Windhorst - "Sixers wouldn't give up Maxey"

[Johnny Bball]

So now Masai being greedy and not taking what was clearly more than enough (Maxey + first) is another notch on the belt for Masai when he ended up with Precious?

I need to go to the same gym some people do to learn these mental gymnastics.

Or stop pretending **** rumour is fact when you narrative is well past beat. And stop pretending when plenty of people said they would have taken the proposed offer, because it was too much and obviously fantasy.

[PerfectJab]

In a vacuum your completely right, most of us Precious boosters are hoping his prototype pans out and like you mentioned many guys with fantastic tools don't pan out.

That said TOR is considered a premier organization for scouting & developing. We've seen the work they did with Siakam, Powell, OG etc.

You can't discount TORs track record in this regard. So with that said, given the choice between an Athletic 6'9 big who can switch everything & shoot who is still raw vs a 6'1 scoring combo guard, it's very easy to choose potential in this case since TOR has a track record of developing said 6'9 bigs.

We saw the jump Achiuwa made in season, the work he's put in with the org is already bearing fruit. I don't think these 2 games change that.

Achiuwa ceiling>Maxey Ceiling.

Therein lies the problem. You're making the assumption that Toronto's system can turn any player into gold and fallaciously making an argument out of it.

You're ignoring the fact that efficacy needs one foundational item in order to happen, reality. This 'ceiling' that you speak of is hard to justify as it is based on opinion and a best case scenario based on a universal acceptance of what your version of ceiling entails. It hasn't happened yet and you're predicting that it will. Anyone can easily disagree with you as a result as it hasn't been proven yet. Why? Because there is no reality behind it.

The reality is, a player needs to be efficient enough to stay on the floor. Maxey has been a starter averaging 35 mins on a 50 win team producing very high percentages. You can argue as to why he has accomplished this all you want but it doesn't take away from the fact that he has already done it.

In the playoffs Maxey has been able to accomplish 30.5 pts/6.5R/5.0A/11-16 FGA 68%/ 4-7 3PA 57% in two playoff games versus a 50 win team and you can see why reality trumps any speculatory opinion someone has.

It's not an easy feat to do regardless of how much you downplay it. Again, it has actually been done. Let's give credit where credit is due. There are actually hard numbers to prove that he has a higher ceiling than Precious. Again, not opinions, facts. I'd be happy to hear any facts that discredit this otherwise.

I don't believe TOR can turn any player into gold. Flynn looks like a bust. Bruno was a bust, Delon Wright was meh. OG has exceeded expectations but he never took that step many hoped of him to become a wing scorer etc.

You seem to be saying that current production is the biggest marker for deciding someone's ceiling. I disagree with that. In a cross position and role comparison like this, you can't simply decide this early. Yes, Maxey is killing it this series, credit to him. But he came into the league more skilled. He's not a project like Precious. How many guys do you think can replicate what Maxey is doing playing behind Harden and Embiid? Jordan Poole, Colin Sexton, Tyler Herro etc can all go off like this. And I'm not even considering the more proven stars of this scoring guard archetype like a Donovan Mitchell, CJ McCollum, Beal. Hell, I think a guy like Bones Hyland could go off like this in 2-3 years.

Conversely, when Achiuwa shows his flashes, how many guys can replicate that? It's a lot smaller, because there aren't as many players as athletic, fluid, and strong while being 6'9+ and able to shoot the 3. Achiuwa has the potential to be a stretch big who can protect the paint.

And it's not like it's just flashes, Achiuwa has shown something though. Post ASB, he averaged 12/6 on 39% from 3.

I'll put it another way. I think players of Maxey's archetype are more common than those of Precious. And I think Precious types are inherently more valuable since they can play both ends.

My issue is that your arguments are based on assumptions. He hasn't even proven to be the player that you're arguing that he is.

I disagree that he has proven himself to be a two way threat. A big man with a TS% of .502 is not that impressive and I don't believe that 12/6 on 39% from 3 after ASB is a large enough sample size to crown him with this achievement. Defensively, eye test says he is ok but man the way people are talking about him you'd think he had made an all defensive team. I'd argue that Boucher has proven better on both sides of the floor the past couple years yet why isn't he getting any credit?

The answer to the above is that this board has a history of overrating their prospects. Sonny Weems come to mind. Pops Mensah Bonsu, Malachi Flynn, Jamario Moon. Heck, Biyombo was the next Ben Wallace. The list goes on...

[Los_29]

Just a few stats on Maxey to highlight how he scores a lot of his baskets and how he has benefitted from playing with Embiid and more recently Harden as well.

Maxey has attempted 309 threes this year. He was wide open (>6 ft) on 61% of those attempts. For reference, Fred's at 35%, Steph is at 26% and our good friend Collin Sexton is at 33% (last year). Maxey has attempted 96 threes when he was open by 4-6ft. From 2-4ft he's attempted only 22 threes and from 0-2 feet he's attempted only 1 three.

7% of his three point attempts have been when a defender was within 4ft of him. 93% of his three point attempts were when he was open to wide open.

I don't get it, what's your point? That he has good shot selection?

He's getting docked for playing well within the roster he is playing for? You're basically saying he's not good because of who he plays with yet there are people here spewing bull that Precious is of higher value because he fits within the system that he plays with. You don't think future All NBA superstar Precious has benefited? Such a silly double standard, if you're going to make an argument at least apply it universally and not just to bring another down. You won't, because the argument disintegrates when you do.

I'd love to see how Precious and Maxey stats compare. Let's talk reality again.

How is that your biggest takeaway from that post?

The point is playing with Embiid and Harden is extremely easy. 61% of his threes were wide open. 93% of his threes were when he was open by at least 4ft. I don't think you realize how insane that is. Everyone goes on about how NBA players can make open shots with ease. Well 93% of Maxey's 3pt attempts are open. Maxey is largely a product of who he is playing with. You don't think Steph or Fred or Trae or Booker would shoot the ball if there wasn't a defender within 6 feet of them? Of course they would. Unfortunately for them, those opportunities aren't as frequent as Maxey's. Shooting wide open shots doesn't mean you have good shot selection. It just means you have common sense.

Since the all-star break Precious is averaging 12.2ppg, 5.7rpg, 1.1apg on 46.2% from the field, 39.2% from three and 62% from the free throw line in 24.7 minutes a game.

Per 36 - 17.7ppg, 8.3rpg, 1.6apg
Maxey's Per 36 - 17/4/3 on 48/43/87

Clearly Precious needs to improve his FG and FT percentage. But do you not think he could do that considering the leaps that Pascal, OG and even Scottie have made in that department? OG couldn't hit free throws coming into the league. Same with Pascal.

Precious doesn't even have to be that much more efficient offensively for him to impact the game more than Maxey because the difference on defense is substantial. And as discussed earlier, Maxey has been a huge beneficiary of playing with Embiid and Harden.

This is why Precious has a higher ceiling. This doesn't mean that Precious will reach his ceiling and Maxey could easily be the better player throughout their career. But very few people if any, would say that a guy like Maxey has a higher ceiling in today's NBA than Precious Achiuwa.

I don't see anything that suggests Maxey has a high ceiling. His assist rate is terrible and there are no defensive metrics that would indicate he could be a factor on that end. He's got a terrible steal and deflection rate and has shown zero instincts on that side of the ball. People might say "well look at Trent, he improved defensively." And they'd be right but the difference is Trent actually showed potential on that side of the ball. He just wasn't consistent.

If you want to say that Maxey has the higher floor than Precious, I'd agree with you. But he doesn't have a higher ceiling.

[Los_29]

In a vacuum your completely right, most of us Precious boosters are hoping his prototype pans out and like you mentioned many guys with fantastic tools don't pan out.

That said TOR is considered a premier organization for scouting & developing. We've seen the work they did with Siakam, Powell, OG etc.

You can't discount TORs track record in this regard. So with that said, given the choice between an Athletic 6'9 big who can switch everything & shoot who is still raw vs a 6'1 scoring combo guard, it's very easy to choose potential in this case since TOR has a track record of developing said 6'9 bigs.

We saw the jump Achiuwa made in season, the work he's put in with the org is already bearing fruit. I don't think these 2 games change that.

Achiuwa ceiling>Maxey Ceiling.

Therein lies the problem. You're making the assumption that Toronto's system can turn any player into gold and fallaciously making an argument out of it.

You're ignoring the fact that efficacy needs one foundational item in order to happen, reality. This 'ceiling' that you speak of is hard to justify as it is based on opinion and a best case scenario based on a universal acceptance of what your version of ceiling entails. It hasn't happened yet and you're predicting that it will. Anyone can easily disagree with you as a result as it hasn't been proven yet. Why? Because there is no reality behind it.

The reality is, a player needs to be efficient enough to stay on the floor. Maxey has been a starter averaging 35 mins on a 50 win team producing very high percentages. You can argue as to why he has accomplished this all you want but it doesn't take away from the fact that he has already done it.

In the playoffs Maxey has been able to accomplish 30.5 pts/6.5R/5.0A/11-16 FGA 68%/ 4-7 3PA 57% in two playoff games versus a 50 win team and you can see why reality trumps any speculatory opinion someone has.

It's not an easy feat to do regardless of how much you downplay it. Again, it has actually been done. Let's give credit where credit is due. There are actually hard numbers to prove that he has a higher ceiling than Precious. Again, not opinions, facts. I'd be happy to hear any facts that discredit this otherwise.

I don't believe TOR can turn any player into gold. Flynn looks like a bust. Bruno was a bust, Delon Wright was meh. OG has exceeded expectations but he never took that step many hoped of him to become a wing scorer etc.

You seem to be saying that current production is the biggest marker for deciding someone's ceiling. I disagree with that. In a cross position and role comparison like this, you can't simply decide this early. Yes, Maxey is killing it this series, credit to him. But he came into the league more skilled. He's not a project like Precious. How many guys do you think can replicate what Maxey is doing playing behind Harden and Embiid? Jordan Poole, Colin Sexton, Tyler Herro etc can all go off like this. And I'm not even considering the more proven stars of this scoring guard archetype like a Donovan Mitchell, CJ McCollum, Beal. Hell, I think a guy like Bones Hyland could go off like this in 2-3 years.

Conversely, when Achiuwa shows his flashes, how many guys can replicate that? It's a lot smaller, because there aren't as many players as athletic, fluid, and strong while being 6'9+ and able to shoot the 3. Achiuwa has the potential to be a stretch big who can protect the paint.

And it's not like it's just flashes, Achiuwa has shown something though. Post ASB, he averaged 12/6 on 39% from 3.

I'll put it another way. I think players of Maxey's archetype are more common than those of Precious. And I think Precious types are inherently more valuable since they can play both ends.

[kj_]

In sum....

There was/is no credible source that states that Philly offered Maxey + 1st rounder

....Move on

It is clear that Maxey was offered. Not the first, but Maxey alone. Lowe doesn’t make claims like that unless true. I relistened to the Lowe post with Marks for confirmation.

Maxey would have been the better deal.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Los_29]

In sum....

There was/is no credible source that states that Philly offered Maxey + 1st rounder

....Move on

It is clear that Maxey was offered. Not the first, but Maxey alone. Lowe doesn’t make claims like that unless true. I relistened to the Lowe post with Marks for confirmation.

Maxey would have been the better deal.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Windhorst says he wasn’t. Lots of conflicting reports.

Do you have a link to that Lowe podcast?

[kj_]

In sum....

There was/is no credible source that states that Philly offered Maxey + 1st rounder

....Move on

It is clear that Maxey was offered. Not the first, but Maxey alone. Lowe doesn’t make claims like that unless true. I relistened to the Lowe post with Marks for confirmation.

Maxey would have been the better deal.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Windhorst says he wasn’t. Lots of conflicting reports.

Do you have a link to that Lowe podcast?

Lowe Post.
Deadline reaction with Bobby Marks. Mar 25th 2021.
Just after the 49 min mark.

Lowe said he knows Maxey and Green were on the table. Speculates that it was more than a first was the Raps ask because “he felt” Green, Maxey and a first made sense for Philly. But that part was pure speculation.

Edit: Check out Trade Deadline Reaction with Bobby Marks https://listen.stitcher.com/yvap/?c=sharelink&af_dp=stitcher://episode/82684631&af_web_dp=https://www.stitcher.com/episode/82684631&deep_link_value=stitcher://episode/82684631

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Los_29]

It is clear that Maxey was offered. Not the first, but Maxey alone. Lowe doesn’t make claims like that unless true. I relistened to the Lowe post with Marks for confirmation.

Maxey would have been the better deal.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Windhorst says he wasn’t. Lots of conflicting reports.

Do you have a link to that Lowe podcast?

Lowe Post.
Deadline reaction with Bobby Marks. Mar 25th 2021.
Just after the 49 min mark.

Lowe said he knows Maxey and Green were on the table. Speculates that it was more than a first was the Raps ask because “he felt” Green, Maxey and a first made sense for Philly. But that part was pure speculation.

Edit: Check out Trade Deadline Reaction with Bobby Marks https://listen.stitcher.com/yvap/?c=sharelink&af_dp=stitcher://episode/82684631&af_web_dp=https://www.stitcher.com/episode/82684631&deep_link_value=stitcher://episode/82684631

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks.

Don’t think Maxey/Green worked cap wise. Philly would still be 12 million dollars shy. So Toronto would be needing to take back a lot more. Green was making 15 million, Maxey 2.5 million and Lowry was making 30 million. That deal that Lowe said was on the table couldn’t have been offered because it couldn’t have worked.

Given Windhorst said Maxey wasn’t available 3 days ago, I’ll take his word for it.

[Pooh_Jeter]

Windhorst says he wasn’t. Lots of conflicting reports.

Do you have a link to that Lowe podcast?

Lowe Post.
Deadline reaction with Bobby Marks. Mar 25th 2021.
Just after the 49 min mark.

Lowe said he knows Maxey and Green were on the table. Speculates that it was more than a first was the Raps ask because “he felt” Green, Maxey and a first made sense for Philly. But that part was pure speculation.

Edit: Check out Trade Deadline Reaction with Bobby Marks https://listen.stitcher.com/yvap/?c=sharelink&af_dp=stitcher://episode/82684631&af_web_dp=https://www.stitcher.com/episode/82684631&deep_link_value=stitcher://episode/82684631

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks.

Don’t think Maxey/Green worked cap wise. Philly would still be 12 million dollars shy. So Toronto would be needing to take back a lot more. Green was making 15 million, Maxey 2.5 million and Lowry was making 30 million. That deal that Lowe said was on the table couldn’t have been offered because it couldn’t have worked.

Given Windhorst said Maxey wasn’t available 3 days ago, I’ll take his word for it.

Maxey, Green and the players who were traded for Hill would have worked under the cap. Any claims there wasn't a deal to made that was legal under the cap is completely untrue.

[Los_29]

Lowe Post.
Deadline reaction with Bobby Marks. Mar 25th 2021.
Just after the 49 min mark.

Lowe said he knows Maxey and Green were on the table. Speculates that it was more than a first was the Raps ask because “he felt” Green, Maxey and a first made sense for Philly. But that part was pure speculation.

Edit: Check out Trade Deadline Reaction with Bobby Marks https://listen.stitcher.com/yvap/?c=sharelink&af_dp=stitcher://episode/82684631&af_web_dp=https://www.stitcher.com/episode/82684631&deep_link_value=stitcher://episode/82684631

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks.

Don’t think Maxey/Green worked cap wise. Philly would still be 12 million dollars shy. So Toronto would be needing to take back a lot more. Green was making 15 million, Maxey 2.5 million and Lowry was making 30 million. That deal that Lowe said was on the table couldn’t have been offered because it couldn’t have worked.

Given Windhorst said Maxey wasn’t available 3 days ago, I’ll take his word for it.

Maxey, Green and the players who were traded for Hill would have worked under the cap. Any claims there wasn't a deal to made that was legal under the cap is completely untrue.

Didn't you say before we needed a third team to make it work? How come the information constantly changes? There were reports that Morey wanted to keep his young players and his picks and that's why he opted for George Hill. Morey likely pivoted and got cold feet.

Considering Windhorst said Maxey wasn't available THREE days ago, I will take his word for it. Do you know the kind of repercussions that would result in Brian Windhorst lying in front of millions of people on national tv? This is different than Lowe talking from his basement on a podcast very few people listen to.

You're providing sources from last March, I'm providing sources from last week. Which one do you think is more reliable? The one that was right around the deadline with hundreds of other different rumours or the one that had 13 months for the truth to reveal itself? You can't pick 1-2 sources from the 100 that you want to believe in. That's called confirmation bias. Why should I believe the 1-2 sources you provided and ignore the others?

I think for Maxey's career, staying in Philly was his best option. Embiid and Harden have given him a ton of open looks. 93% of his threes he's been open at least 4 feet. He would've had to work a lot harder for his points here thus leading to far worse efficiency. I also don't think he would've played much here given Nurse's emphasis on defense.

I want to win championships here, in order to do so, you have to aim high. I'll take a chance with Achiuwa's upside. Combo guards with mediocre defense and passing have traditionally been a lot easier to find.

[spikeslovechild]

One sort of misnomer I wanted to point out and it's been repeated in this thread that somehow without Harden Maxey couldn't do anything. Well he played most of the year without Harden and did just fine infact he averaged 16.9 PTS, 4.8 AST, .471 FG, .398 3PT shooting.

Did his numbers increase once we got Harden? Yes. Has he gotten better looks and improved upon those numbers further? Yes. But in what world is that somehow a detriment? Should he have played worse? Some people here seem to be convinced he can only function off the ball and dependent on others to create looks like Curry did when the reality was before Harden he was essentially our PG.

I also don't really get the idea he can't get better either. He has already shown more growth then Precious has from year 1 to 2. Why would anyone believe that would change in year 3? Maxey puts the work in. I have no doubt he will continue to improve

[Los_29]

One sort of misnomer I wanted to point out and it's been repeated in this thread that somehow without Harden Maxey couldn't do anything. Well he played most of the year without Harden and did just fine infact he averaged 16.9 PTS, 4.8 AST, .471 FG, .398 3PT shooting.

Did his numbers increase once we got Harden? Yes. Has he gotten better looks and improved upon those numbers further? Yes. But in what world is that somehow a detriment? Should he have played worse? Some people here seem to be convinced he can only function off the ball and dependent on others to create looks like Curry did when the reality was before Harden he was essentially our PG.

I also don't really get the idea he can't get better either. He has already shown more growth then Precious has from year 1 to 2. Why would anyone believe that would change in year 3? Maxey puts the work in. I have no doubt he will continue to improve

I don't think anyone said he can't play at all without Harden. But it is absolutely no secret that his efficiency was considerably worse without him. He was putting up a TS% of 56% from October-January. With Harden it exploded. So when you factor everything in, is a player who's putting up 17ppg on 56% TS% with bad defense and mediocre playmaking really that valuable of a player?

No one is saying it's a detriment. People are just highlighting the fact that the numbers he's putting up are largely a result of playing with excellent players. There are tons of players that can hit 40% from three when 93% of their threes are open.

Maxey's ceiling is hindered by his size and what he's bad at. What he's bad at are extremely hard to improve on. What Precious is bad at aren't as hard. Then you factor in that Precious is 6'9, 7'2 wingspan, super athletic, can defend every position on the floor, handle the ball and was stroking the three at a near 40% clip after the all-star break. That's why he's got the higher ceiling.

[EH15]

One sort of misnomer I wanted to point out and it's been repeated in this thread that somehow without Harden Maxey couldn't do anything. Well he played most of the year without Harden and did just fine infact he averaged 16.9 PTS, 4.8 AST, .471 FG, .398 3PT shooting.

Did his numbers increase once we got Harden? Yes. Has he gotten better looks and improved upon those numbers further? Yes. But in what world is that somehow a detriment? Should he have played worse? Some people here seem to be convinced he can only function off the ball and dependent on others to create looks like Curry did when the reality was before Harden he was essentially our PG.

I also don't really get the idea he can't get better either. He has already shown more growth then Precious has from year 1 to 2. Why would anyone believe that would change in year 3? Maxey puts the work in. I have no doubt he will continue to improve

Before the Harden trade, when Embiid sat, Maxey averaged:

12 games
23.3 PPG, 3.3 RPG, 5.3 APG, 1 SPG, 1.3 TOV
50/40.4/89.7
59.7%TS, 25.8 USG, 17.3 FGA

Sixers went 4-8. Most of these games were during the Sixers covid outbreak and they were pretty much playing with their skeleton crew. Tobias simultaneously missed 5 games when Embiid sat. Sixers went 2-3 during these games without Embiid and Tobias.

[spikeslovechild]

One sort of misnomer I wanted to point out and it's been repeated in this thread that somehow without Harden Maxey couldn't do anything. Well he played most of the year without Harden and did just fine infact he averaged 16.9 PTS, 4.8 AST, .471 FG, .398 3PT shooting.

Did his numbers increase once we got Harden? Yes. Has he gotten better looks and improved upon those numbers further? Yes. But in what world is that somehow a detriment? Should he have played worse? Some people here seem to be convinced he can only function off the ball and dependent on others to create looks like Curry did when the reality was before Harden he was essentially our PG.

I also don't really get the idea he can't get better either. He has already shown more growth then Precious has from year 1 to 2. Why would anyone believe that would change in year 3? Maxey puts the work in. I have no doubt he will continue to improve

I don't think anyone said he can't play at all without Harden. But it is absolutely no secret that his efficiency was considerably worse without him. He was putting up a TS% of 56% from October-January. With Harden it exploded. So when you factor everything in, [b]is a player who's putting up 17ppg on 56% TS% with bad defense and mediocre playmaking really that valuable of a player? [/b]

No one is saying it's a detriment. People are just highlighting the fact that the numbers he's putting up are largely a result of playing with excellent players. There are tons of players that can hit 40% from three when 93% of their threes are open.

Maxey's ceiling is hindered by his size and what he's bad at. What he's bad at are extremely hard to improve on. What Precious is bad at aren't as hard. Then you factor in that Precious is 6'9, 7'2 wingspan, super athletic, can defend every position on the floor, handle the ball and was stroking the three at a near 40% clip after the all-star break. That's why he's got the higher ceiling.

But you aren't factoring everything in. You are factoring in what you want to and leaving the rest out. Irrespective of my disagreement on your evaluation of him without Harden for us it's more important to how he played with Harden which during the regular season was 18.5 Pts on .511 shooting and .462 3PT. We've all seen how he's played during the playoffs which those numbers don't even include.

Lets also not forget he is doing this all as a 21 year old. There are guys in the NBA draft top 5 projected picks like Keegan Murray who are older then he is right now. Will he ever develop into a lead guard I dunno. Just like I don't know if he would have ever improved as a playmaker (or will improve I should say) but he has time and what he does now is valuable enough as it is.

[Los_29]

One sort of misnomer I wanted to point out and it's been repeated in this thread that somehow without Harden Maxey couldn't do anything. Well he played most of the year without Harden and did just fine infact he averaged 16.9 PTS, 4.8 AST, .471 FG, .398 3PT shooting.

Did his numbers increase once we got Harden? Yes. Has he gotten better looks and improved upon those numbers further? Yes. But in what world is that somehow a detriment? Should he have played worse? Some people here seem to be convinced he can only function off the ball and dependent on others to create looks like Curry did when the reality was before Harden he was essentially our PG.

I also don't really get the idea he can't get better either. He has already shown more growth then Precious has from year 1 to 2. Why would anyone believe that would change in year 3? Maxey puts the work in. I have no doubt he will continue to improve

I don't think anyone said he can't play at all without Harden. But it is absolutely no secret that his efficiency was considerably worse without him. He was putting up a TS% of 56% from October-January. With Harden it exploded. So when you factor everything in, [b]is a player who's putting up 17ppg on 56% TS% with bad defense and mediocre playmaking really that valuable of a player? [/b]

No one is saying it's a detriment. People are just highlighting the fact that the numbers he's putting up are largely a result of playing with excellent players. There are tons of players that can hit 40% from three when 93% of their threes are open.

Maxey's ceiling is hindered by his size and what he's bad at. What he's bad at are extremely hard to improve on. What Precious is bad at aren't as hard. Then you factor in that Precious is 6'9, 7'2 wingspan, super athletic, can defend every position on the floor, handle the ball and was stroking the three at a near 40% clip after the all-star break. That's why he's got the higher ceiling.

But you aren't factoring everything in. You are factoring in what you want to and leaving the rest out. Irrespective of my disagreement on your evaluation of him without Harden for us it's more important to how he played with Harden which during the regular season was 18.5 Pts on .511 shooting and .462 3PT. We've all seen how he's played during the playoffs which those numbers don't even include.

Lets also not forget he is doing this all as a 21 year old. There are guys in the NBA draft top 5 projected picks like Keegan Murray who are older then he is right now. Will he ever develop into a lead guard I dunno. Just like I don't know if he would have ever improved as a playmaker (or will improve I should say) but he has time and what he does now is valuable enough as it is.

No one is factoring anything out. It’s been written quite clearly throughout my posts how well Maxey has played with Harden. That’s actually the point I’m trying to make. Lol.

Maxey’s shot difficulty has been extremely easy this year and what he’s been doing in the playoffs has been great but Tobias Harris has also gone off. Why do you think that is? As another poster here mentioned, there are tons of players around the league that can do what Maxey is doing right now. Our young shooting guard did it on numerous occasions this year and he didn’t have the luxury of playing with Embiid and Harden.

No one is saying Maxey is a bad player. What we are saying is that his ceiling isn’t high and I’m confident NBA executives would feel the same way. He’s an undersized combo guard who can’t defend and can’t pass and that great offensive efficiency you see is a reflection of who he’s playing with.

There is a reason why players of Maxey’s skill set traditionally don’t have a lot of value in this league.

[Los_29]

Last night showed you why Precious has the higher ceiling.

20 points, 6 rebounds, 1 assist, 1 block on 9-11 from the field and a couple threes to go along with his ability to guard every position on the floor.

Maxey was 8-18 and had as many assists as Precious Achiuwa and was hunted down on defense.

There should be very little doubt at this point.

[mihaic]

Maxey looks good because He
1. benefits from double an triple teams on Embiid and/or Harden
2. Against Toronto, Fvv played like **** in defence, last night as I was in the arena it was obvious, could not stay in front at all. When Flynn was in Maxey had zero blowbys as far as I remember.

I wonder if Fred is still injured.

[Los_29]

Maxey looks good because He
1. benefits from double an triple teams on Embiid and/or Harden
2. Against Toronto, Fvv played like **** in defence, last night as I was in the arena it was obvious, could not stay in front at all. When Flynn was in Maxey had zero blowbys as far as I remember.

I wonder if Fred is still injured.

He absolutely is still injured. 48% TS since the all-star break and his defense has been significantly worse.

I also noticed that. Flynn was pretty good on Maxey. I think Masai saw Maxey as a nice consolation prize and a player that could've slid into a nice role off the bench as a scorer. I don't think Nurse would have any hair left after watching Maxey play defense for a year though and Maxey just wouldn't be able to score as efficiently here as he can with an MVP candidate and James Harden. You're probably looking at a 53-54% TS% here with bad defense. Not a needle mover but I guess at the time it was better than nothing.

I'm stoked to see Precious next year. It will be interesting to see what he adds to his repertoire next year.

[ash_k]

He might not be John Wall-with-a-3pt-shot after all...His 3pt-shot must not have gotten the vaccine like Thybulle

[Los_29]

He might not be John Wall-with-a-3pt-shot after all...His 3pt-shot must not have gotten the vaccine like Thybulle

I like it. Who would've thought that Maxey would stop shooting 70% from the field? Is Maxey at 40% from the field with no defense really that much better than Precious? And we aren't even getting into each player's ceiling.