2025 NBA Draft Prospect Part 2

[earthtone]

I agree, it’s just like you said, probably too big for the 4 and too small for the 5. Skilled, but probably limited against NBA athletes.

It's funny because that's the exact reason Sengun fell out of the lottery, but apparently they're not comparable

It’s actually not, but I guess go with whatever fits your narrative.

Then why did he fall? I'm not even particularly high on Queen and I think Sengun was the better prospect, but they have more similarities in their profiles than difference, it makes sense why they get compared.

[T-d0t]

Edgecombe just seems like a typical Raptor pick.

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

I agree, it’s just like you said, probably too big for the 4 and too small for the 5. Skilled, but probably limited against NBA athletes.

It's funny because that's the exact reason Sengun fell out of the lottery, but apparently they're not comparable

Sengun had a TS% of 70.9% against grown men.

Comparatively, Derik Queen is at 58.5 TS%.

CMB is at 61.5 and 62.5 TS% in his freshman/sophomore year.
Evan Mobley, 62.4%
Embiid, 65.5%
Zion, 70.2%
Sabonis, 67.5%, 65.4%

There seems to be a major lack of evidence for an elite post game, both in terms of having zero Jokic/Sengun/Sabonis-esque highlights and an ok, but not elite efficiency.

Queen has underwhelmed a ton as has Fears who needs to return for a 2nd year of college.

CMB has a lot of tools such as power, very good handle, passing chops, rim finishing, excellent HT:WS ratio, defensive ability, etc... but his FT% is worrisome for shot projection (as is the eye test he does not get his legs into jumper very much) along with his TOV% this year and the fact he can't carry a bad team. Some of this could be mitigated by the fact he's gonna be close to the age of a lot of freshmen but overall it dampers the likelihood he has a star outcome. At worst he should be a better Xavier Tillman type of rotation player.

Right now my t7 is:

1. Cooper Flagg
2. VJ Edgecombe
3. Braden Smith
4. Carter Bryant
5. Johni Broome
6. Collin Murray-Boyles
7. Bogoljub Markovic

Smith has NBA movement skills and has proven himself against NBA size and athleticism already by playing well against elite college comp 2 years in a row. Has rumored +5 WS and his hands look big. He is in rarefied air in numerous areas of production and is the closest I have personally seen to FVV type of producer and competitor since FVV himself at Wichita. I give 0 **** what anyone thinks of me having him 3rd on my board. He's put up a >4 DBPM every year in college with strong defensive FG% and has taken his STL rate to new heights and can possibly add in strip blocks like FVV did as he migrates to the NBA. Smith worked out with NBA players this past summer and has a pro makeup and elite competitive traits.

Carter Bryant is actually a very good FT shooter according to priors which most people don't realize. Has a great story and is also hyper competitive - he dunks everything and is a disruptive force on D with very promising shooting potential. Really underrated prospect.

Tre Johnson has too much GTJ in him for whatever degree of Booker is in his DNA. Harper crap shooter uninspiring defender and subpar athleticism (v low dunk rate). Demin totally fake prospect. Kasparas handle and movement skill issues poor against top competition.

I'm still not sure how I feel about Asa Newell as I wrote him off with his .180 FTR or whatever it was at Montverde but that has improved a bit. He still feels like something between an energy big and a legit starter but I will evaluate him more later as I am liking him more as the year goes on. Sergio De Larrea is also somewhat intriguing.

Danny Wolf is flawed as hell, not my kinda guy.

Tugler another guy I will want to evaluate hard after season is over but I have a feeling Sampson convinces him to return to play with his elite recruiting class.

Lots of flawed empty calorie scorers this year who will inevitably deceive people because they believe that drafts by default must have a few volume scoring stars but this is just a weak draft. Next year is the big one.

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

I did a quick check of the top 5 draft prospects, and my goodness has VJ Edgecombe been killing it lately. I've always been a big VJ believer, but this is the best he's ever looked. His BPM is up to 11.9, and the only red number he has on his advanced stats page is his personal fouls per 36 minutes. We'll probably win our way out of VJ range, but you never know.

When people were down on him early I said a couple of times don’t forget he was the best player for Bermuda during Olympic qualifiers

Yes it was only 5 games, but it was still an 18 year old playing with multiple nba players and the best player

He’s going to be good. Looking forward to finding out his measurements

The most generous measurements I've seen reported are 6'5" height with a 6'6" wingspan.

VJ's measurements won't matter much because his athleticism helps him overcome them. If he were legit something crazy like 6'4 w 6'9 wingspan then we'd be talking about Tony Allen event creation but he's gonna be a notch below in that department while hopefully giving way better offensive returns. He's an excellent ball protector and connective passer particularly his post-entry pass accuracy stands out. Hopefully his touch on layups does show some improvement over time and he adds a dribble jumper to his arsenal which I don't see why he can't as I like his JS form and he can handle limited dribbling.

VJ has some podz and some anunoby in him but in the body of a track athlete.

[BoyzNTheHood]

It's funny because that's the exact reason Sengun fell out of the lottery, but apparently they're not comparable

It’s actually not, but I guess go with whatever fits your narrative.

Then why did he fall? I'm not even particularly high on Queen and I think Sengun was the better prospect, but they have more similarities in their profiles than difference, it makes sense why they get compared.

Lack of length and athleticism, plus that typical North American doubt about international competition levels. The same reason Jokic dropped, the same reason a guy like Luka wasn’t the undeniable #1 pick.

[RoteSchroder]

It's funny because that's the exact reason Sengun fell out of the lottery, but apparently they're not comparable

It’s actually not, but I guess go with whatever fits your narrative.

Then why did he fall? I'm not even particularly high on Queen and I think Sengun was the better prospect, but they have more similarities in their profiles than difference, it makes sense why they get compared.

Size/length was partially a reason and people didn't know if he could replicate what he was doing in a tougher league.

Difference between Sengun and Queen is that people were worried Sengun was going to go from elite play in the Turkish league to average play in the NBA.

For Queen, people are assuming he's gonna go from ok play in college to elite play in the NBA. For these type of prospects, you generally want good athletic metrics cause you're projecting future potential (e.g. Maluach is not that good, but people are intrigued by his mobility, length and height).

[Yallbecrazy]

It’s actually not, but I guess go with whatever fits your narrative.

Then why did he fall? I'm not even particularly high on Queen and I think Sengun was the better prospect, but they have more similarities in their profiles than difference, it makes sense why they get compared.

Lack of length and athleticism, plus that typical North American doubt about international competition levels. The same reason Jokic dropped, the same reason a guy like Luka wasn’t the undeniable #1 pick.

To be fair, Jokic took a GIANT leap in his productivity in his draft stash year and would have gone in the lottery (still underdrafted) if he declared a year later.

[Yallbecrazy]

Think I'm jumping on the Edgecombe train and putting him past Jak and Harper for #2.

[Psubs]

Think I'm jumping on the Edgecombe train and putting him past Jak and Harper for #2.

Ya, he might be mini Amen Thompson that can shoot the 3 at least league average.

Flagg
Bailey
VJ
Harper
Tre Johnson

[Raptorfan2012]

It's funny because that's the exact reason Sengun fell out of the lottery, but apparently they're not comparable

Sengun had a TS% of 70.9% against grown men.

Comparatively, Derik Queen is at 58.5 TS%.

CMB is at 61.5 and 62.5 TS% in his freshman/sophomore year.
Evan Mobley, 62.4%
Embiid, 65.5%
Zion, 70.2%
Sabonis, 67.5%, 65.4%

There seems to be a major lack of evidence for an elite post game, both in terms of having zero Jokic/Sengun/Sabonis-esque highlights and an ok, but not elite efficiency.

Queen has underwhelmed a ton as has Fears who needs to return for a 2nd year of college.

CMB has a lot of tools such as power, very good handle, passing chops, rim finishing, excellent HT:WS ratio, defensive ability, etc... but his FT% is worrisome for shot projection (as is the eye test he does not get his legs into jumper very much) along with his TOV% this year and the fact he can't carry a bad team. Some of this could be mitigated by the fact he's gonna be close to the age of a lot of freshmen but overall it dampers the likelihood he has a star outcome. At worst he should be a better Xavier Tillman type of rotation player.

Right now my t7 is:

1. Cooper Flagg
2. VJ Edgecombe
3. Braden Smith
4. Carter Bryant
5. Johni Broome
6. Collin Murray-Boyles
7. Bogoljub Markovic

Smith has NBA movement skills and has proven himself against NBA size and athleticism already by playing well against elite college comp 2 years in a row. Has rumored +5 WS and his hands look big. He is in rarefied air in numerous areas of production and is the closest I have personally seen to FVV type of producer and competitor since FVV himself at Wichita. I give 0 **** what anyone thinks of me having him 3rd on my board. He's put up a >4 DBPM every year in college with strong defensive FG% and has taken his STL rate to new heights and can possibly add in strip blocks like FVV did as he migrates to the NBA. Smith worked out with NBA players this past summer and has a pro makeup and elite competitive traits.

Carter Bryant is actually a very good FT shooter according to priors which most people don't realize. Has a great story and is also hyper competitive - he dunks everything and is a disruptive force on D with very promising shooting potential. Really underrated prospect.

Tre Johnson has too much GTJ in him for whatever degree of Booker is in his DNA. Harper crap shooter uninspiring defender and subpar athleticism (v low dunk rate). Demin totally fake prospect. Kasparas handle and movement skill issues poor against top competition.

I'm still not sure how I feel about Asa Newell as I wrote him off with his .180 FTR or whatever it was at Montverde but that has improved a bit. He still feels like something between an energy big and a legit starter but I will evaluate him more later as I am liking him more as the year goes on. Sergio De Larrea is also somewhat intriguing.

Danny Wolf is flawed as hell, not my kinda guy.

Tugler another guy I will want to evaluate hard after season is over but I have a feeling Sampson convinces him to return to play with his elite recruiting class.

Lots of flawed empty calorie scorers this year who will inevitably deceive people because they believe that drafts by default must have a few volume scoring stars but this is just a weak draft. Next year is the big one.

That's the thing with TWO - there is always a reason to tank because there are always shiny new prospects each year.

[Yallbecrazy]

Think I'm jumping on the Edgecombe train and putting him past Jak and Harper for #2.

Ya, he might be mini Amen Thompson that can shoot the 3 at least league average.

Flagg
Bailey
VJ
Harper
Tre Johnson

My one big hesitation is he seems to be a little too skinny. Needs to bulk up and not lose his quickness which isn't an easy task.

[UnbelievablyRAW]

Think I'm jumping on the Edgecombe train and putting him past Jak and Harper for #2.

Ya, he might be mini Amen Thompson that can shoot the 3 at least league average.

Flagg
Bailey
VJ
Harper
Tre Johnson

I need yall to go look at how well Amen dribbles and playmakes before we start comparing him to VJ. Amen is an actual point guard in the body of an athletic freak

[Psubs]

I literally said he’s taller than Lofton. What are these moves you’re referring to? Show me a Sengun style move. He’s at best a decent 4 man in the league.

I’d much rather a guy like Danny Wolf who’s older but could become a unicorn if given the opportunity.

Take a gamble on Alex Condon who is athletic and coordinated, just need more experience.

Condon's passing is so clean. He's like everything you think that Wolf and Hansen Yang could be as passing bigs, plus he's fit and athletic. Condon is probably the best passing big in this draft behind Egor Demin. Likely the best one 6'11 or taller.

I think he could be like the PF/C version of Nikola Jovic with good passing to take Poeltl's spot.

Oh, Condon had a so so last game but played tonight and was good vs Vanderbilt.

19 pts (7 for 11), 9 rebs, 4 ast (0 tos), 2 blks (1 foul).

For someone that picked up organized basketball late he is a quick learner.

I found a comp for Alex Condon, Santi Aldama with more blocks. Maybe a mix of Aldama and Bitadze?

I don't think I saw Santi Aldama on any mocks and Memphis took him #30.

Watch on YouTube

[RoteSchroder]

Take a gamble on Alex Condon who is athletic and coordinated, just need more experience.

Condon's passing is so clean. He's like everything you think that Wolf and Hansen Yang could be as passing bigs, plus he's fit and athletic. Condon is probably the best passing big in this draft behind Egor Demin. Likely the best one 6'11 or taller.

I think he could be like the PF/C version of Nikola Jovic with good passing to take Poeltl's spot.

Oh, Condon had a so so last game but played tonight and was good vs Vanderbilt.

19 pts (7 for 11), 9 rebs, 4 ast (0 tos), 2 blks (1 foul).

For someone that picked up organized basketball late he is a quick learner.

I found a comp for Alex Condon, Santi Aldama with more blocks. Maybe a mix of Aldama and Bitadze?

I don't think I saw Santi Aldama on any mocks and Memphis took him #30.

Watch on YouTube

Haven’t watched low lights yet, but holy crap, the highlights display the type of craftiness/court vision I’m looking for in a prospect.

It looks like he may be a little raw defensively and his jumper looks slow, with a small hitch at times, but the highlights of subtle fakes/fakeouts, passing ability, and court vision looks closer to Sengun/Doncic/Jokic level than players like Queen/Scottie/Demin.

[earthtone]

It’s actually not, but I guess go with whatever fits your narrative.

Then why did he fall? I'm not even particularly high on Queen and I think Sengun was the better prospect, but they have more similarities in their profiles than difference, it makes sense why they get compared.

Size/length was partially a reason and people didn't know if he could replicate what he was doing in a tougher league.

That's all I was saying. They're both ~6'10" centers with less than ideal athleticism who make up for it by being incredibly crafty post-scorers and passers, and being great rebounders.

Sengun is the better prospect, but they have way more similarities than differences and will likely go in the same range in the draft. Makes no sense to say they're not comparable.

[UnbelievablyRAW]

Derik Queen fits the Christian Wood tier of C that can probably get you 16-20 but can't anchor your defense at all. Also can't really guard 4's either so you're stuck with him at the 5

Wood was getting 20/10 in Houston and they let him go because he wasn't a real center. Same thing happened with Bagley who can't play the 4 but can't play good enough defense to be a scoring 5.

[Psubs]

Oh, Condon had a so so last game but played tonight and was good vs Vanderbilt.

19 pts (7 for 11), 9 rebs, 4 ast (0 tos), 2 blks (1 foul).

For someone that picked up organized basketball late he is a quick learner.

I found a comp for Alex Condon, Santi Aldama with more blocks. Maybe a mix of Aldama and Bitadze?

I don't think I saw Santi Aldama on any mocks and Memphis took him #30.

Watch on YouTube

Haven’t watched low lights yet, but holy crap, the highlights display the type of craftiness/court vision I’m looking for in a prospect.

It looks like he may be a little raw defensively and his jumper looks slow, with a small hitch at times, but the highlights of subtle fakes/fakeouts, passing ability, and court vision looks closer to Sengun/Doncic/Jokic level than players like Queen/Scottie/Demin.

It's weird that he's not being mocked. He's helped Florida move from a team in the 20's to a top 10 team.

He may be raw starting later than most but the numbers look solid like blocks/foul and A/T better than most guards. Surely with a good showing in the tournament others will notice.

[Psubs]

Then why did he fall? I'm not even particularly high on Queen and I think Sengun was the better prospect, but they have more similarities in their profiles than difference, it makes sense why they get compared.

Size/length was partially a reason and people didn't know if he could replicate what he was doing in a tougher league.

That's all I was saying. They're both ~6'10" centers with less than ideal athleticism who make up for it by being incredibly crafty post-scorers and passers, and being great rebounders.

Sengun is the better prospect, but they have way more similarities than differences and will likely go in the same range in the draft. Makes no sense to say they're not comparable.

Sengun was always looking strong like an Enes Kanter. Just wasn't sure if his lack of lift would hinder him. He's shown that he is a lessor version of Domantas Sabonis with no outside shooting.

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

Think I'm jumping on the Edgecombe train and putting him past Jak and Harper for #2.

I'm surprised you like Harper since he has a multiyear history of subpar shooting. 8 dunks on 258 FGA, 27.7% on the dribble jumper and 71% from the line. FWIW Braden bitch slapped him and carved Rutgers' D to shreds.

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

Condon doesn't really appeal to me when there are guys like Ryan Kalkbrenner and Oumar Ballo out there. His TS% is weak, rim finishing weak for a C, I don't buy any shooting potential and he only has 7' WS whereas those two are at 7'5 and very efficient scorers.

When you basically reveal that Condon's offense is not projectable you're left with a scrapper and those guys are a dime a dozen.