Raps 2020 Picks (Prospect Watch, Update: Vecenie Mock Released)

[Indeed]

I like Dotson but would prefer taller/stronger gaurds who you can play next to Fred/Lowry without being too small

Its why i like Maledon/Maxey so much, you can add ballhandling without giving up anything defense or size.

This is basically my thought process behind not taking him or really any pg aside from Theo with our first.

Toronto has made a backcourt of Lowry and FVV work because they have guys with length like OG and Pascal and Serge/Marc surrounding them. The two experiments of combo guards like TD and Powell have had some good results, but at the end of the day you don't see Powell closing too many games or starting. TD drops out of the rotation at times.

FVV and Lowry play bigger than their size. FVV has a great steal/deflection rate, while Lowry is a strong post-up defender. Dotson has a similar body-type but with added quick twitch agility. His defensive analytics that show he has a chance to be a pest on defense and on offense his finishing ability that shows in every level of competition he has faced.

You can really see his speed balance and shiftiness on display during last year's combine:

Spoiler:

Read on Twitter

I don't think Lowry and VanVleet work all the time even you have length at other positions, but both Lowry and VanVleet provide something our team needs, which is point skill. Powell will not start unless we have another position who can penetrate and pass. This is the reason you may rather have Dotson or Marshall (regardless of size, but skill set) playing for the other guard position.

[casual_raps_fan]

This is basically my thought process behind not taking him or really any pg aside from Theo with our first.

Toronto has made a backcourt of Lowry and FVV work because they have guys with length like OG and Pascal and Serge/Marc surrounding them. The two experiments of combo guards like TD and Powell have had some good results, but at the end of the day you don't see Powell closing too many games or starting. TD drops out of the rotation at times.

FVV and Lowry play bigger than their size. FVV has a great steal/deflection rate, while Lowry is a strong post-up defender. Dotson has a similar body-type but with added quick twitch agility. His defensive analytics that show he has a chance to be a pest on defense and on offense his finishing ability that shows in every level of competition he has faced.

You can really see his speed balance and shiftiness on display during last year's combine:

Spoiler:

Read on Twitter

I don't think Lowry and VanVleet work all the time even you have length at other positions, but both Lowry and VanVleet provide something our team needs, which is point skill. Powell will not start unless we have another position who can penetrate and pass. This is the reason you may rather have Dotson or Marshall (regardless of size, but skill set) playing for the other guard position.

Sorry but can you remind me which game the Lowry/Fred backcourt wasn't working this season? I can't recall a game this season where it wasn't working. Maybe one of the games I missed.

[JYD]

Flynn reminds me so much of Fred. He would be a good guy to groom either as Fred's replacement or his backup. Really smart defensively with quick hands, and excellent feel for the game offensively. 14th in the NCAA (tops among guards in this draft) in assist to turn over ratio. His numbers in his junior year compare favorably with Fred, in fact, they're borderline identical.

I have to agree. I checked out Flynn for the first time yesterday after seeing one mock have him in our range, never seen a single clip of him before, never looked at the numbers, my impression was exactly the same. Undersized if you're talking guarding both backcourt spots at 6'1 with a 6'3 span, and a 22 year old junior, but high IQ, great defender, very good passer, can shoot it, led a very successful team.

I say undersized as it's typically undersized, our own guards have shown what's possible if the motor, toughness and defensive acumen are there, this guy seems to have that.

The way he moves I also see a little Dragic in there with his shiftiness on attack.

[casual_raps_fan]

I like Dotson but would prefer taller/stronger gaurds who you can play next to Fred/Lowry without being too small

Its why i like Maledon/Maxey so much, you can add ballhandling without giving up anything defense or size.

This is basically my thought process behind not taking him or really any pg aside from Theo with our first.

I agree with this but I think I'd still prefer a guard rather than a big in this draft even if they are a bit small. I can envision borderline starter production from a player like Dotson and at worst a serviceable end of the rotation player. I can't say the same for most of the bigs that we've looked at.

I know many people around here love our guard rotation but when you remove 34 year old Lowry from the equation, we have Fred, Norm, McCaw, TD, Thomas. It isn't bad but not good either.

[HeadtopChunes]

I like Dotson but would prefer taller/stronger gaurds who you can play next to Fred/Lowry without being too small

Its why i like Maledon/Maxey so much, you can add ballhandling without giving up anything defense or size.

This is basically my thought process behind not taking him or really any pg aside from Theo with our first.

I agree with this but I think I'd still prefer a guard rather than a big in this draft even if they are a bit small. I can envision borderline starter production from a player like Dotson and at worst a serviceable end of the rotation player. I can't say the same for most of the bigs that we've looked at.

I know many people around here love our guard rotation but when you remove 34 year old Lowry from the equation, we have Fred, Norm, McCaw, TD, Thomas. It isn't bad but not good either.

yeah, this is pretty much what I think, our ballhandler rotation isn't really that great (Kyle, Fred, McCaw?) Nurse even had Rondae handling it the other night lol.

We could really use a halfcourt penetrator/creator off the bench to play that Delon Wright role at first and eventually grow into a starter role (even not thinking about Kyle, a guard drafted this year will be coming off their rookie deal probably the same time Fred's soon to be new contract expires)

I can see the argument for a big but besides Wiseman, I can't say I'm too interested so far.

Even someone like Okongwu with his size is a pretty big hesitation point for me, what does 6'8- 6''9 Okongwu do at the 5 that someone like OG/Pascal cant also do at the 5? Its just rebounding from what i can tell.

[Indeed]

Toronto has made a backcourt of Lowry and FVV work because they have guys with length like OG and Pascal and Serge/Marc surrounding them. The two experiments of combo guards like TD and Powell have had some good results, but at the end of the day you don't see Powell closing too many games or starting. TD drops out of the rotation at times.

FVV and Lowry play bigger than their size. FVV has a great steal/deflection rate, while Lowry is a strong post-up defender. Dotson has a similar body-type but with added quick twitch agility. His defensive analytics that show he has a chance to be a pest on defense and on offense his finishing ability that shows in every level of competition he has faced.

You can really see his speed balance and shiftiness on display during last year's combine:

Spoiler:

Read on Twitter

I don't think Lowry and VanVleet work all the time even you have length at other positions, but both Lowry and VanVleet provide something our team needs, which is point skill. Powell will not start unless we have another position who can penetrate and pass. This is the reason you may rather have Dotson or Marshall (regardless of size, but skill set) playing for the other guard position.

Sorry but can you remind me which game the Lowry/Fred backcourt wasn't working this season? I can't recall a game this season where it wasn't working. Maybe one of the games I missed.

Suns pre-restart game

[Indeed]

This is basically my thought process behind not taking him or really any pg aside from Theo with our first.

I agree with this but I think I'd still prefer a guard rather than a big in this draft even if they are a bit small. I can envision borderline starter production from a player like Dotson and at worst a serviceable end of the rotation player. I can't say the same for most of the bigs that we've looked at.

I know many people around here love our guard rotation but when you remove 34 year old Lowry from the equation, we have Fred, Norm, McCaw, TD, Thomas. It isn't bad but not good either.

yeah, this is pretty much what I think, our ballhandler rotation isn't really that great (Kyle, Fred, McCaw?) Nurse even had Rondae handling it the other night lol.

We could really use a halfcourt penetrator/creator off the bench to play that Delon Wright role at first and eventually grow into a starter role (even not thinking about Kyle, a guard drafted this year will be coming off their rookie deal probably the same time Fred's soon to be new contract expires)

I can see the argument for a big but besides Wiseman, I can't say I'm too interested so far.

Even someone like Okongwu with his size is a pretty big hesitation point for me, what does 6'8- 6''9 Okongwu do at the 5 that someone like OG/Pascal cant also do at the 5? Its just rebounding from what i can tell.

My only reason for not using our 1st round pick for a guard, because we had so much success getting guards after the 1st round. I prefer a wing with guard skills or capable of developing their guard skills.

[HeadtopChunes]

I agree with this but I think I'd still prefer a guard rather than a big in this draft even if they are a bit small. I can envision borderline starter production from a player like Dotson and at worst a serviceable end of the rotation player. I can't say the same for most of the bigs that we've looked at.

I know many people around here love our guard rotation but when you remove 34 year old Lowry from the equation, we have Fred, Norm, McCaw, TD, Thomas. It isn't bad but not good either.

yeah, this is pretty much what I think, our ballhandler rotation isn't really that great (Kyle, Fred, McCaw?) Nurse even had Rondae handling it the other night lol.

We could really use a halfcourt penetrator/creator off the bench to play that Delon Wright role at first and eventually grow into a starter role (even not thinking about Kyle, a guard drafted this year will be coming off their rookie deal probably the same time Fred's soon to be new contract expires)

I can see the argument for a big but besides Wiseman, I can't say I'm too interested so far.

Even someone like Okongwu with his size is a pretty big hesitation point for me, what does 6'8- 6''9 Okongwu do at the 5 that someone like OG/Pascal cant also do at the 5? Its just rebounding from what i can tell.

My only reason for not using our 1st round pick for a guard, because we had so much success getting guards after the 1st round. I prefer a wing with guard skills or capable of developing their guard skills.

I def see what you are saying but its a case by case basis for me. ie, it depends on exactly who the guard is? Jaden Mcdaniels is a good example of the wing archetype you are talking about and there only a handful of guards i'd take over him (Maledon, Maxey, Ball and Anthony Edwards )

For this team, I look at the following traits for a prospect and try to parse how likely they are to succeed at those things and then go from there.

Shot Creation
Tools
Fit in our defensive system
Positional Versatility

I'm also not sure how replicable pulling good guards in undrafted free agency is, Fred was a huge hit for sure. TD looks promising although maybe not a sure thing at this point. I do think we can find a backup level G pretty easily in FA though, but I'm looking for more upside than that.

[Syd-TK3]

Double

[Syd-TK3]

I like Dotson but would prefer taller/stronger gaurds who you can play next to Fred/Lowry without being too small

Its why i like Maledon/Maxey so much, you can add ballhandling without giving up anything defense or size.

This is basically my thought process behind not taking him or really any pg aside from Theo with our first.

I agree with this but I think I'd still prefer a guard rather than a big in this draft even if they are a bit small. I can envision borderline starter production from a player like Dotson and at worst a serviceable end of the rotation player. I can't say the same for most of the bigs that we've looked at.

I know many people around here love our guard rotation but when you remove 34 year old Lowry from the equation, we have Fred, Norm, McCaw, TD, Thomas. It isn't bad but not good either.

Our foward rotation is much weaker and unproven though, Rondae is probably gone and he's been just ok.
You still always go best player available and in a perfect world McDaniels falls to us but I think if not you try and get the best guy there and fill out the guards later

[Indeed]

yeah, this is pretty much what I think, our ballhandler rotation isn't really that great (Kyle, Fred, McCaw?) Nurse even had Rondae handling it the other night lol.

We could really use a halfcourt penetrator/creator off the bench to play that Delon Wright role at first and eventually grow into a starter role (even not thinking about Kyle, a guard drafted this year will be coming off their rookie deal probably the same time Fred's soon to be new contract expires)

I can see the argument for a big but besides Wiseman, I can't say I'm too interested so far.

Even someone like Okongwu with his size is a pretty big hesitation point for me, what does 6'8- 6''9 Okongwu do at the 5 that someone like OG/Pascal cant also do at the 5? Its just rebounding from what i can tell.

My only reason for not using our 1st round pick for a guard, because we had so much success getting guards after the 1st round. I prefer a wing with guard skills or capable of developing their guard skills.

I def see what you are saying but its a case by case basis for me. ie, it depends on exactly who the guard is? Jaden Mcdaniels is a good example of the wing archetype you are talking about and there only a handful of guards i'd take over him (Maledon, Maxey, Ball and Anthony Edwards )

For this team, I look at the following traits for a prospect and try to parse how likely they are to succeed at those things and then go from there.

Shot Creation
Tools
Fit in our defensive system
Positional Versatility

I'm also not sure how replicable pulling good guards in undrafted free agency is, Fred was a huge hit for sure. TD looks promising although maybe not a sure thing at this point. I do think we can find a backup level G pretty easily in FA though, but I'm looking for more upside than that.

I have Fit in our defensive system and Positional Versatility, and not surprised the Raptors coaching staffs will have their priority.

[Dalek]

This is basically my thought process behind not taking him or really any pg aside from Theo with our first.

I agree with this but I think I'd still prefer a guard rather than a big in this draft even if they are a bit small. I can envision borderline starter production from a player like Dotson and at worst a serviceable end of the rotation player. I can't say the same for most of the bigs that we've looked at.

I know many people around here love our guard rotation but when you remove 34 year old Lowry from the equation, we have Fred, Norm, McCaw, TD, Thomas. It isn't bad but not good either.

Our foward rotation is much weaker and unproven though, Rondae is probably gone and he's been just ok.
You still always go best player available and in a perfect world McDaniels falls to us but I think if not you try and get the best guy there and fill out the guards later

To me, a guy like McDaniels has a load of red flags - poor production, high foul numbers, being relegated to the bench on a crappy team. I see the size and skills on display at times, but he was a guy who was invisible most of the time in Washington.

Toronto has done well typically with drafting or signing productive players who were leaders on their team. The best draft picks: Delon Wright, Jakob Poeltl, Siakam, FVV, TD were all the best players who led their teams and were considered model players and all-Conference types. Only OG and Powell were true roleplayers in college who eventually grinded his way into being starter quality.

Their swing for the fences types like Bruno, Dewan and DeAndre Daniels failed because there is something missing. The red flag was that they were never important players for their team. They seem like good gambles based on size and mobility, but their basketball sense is so underdeveloped.

Guys like Dotson or Flynn make sense because they are great leaders and have good NBA skill-sets. I'd love to get Dotson and Azubuike which would be like when Toronto lucked into Poeltl and Wright. You'd get two guys who know each other and are kind of the same type of co-leaders like Wright and Poeltl were.

[Syd-TK3]

I agree with this but I think I'd still prefer a guard rather than a big in this draft even if they are a bit small. I can envision borderline starter production from a player like Dotson and at worst a serviceable end of the rotation player. I can't say the same for most of the bigs that we've looked at.

I know many people around here love our guard rotation but when you remove 34 year old Lowry from the equation, we have Fred, Norm, McCaw, TD, Thomas. It isn't bad but not good either.

Our foward rotation is much weaker and unproven though, Rondae is probably gone and he's been just ok.
You still always go best player available and in a perfect world McDaniels falls to us but I think if not you try and get the best guy there and fill out the guards later

To me, a guy like McDaniels has a load of red flags - poor production, high foul numbers, being relegated to the bench on a crappy team. I see the size and skills on display at times, but he was a guy who was invisible most of the time in Washington.

Toronto has done well typically with drafting or signing productive players who were leaders on their team. The best draft picks: Delon Wright, Jakob Poeltl, Siakam, FVV, TD were all the best players who led their teams and were considered model players and all-Conference types. Only OG and Powell were true roleplayers in college who eventually grinded his way into being starter quality.

Their swing for the fences types like Bruno, Dewan and DeAndre Daniels failed because there is something missing. The red flag was that they were never important players for their team. They seem like good gambles based on size and mobility, but their basketball sense is so underdeveloped.

Guys like Dotson or Flynn make sense because they are great leaders and have good NBA skill-sets. I'd love to get Dotson and Azubuike which would be like when Toronto lucked into Poeltl and Wright. You'd get two guys who know each other and are kind of the same type of co-leaders like Wright and Poeltl were.

That late in the 1st he's still got enough intriguing aspects to not pass him up, and after watching a lot of MPJ it only makes it harder. The fact that we have done so well with late picks and undrafted guys is even more of a reason why we can take a risk like that. Just like Denver that's the benefit of being a good team with time for developement.
Also bruno was the only swing for the fence pick. Dewan was a senior and it's far too early to call him a fail. Taking Daniels might have been wrong considering we missed Jokic but he was a mid 2nd pick. McDaniels would fall more into the OG category of someone with talent but clear problems dropping (OG obviously more acceptable because his problems were injury related and not production).

[Dalek]

Our foward rotation is much weaker and unproven though, Rondae is probably gone and he's been just ok.
You still always go best player available and in a perfect world McDaniels falls to us but I think if not you try and get the best guy there and fill out the guards later

To me, a guy like McDaniels has a load of red flags - poor production, high foul numbers, being relegated to the bench on a crappy team. I see the size and skills on display at times, but he was a guy who was invisible most of the time in Washington.

Toronto has done well typically with drafting or signing productive players who were leaders on their team. The best draft picks: Delon Wright, Jakob Poeltl, Siakam, FVV, TD were all the best players who led their teams and were considered model players and all-Conference types. Only OG and Powell were true roleplayers in college who eventually grinded his way into being starter quality.

Their swing for the fences types like Bruno, Dewan and DeAndre Daniels failed because there is something missing. The red flag was that they were never important players for their team. They seem like good gambles based on size and mobility, but their basketball sense is so underdeveloped.

Guys like Dotson or Flynn make sense because they are great leaders and have good NBA skill-sets. I'd love to get Dotson and Azubuike which would be like when Toronto lucked into Poeltl and Wright. You'd get two guys who know each other and are kind of the same type of co-leaders like Wright and Poeltl were.

That late in the 1st he's still got enough intriguing aspects to not pass him up, and after watching a lot of MPJ it only makes it harder. The fact that we have done so well with late picks and undrafted guys is even more of a reason why we can take a risk like that. Just like Denver that's the benefit of being a good team with time for developement.
Also bruno was the only swing for the fence pick. Dewan was a senior and it's far too early to call him a fail. Taking Daniels might have been wrong considering we missed Jokic but he was a mid 2nd pick. McDaniels would fall more into the OG category of someone with talent but clear problems dropping (OG obviously more acceptable because his problems were injury related and not production).

I am glad you mentioned MPJ. He has completely blown away any expectations about his ability. The knock on him was his injury history but he always had skill. It is very similar to Caris Levert who I also thought was a brilliant player but his injury history in college made me worry about drafting him. Makes you think a guy like Killian Tillie is worth a gamble because he probably should be a lottery pick in this draft.

Maybe McDaniels is too good to pass up at 28. I sometimes feel the same about Poku. They are the mystery box type players who look so compelling on film yet I wonder if either of those guys would be okay with sitting in the G-League for a couple years developing. Both seem like 2-3 year projects. If you see a shorter timeline and think they will be patient enough to pan out, then maybe it is worth it.

[Syd-TK3]

To me, a guy like McDaniels has a load of red flags - poor production, high foul numbers, being relegated to the bench on a crappy team. I see the size and skills on display at times, but he was a guy who was invisible most of the time in Washington.

Toronto has done well typically with drafting or signing productive players who were leaders on their team. The best draft picks: Delon Wright, Jakob Poeltl, Siakam, FVV, TD were all the best players who led their teams and were considered model players and all-Conference types. Only OG and Powell were true roleplayers in college who eventually grinded his way into being starter quality.

Their swing for the fences types like Bruno, Dewan and DeAndre Daniels failed because there is something missing. The red flag was that they were never important players for their team. They seem like good gambles based on size and mobility, but their basketball sense is so underdeveloped.

Guys like Dotson or Flynn make sense because they are great leaders and have good NBA skill-sets. I'd love to get Dotson and Azubuike which would be like when Toronto lucked into Poeltl and Wright. You'd get two guys who know each other and are kind of the same type of co-leaders like Wright and Poeltl were.

That late in the 1st he's still got enough intriguing aspects to not pass him up, and after watching a lot of MPJ it only makes it harder. The fact that we have done so well with late picks and undrafted guys is even more of a reason why we can take a risk like that. Just like Denver that's the benefit of being a good team with time for developement.
Also bruno was the only swing for the fence pick. Dewan was a senior and it's far too early to call him a fail. Taking Daniels might have been wrong considering we missed Jokic but he was a mid 2nd pick. McDaniels would fall more into the OG category of someone with talent but clear problems dropping (OG obviously more acceptable because his problems were injury related and not production).

I am glad you mentioned MPJ. He has completely blown away any expectations about his ability. The knock on him was his injury history but he always had skill. It is very similar to Caris Levert who I also thought was a brilliant player but his injury history in college made me worry about drafting him. Makes you think a guy like Killian Tillie is worth a gamble because he probably should be a lottery pick in this draft.

Maybe McDaniels is too good to pass up at 28. I sometimes feel the same about Poku. They are the mystery box type players who look so compelling on film yet I wonder if either of those guys would be okay with sitting in the G-League for a couple years developing. Both seem like 2-3 year projects. If you see a shorter timeline and think they will be patient enough to pan out, then maybe it is worth it.

Honestly most guys drafted lower because of injury problems have turned out to be worth the risk. From Embiid to Porter. Tillie I'm expecting to be the same although I think his case is slightly worse considering just how much he's had. But in the second round he's worth it.

Imo he's definitely too good to pass up on at 28. He could easily turn into a bust or just a simple role player but it's worth the risks.
Poku I'm not expecting to drop anywhere past 20 and wouldn't be surprised to see him gone in the lottery. He's only 18 so he definitely would be a bigger project but I'm sure he'd expecting to be in the g league for atleast a year. I think Jaden could get spot minutes as long as he committed to his defensive strengths but still mainly gleague

[casual_raps_fan]

This is basically my thought process behind not taking him or really any pg aside from Theo with our first.

I agree with this but I think I'd still prefer a guard rather than a big in this draft even if they are a bit small. I can envision borderline starter production from a player like Dotson and at worst a serviceable end of the rotation player. I can't say the same for most of the bigs that we've looked at.

I know many people around here love our guard rotation but when you remove 34 year old Lowry from the equation, we have Fred, Norm, McCaw, TD, Thomas. It isn't bad but not good either.

Our foward rotation is much weaker and unproven though, Rondae is probably gone and he's been just ok.
You still always go best player available and in a perfect world McDaniels falls to us but I think if not you try and get the best guy there and fill out the guards later

Yeah I agree with you. A forward is at the top of my wish list as well (unless Maledon is miraculously available). I was just pointing out that the guards overall look more promising than the bigs (centers) in our draft range.

[NotMyKawhi]

I just think it's a lock we take a big.....gasol, ibaka and boucher all free agents. I doubt we bring them all back.

[casual_raps_fan]

I just think it's a lock we take a big.....gasol, ibaka and boucher all free agents. I doubt we bring them all back.

Really? Which bigs do you like? There's a bunch of wings and guards that look decent but the bigs just don't look that great for our 1st round pick.

[Psubs]

I just think it's a lock we take a big.....gasol, ibaka and boucher all free agents. I doubt we bring them all back.

Really? Which bigs do you like? There's a bunch of wings and guards that look decent but the bigs just don't look that great for our 1st round pick.

Reed, Tillman, Perry, Jalen Smith, Stewart, Carey, Oturu and Nnaji. 4 or 5 of them should still be on the board

Would like to improve rebounding. Bey and Woodard would help that and replace RHJ as a wing/forward (can guard 2-4).

Really, I think they'll draft someone 6'6 or taller.

[HeadtopChunes]

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