is battling the COVID19 virus, not just your team. If you think that's trolling or being a clown because I pointed out the value of the draft pick that was being offered in a proposed deal, put your big boy pants on, it's just a fact, I never indicated this was a trend or any sort of indictment on your playoff run, just it wasn't in the cards for you THIS year. Stop WHINING, Man Up !! What's sad is that's what you take out of the whole conversation, rather than the fact one of your ,@JuelzSantanaown is trying to lead you into believing the Nuggets are going to trade Jamal Murray for FVV, a 30yo Boucher and a mid-to-late 1st because he got injured.....that sad and pathetic to misrepresent the validity to get And1's