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0 reason to trade Siakam unless someone offers a star-studded package. He's our guy.

Not interested in trading a 27/28 year old two way versatile allstar big who has arms from here to Europe. Pascal just need a Batman aka Kawhi to lead the charge and he’s an amazing #2.

RoyceDa59 wrote:Not interested in trading a 27/28 year old two way versatile allstar big who has arms from here to Europe. Pascal just need a Batman aka Kawhi to lead the charge and he’s an amazing #2.

Just need a #1 without trading the #2.

Beal!!!!! How to get Beal?

If Phoenix loses to Dallas, trade Pascal to Phoenix for Ayton and three 1st picks. Trade FVV or (Trent and Flynn) and 5-6 1st picks for Beal.

Psubs wrote:

RoyceDa59 wrote:Not interested in trading a 27/28 year old two way versatile allstar big who has arms from here to Europe. Pascal just need a Batman aka Kawhi to lead the charge and he’s an amazing #2.

Just need a #1 without trading the #2.

Beal!!!!! How to get Beal?

If Phoenix loses to Dallas, trade Pascal to Phoenix for Ayton and three 1st picks. Trade FVV or (Trent and Flynn) and 5-6 1st picks for Beal.

Beal is not the answer.

To me we did a bad job last 2-3 seasons after draft because we were waiting on the Giannis pipe dream and then KLow sign and trade both of those meant we were left with whatever no one else wants or Baynes, Svi and Bonga ect.
Needs Shooting: I’m hopeful that Barnes, PS, Chris B and PA all can be more consistent than last year. Even if 2/4 are that way it will help. I think we need to get a guard that is 33+% from 3 that NN can trust so FVV plays less and is very good from 3 all year instead of up to Allstar break.
Playmaking if the guard above off bench in 20-24 mpg can give you 4 assists awesome.
Bigger C so SB and OG play less C and don’t wear down as much. SB can play some pG and OG can play some SG. I want all of their mins in the 1-4 spots except first 5 at C for SB.

I would like one year to keep most of the Core except maybe Thad moves if we can’t pay him enough. Draft someone that can help one of the 3 above just 14-19 mins per game would do it. Then from the jump sign good FA that help the other needs areas above.
There are several Vet guards we could get for small raises if they opt out.

Psubs wrote:

RoyceDa59 wrote:Not interested in trading a 27/28 year old two way versatile allstar big who has arms from here to Europe. Pascal just need a Batman aka Kawhi to lead the charge and he’s an amazing #2.

Just need a #1 without trading the #2.

Beal!!!!! How to get Beal?

If Phoenix loses to Dallas, trade Pascal to Phoenix for Ayton and three 1st picks. Trade FVV or (Trent and Flynn) and 5-6 1st picks for Beal.

i don't know about Ayton, but that Beal offer is terrible for us.

Raptors just need a one.

They’re the easiest thing to get.

Steelo Green wrote:Raptors just need a one.

They’re the easiest thing to get.

Do you think Scottie can become a #1?

I think we should remain patient and wait for a Kawhi like player to be available again.

We got some nice valuable assets and maybe a star in Scottie Barnes.

Let's keep winning and making the team better and be patient

Los_29 wrote:

WaltFrazier wrote:

OakleyDokely wrote:Unless something big falls into their lap, they will likely come back with the same core, maybe with a bench addition or two and they see how things play out next season. If they take a step back or they underachieve then maybe they look to move GTJ or VV, like they did with Norm prior to his free agency.

I really don't expect anything major this offseason beyond the use of their MLE.

I think you're right, but it's a very depressing prospect to me. The only hope is that the "bench addition or two" turn out very impactful. If the FO adds mediocrity as they have in the past few years, then we won't take a big step forward. We need 2 home run additions to the core. Internal improvement will be nice, and expected, but not enough.

We lost in first round and could have won that series. It's not about development anymore it's about 2nd round or better.

Internal development is how teams win in this league. You don't get anywhere this league by throwing money at guys like Richaun Holmes or Luke Kennard. You have to develop talent internally like we have done the past decade. If we didn't develop talent internally we'd have zero championships right now.

Remember, this league has a salary cap. Cap management is critically important in this league.

And we could have won that series but we can't control injuries. Injuries happen.

And what do you mean it's not about development? That is literally all that it's about. LOL. And of course it's not 2nd round or better. We weren't even expected to make the playoffs this year. We had 4 rotation players that are 24 and younger. C'mon Walt.

Not ONLY about development, I should have said. But it's time to win too. Of course development in the sense of improving individual and team play carries on. But many here throw around the phrase development year as if to say, doesn't matter if we win or not, it's a development year anyway. A losing mentality.

What we were"expected" to do by pundits means nothing, we had the talent to do what we did do. Or better with a break or two. The right bench piece additions could definitely help us go one round further. Boston for example had internal development but also made important offseason and deadline moves, Horford, Theis, White. We need to add better pieces than Svi and Bonga

Madhouse wrote:

WaltFrazier wrote:

Madhouse wrote: Yes, basically. He is a very good player overall.

Posters throw around terms like good, very good, great as if they are precise factual terms. They are vague, subjective words that don't mean the same to everyone.

Top 5 or 10 or 20 is still subjective, but better. If Pascal is named 3rd team all NBA as he should be, that's top 15. If he's not named because of Canada, but we all know he belongs there, same thing. We aren't trading a player of that level, who Masai loves and Nurse raves about his early to the gym work ethic.

Just because he is 3rd team All-NBA doesn't make him a legit top 15 player.

It just means the parameters with guards/forwards/Centers fit for him in that specific year and he had a good season.

Given those parameters he's still certainly top 20 minimum. And could be 15

WaltFrazier wrote:

Los_29 wrote:

WaltFrazier wrote:I think you're right, but it's a very depressing prospect to me. The only hope is that the "bench addition or two" turn out very impactful. If the FO adds mediocrity as they have in the past few years, then we won't take a big step forward. We need 2 home run additions to the core. Internal improvement will be nice, and expected, but not enough.

We lost in first round and could have won that series. It's not about development anymore it's about 2nd round or better.

Internal development is how teams win in this league. You don't get anywhere this league by throwing money at guys like Richaun Holmes or Luke Kennard. You have to develop talent internally like we have done the past decade. If we didn't develop talent internally we'd have zero championships right now.

Remember, this league has a salary cap. Cap management is critically important in this league.

And we could have won that series but we can't control injuries. Injuries happen.

And what do you mean it's not about development? That is literally all that it's about. LOL. And of course it's not 2nd round or better. We weren't even expected to make the playoffs this year. We had 4 rotation players that are 24 and younger. C'mon Walt.

Not ONLY about development, I should have said. But it's time to win too. Of course development in the sense of improving individual and team play carries on. But many here throw around the phrase development year as if to say, doesn't matter if we win or not, it's a development year anyway. A losing mentality.

What we were"expected" to do by pundits means nothing, we had the talent to do what we did do. Or better with a break or two. The right bench piece additions could definitely help us go one round further. Boston for example had internal development but also made important offseason and deadline moves, Horford, Theis, White. We need to add better pieces than Svi and Bonga

“It’s time to win.” We won 48 games this year after losing half our championship roster from 2019.

Didn’t we make the playoffs? And didn’t Masai say it was a development year? If we had a losing mentality why did we make the playoffs?

Boston has been together for 6 years and traded their future for Horford and White. And Theis? Really? The guy playing 10 minutes a game? Are you watching the playoffs? He’s getting killed out there.

This is a bizarre take Walt.

Los_29 wrote:

WaltFrazier wrote:

Los_29 wrote:
Internal development is how teams win in this league. You don't get anywhere this league by throwing money at guys like Richaun Holmes or Luke Kennard. You have to develop talent internally like we have done the past decade. If we didn't develop talent internally we'd have zero championships right now.

Remember, this league has a salary cap. Cap management is critically important in this league.

And we could have won that series but we can't control injuries. Injuries happen.

And what do you mean it's not about development? That is literally all that it's about. LOL. And of course it's not 2nd round or better. We weren't even expected to make the playoffs this year. We had 4 rotation players that are 24 and younger. C'mon Walt.

Not ONLY about development, I should have said. But it's time to win too. Of course development in the sense of improving individual and team play carries on. But many here throw around the phrase development year as if to say, doesn't matter if we win or not, it's a development year anyway. A losing mentality.

What we were"expected" to do by pundits means nothing, we had the talent to do what we did do. Or better with a break or two. The right bench piece additions could definitely help us go one round further. Boston for example had internal development but also made important offseason and deadline moves, Horford, Theis, White. We need to add better pieces than Svi and Bonga

“It’s time to win.” We won 48 games this year after losing half our championship roster from 2019.

Didn’t we make the playoffs? And didn’t Masai say it was a development year? If we had a losing mentality why did we make the playoffs?

Boston has been together for 6 years and traded their future for Horford and White. And Theis? Really? The guy playing 10 minutes a game? Are you watching the playoffs? He’s getting killed out there.

This is a bizarre take Walt.

Keep twisting and misinterpreting. Time to win means win more next year than this year. Not go all in yet, I said that initially. No Kawhi trade. Keep the core. But do better in adding rotation bench pieces. I hope Barnes makes the jump we all hope, Achiuwa, even Banton. But we still need more to really take a step up in the playoffs. Fred said shooting and size would be good. I agree with Fred. Masai said he was looking too. He may have thought development only in preseason but when we were winning he pivoted to getting a veteran at deadline.

Development as in continued improvement, and adding pieces who can actually contribute, are not mutually exclusive. No need to set up this false dichotomy.

Boston has a young core Tatum, Brown, R. Williams, Smart and more. They've a chance to win now and the next few years. Their future is just fine.

WaltFrazier wrote:

Los_29 wrote:

WaltFrazier wrote:Not ONLY about development, I should have said. But it's time to win too. Of course development in the sense of improving individual and team play carries on. But many here throw around the phrase development year as if to say, doesn't matter if we win or not, it's a development year anyway. A losing mentality.

What we were"expected" to do by pundits means nothing, we had the talent to do what we did do. Or better with a break or two. The right bench piece additions could definitely help us go one round further. Boston for example had internal development but also made important offseason and deadline moves, Horford, Theis, White. We need to add better pieces than Svi and Bonga

“It’s time to win.” We won 48 games this year after losing half our championship roster from 2019.

Didn’t we make the playoffs? And didn’t Masai say it was a development year? If we had a losing mentality why did we make the playoffs?

Boston has been together for 6 years and traded their future for Horford and White. And Theis? Really? The guy playing 10 minutes a game? Are you watching the playoffs? He’s getting killed out there.

This is a bizarre take Walt.

Keep twisting and misinterpreting. Time to win means win more next year than this year. Not go all in yet, I said that initially. No Kawhi trade. Keep the core. But do better in adding rotation bench pieces. I hope Barnes makes the jump we all hope, Achiuwa, even Banton. But we still need more to really take a step up in the playoffs. Fred said shooting and size would be good. I agree with Fred. Masai said he was looking too. He may have thought development only in preseason but when we were winning he pivoted to getting a veteran at deadline.

Development as in continued improvement, and adding pieces who can actually contribute, are not mutually exclusive. No need to set up this false dichotomy.

Boston has a young core Tatum, Brown, R. Williams, Smart and more. They've a chance to win now and the next few years. Their future is just fine.

I didn't say Boston's future is bleak. They traded their FRP's though for Horford and White and their core has been together for 6 years.

When did I say we shouldn't try to win more than 48 games. I legitimately don't even know what you're trying to say. You just said our young guys are going to improve. If our young guys improve and we stay healthy then why would we win less than 48 games? You don't think an improved Scottie, GTJ, Precious, OG, a healthy Fred plus Pascal is enough to beat the team we just faced in the playoffs? We went 6 games against a team in which Scottie missed 3 games, GTJ was sick for 2 games, Fred was injured for 4 and then missed the last 2 games.

If you don't think our young guys are going to get better then we are likely going to win the same amount of games or less. If you think our guys are going to get better then we should win more than 48 games especially if we stay healthy.

I'm not opposed to adding a bench piece to this team. I'm not opposed to anything. But it has to make sense. Remember, Masai and the front office want to win championships. That's the ultimate goal. Just getting to the 2nd round isn't their goal.

Los_29 wrote:

WaltFrazier wrote:

Los_29 wrote:
“It’s time to win.” We won 48 games this year after losing half our championship roster from 2019.

Didn’t we make the playoffs? And didn’t Masai say it was a development year? If we had a losing mentality why did we make the playoffs?

Boston has been together for 6 years and traded their future for Horford and White. And Theis? Really? The guy playing 10 minutes a game? Are you watching the playoffs? He’s getting killed out there.

This is a bizarre take Walt.

Keep twisting and misinterpreting. Time to win means win more next year than this year. Not go all in yet, I said that initially. No Kawhi trade. Keep the core. But do better in adding rotation bench pieces. I hope Barnes makes the jump we all hope, Achiuwa, even Banton. But we still need more to really take a step up in the playoffs. Fred said shooting and size would be good. I agree with Fred. Masai said he was looking too. He may have thought development only in preseason but when we were winning he pivoted to getting a veteran at deadline.

Development as in continued improvement, and adding pieces who can actually contribute, are not mutually exclusive. No need to set up this false dichotomy.

Boston has a young core Tatum, Brown, R. Williams, Smart and more. They've a chance to win now and the next few years. Their future is just fine.

I didn't say Boston's future is bleak. They traded their FRP's though for Horford and White and their core has been together for 6 years.

When did I say we shouldn't try to win more than 48 games. I legitimately don't even know what you're trying to say. You just said our young guys are going to improve. If our young guys improve and we stay healthy then why would we win less than 48 games? You don't think an improved Scottie, GTJ, Precious, OG, a healthy Fred plus Pascal is enough to beat the team we just faced in the playoffs? We went 6 games against a team in which Scottie missed 3 games, GTJ was sick for 2 games, Fred was injured for 4 and then missed the last 2 games.

If you don't think our young guys are going to get better then we are likely going to win the same amount of games or less. If you think our guys are going to get better then we should win more than 48 games especially if we stay healthy.

I'm not opposed to adding a bench piece to this team. I'm not opposed to anything. But it has to make sense. Remember, Masai and the front office want to win championships. That's the ultimate goal. Just getting to the 2nd round isn't their goal.

I forget but I think I was originally reacting to someone else's post? Which sounded to me like advocating standing pat just rely on developing. As for added pieces making sense, well that's what we assume Masai and co. are going to do. I'm hoping for successful adds of things we need, not more Svi and Bonga. I guess that's one of my points, proven young vets not long term prospects.

And second round of course is not the ultimate goal but surely it's the next step after this year, not to say we couldn't do even better. Aside from next season having horrible luck with injuries, you wouldn't be happy with 8th place and losing the play-in would you?

Madhouse wrote:

TheBoi10 wrote:

anotherhomer wrote:
Tear it down. Rebuild. Tank /s

Kinda...Siakam fits well with Scottie and is a real impact player on-ball, we should keep him. But it'd be a disaster to pay real star money to an aging FVV and $20 mill+ to GTJ. Masai and Bobby need to get on the phones.

Nothing will happen.

They will simply run it back and look to improve while knowing they have zero shot at a title without a superstar.

it's not the worst thing to run it back, knowing this team will make and compete in the playoffs

Here's the problem with Siakam: he's just not at the level of the best guys in the Eastern Conference (Giannis, Embiid, and Tatum) and all of them are capable of defending him effectively one on one.

He's the same age as Embiid, a little older than Giannis, and much older than Tatum so there's every expectation that the Raptors are a second round and out team at best for the foreseeable future short of a big jump from Scottie or Masai miraculously finding another diamond in the rough. It will be very hard to seriously challenge the Bucks, 76ers, and Celtics over the next few seasons.

I agree with Boston did.

Trading the picks suck but was necessarily to correct previous mistakes

id trade him for ivey. If Portland jumps into the top 3 and Ivey is available, id make that move. I think they would too

WaltFrazier wrote:

Los_29 wrote:

WaltFrazier wrote:Keep twisting and misinterpreting. Time to win means win more next year than this year. Not go all in yet, I said that initially. No Kawhi trade. Keep the core. But do better in adding rotation bench pieces. I hope Barnes makes the jump we all hope, Achiuwa, even Banton. But we still need more to really take a step up in the playoffs. Fred said shooting and size would be good. I agree with Fred. Masai said he was looking too. He may have thought development only in preseason but when we were winning he pivoted to getting a veteran at deadline.

Development as in continued improvement, and adding pieces who can actually contribute, are not mutually exclusive. No need to set up this false dichotomy.

Boston has a young core Tatum, Brown, R. Williams, Smart and more. They've a chance to win now and the next few years. Their future is just fine.

I didn't say Boston's future is bleak. They traded their FRP's though for Horford and White and their core has been together for 6 years.

When did I say we shouldn't try to win more than 48 games. I legitimately don't even know what you're trying to say. You just said our young guys are going to improve. If our young guys improve and we stay healthy then why would we win less than 48 games? You don't think an improved Scottie, GTJ, Precious, OG, a healthy Fred plus Pascal is enough to beat the team we just faced in the playoffs? We went 6 games against a team in which Scottie missed 3 games, GTJ was sick for 2 games, Fred was injured for 4 and then missed the last 2 games.

If you don't think our young guys are going to get better then we are likely going to win the same amount of games or less. If you think our guys are going to get better then we should win more than 48 games especially if we stay healthy.

I'm not opposed to adding a bench piece to this team. I'm not opposed to anything. But it has to make sense. Remember, Masai and the front office want to win championships. That's the ultimate goal. Just getting to the 2nd round isn't their goal.

I forget but I think I was originally reacting to someone else's post? Which sounded to me like advocating standing pat just rely on developing. As for added pieces making sense, well that's what we assume Masai and co. are going to do. I'm hoping for successful adds of things we need, not more Svi and Bonga. I guess that's one of my points, proven young vets not long term prospects.

And second round of course is not the ultimate goal but surely it's the next step after this year, not to say we couldn't do even better. Aside from next season having horrible luck with injuries, you wouldn't be happy with 8th place and losing the play-in would you?

If you don’t want this team to sign players like Svi and Bonga then you’re going to be sorely disappointed because every team makes these kinds of signings to round out their roster. As I mentioned earlier, this is a salary cap league. I’d love to be able to just sign Jarret Allen and Lonzo Ball but there is a salary cap and we need to adhere by it. As a result this team will continue developing players as that’s what the best teams in the league do. If there is a player we can acquire at the right price I’m all for it. But it has to be at the right price.

Proven young vets? Who do you have in mind? And do you think these players are cheap to get?

And no, not everything is linear. Maybe we lose in the first round next year but Scottie, Precious and GTJ play more of a role offensively. Like I said, ultimate goal is the championship. You have to look at the bigger picture.

And of course I wouldn’t be happy with 8th place. When did I say I would?