Smith: 15 more games without TJ?

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

Doesn't that fact that TJ might come back, prevent us from getting an option that may be on the level of Damon or Cassell, because when TJ returns we would have 3 pg's. And whoever we got would be just as unhappy here. The only way I see us landing an upgrade at the current 2pg, is if we acquire a combo, who can maybe get minutes at the 2 spot when/if Tj returns. Or we acquire someone on a 10 day, but will players of that caliber be a significant upgrade?

[TheDoctor]

Doesn't that fact that TJ might come back, prevent us from getting an option that may be on the level of Damon or Cassell, because when TJ returns we would have 3 pg's. And whoever we got would be just as unhappy here. The only way I see us landing an upgrade at the current 2pg, is if we acquire a combo, who can maybe get minutes at the 2 spot when/if Tj returns. Or we acquire someone on a 10 day, but will players of that caliber be a significant upgrade?

I would argue 3 things:

1) Jose is a good enough shooter now to play stretches with another PG
2) Damon and Cassell are also capable of shifting focus to scoring a bit more, as necessary
3) Our swingmen haven't been consistent enough to warrant being on the floor all the time, anyway

There's PT available for gritty vets who can make a shot down the stretch.

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

[quote="TheDoctor"][/quote]

they can hist shots but are they tall enough to guard the opposing backcourt along side TJ and Jose. I mean isn't that part of the reason Juan doesn't get more burn.

[C Court]

Sam.

He wants out of Clipperland, he's gutsy, fiery, and can make big shots down the stretch in a game. He's been a winner throughout his career, and his career is almost done... but he has just enough left in the tank to help us now.

And he's a good enough shooter that you could play him with one of our other PGs.

Damon would definitely work too.

Juan + Joey for Damon + filler?

Done.

I agree. Something like this will definitely happen within the near term. Bryan won't allow our back-up PG play to continue at this subpar level.

Hopefully its a move that sparks the 2008 Raptors similar to how the Chris Childs for Mark Jackson deal ignited the 2000 Raptors.

[TheDoctor]

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they can hist shots but are they tall enough to guard the opposing backcourt along side TJ and Jose. I mean isn't that part of the reason Juan doesn't get more burn.

There's a variety of issues with Dixon. Right now the biggest one is his shot isn't falling... if it is, then he's an ok passer/ballhandler and can make some things happen. But he's never a true PG, or a leader out there (not since Maryland anyway, and he always had Blake with him too).

For people saying that Damon would be upset with his role after TJ comes back... well, more upset than playing for a crap team right now? I think not. I think he'd rather be here, and even with some reduced minutes on a solid team later in the year. Then next year he's an expiring contract anyway... but we'd be ok with him as a backup to either TJ or Jose if we do trade the other.

[ruckus]

Call my glasses rose-coloured but, I don't think things are so bad. We have 48 games left in the season and we are currently sitting at 17-17. Let's say it takes TJ 20 games to get back (15 + 5 to get back into playing shape). If we continue our win 1, lose 1 ways, by the time TJ comes back, we should be somewhere around 27-27 with 28 games remaining to make a final push for seeding.

[dagger]

The problem with Damon is that his contract does have one more year to run, and unless we send out some 08-09 salary, we may not be able to do all the things we could do this summer, such as use our draft choice, re-sign our own free agents, and use some or all of our mid-level exception. I already believe we're heading into a bit of luxury tax, but at $1 of tax for every $1 of salary, Damon becomes a horribly expensive solution for third string point guard.

[TheDoctor]

Call my glasses rose-coloured but, I don't think things are so bad. We have 48 games left in the season and we are currently sitting at 17-17. Let's say it takes TJ 20 games to get back (15 + 5 to get back into playing shape). If we continue our win 1, lose 1 ways, by the time TJ comes back, we should be somewhere around 27-27 with 28 games remaining to make a final push for seeding.

That's fair to say as well.

But I also think that to upgrade the PG situation right now, cheaply, would let us play at a little higher clip while TJ is out, and work on higher seeding.

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

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There's a variety of issues with Dixon. Right now the biggest one is his shot isn't falling... if it is, then he's an ok passer/ballhandler and can make some things happen. But he's never a true PG, or a leader out there (not since Maryland anyway, and he always had Blake with him too).

For people saying that Damon would be upset with his role after TJ comes back... well, more upset than playing for a crap team right now? I think not. I think he'd rather be here, and even with some reduced minutes on a solid team later in the year. Then next year he's an expiring contract anyway... but we'd be ok with him as a backup to either TJ or Jose if we do trade the other.

I thought that too, that if we get a decent 2 pg than we could trade the other, but for this year, with tj's extended absence and the trade deadline, will we have an accurate picture of where we are in terms of TJ's play by the deadline? And I don't see any way a team takes TJ now -
I mean, maybe that's why he's seeing so many specialists, so that if we do try to move him we'll have plenty of info to give to other teams, but I think until he plays a season without incident how can you get anything close to value for him. I mean, I like tj but right now I think you'd be crazy to trade for him. So that leaves Jose to be moved, and even then TJ long term, is perhaps, too great a risk at this point. I don't want to be a doomsayer but all ways around, TJ's injury presents quite a pickle, or conundrum (not condomdrum)

[dacrusha]

Call my glasses rose-coloured but, I don't think things are so bad. We have 48 games left in the season and we are currently sitting at 17-17. Let's say it takes TJ 20 games to get back (15 + 5 to get back into playing shape). If we continue our win 1, lose 1 ways, by the time TJ comes back, we should be somewhere around 27-27 with 28 games remaining to make a final push for seeding.

Our first 34 games had a strength of schedule of .544.

Our last 48 games have a strength of schedule of .464.

I have no doubts that we'll make a big push in the second half of the season.

[C Court]

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Our first 34 games had a strength of schedule of .544.

Our last 48 games have a strength of schedule of .464.

I have no doubts that we'll make a big push in the second half of the season.

Agreed. But you'd hate to squander an opportunity to move up in the standings by not at least tweaking the roster beween now and the trade deadline.

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

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Agreed. But you'd hate to squander an opportunity to move up in the standings by not at least tweaking the roster beween now and the trade deadline.

But I think too you have to weigh the cost of whatever move you make to, see if that deviation, from your long term plan is worth a difference between 4-8th seed.

My big fear though is Chicago still has time to turn things around, and of all the spots for them to take - well, let's just say we've been rocky at best lately.

[TheDoctor]

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I thought that too, that if we get a decent 2 pg than we could trade the other, but for this year, with tj's extended absence and the trade deadline, will we have an accurate picture of where we are in terms of TJ's play by the deadline? And I don't see any way a team takes TJ now -
I mean, maybe that's why he's seeing so many specialists, so that if we do try to move him we'll have plenty of info to give to other teams, but I think until he plays a season without incident how can you get anything close to value for him. I mean, I like tj but right now I think you'd be crazy to trade for him. So that leaves Jose to be moved, and even then TJ long term, is perhaps, too great a risk at this point. I don't want to be a doomsayer but all ways around, TJ's injury presents quite a pickle, or conundrum (not condomdrum)

I would be shocked to see either PG traded by the deadline.

My point is - if you got a Damon, then he gets a month+ to play major minutes, then assuming great health for everyone, gets a couple of months playing some kind of minutes on a solid to good team. But the value proposition to him is feeling needed by a solid to good team for the rest of the season, instead of in the way of progress of two good young PGs on a bad team, I think that works for him - then worry about next year later.

And that goes for us too. Maybe we S&T Jose? Maybe we trade TJ? Maybe we trade Damon as the expiring contract he has then become? Lots of possibilities.

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

^ yeah, if we could pull it off i wouldn't be against it. There's absolutely, IMO, no value of having a third string PG you are afraid to play and a 3rd sg you can''t trade because he has to cover when a pg goes down. Not that I think D mart should play, because I don't and haven't all year. Remind me again why we got rid of Luke for Moon, but signed D-mart?

[TheDoctor]

^ yeah, if we could pull it off i wouldn't be against it. There's absolutely, IMO, no value of having a third string PG you are afraid to play and a 3rd sg you can''t trade because he has to cover when a pg goes down. Not that I think D mart should play, because I don't and haven't all year. Remind me again why we got rid of Luke for Moon, but signed D-mart?

Because we didn't have faith in Dixon as a backup PG, and Luke wouldn't have played as much as Joey has.

Then when D-Mart started looking done, we tried out Dixon and he wasn't totally useless, and ok in stretches.

So now you dump D-Mart for a better PG, if possible.

[Trilogy]

Martin better get cut. I'll end up punching someone if he doesn't.

I wish Roko was here this year.

As for Damon, we'd really be screwing ourselves in terms of salaries. We'd have to go into the lux tax to resign Calderon & Delfino.

I like the idea of Cassell. He's got an attitude that this team needs too.

[HighOctane]

We need a few 10 day contracts.

Actually, I've been wanting Delfino to get his act together and play pg.

[BIGSMOOTH79]

read more here

The concern, in some quarters, is that the Raptors may not see T.J. Ford in uniform for another month (think post-all star) and I

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

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Because we didn't have faith in Dixon as a backup PG, and Luke wouldn't have played as much as Joey has.

Then when D-Mart started looking done, we tried out Dixon and he wasn't totally useless, and ok in stretches.

So now you dump D-Mart for a better PG, if possible.

thanks Doc. BTW Is a there a font colour for rhetorical per chance?

[tsherkin]

I would be especially surprised if Cassell ended up in Toronto, since he wants to play for a contender and with or without Alien, we're not going anywhere near the Finals series.

If anything, he might end up in Phoenix or somewhere like that but not here.