Official Raptors 2012 NBA Draft Thread

[DreamTeam09]

This Barnes going #1 talk scares me, b/c I want him as a raptor and no way we're coming away with the #1 pick. A Derozan Barnes combo on the wing is perfect. Especially in a lockout year.

A Miller/DeRozan combo would be really deadly

Yea I like Q.miller too, hes 2nd on my board. His form is ugly tho

[fredericklove]

This Barnes going #1 talk scares me, b/c I want him as a raptor and no way we're coming away with the #1 pick. A Derozan Barnes combo on the wing is perfect. Especially in a lockout year.

A Miller/DeRozan combo would be really deadly

Yea I like Q.miller too, hes 2nd on my board. His form is ugly tho

form is ugly but he can knock down shots., but never really seen him shoot 3s tho...

[Dr Positivity]

Barnes reminds me so much of the SF version of Demar. That's a good thing and a bad thing. People would be much harder on Demar so far in his career if he went #2 or #3 overall and had the expectations people have of Harrison Barnes. I'm expecting a solid 18/6 3rd option career for Barnes. Something like Sean Elliot's career but with more of a 3 centric focus. And by the way, SFs who are spot up 3 guys offensively and defend are way more rare than people think. Try naming 5.

I just think we need a higher upside player at this point, though. Obviously it's overestimating the draft to say Sean Elliot's career would be disappointing out of our next pick, but we're just not going to have many chances to pick top 5, this might be our last before we become a Hawks or Pacers. We have a lot of solid position players like Demar, Ed, Val, but we need a big time centerpiece. I'm in on James McAdoo and Quincy Miller, I just think they're really talented

[JamesNaismith]

^Pretty damn close to what I think too.

Barnes seems like he's going to be a very solid starter but something about him is just not screaming franchise player to me and I think it has mainly to do with his ballhandling. Everyone keeps mentioning about things like the CP3 camp to improve his handles but as I noted in another draft thread, Barnes actually attended this last year as well yet he is what he is. Of course I expect that to improve over time but like your example I would expect it to be almost like that of Demar.

Both guys I think can get better but not to the point of a truly elite wing....I also don't think McAdoo will make that leap either. He's just as robotic as Barnes with his handles. I've always loved Miller as our pick cuz he's already got an amazing ability to iso which is absolutely KEY as an elite wing (Wade, Kobe, Melo, Durant can all break down their man). Miller's form needs a little work but the fact is he is still a good shooter...mechanics is somewhat of a minor issue in comparison.

All that said I'm worried we end up with Anthony Davis cuz we like some funny looking dudes for our draft picks (Davis, DeMar and Bargnani) lmao I'm only jk plus I still might like Davis more then Barnes still split on that.

[bboyskinnylegs]

I prefer Miller, and I think probably Gilchrist as well over Barnes.

Of course, there's a lot of college ball to be played between now and the draft.

[Mr Swagtastic]

I still like Quincy Miller as the #1 option here people may trash his shot and call it ugly but whatever works for you just ask Shawn Marion he made a career of having the worst shot in the NBA.

Barnes may have the slight edge in the defensive department but I think Miller has the most upside out of the wings.

Of course I would love Drummond here in Toronto but with Bargs/Davis/Amir/Jonas V all here I can't see us picking him unless we make a trade and hopefully move Bargs or Davis or Amir for another pick and get Myck Kobango or Wooten at the point

[JamesNaismith]

Of course I would love Drummond here in Toronto but with Bargs/Davis/Amir/Jonas V all here I can't see us picking him unless we make a trade and hopefully move Bargs or Davis or Amir for another pick and get Myck Kobango or Wooten at the point

I'm doubtful that if Drummond continues to develop that any team in the lottery will have enough nerve to pass on him regardless of the situation. You don't pass up a potential franchise PF/C (*ahem Duncan and no I'm not saying their games are the same) because of the Davis' and Amirs of the world.

Just a kid with that combination of size, power and skill you don't pass on for good role players...you do exactly as you were thinking and trade one of them which in all likelyhood would be Ed Davis because of his combination of potential and age. I would personally use that pick in that imaginary scenario to get a SF because elite wings take you a lot further then PGs and there is an abundance of good young PGs in the league. I would use that 2nd pick to go after (Miller or ADavis preferably then Barnes, Gilchrist or McAdoo).

[DreamTeam09]

Ya'all are sleeping Barnes, I'll match any bet any poster wants to put up saying no freshman will go for 40pts in the tourney. Barnes led them a long way, he was ranked #1 pre season last yr and although he started slow, he took off at the end. I know he has the franchise tag based on his game, and persona alone. It takes big time talent to go get 40 in a tournament game.

[7-Day Dray]

^Pretty damn close to what I think too.

Barnes seems like he's going to be a very solid starter but something about him is just not screaming franchise player to me and I think it has mainly to do with his ballhandling. Everyone keeps mentioning about things like the CP3 camp to improve his handles but as I noted in another draft thread, Barnes actually attended this last year as well yet he is what he is. Of course I expect that to improve over time but like your example I would expect it to be almost like that of Demar.

Both guys I think can get better but not to the point of a truly elite wing....I also don't think McAdoo will make that leap either. He's just as robotic as Barnes with his handles. I've always loved Miller as our pick cuz he's already got an amazing ability to iso which is absolutely KEY as an elite wing (Wade, Kobe, Melo, Durant can all break down their man). Miller's form needs a little work but the fact is he is still a good shooter...mechanics is somewhat of a minor issue in comparison.

All that said I'm worried we end up with Anthony Davis cuz we like some funny looking dudes for our draft picks (Davis, DeMar and Bargnani) lmao I'm only jk plus I still might like Davis more then Barnes still split on that.

LMAO @ the bolded part.

[Rapsfan07]

Of course I would love Drummond here in Toronto but with Bargs/Davis/Amir/Jonas V all here I can't see us picking him unless we make a trade and hopefully move Bargs or Davis or Amir for another pick and get Myck Kobango or Wooten at the point

I'm doubtful that if Drummond continues to develop that any team in the lottery will have enough nerve to pass on him regardless of the situation. You don't pass up a potential franchise PF/C (*ahem Duncan and no I'm not saying their games are the same) because of the Davis' and Amirs of the world.

Just a kid with that combination of size, power and skill you don't pass on for good role players...you do exactly as you were thinking and trade one of them which in all likelyhood would be Ed Davis because of his combination of potential and age. I would personally use that pick in that imaginary scenario to get a SF because elite wings take you a lot further then PGs and there is an abundance of good young PGs in the league. I would use that 2nd pick to go after (Miller or ADavis preferably then Barnes, Gilchrist or McAdoo).

I agree. I don't care how many young bigs we have, you don't pass a a big as gifted at Drummond. He screams franchise player and we desperately need one. If he's on the board, you take him and move the other's later...or just move the other ones before the draft. If we could score Drummond with our pick and then Quincy that'd be awesome...I'd be willing to trade a package of Davis + top 8 2013 protected pick for him.

[fredericklove]

^Pretty damn close to what I think too.

Barnes seems like he's going to be a very solid starter but something about him is just not screaming franchise player to me and I think it has mainly to do with his ballhandling. Everyone keeps mentioning about things like the CP3 camp to improve his handles but as I noted in another draft thread, Barnes actually attended this last year as well yet he is what he is. Of course I expect that to improve over time but like your example I would expect it to be almost like that of Demar.

Both guys I think can get better but not to the point of a truly elite wing....I also don't think McAdoo will make that leap either. He's just as robotic as Barnes with his handles. I've always loved Miller as our pick cuz he's already got an amazing ability to iso which is absolutely KEY as an elite wing (Wade, Kobe, Melo, Durant can all break down their man). Miller's form needs a little work but the fact is he is still a good shooter...mechanics is somewhat of a minor issue in comparison.

All that said I'm worried we end up with Anthony Davis cuz we like some funny looking dudes for our draft picks (Davis, DeMar and Bargnani) lmao I'm only jk plus I still might like Davis more then Barnes still split on that.

Dude, what did u do to my miller sig, so blurry

[S.W.A.N]

Will be interesting to see how things turn out in college this year but as of right now

Harrison Barnes is my #1 he going to be a stud small forward and is exactly what we need.

[fredericklove]

Retrieved it from espn insider

Why Andre Drummond should go No. 1

Scouting breakdown

David Thorpe: I remember attending a high school game in December 2001, in St. Petersburg, Fla. The game featured one of the top prep players in the country against my alma mater, Seminole High School, which had a small and slow team with no one taller than 6-foot-3. The prep phenom had killed everyone all summer -- for the second year in a row -- and should have scored 50 in a cakewalk on his way to being a top five NBA draft pick the following June.

After watching him jog up and down the court, rarely showing his immense talent while his team lost to my below-average Warhawks, I laughed at the notion that a team would even think about drafting him. Apparently eight teams agreed with me in June 2002, perhaps having seen similar incidents throughout his prep career.

Today it's clear that Amare Stoudemire was just bored out of his mind in those games. Likewise, I've seen Andre Drummond jog around during games. At times, scouts will catch him standing and watching rebounds, looking alive only when the ball is in his hands. Sure, it's possible that he lacks the kind of motor a No. 1 overall pick should have, but it's more likely that he's so much better than everyone else on the court that it's hard to remain on edge.

Indeed, the landscape of NBA draft history is littered with remnants of super-talented guys with lazy streaks, everyone from Stromile Swift to Andray Blatche -- who's as talented as anyone at his position but has not come close to realizing that potential. It won't be enough for Drummond to play well, if he wants that No. 1 spot in the draft. He'll need to play with reckless abandon, destroying guys most nights and not looking cute and crafty. It's great that he likes to pass, but top overall picks need to show a disposition to dominate.

Certainly, potential drips off Drummond like beads of sweat. When compared to the rest of the possible 2012 draft class, he clearly leads in potential, with his rare combination of height, size, wingspan, build and agility matched with surprisingly adept basketball skills. Prospects usually have some or most of those assets, but not all.

The good news for Drummond is NBA scouts get to see him in action against Big East competition all year now, so there's little chance he'll be bored more than a few times all season. Scouts will get to see how hard he fights for paint touches or to deny them for his opponent. We know he can run the floor with speed, but will he consistently? He's a gifted passer in loose AAU and All-Star events, but can he thread the needle a few times a game while not committing turnovers against five focused defenders? And there is little doubt he'll be a strong in-area rebounder, simply because he's both long and strong. He has the quickness and reach to dominate out of area as well, but that requires laser-like focus and desire.

The Big East is not for unfocused, lazy players, so we'll see rather quickly how he's built internally. No longer will he be the adult playing a game of checkers against 5-year-olds. So it will not bode well for Drummond if he still exudes disinterest as the season unfolds. Even with a great attitude, teams will not be ranking Drummond above Anthony Davis or Harrison Barnes if he is not a beast on the floor.

The college game

Fran Fraschilla: As if Jim Calhoun didn't have enough talent returning from last year's national championship run. Now, he's added a 6-10 power forward in Drummond, who was thought to be the No. 1 player in the Class of 2012 before enrolling at UConn a year earlier than everyone expected.

Drummond
USA BasketballIn the Big East, Drummond's true on-court persona will be revealed.

Watching Drummond is like watchingShawn Kemp when he was in high school. For his size, Drummond is a powerful athletic presence around the rim, has excellent shot-blocking instincts and has the mobility and agility of a smaller player. While Ohio State's Jared Sullinger is the most polished big man in the country and Kentucky's Anthony Davismay be the most versatile, Drummond might be the most physically imposing.

Ultimately, while Drummond's NBA stock will be sky high based on his talent, it will also be because he will be surrounded by an experienced group of players that fit in with his strengths. He will play with one of the best backcourts in the country in Jeremy Lamb, Shabazz Napier and Ryan Boatright. And the veteranAlex Oriakhi will team with Drummond to provide the Huskies with a physical tandem inside.

If Drummond does what's expected of him this season, his stay in the Green Room at next June's NBA draft will be very, very brief.

Entering the draft

Chad Ford: As mentioned earlier, on sheer NBA potential, Drummond might be the best prospect in college basketball. He's an athletic freak with an NBA body. What NBA GM doesn't want that?

Drummond is more than just a physical specimen. He defends, rebounds, blocks shots on one end of the floor. On the other he can face the basket, take his man off the dribble and play in the post. Add in a great basketball IQ and some real passing ability out of the post and what isn't to like?

Well … that's where you start to lose GMs.

Drummond is a late addition to UConn, and his career has been shrouded in a bit of mystery. Despite immense physical abilities, he's never dominated the way his athletic abilities suggest he should. His motor has been inconsistent, he's shied away from contact in the paint and has scouts asking whether he really loves to play the game.

We saw a similar phenomenon last year with Baylor's Perry Jones. He has the talent to be a No. 1 pick, but didn't always play like one.

If Drummond can erase those doubts at UConn this season, he could leap both Davis and Barnes and grab the No. 1 spot in the draft. He's that good. But scouts will be watching his every move closely. He's going to have to convince them that he's willing to do the dirty work that it takes to succeed in the paint.

[Dr Positivity]

Yeah. It doesn't sound to me like Drummond's make up is *bad*, it's just he's not Derrick Rose or Kevin Durant upstairs. John Wall or even Lebron upstairs is probably a good comparison. I'm a bit more critical of Wall's future than some... perenniel all-star, yes. But I think there's a line in the sand between Wall and Rose mentally. Rose just puts everything into working to get better, ensuring success for his franchise, trying to read the game and dissect opponents, etc. Wall is in the Lebron zone of maybe not being as grounded or as much of a culture beacon as you'd want. Still enough for Wall and Drummond to have spectacular careers, maybe together, but it could be the difference between great player and generation defining champion

I still wouldn't dream of taking Barnes or Davis over him. That's like taking Derozan over Wall. At some point special talent is special talent and you need to take it. Especially considering we do have core workout guys like Demar and Valanciunas on our team. w/ Washington everyone would lose their crap if they get #1 but I'd be concerned about how much Wall and Drummond want to be champions instead of just big stars, personally

[fredericklove]

Yeah. It doesn't sound to me like Drummond's make up is *bad*, it's just he's not Derrick Rose or Kevin Durant upstairs. John Wall or even Lebron upstairs is probably a good comparison. I'm a bit more critical of Wall's future than some... perenniel all-star, yes. But I think there's a line in the sand between Wall and Rose mentally. Rose just puts everything into working to get better, ensuring success for his franchise, trying to read the game and dissect opponents, etc. Wall is in the Lebron zone of maybe not being as grounded or as much of a culture beacon as you'd want. Still enough for Wall and Drummond to have spectacular careers, maybe together, but it could be the difference between great player and generation defining champion

I still wouldn't dream of taking Barnes or Davis over him. That's like taking Derozan over Wall. At some point special talent is special talent and you need to take it. Especially considering we do have core workout guys like Demar and Valanciunas on our team. w/ Washington everyone would lose their crap if they get #1 but I'd be concerned about how much Wall and Drummond want to be champions instead of just big stars, personally

His makeup isn't bad, I just hope he's not going to be someone who's gonna waste his talent. Drummond, Rose, Wall and Griffin are those whole's athleticism alone can dictate the game....but I get scared if Drummond has Amare's mindset, someone who's an offensive juggernaut but doesn't work hard enough to be an all around threat. Like you said about Rose, he works insanely hard to become who he is today, but Wall could be someone like that too, he does work really hard and doesn't seem to take things for granted...he also works hard on both ends, so let's not write Wall off that fast.

I think everyone is concern about the same thing from Drummond I don't see him as KG type. If we talk about the best all around athletic PF in this decade, it has to be KG., the closest thing to prime KG is Dwight, one that uses elite athleticism and one that works super hard on both ends of the floor., envisioning Drummond as someone with advanced skillset with the absence of tough hard nose mentality (e.g KG) is like watching another Chris Bosh on our team, no more "soft" player please! And we had our moments with VC, his athleticism and skillset were off the chart but he's got lousy work ethic.

Anyways, it's still hard to pass up on a potential big time marketable talent like Drummond. We just can't.

[hops_88]

All I know is that if Tony Wrotens stock remains this low.. we better pick up a second pick and grab this kid. I am definitely on the Tony Wroten bandwagon. We need a point guard that can create badly.. and one with his gifts passing the ball, a left who can also play great defense with his size... I don't see why you don't pick him up with another top 10 pick. The NCAA season is going to be awesome this year.

[Rapsfan07]

All I know is that if Tony Wrotens stock remains this low.. we better pick up a second pick and grab this kid. I am definitely on the Tony Wroten bandwagon. We need a point guard that can create badly.. and one with his gifts passing the ball, a left who can also play great defense with his size... I don't see why you don't pick him up with another top 10 pick. The NCAA season is going to be awesome this year.

I definitely down with this. Wroten's on my sleeper list and I think if we can do a Bargnani-Gooden + pick swap at the deadline or something, I'd take him with that pick. He's a big guard that can play D, make the good pass, break down defenses and he's a lefty.

[Prestige]

Drummond + Wroten would be a dream draft..

[Mr Swagtastic]

Of course I would love Drummond here in Toronto but with Bargs/Davis/Amir/Jonas V all here I can't see us picking him unless we make a trade and hopefully move Bargs or Davis or Amir for another pick and get Myck Kobango or Wooten at the point

I'm doubtful that if Drummond continues to develop that any team in the lottery will have enough nerve to pass on him regardless of the situation. You don't pass up a potential franchise PF/C (*ahem Duncan and no I'm not saying their games are the same) because of the Davis' and Amirs of the world.

Just a kid with that combination of size, power and skill you don't pass on for good role players...you do exactly as you were thinking and trade one of them which in all likelyhood would be Ed Davis because of his combination of potential and age. I would personally use that pick in that imaginary scenario to get a SF because elite wings take you a lot further then PGs and there is an abundance of good young PGs in the league. I would use that 2nd pick to go after (Miller or ADavis preferably then Barnes, Gilchrist or McAdoo).

Yeah I didn't mean pass on him. I was going on the fact he might not want to come here like what Kanter said and Iverson said back in the day and so on and so forth. I was making the point that if we have the same influx of big men I don't think he would want to play here unless we promise him the full time PF job and that would mean we would have to sell Bargs for pennies on the dollar and Ed Davis for the best 2nd 2012 pick we could get and hope to see Myck Kobongo or Gillchrist names still off the board. That team has a lot of promise and would have some cap room to make some moves to fill the roster out. Lets hope the team sucks one more year for Shabazz Mohammad

[DreamTeam09]

NBADRAFT.NET
http://www.nbadraft.net/2012-nba-draft-preview-top-10-small-forwards

They just did a good write up on their Top 10 SF for the 2012 draft.

2. Harrison Barnes, North Carolina

The practice battles between McAdoo and Barnes have to be a sight to behold. Barnes has proven to be one of those players whose performance increases when game situation intensify. Barnes unexpectedly opted to stay in school for a second year and develop his game. The move was not unwise however; NBA teams would have picked him on talent alone but Barnes’ freshman year was inconsistent as he adapted to the stiff learning curve of the college game. The first half of his season was mediocre at best but Barnes lit up in the second half and flourished in the tournament, jumping right back into potential top overall pick discussions.

Barnes is a smooth two way player who is rapidly developing into a future star. He is 6’8”, athletic, and long and he uses his physical attributes to get his shot off against tough opponents and play stinging, opportunistic defense. He also has great court vision and has shown coaches and talent evaluators his impressive basketball IQ by developing excellent midrange playmaking ability and adding cuts and angles to his game. He is also improving his long range shot and ball-handling capabilities.

The knock on Barnes has always been that he may lack the “killer instinct” that drives superstar swingmen like Kobe Bryant. He is too much of “nice guy” in the eyes of some scouts. But if his clutch tournament outbursts are any indication, that killer instinct may actually be there after all.

3. Quincy Miller, Baylor

Miller has the best offensive arsenal of any forward in the 2012 draft. He can break oppoents down off the dribble with tremendous height and length, which has drawn some comparisons to Kevin Durant. He has standout physical attributes with a high basketball IQ and exceptional ability to score almost at will.

However, Miller needs to bulk up and add stamina to become a top NBA prospect. He also needs to tweak his shot some as his low release point will make it difficult to get shots against elite level athletes. He's coming off an ACL injury which puts his status in question. And some feel he will need a second year in college to truly get back to form physically. But, if he can embrace playing defense and adding strength, Miller has All Star potential.

Those tow had the best write ups imo. I still think the player we need to leave out of this draft with is Barnes. He's definitely what you consider athletic and his jumper is what seperates him from all these other SF.

I wouldn't mind Miller at all tho.