[Windhorst] Pascal Siakam Potentially Could Be Available For The Right Trade

[Tor_Raps]

Masai made it quite clear the core is not being traded, especially Pascal, yet the rampant unfounded speculation of this thread rolls on

Trading Pascal is the least of our worries and should only be considered if we are getting a top 10 talent who wants to stay here. What him and Barnes provide on both ends of the court is hard to match.

At the worst case, they become our SF/PF combo. If Barnes develops a good 3 point shot then him, Siakam and OG can easily make the SG/SF/PF spots work.

[WaltFrazier]

Masai made it quite clear the core is not being traded, especially Pascal, yet the rampant unfounded speculation of this thread rolls on

Trading Pascal is the least of our worries and should only be considered if we are getting a top 10 talent who wants to stay here. What him and Barnes provide on both ends of the court is hard to match.

At the worst case, they become our SF/PF combo. If Barnes develops a good 3 point shot then him, Siakam and OG can easily make the SG/SF/PF spots work.

That trio is the identity of the team, what sets us apart. But they have to play 2-3-4 as you said, not 3-4-5. Those 3 starting with a center (Achiuwa and a new guy) plus a PG should be our future starting lineup

[slicedbread2]

I think people will be surprised by a potential package that Siakim gets moved for. I don’t see him getting moved for a top 10 player, most likely a package of players and picks that will help balance the roster. Especially if we want to hand the keys to Scottie Barnes. When the Warriors traded Montae Ellis for Bogut to let Curry develop comes to mind as a similar type of move.

When they traded Ellis, Curry was shut down while they tanked. iirc Bogut was also out for the year at that point. Might have been to just change the tone from soft offense to defense and give rookie Klay some more touches. That was when Mark Jackson took over and was trying to turn them into a defensive oriented team.

Doesn't seem like Masai's MO at all, if you look at his history of building winners. Every name he's traded was for an upgrade in talent, from Ross to JV to DeMar. I guess we would be surprised if he traded Pascal for a downgrade, because he's never done something like that.

We see those type of moves all of time. A team will move a veteran player to get the ball in the hands of a high potential young player. I’m not saying that we absolutely have to or we should, just that it’s a possibility.

I’d say that the JV trade is a good example of downgrade from a talent and youth stand point for fit and defence. JV just had a monster year with the Pelicans and Gasol is retired. I still loved that trade at the time because even though Gasol’s shelf life was limited he just added a needed dimension that JV didn’t provide.

Another thing that people forget during that Warriors season was the following:

1) Monte made it known that a back court of him and Curry wasn't going to work and let's face it two 6'3 guys who are known for offense wasn't going to work. The Bucks had the choice between those 2 and chose Ellis. To be fair Curry's ankles were a huge issue and the fact that he got a 2nd contract at the time was seen as a win-win. Curry overcame those problems and became the GOAT 3pt shooter and 1st ballot hall of famer
2) Bogut post-injury added an extra dimension as a facilitator in the offensive half court set not to mention he was a great defensive anchor. He took Draymond Green under his wing and Dray made it known that Bogut helped him learn a lot of stuff that made it possible for not only him to thrive but also the Warriors. Dray became a pest that learned from Andrew on how to push your luck and see what you can get away with and made him a far more lethal weapon.
3) The Warriors in 2012 owed a 1st round pick to the Jazz that was top 7 pro. and then unprotected in 2013 thanks to the Deron Williams trade. Warriors tanked and were able to keep it which became Harrison Barnes while the 2013 1st eventually became Gorgui Dieng so it was a win I suppose.

Honestly the Raptors should think long and hard about what they want going forward, but I wouldn't hesitate to move Siakam for the right package although anybody thinking a Kawhi Leonard style package will happen will be disappointed.

[Van_Trump]

Siakam wants to stay here.
Unlike any superstar you wish to swap him for.

You only trade Siakam to upgrade to pursue an immediate championship.

[anotherhomer]

Siakam wants to stay here.
Unlike any superstar you wish to swap him for.

You only trade Siakam to upgrade to pursue an immediate championship.

+1....
at the risk of going into an intermediate rebuild

Raps lost JV, Poetl, Derozan, even TRoss
4 good players who would be solid contributors

[pagal]

Fat bastard just throwing crap against the wall and see if it sticks.

Aurelie, anyone can be had for the right trade but the odds of PS getting traded would be extremely slim because no one is trading us a player better than him and Masai isn't the type to trade a dollar for 4 quarters.

Furthermore, he has great on court chemistry with Barnes and it's only going to get better.

[BillNyeBballGuy]

That elbow Siakam gave to Embiid after he tried to humiliate the team really gave me a new found respect for him. I don't care if it was intentional or not, he made a strong, aggressive move to the hoop and didn't quit. That's the kind of player I want the Raptors to have more of.

[omar36]

why would we trade pascal. hes our best palyer and moving him signals another retool/rebuild which i wouldnt mind but eh. The guys a perfect number 2 on a legit team.

if Utah is also giving us 4 FRP (2022, 2024, 2026, 2028) and Gobert... I would do that trade.

ok yea same lmao

[will]

Fat bastard just throwing crap against the wall and see if it sticks.

Aurelie, anyone can be had for the right trade but the odds of PS getting traded would be extremely slim because no one is trading us a player better than him and Masai isn't the type to trade a dollar for 4 quarters.

Furthermore, he has great on court chemistry with Barnes and it's only going to get better.

[RapsFanInOhio]

There are like, 15 players in the NBA that are better than Siakam for the next two years. Unless one of those guys is coming back in a Siakam deal, it’s not happening. I don’t even think they would move him for a top 5 pick.

You don't really think Siakam is top 15... do you?

In no particular order...
Doncic
Jokic
Curry
Morant
Embiid
Giannis
Durant
Kyrie
Tatum
Young
Butler
Lebron
George
Kawhi
Davis

Then you have fringe guys like
Beal
Adebayo
Brown
Klay
Harden
Lillard
SGA
Zion
KAT
Gobert/Mitchell
CP3/Booker

Siakam is closer to top 30 than he is top 15. He had a great individual year with good team success in the regular season.

I think I would take Siakam over Gobert, Mitchell, CP3 (again, next two years, not right now), Zion, SGA, Lillard, Harden, Klay, Beal, Kawhi, Butler, Young, George, and Kyrie. I probably should say Lebron and KAT, too, but I just can't get myself there.

That leaves:
Doncic, Jokic, Curry, Morant, Embiid (sheesh.. Idk. Dude hasn't won anything and can't stay healthy. I guess.), Giannis, Durant (also sheesh), Tatum, Davis, Brown, Adebayo, Lebron, Booker, and KAT.

Siakam is right smack in that fringe guys list over the next two years. I don't see any one-for-one deals there, so I don't see him going anywhere.

[RapsFanInOhio]

OG for Huerter and Okongwu

Absolutely not.

[RapsFanInOhio]

Fred and Pascal for Donovan and Rudy

Absolutely not.

[RapsFanInOhio]

He's coming off a monster season and just about to enter his prime. Same age as when KD signed with Golden state.

You only trade him if its for a MEGA package but that likely isn't happening.

Definitely a top 2 guy on a contending team and those are hard to find.

This is it.

Even a MEGA package (like Kuminga, Poole / Klay, Wiseman, etc.) probably makes us take a step back in the short term and I just can't see that happening.This team is an upwards trajectory, Pascal is 28, and I can't see them doing anything to slip backwards. They're going to add a few pieces and continue to develop the guys we have.

[Son Goku 25]

Siakam is a legit All star I think he's pretty much shown that in season and playoffs.. oh and he's a two way star who wants to be here.

[RapsFanInOhio]

There are like, 15 players in the NBA that are better than Siakam for the next two years. Unless one of those guys is coming back in a Siakam deal, it’s not happening. I don’t even think they would move him for a top 5 pick.

I'd move him for the first overall pick and for a Poole/Kuminga package.


But considering these things won't get offered he will stay. There is close to a zero percent chance he is getting moved.

.. makes way to the Trade Checker

GSW is in such an enviable spot man. I'm convinced Kuminga is going to be a star. Poole is playing out of his mind, Curry is Curry, Wiggins is playing like he should have been his whole career, and when your biggest worry is how well one of the top shooters in the world is going to shoot.. man.

I'm not sure I want Poole, quite honestly. I think he's on a heater but when they inevitably overpay him, that contract isn't going to age well. It's easy to get open looks when you're surrounded by two of the best shooters ever. A Poole / Kuminga / Wiggins deal is so interesting but I just don't know how comfortable I am paying Poole that much to be the defacto "guy" and then you lose Pascal's defense all to get three guys who can't yet create the offense needed to overcome that. Having GTJ, Kuminga, Barnes, Wiggins, Poole, and OG all on the same roster is probably too much to talent to say no to though - you just take all that and figure it out, defense be damned.

I do think that GSW is the most logical trade partner if we're ever going to move him. They've got enough young talent plus the contracts to make a deal work, and if we make a big move I think it's more likely to open our window up more than to close it - so any deal with GSW probably makes them title favorites for the short term but gives us some crazy depth of talent that would hopefully develop into something Championship caliber.

I'd also probably move him for the #1 overall this year but only because I think Chet is the truth and a Scottie / Chet combo for the next 8-10 years would be super fun to watch.

[Ell Curry]

OG for Huerter and Okongwu

Absolutely not.

Okongwu should be worth more than OG but big 3 and D wings are just too valuable compared to a solid center. You have to think Okongwu can be Bam for him to be as valuable playing 34 minutes a night and whatever wing you can get compared to a just ok center you can get for the MLE and OG.

[Johnny Bball]

I think people will be surprised by a potential package that Siakim gets moved for. I don’t see him getting moved for a top 10 player, most likely a package of players and picks that will help balance the roster. Especially if we want to hand the keys to Scottie Barnes. When the Warriors traded Montae Ellis for Bogut to let Curry develop comes to mind as a similar type of move.

I wouldn’t be inclined to trade Siakam in a 4 quarters for a dollar type of deal. For me it’s got to be a really high upside move similar to the Kawhi trade. I would consider something built around Siakam for Zion for example because it’s risky, but really high upside if it works out. Then move Vanvleet and Trent for another younger high upside piece. A young core of Barnes, Zion, OG and a 4th player would raise the overall ceiling of the team. Toronto will always have to roll the dice to get to that championship level again.

There will never be a Kawhi type deal.

How do you figure. You hate Derozan so lets put it in different currency that YOU understand. They eventually, at the end of it all, got basically 5 FRPs (4 plus Poeltl at the time that was 9th) for a known rental of Kawhi and Green. How do you figure that's impossible to happen again?

[Steelo Green]

I wouldn’t be inclined to trade Siakam in a 4 quarters for a dollar type of deal. For me it’s got to be a really high upside move similar to the Kawhi trade. I would consider something built around Siakam for Zion for example because it’s risky, but really high upside if it works out. Then move Vanvleet and Trent for another younger high upside piece. A young core of Barnes, Zion, OG and a 4th player would raise the overall ceiling of the team. Toronto will always have to roll the dice to get to that championship level again.

There will never be a Kawhi type deal.

How do you figure. You hate Derozan so lets put it in different currency that YOU understand. They eventually, at the end of it all, got basically 5 FRPs (4 plus Poeltl at the time that was 9th) for a known rental of Kawhi and Green. How do you figure that's impossible to happen again?

The thing with a Kawhi is he is at his best and at that time prime a top 3 player.

We are going to assume a player of that caliber on the block will not be hurt in the strange circumstances he was dealt in so the question is - what is the trade value of Giannis/Embiid/Jokic?

Not even Harden, hell not even Butler.

Given the Paul George trade, we are talking something like:

-5-7 picks + swaps
-Scottie
-some amalgamation of Trent, Siakam, Fred and OG

Now we get into the will those players ever be available and will those players even want to come here.

A player of the magnitude of Kawhi fully healthy is both an insane capital loss (you do it obviously) an availability issue, and a will they come issue.

Add those up and yes - it will virtually never happen.

The Butlers of the world aren’t even in the vicinity of the Kawhi’s. Falling off Harden same thing.

A prime top 3 player in the league fully healthy is a rare feat.

[KrazyP]

I doubt Siakam gets moved anytime soon. That said, if it does happen....I could potentially see some sort of 3-way working that nets the Raps Shai Gilgeous Alexander. Warriors-Thunder-Raptors would be good trade partners.

[Johnny Bball]

There will never be a Kawhi type deal.

How do you figure. You hate Derozan so lets put it in different currency that YOU understand. They eventually, at the end of it all, got basically 5 FRPs (4 plus Poeltl at the time that was 9th) for a known rental of Kawhi and Green. How do you figure that's impossible to happen again?

The thing with a Kawhi is he is at his best and at that time prime a top 3 player.

We are going to assume a player of that caliber on the block will not be hurt in the strange circumstances he was dealt in so the question is - what is the trade value of Giannis/Embiid/Jokic?

Not even Harden, hell not even Butler.

Given the Paul George trade, we are talking something like:

-5-7 picks + swaps
-Scottie
-some amalgamation of Trent, Siakam, Fred and OG

Now we get into the will those players ever be available and will those players even want to come here.

A player of the magnitude of Kawhi fully healthy is both an insane capital loss (you do it obviously) an availability issue, and a will they come issue.

Add those up and yes - it will virtually never happen.

The Butlers of the world aren’t even in the vicinity of the Kawhi’s. Falling off Harden same thing.

A prime top 3 player in the league fully healthy is a rare feat.

So,you agree then. In the end the Spurs did not get fleeced and got what they should for a rental.

The Paul George trade wasn’t just the Paul George trade, it was being held hostage and.getting kawhi. It was a clear overpay.

Either way…. Stars move all the time now. Not one in a million times. And the price is 5-7 picks and players. And we clearly have that. And it clearly could be done not including Barnes. There are other deals out there and will be other deals that can put us back in contention when we are ready.

Saying otherwise is just wilful ignorance, especially with the number of stars moving around.