2025 NBA Draft Discussion Part 4

[Indeed]

Now you’re moving goal posts.

I said they had comparable stats overall, with some better and some worse.

And again, Maluach is putting up comparable numbers as a freshman as an 18 year old when Williams was 19 and Lively 20. Plus he has been playing for 5 years.

He has better TS%, FTr, Reb%, WS/40, BPM as a freshman than either.

I’m not saying the blk% and ast% aren’t concerns, they are. But I’m not going to put the whole evaluation and projection on two stats either.

FWIW over the last 8 games Maluach has raised his blk% from 5.8 to 6.9%. Again, another example of progress and him playing better as the games matter more and competition gets harder.

So what is wrong for me saying him "two years from being two years"?
He is a year young, and to me, that is at least two years away from other bigs being drafted that high, no?

All you are pointing is "potential", which isn't it exactly what I am saying "two years from being two years", and that is the only thing I said, no?

Yeah, I'm probably misinterpreting 2 years away from 2 years away. My interpretation of that line is it being more of a slander and a guy who never develops....like our very own Bruno the OG 2 years away....

Yeah, no development would be the same, just that there are certain risks in players reaching the full potential.
The average case of Maluach for me is a bigger longer Boucher.

Scouting report:

Watch on YouTube

[Indeed]

1. Cooper
2. Harper
3/4. VJ or Ace.

Feels like anything goes after 4. Kasp, Tre, Fears, Queen, Maluach.

After 3-4, it seems like a totally mixed bag for the rest of the lottery

They are all a tier higher than previous draft. It is because Flagg being a generation talent that overshadow the others, it doesn't mean the top 10 isn't strong. Top 10 in this draft would be closer to top 5 in most drafts.
Harper would be Cunningham. Queen would be very close to Bancharo

[Jtoneller1]

So what is wrong for me saying him "two years from being two years"?
He is a year young, and to me, that is at least two years away from other bigs being drafted that high, no?

All you are pointing is "potential", which isn't it exactly what I am saying "two years from being two years", and that is the only thing I said, no?

Yeah, I'm probably misinterpreting 2 years away from 2 years away. My interpretation of that line is it being more of a slander and a guy who never develops....like our very own Bruno the OG 2 years away....

Yeah, no development would be the same, just that there are certain risks in players reaching the full potential.
The average case of Maluach for me is a bigger longer Boucher.

Scouting report:

Watch on YouTube

Sign me up for a bigger Boucher all day long

Sent from my Pixel 6 using RealGM mobile app

[WuTang_CMB]

1. Cooper
2. Harper
3/4. VJ or Ace.

Feels like anything goes after 4. Kasp, Tre, Fears, Queen, Maluach.

After 3-4, it seems like a totally mixed bag for the rest of the lottery

They are all a tier higher than previous draft. It is because Flagg being a generation talent that overshadow the others, it doesn't mean the top 10 isn't strong. Top 10 in this draft would be closer to top 5 in most drafts.
Harper would be Cunningham. Queen would be very close to Bancharo

Mixed bag for the mocks not talent. I would even say after the lottery that it will be fluid

[PushDaRock]

Totally different shooting forms both in gather and release. I don't see it.

I am not sure how you see them as "totally different". Steph and Ray Allen are "totally different"

Because Ray Allen is totally unique. He's all arms with barely any legs. I don't see how you can watch Kon's form and release and think that they are similar in any way.

Yeah there's really no similarity there at all in how they shoot, Ray Allen shot the ball at the apex of his jump which is pretty hard to do consistently and less margin of error if not timed right because of the lack of leg drive that goes into his shot. Kon is like all leg drive, which is why he doesn't get off the ground too high on his jumper.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Hard to watch these 2 videos in comparison and find any similarities really

[BoyzNTheHood]

Kon’s jumper reminds me of Jason Kapono

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

Ray allen was an athletic freak at uconn with crazy event creation.

Kon was a monster rebounder in high school and blocked shots a bit too. I was hoping that was gonna translate to Duke but it hasn't so there's already some falloff there between HS and D1 and there's gonna be more falloff between D1 and NBA.

Kon is good he's just not *that* good. I'm not gonna question his shot accuracy or IQ because they are both through the roof and unlike many guys like him he actually competes his tail off on defense enough to not be deemed a liability on that end.

[dballislife]

i really need to see kon's wingspan and vertical, him and queens...you gotta score over length and athleticism in the nba and guard it too

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

i really need to see kon's wingspan and vertical, him and queens...you gotta score over length and athleticism in the nba and guard it too

at this point as long as queen isn't 6'8 w/ 6'10 WS he'll be fine

he's the most skilled big man since well i'd say flip but going further back at least in terms of ability to cook, Paolo.

he's pretty unique because his shot is highly translatable IMO, touch looks real good - better than guys like Paolo and others going back

underrated by too many people still, very talented player - i dont think people realize what they are looking at with him

[Indeed]

i really need to see kon's wingspan and vertical, him and queens...you gotta score over length and athleticism in the nba and guard it too

at this point as long as queen isn't 6'8 w/ 6'10 WS he'll be fine

he's the most skilled big man since well i'd say flip but going further back at least in terms of ability to cook, Paolo.

he's pretty unique because his shot is highly translatable IMO, touch looks real good - better than guys like Paolo and others going back

underrated by too many people still, very talented player - i dont think people realize what they are looking at with him

Queen needs to measure 6'10 / 7'2 - 7'4 wingspan to compensate his defense (play the passing lane role with long wingspan, cover more space).
If Queen is only 6'10 in wingspan, that would be very hard to imagine him being drafted in the top 10. Unless he showed he can improve his quickness (probably by reducing weight and better condition) with an average PF wingspan in 7'0, otherwise, he is just a stretch 4, which you can find with a lower pick.

[MainEvent]

Depth at C was crazy in last years draft, you had Sarr, Clingan, Edey, Ware and Missi who have all been good for rookie C's. This year there's Maluach and some tweeners in the top 20

[Dalek]

Read on Twitter

Ujiri the Raps top official out at a random Real Madrid game. Who cares about the actual scouting? I think as a high level as Ujiri is, he is probably out there to meet up with Hugo Gonzalez, watch him practice and see who he is as a person. Real Madrid also has several former Raptors/905 (Serge Ibaka, Bruno Fernando, Walter Tavares) which can help in learning about the player.

Gonzalez was rated as high as fifth in prospect ranking by ESPN last year and he is well-known in Europe coming up through Real Madrid's system since age 9. He plays very limited minutes at RM so there isn't a lot to scout, mostly in an off ball role which is not ideal, but from previous years is a monster defender, excellent slasher, and has a developing jumper.

27.2% on 3s in three years combined in the Real Madrid system and for the Spanish youth national team
77.6% free throws

Reminder, his u18 Real Madrid team won the Euroleague Basketball Next Generation Tournament twice in a row and he was MVP last year. He a winner and a two-way player who plays in a high level European system. To me this draft lacks obvious NBA level athletes, and Gonzalez is a legit NBA level one at 6'6" with some star upside.

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[Indeed]

Depth at C was crazy in last years draft, you had Sarr, Clingan, Edey, Ware and Missi who have all been good for rookie C's. This year there's Maluach and some tweeners in the top 20

Last year was weak, and became center heavy draft. This is guard heavy draft. Next year is forward heavy draft.
Edey is unlikely a top 10 pick in this draft. For a senior, he might be near mid or late 1st.

[niQ]

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Gonzalez was rated as high as fifth in prospect ranking by ESPN last year and he is well-known in Europe coming up through Real Madrid's system since age 9.

Read on Twitter

I def remember trying to youtube the kid last year because of early rankings. Haven't heard anything of him during this draft cycle but I guess it makes sense when he's playing less than 10mpg.

[dohboy_24]

Depth at C was crazy in last years draft, you had Sarr, Clingan, Edey, Ware and Missi who have all been good for rookie C's. This year there's Maluach and some tweeners in the top 20

Agreed. This year's draft doesn't have a lot of bigs (PF, C, PF/C) who are likely to be selected in the first round.

For the C position, it's probably going to be Khaman Maluach, Derik Queen, Danny Wolf, and maybe Joan Beringer.

For the PF/C position, only Thomas Sorber, Alex Condon, and Johnni Broome have a good chance of hearing their names called within the first 30 picks while the PF position has just a handful more with Asa Newell, Collin Murray-Boyles, Rasheer Fleming, Yaxel Lendeborg, and JT Toppin having the best odds to be selected in the first round.

In comparison, more than half, if not 2/3rds of the players who are likely to be selected in the first round play either the guard (PG, SG, PG/SG) or wing (SG/SF, SF) positions...

Dylan Harper, PG/SG
VJ Edgecombe, SG
Kaspars Jakucionois, PG/SG
Tre Johnson, SG
Jase Richardson, PG/SG
Egor Demin, PG/SG
Nolan Traore, PG
Ben Saraf, PG/SG
Sergio de Larrea, PG/SG
Labaron Philon, PG
Boogie Fland, PG
Walter Clayton Jr, PG
Ace Bailey, SF
Kon Knueppel, SG/SF
Liam McNeeley, SF
Hugo Gonzalez, SG/SF
Will Riley, SG/SF
Nique Clifford, SG/SF
Aduo Thiero, SF
Carter Bryant, SF

[S.W.A.N]

1. Cooper
2. Harper
3/4. VJ or Ace.

Feels like anything goes after 4. Kasp, Tre, Fears, Queen, Maluach.

After 3-4, it seems like a totally mixed bag for the rest of the lottery

They are all a tier higher than previous draft. It is because Flagg being a generation talent that overshadow the others, it doesn't mean the top 10 isn't strong. Top 10 in this draft would be closer to top 5 in most drafts.
Harper would be Cunningham. Queen would be very close to Bancharo

Ya, I think the tiers this year are generally better than last year.

Clear cut number 1. Clear cut number 2 who probably easily goes number 1 last year for most teams.
Then you have a couple guys in Ace and VJ who are the consensus third tier

After that things get murky and will depend on team wants and needs but the talent is still solid. Feels like there is a ranger here of around 15 players who can fill out the lottery.

Always best to draft higher but I am very confident we can get a very solid player regardless of our final draft position. Possibly similar to 2023 and 2019 in draft quality.

[BoyzNTheHood]

Love this kid

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[Dalek]

Read on Twitter

Gonzalez was rated as high as fifth in prospect ranking by ESPN last year and he is well-known in Europe coming up through Real Madrid's system since age 9.

Read on Twitter

I def remember trying to youtube the kid last year because of early rankings. Haven't heard anything of him during this draft cycle but I guess it makes sense when he's playing less than 10mpg.

I do think its fair for mock drafts to rate him lower because him being out of sight it might make him appears less likely someone will spend a high pick. That said, I think he has a long track record beyond this season where Toronto might gamble on him.

Kind of interesting Egor Demin was his former Real Madrid teammate and BYU got him and gave him a big opportunity while Hugo got buried. Staying in Europe hurt his stock.

[MEDIC]

I am not sure how you see them as "totally different". Steph and Ray Allen are "totally different"

Because Ray Allen is totally unique. He's all arms with barely any legs. I don't see how you can watch Kon's form and release and think that they are similar in any way.

Yeah there's really no similarity there at all in how they shoot, Ray Allen shot the ball at the apex of his jump which is pretty hard to do consistently and less margin of error if not timed right because of the lack of leg drive that goes into his shot. Kon is like all leg drive, which is why he doesn't get off the ground too high on his jumper.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Hard to watch these 2 videos in comparison and find any similarities really

Lets just agree to disagree. Aside from the legs, I see a similar shooting motion & release point (arms). Of course Kon is more of a set shot, with very little lift & Ray is a full on jumper.

It's the low dip on his gather & the way he swings his arms above his head (higher set point) that catches my eye. Similar motion to Ray.

[Psubs]

Read on Twitter

Gonzalez was rated as high as fifth in prospect ranking by ESPN last year and he is well-known in Europe coming up through Real Madrid's system since age 9.

Read on Twitter

I def remember trying to youtube the kid last year because of early rankings. Haven't heard anything of him during this draft cycle but I guess it makes sense when he's playing less than 10mpg.

I do think its fair for mock drafts to rate him lower because him being out of sight it might make him appears less likely someone will spend a high pick. That said, I think he has a long track record beyond this season where Toronto might gamble on him.

Kind of interesting Egor Demin was his former Real Madrid teammate and BYU got him and gave him a big opportunity while Hugo got buried. Staying in Europe hurt his stock.

He didn't shoot that well from 3.

I would say that de Larrea is like Nikola Topic but can shoot the 3.

Watch on YouTube