Official Scottie Barnes Thread - Part 5

[YogurtProducer]

Results baby, all that matters.

One playoff series win from 2019-2020 until now. Refute it.

Why dont u start with what defines being mediocre? Because loosely speaking im thinking 50-60% of the league is mediocre using your logic. Maybe even higher..

Poor asset management, poor culture, poor roster construction, watchable product and most importantly, lack of a firm direction.

We’re maybe 1/5 at best ?

LMAO

Always assumed it to be, but you just proven you don't follow the NBA at all. My god.

"wah - Masai does not do what I want so that means it is wrong!"

[sbsat]

Results baby, all that matters.

One playoff series win from 2019-2020 until now. Refute it.

Why dont u start with what defines being mediocre? Because loosely speaking im thinking 50-60% of the league is mediocre using your logic. Maybe even higher..

Poor asset management, poor culture, poor roster construction, watchable product and most importantly, lack of a firm direction.

We’re maybe 1/5 at best ?

You havent defined anything.

[YogurtProducer]

Can someone answer me this. Who wins?

FVV/GTJ/Scottie/OG/Embiid (with FVV shooting 35%, GTJ being sick, and Scottie having a bum ankle)

or

Maxey/Green/Harden/Harris/Siakam

At least offensively, Siakam would feast with that lineup around him

[HumbleRen]

Why dont u start with what defines being mediocre? Because loosely speaking im thinking 50-60% of the league is mediocre using your logic. Maybe even higher..

Poor asset management, poor culture, poor roster construction, watchable product and most importantly, lack of a firm direction.

We’re maybe 1/5 at best ?

LMAO

Always assumed it to be, but you just proven you don't follow the NBA at all. My god.

"wah - Masai does not do what I want so that means it is wrong!"

So explain to me why we aren’t in a mediocre state right now ? What has the last 4 years been building to ?

[Johnny Bball]

Lowry led us. This was still firmly his team and it’s best player.

Tampa is a write off but let’s be real, that was a play in team at best.

2021-2022 was a solid year. Unsustainable due to playing the guys into the ground. Lost in 6 in embarrassing fashion to the Sixers in where Siakam was arguably the 4th best player on the floor.

2022-2023 - Couldn’t even win the play in.

2023-2024 - Most likely a repeat of last year unless we make a big trade splash.

Sounds mediocre to me.

You're presenting evidence that our team has been mediocre and equating that to Pascal?

Is Lillard mediocre to you? Because Pascal has achieved more team success in his career and across the last 4 years than Dame has. And Dame gets paid more.

No, that’s what you’re choosing to take away from what I’m posting lol.

I said verbatim that this is Masai’s fault. Siakam unfairly gets the heat because he’s the best player on the team. It comes with the job of being the “guy”.

Understands the fallacy but still does it every time. Smfh.

[Scase]

Again, you seem to confuse role players playing off of guys like Embiid/Harden as being "better".

You flip Embiid and Siakam and the Sixers win that series, Siakam's stats go through the roof, and suddenly your whole narrative changes. Use some **** nuance my guy.

Siakam showed up when the series was effectively over lol.

Game 1 - The guy had 24/7 on 50% shooting and 0 turnovers. Literally played pretty great in game 1.

Game 2 - we lost this game in the first half getting blown out in Q2 scoring 19 points. Siakam had 8 of them. Q3 we lost by 9 points. FVV/Precious/GTJ started that half and got 0 points. Yeah - blame Siakam here.

Game 3 - He had a bad game. No question about that. (but of course, we will ignore Hardens 14/6 G2, or Maxey's 11 point and 12 point G4 and G5, or Embiid's 19 points on 33% in G1, etc. Seems convinient)

And then of course, since Game 4 to 6 "don't matter" you are going to ignore the rest of the series like the 27/8/6 on 55% shooting did not happen.

Game 1 - Siakam scored 8 points in the first half, game was a 20pt blowout by halftime. Then he scored 16 in the second half after the game was already over.

Game 2 - Siakam scored 14 points in the first half on 5/12 shooting. Only player who shot worse was Fred, hell Siakam only had 8 because he took 36% of the shots that entire quarter. Him and Fred took 77% of all shots in the second quarter. So yeah, he had 8 of that 19, but we only scored 19 because him and Fred took damn near every shot, and shot a collective 23.5%. Second half he was 2/8. Only player who shot worse was Fred.

Game 3 - Down 10 after the first quarter, Siakam shot 2/5 for 4 points. Only player who shot worse was Fred. Had an ok second quarter going 4/6 for 8 points. Third quarter 0/2. Fourth quarter 0/2. OT 0/1. Ended the game 6/16, only player who shot worse was Fred.

Game 4 - Has a great game, no complaints.

Game 5 - Has a good game, no complaints.

Game 6 - Has a good first half shooting 7/11 with 18 points. Second half completely disappears going 2/6 with 6 points.

Is it his fault that we lost that series? Nah, if that was to lay at anyones feet that was Fred stinking it up the 4 games he played. But, Siakam is not free of criticism, he had 2 genuinely good games and the rest of the series was complete crap.

You know, since you were talking about nuance, I figured I'd give you some context. Since a series average means nothing without context.

Come on man. Games are 48 minutes long and you are attempting to use the small sample of 1Q of G1 where he shot 2/5 as a negative

Only you can say with a straight face "Had an ok second quarter going 4/6 for 8 points" like shooting 66% form the field and scoring 8 points in a quarter is not good

You are the one who does not understand averages. Anytime Siakam does good it is brushed off as "ah that does not count", but if Siakam performs poorly that is what matters. The goal posts CONSTANTLY move with you and your clique.

AGAIN - use some damn nuance. The due was playing alongside hobbled FVV, sick GTJ, and hurt Barnes for most of the series and still post up a respectable fight.

Offense got 11 points worse when Siakam set (from 111pts/100 to 100pts/100) that series as well.

Anyone trying to put any blame on Pascal for that series is frankly just blind with hatred. He was the only guy on our team who was even somewhat consistent (or just straight up available to play, no disrespect to Barnes/FVV/GTJ as that is not their fault either they got hurt).

This just all goes back to calling that series loss "embarrassing" an absolute joke.

It's a 6 games series, what kind of sample size am I supposed to use? You used his full game stats ignoring that 65% of those came after the game was already a blowout loss.

I literally said he had 2 good games, at no point did I say they didn't matter.

His 2nd quarter with 8 point was ok because context matters, the other 3 quarters and OT minutes he was hot garbage.

For the millionth time, I am not blaming Siakam for the series result, but to say he is 100% blameless is just pure excuses. He played poorly for a large part of that series, and was a key factor (along with Fred) as to why we were constantly in a hole after the 1st half.

Here I am clearly pointing out good games he had, while also criticizing the bad ones, meanwhile you try and hang on the good ones and make excuses for everything else. One of those sounds pretty unbiased, and the other sounds defensive of a player.

Every team/star deals with injuries, this is not unique to him. Everyone is still expected to perform, he's not special. Even Luka who had a TRASH team still got criticized. No one is immune to it.

[HumbleRen]

Game 1 - Siakam scored 8 points in the first half, game was a 20pt blowout by halftime. Then he scored 16 in the second half after the game was already over.

Game 2 - Siakam scored 14 points in the first half on 5/12 shooting. Only player who shot worse was Fred, hell Siakam only had 8 because he took 36% of the shots that entire quarter. Him and Fred took 77% of all shots in the second quarter. So yeah, he had 8 of that 19, but we only scored 19 because him and Fred took damn near every shot, and shot a collective 23.5%. Second half he was 2/8. Only player who shot worse was Fred.

Game 3 - Down 10 after the first quarter, Siakam shot 2/5 for 4 points. Only player who shot worse was Fred. Had an ok second quarter going 4/6 for 8 points. Third quarter 0/2. Fourth quarter 0/2. OT 0/1. Ended the game 6/16, only player who shot worse was Fred.

Game 4 - Has a great game, no complaints.

Game 5 - Has a good game, no complaints.

Game 6 - Has a good first half shooting 7/11 with 18 points. Second half completely disappears going 2/6 with 6 points.

Is it his fault that we lost that series? Nah, if that was to lay at anyones feet that was Fred stinking it up the 4 games he played. But, Siakam is not free of criticism, he had 2 genuinely good games and the rest of the series was complete crap.

You know, since you were talking about nuance, I figured I'd give you some context. Since a series average means nothing without context.

Come on man. Games are 48 minutes long and you are attempting to use the small sample of 1Q of G1 where he shot 2/5 as a negative

Only you can say with a straight face "Had an ok second quarter going 4/6 for 8 points" like shooting 66% form the field and scoring 8 points in a quarter is not good

You are the one who does not understand averages. Anytime Siakam does good it is brushed off as "ah that does not count", but if Siakam performs poorly that is what matters. The goal posts CONSTANTLY move with you and your clique.

AGAIN - use some damn nuance. The due was playing alongside hobbled FVV, sick GTJ, and hurt Barnes for most of the series and still post up a respectable fight.

Offense got 11 points worse when Siakam set (from 111pts/100 to 100pts/100) that series as well.

Anyone trying to put any blame on Pascal for that series is frankly just blind with hatred. He was the only guy on our team who was even somewhat consistent (or just straight up available to play, no disrespect to Barnes/FVV/GTJ as that is not their fault either they got hurt).

This just all goes back to calling that series loss "embarrassing" an absolute joke.

It's a 6 games series, what kind of sample size am I supposed to use? You used his full game stats ignoring that 65% of those came after the game was already a blowout loss.

I literally said he had 2 good games, at no point did I say they didn't matter.

His 2nd quarter with 8 point was ok because context matters, the other 3 quarters and OT minutes he was hot garbage.

For the millionth time, I am not blaming Siakam for the series result, but to say he is 100% blameless is just pure excuses. He played poorly for a large part of that series, and was a key factor (along with Fred) as to why we were constantly in a hole after the 1st half.

Here I am clearly pointing out good games he had, while also criticizing the bad ones, meanwhile you try and hang on the good ones and make excuses for everything else. One of those sounds pretty unbiased, and the other sounds defensive of a player.

Every team/star deals with injuries, this is not unique to him. Everyone is still expected to perform, he's not special. Even Luka who had a TRASH team still got criticized. No one is immune to it.

Bingo.

You’re judged accordingly to your role and salary.

[sbsat]

Poor asset management, poor culture, poor roster construction, watchable product and most importantly, lack of a firm direction.

We’re maybe 1/5 at best ?

LMAO

Always assumed it to be, but you just proven you don't follow the NBA at all. My god.

"wah - Masai does not do what I want so that means it is wrong!"

So explain to me why we aren’t in a mediocre state right now ? What has the last 4 years been building to ?

You still have no defined what it is to be a mediocre team? Nothing you you say and is backed with any reason or logic just throwing sh*t against the wall and see what sticks.

[HumbleRen]

LMAO

Always assumed it to be, but you just proven you don't follow the NBA at all. My god.

"wah - Masai does not do what I want so that means it is wrong!"

So explain to me why we aren’t in a mediocre state right now ? What has the last 4 years been building to ?

You still have no defined what it is to be a mediocre team? Nothing you you say and is backed with any reason or logic just throwing sh*t against the wall and see what sticks.

You asked me what does a mediocre team looks like and I described one to you.

If that’s not to your liking, you’re free to explain why our current team is in a good state.

[YogurtProducer]

Come on man. Games are 48 minutes long and you are attempting to use the small sample of 1Q of G1 where he shot 2/5 as a negative

Only you can say with a straight face "Had an ok second quarter going 4/6 for 8 points" like shooting 66% form the field and scoring 8 points in a quarter is not good

You are the one who does not understand averages. Anytime Siakam does good it is brushed off as "ah that does not count", but if Siakam performs poorly that is what matters. The goal posts CONSTANTLY move with you and your clique.

AGAIN - use some damn nuance. The due was playing alongside hobbled FVV, sick GTJ, and hurt Barnes for most of the series and still post up a respectable fight.

Offense got 11 points worse when Siakam set (from 111pts/100 to 100pts/100) that series as well.

Anyone trying to put any blame on Pascal for that series is frankly just blind with hatred. He was the only guy on our team who was even somewhat consistent (or just straight up available to play, no disrespect to Barnes/FVV/GTJ as that is not their fault either they got hurt).

This just all goes back to calling that series loss "embarrassing" an absolute joke.

It's a 6 games series, what kind of sample size am I supposed to use? You used his full game stats ignoring that 65% of those came after the game was already a blowout loss.

I literally said he had 2 good games, at no point did I say they didn't matter.

His 2nd quarter with 8 point was ok because context matters, the other 3 quarters and OT minutes he was hot garbage.

For the millionth time, I am not blaming Siakam for the series result, but to say he is 100% blameless is just pure excuses. He played poorly for a large part of that series, and was a key factor (along with Fred) as to why we were constantly in a hole after the 1st half.

Here I am clearly pointing out good games he had, while also criticizing the bad ones, meanwhile you try and hang on the good ones and make excuses for everything else. One of those sounds pretty unbiased, and the other sounds defensive of a player.

Every team/star deals with injuries, this is not unique to him. Everyone is still expected to perform, he's not special. Even Luka who had a TRASH team still got criticized. No one is immune to it.

Bingo.

You’re judged accordingly to your role and salary.

Yes, lets ignore all context and instead go "lose games fault of big paid player".

No player in the NBA was winning a series against Philly when they literally had to start Khem Birch, play Thad Young, and have Chris Boucher be a key player in an elimination game.

Come on man. We all know you are not dumb, why act like you are?

[sbsat]

So explain to me why we aren’t in a mediocre state right now ? What has the last 4 years been building to ?

You still have no defined what it is to be a mediocre team? Nothing you you say and is backed with any reason or logic just throwing sh*t against the wall and see what sticks.

You asked me what does a mediocre team looks like and I described one to you.

If that’s not to your liking, you’re free to explain why our current team is in a good state.

Its probably a good idea to read what people are saying to you. I asked how you would define a mediocre team. Your response was essentially replacing the word "mediocre" with "poor" on a series of generic metrics. None of this means anything and you seemingly have no actual point.

[HumbleRen]

It's a 6 games series, what kind of sample size am I supposed to use? You used his full game stats ignoring that 65% of those came after the game was already a blowout loss.

I literally said he had 2 good games, at no point did I say they didn't matter.

His 2nd quarter with 8 point was ok because context matters, the other 3 quarters and OT minutes he was hot garbage.

For the millionth time, I am not blaming Siakam for the series result, but to say he is 100% blameless is just pure excuses. He played poorly for a large part of that series, and was a key factor (along with Fred) as to why we were constantly in a hole after the 1st half.

Here I am clearly pointing out good games he had, while also criticizing the bad ones, meanwhile you try and hang on the good ones and make excuses for everything else. One of those sounds pretty unbiased, and the other sounds defensive of a player.

Every team/star deals with injuries, this is not unique to him. Everyone is still expected to perform, he's not special. Even Luka who had a TRASH team still got criticized. No one is immune to it.

Bingo.

You’re judged accordingly to your role and salary.

Yes, lets ignore all context and instead go "lose games fault of big paid player".

No player in the NBA was winning a series against Philly when they literally had to start Khem Birch, play Thad Young, and have Chris Boucher be a key player in an elimination game.

Come on man. We all know you are not dumb, why act like you are?

Once again, you’re making up things that I did not say lol.

I never said we should of won that series, nor did I ever say Siakam was the sole reason why we lost.

I’m saying that series was not competitive at all. Siakam was clearly not better than Harden or Embiid during that series and there’s a legit case to be made that he wasn’t better than Maxey.

Those are the points I made. I never expected Siakam to lead us to a W over them.

[HumbleRen]

You still have no defined what it is to be a mediocre team? Nothing you you say and is backed with any reason or logic just throwing sh*t against the wall and see what sticks.

You asked me what does a mediocre team looks like and I described one to you.

If that’s not to your liking, you’re free to explain why our current team is in a good state.

Its probably a good idea to read what people are saying to you. I asked how you would define a mediocre team. Your response was essentially replacing the word "mediocre" with "poor" on a series of generic metrics. None of this means anything and you seemingly have no actual point.

you’re bringing nothing of substance and refuse expand on why you disagree with the notion that we aren’t a mediocre team.

Let me simplify it even more for you so you can stop ducking the question.

Is this team going towards a positive direction ? Yes or no.

[sbsat]

You asked me what does a mediocre team looks like and I described one to you.

If that’s not to your liking, you’re free to explain why our current team is in a good state.

Its probably a good idea to read what people are saying to you. I asked how you would define a mediocre team. Your response was essentially replacing the word "mediocre" with "poor" on a series of generic metrics. None of this means anything and you seemingly have no actual point.

you’re bringing nothing of substance and refuse expand on why you disagree with the notion that we aren’t a mediocre team.

Let me simplify it even more for you so you can stop ducking the question.

Is this team going towards a positive direction ? Yes or no.

im trying to get you to actually defines what it means to be mediocre. Thats pretty substantive. Secondly prior to now you have not asked me a question so wtf am i ducking? Are you ok?

Positive direction vs what? Last year? Last decade? Vs last year, yes i would say they have moved in the right direction roster wise.

[HumbleRen]

Its probably a good idea to read what people are saying to you. I asked how you would define a mediocre team. Your response was essentially replacing the word "mediocre" with "poor" on a series of generic metrics. None of this means anything and you seemingly have no actual point.

you’re bringing nothing of substance and refuse expand on why you disagree with the notion that we aren’t a mediocre team.

Let me simplify it even more for you so you can stop ducking the question.

Is this team going towards a positive direction ? Yes or no.

im trying to get you to actually defines what it means to be mediocre. Thats pretty substantive. Secondly prior to now you have not asked me a question so wtf am i ducking? Are you ok?

Positive direction vs what? Last year? Last decade? Vs last year, yes i would say they have moved in the right direction roster wise.

I explained my thoughts.

And this is a positive direction ? Still no answers for the guard position. 4 of the 5 starters are all below average 3 point shooters. 3 guys are potential unrestricted free agents.

Very interesting. Thank you for the answer.

[sbsat]

you’re bringing nothing of substance and refuse expand on why you disagree with the notion that we aren’t a mediocre team.

Let me simplify it even more for you so you can stop ducking the question.

Is this team going towards a positive direction ? Yes or no.

im trying to get you to actually defines what it means to be mediocre. Thats pretty substantive. Secondly prior to now you have not asked me a question so wtf am i ducking? Are you ok?

Positive direction vs what? Last year? Last decade? Vs last year, yes i would say they have moved in the right direction roster wise.

I explained my thoughts.

And this is a positive direction ? Still no answers for the guard position. 4 of the 5 starters are all below average 3 point shooters. 3 guys are potential unrestricted free agents.

Very interesting. Thank you for the answer.

you cannot come out say "team xyz is mediocre" and not define what it means to actually be mediocre. A orecise definition. Then you accuse me of ducking questions that were never asked.

I can address your points on the roster but given the evolution of this discussion screw it. i almost think youre drunk at this point.

Youre welcome have a good one.

[bluerap23]

I thought this was the scottie barnes thread

[Tha Cynic]

FVV was an all star, regardless of how fake it was.
OG is a top 5 defender in the league and arguably the best 3&D player in the league. Scottie was ROTY. Nurse was regarded as one of the best coaches in the league.

On paper, our core is better than any of the DD/Lowry led teams. The issue is fit and chemistry.

Siakam is in that weird position where he’s not good enough to build around but good enough to be the first option on a 2nd tier playoff team.

You can’t possibly turn and use Fred this way…

Jesus That is some shameless **** if I have ever seen it.

Our core IS better than those DD/Lowry teams - the difference is those DD/Lowry teams had some of the best bench production in the entire league, whereas our current iteration of teams have had some of the worst.

JV
Ibaka
Derozan
Powell (I think eventually OG started here)
Lowry

That's a better team even if you don't factor the bench lol. You guys and gals are seriously underrating that team because they always got beat by James. The Lowry/Derozan combo was better overall in making their teammates better than Siakam/FVV.

[DG88]

Let's keep the discussion on topic please!

[Tha Cynic]

I know not everything gets on video obviously, but is his trainer having Barnes work on his handles? That to me was the most important skill to hone this offseason. His jumper isn't going to get that good in one off season.