Will Masai Tank 4 Flagg?

[ItsDanger]

I'm not convinced he tanked this season...

Our best player got injured (Scottie) & then our best defender got injured (Yak) -- that alone made us one of the worst teams just by the numbers. But then there was unforeseen personal tragedies for both RJ & IQ that had them out. Now if we have some very "loosely defined injuries" next year as they did ONCE for Scottie that keep in mind MOST IMPORTANTLY happened during Covid when MLSE COULDN'T profit on the season NOT BY THEIR OWN CHOICE. The franchise literally had nothing to lose.

And then somehow the anti-tank argument was "we were never going to outtank the bottom 3"
"we never had a chance at wemby in the first place". Yeah no **** sherlock.
The other organizations planned their timeline on landing that once in a generation player. While we always half assed-ly pivot around in response to bad occurrences in shortsighted-ness.

The other team's planned their timeline on a 12% chance of landing Wemby? But Masai was "crazy" to plan his timeline on signing Giannis because the odds of us signing him were low. Were the odds of signing giannis less than 12%? I highly doubt it.

What kind of business man says "let's spend the next 2 years bottoming out because we will end up having a 1 in 10 chance for a opportunity that MIGHT set us up for success"?

A venture capitalist.

[OakleyDokely]

a broke venture capitalist.

[Clutch0z24]

Its fun to see some posters here after watching about 4 years of the team not being good enough having failures after failures expect us to be good this upcoming year with literally no real ways to improve on the roster that drastically.

As much as people liked to hate on FVV he was one of the reasons we had a respectable record. Yes it was middling and going no where with FVV but he still added Ws to the record alongside OG/Siakam/Barnes/Poeltl....That team on paper was a "play in" type of team...

Not the one we had the last half of the year or the one we are about to have this upcoming year....Lose FVV/OG/Siakam and add IQ/Barrett/Olynyk/Brown...Thats a big time drop off in terms of getting NBA Ws in the reg season.

As much as i like IQ/Barrett they are not as good as OG/Siakam was and losing FVV for nothing made us drop in the talent gap...

All the posters saying no way Masai tanks...Well imo its a pretty much made choice for us as we will not improve in the offseason enough to add enough talent to be a winning team...Will we be a bottom of the barrell team...Prolly not but we will be hovering in that mix in the top 5-6 just like last season...

Flagg/Bailey are very much in play for us next season whether MLSE or any of the fans like it or not....We just lack the talent

[ArthurVandelay]

Its fun to see some posters here after watching about 4 years of the team not being good enough having failures after failures expect us to be good this upcoming year with literally no real ways to improve on the roster that drastically.

As much as people liked to hate on FVV he was one of the reasons we had a respectable record. Yes it was middling and going no where with FVV but he still added Ws to the record alongside OG/Siakam/Barnes/Poeltl....That team on paper was a "play in" type of team...

Not the one we had the last half of the year or the one we are about to have this upcoming year....Lose FVV/OG/Siakam and add IQ/Barrett/Olynyk/Brown...Thats a big time drop off in terms of getting NBA Ws in the reg season.

As much as i like IQ/Barrett they are not as good as OG/Siakam was and losing FVV for nothing made us drop in the talent gap...

All the posters saying no way Masai tanks...Well imo its a pretty much made choice for us as we will not improve in the offseason enough to add enough talent to be a winning team...Will we be a bottom of the barrell team...Prolly not but we will be hovering in that mix in the top 5-6 just like last season...

Flagg/Bailey are very much in play for us next season whether MLSE or any of the fans like it or not....We just lack the talent

It’s not a question of tanking. It’s about being good enough. The team isn’t there yet and there shouldn’t be a short-sighted rush to get there either.

Masai will need his A game this off-season and next.

2025-2026. That’s when the team should be returning to league relevance again.

[Chandan]

And then somehow the anti-tank argument was "we were never going to outtank the bottom 3"
"we never had a chance at wemby in the first place". Yeah no **** sherlock.
The other organizations planned their timeline on landing that once in a generation player. While we always half assed-ly pivot around in response to bad occurrences in shortsighted-ness.

The other team's planned their timeline on a 12% chance of landing Wemby? But Masai was "crazy" to plan his timeline on signing Giannis because the odds of us signing him were low. Were the odds of signing giannis less than 12%? I highly doubt it.

https://raptorsrapture.com/2022/11/15/giannis-antetokounmpo-never-play-toronto-raptors/

On former Raptor Serge Ibaka’s YouTube show, Giannis put all those fantasies to bed emphatically.

In an appearance on Ibaka’s “How Hungry Are You?” show, Antetokounmpo said that it’s “false” he would ever consider playing for the Raptors. Unfortunately, the 0.5% chance of Giannis leaving Milwaukee and coming to the Raptors has been reduced to 0%. Bummer.

Sounded like he was never a fan of playing for toronto. what's crazy is the GM being taken for a ride by the guy who he supposedly had a deep connection to.

[ForeverTFC]

And then somehow the anti-tank argument was "we were never going to outtank the bottom 3"
"we never had a chance at wemby in the first place". Yeah no **** sherlock.
The other organizations planned their timeline on landing that once in a generation player. While we always half assed-ly pivot around in response to bad occurrences in shortsighted-ness.

The other team's planned their timeline on a 12% chance of landing Wemby? But Masai was "crazy" to plan his timeline on signing Giannis because the odds of us signing him were low. Were the odds of signing giannis less than 12%? I highly doubt it.

https://raptorsrapture.com/2022/11/15/giannis-antetokounmpo-never-play-toronto-raptors/

On former Raptor Serge Ibaka’s YouTube show, Giannis put all those fantasies to bed emphatically.

In an appearance on Ibaka’s “How Hungry Are You?” show, Antetokounmpo said that it’s “false” he would ever consider playing for the Raptors. Unfortunately, the 0.5% chance of Giannis leaving Milwaukee and coming to the Raptors has been reduced to 0%. Bummer.

Sounded like he was never a fan of playing for toronto. what's crazy is the GM being taken for a ride by the guy who he supposedly had a deep connection to.

Yeah. Because the guy under contract with the Milwaukee Bucks, who has built his brand on loyalty and being a low maintenance superstar - is going to say there/was a chance he would leave his team.

Chris Bosh released a documentary that started with the lyrics "Rep TDot till they bury me". He walked less than a year later and said the city smells weird.

[ForeverTFC]

And then somehow the anti-tank argument was "we were never going to outtank the bottom 3"
"we never had a chance at wemby in the first place". Yeah no **** sherlock.
The other organizations planned their timeline on landing that once in a generation player. While we always half assed-ly pivot around in response to bad occurrences in shortsighted-ness.

The other team's planned their timeline on a 12% chance of landing Wemby? But Masai was "crazy" to plan his timeline on signing Giannis because the odds of us signing him were low. Were the odds of signing giannis less than 12%? I highly doubt it.

What kind of business man says "let's spend the next 2 years bottoming out because we will end up having a 1 in 10 chance for a opportunity that MIGHT set us up for success"?

A venture capitalist.

As I'm sure you know, venture capitalist place a large number of bets and hit on a very small minority of them, with a handful of hits driving their entire returns.

Unfortunately, a basketball executive can only place a handful of bets on the getting the first pick that + hoping that pick turns into a star.

[Clutch0z24]

Its fun to see some posters here after watching about 4 years of the team not being good enough having failures after failures expect us to be good this upcoming year with literally no real ways to improve on the roster that drastically.

As much as people liked to hate on FVV he was one of the reasons we had a respectable record. Yes it was middling and going no where with FVV but he still added Ws to the record alongside OG/Siakam/Barnes/Poeltl....That team on paper was a "play in" type of team...

Not the one we had the last half of the year or the one we are about to have this upcoming year....Lose FVV/OG/Siakam and add IQ/Barrett/Olynyk/Brown...Thats a big time drop off in terms of getting NBA Ws in the reg season.

As much as i like IQ/Barrett they are not as good as OG/Siakam was and losing FVV for nothing made us drop in the talent gap...

All the posters saying no way Masai tanks...Well imo its a pretty much made choice for us as we will not improve in the offseason enough to add enough talent to be a winning team...Will we be a bottom of the barrell team...Prolly not but we will be hovering in that mix in the top 5-6 just like last season...

Flagg/Bailey are very much in play for us next season whether MLSE or any of the fans like it or not....We just lack the talent

It’s not a question of tanking. It’s about being good enough. The team isn’t there yet and there shouldn’t be a short-sighted rush to get there either.

Masai will need his A game this off-season and next.

2025-2026. That’s when the team should be returning to league relevance again.

Yep i just don't get some of the people here that are not down for trying to go for a Flagg/Bailey...Or any other of the prospects in the upcoming draft....Imagine how good of a situation we would be in if we added another Barnes level prospect to the team...

Having IQ/Barrett/Barnes/Dick + Another Barnes level prospect...That would be exciting as heck to watch grow...I believe Barrett/IQ have alot more growth in the future imagine having Barnes and lets say a Banchero level added to the mix...

Now that would be something worth getting excited about.

[disoblige]

Next year is a really good draft class base on many reports.

[wegotthabeet]

And then somehow the anti-tank argument was "we were never going to outtank the bottom 3"
"we never had a chance at wemby in the first place". Yeah no **** sherlock.
The other organizations planned their timeline on landing that once in a generation player. While we always half assed-ly pivot around in response to bad occurrences in shortsighted-ness.

The other team's planned their timeline on a 12% chance of landing Wemby? But Masai was "crazy" to plan his timeline on signing Giannis because the odds of us signing him were low. Were the odds of signing giannis less than 12%? I highly doubt it.

What kind of business man says "let's spend the next 2 years bottoming out because we will end up having a 1 in 10 chance for a opportunity that MIGHT set us up for success"?

A venture capitalist.

a VC places the same bet 10 times hoping to hit once, but hit so big that it makes up for the other 9 misses. they don't take 1 10% chance, so it's not quite the same.

basically Hinkie was the closest thing to a VC as a GM.

[Chandan]

Next year is a really good draft class base on many reports.

Good draft you say...?

[Potential]

I doubt we even tank next year. Hopefully Bobsai can trade the pick for some wing depth. Don't mind a guy like Jeremy Grant or Pat Connaughton

[Chuck Everett]

Team looks like a bottom-10 just based on the current roster. Things can change, but IMO, this core doesn't seem like they could absorb any injuries that knocks a key piece out for 10-15 games. Right now, they're no longer an oversized team, but the bigs (not including Scottie since he's a versatile SF/PF) they do have are either zeros on offense (Poeltl outside of screens) or zeros on defense (Olynyk). They could use a big athlete manning the 5 (like Derrick Lively II) and a good-sized SF (like Herb Jones/Trey Murphy/Keegan Murray/Tari Eason)

I also find myself intrigued by Asa Newell (going to Georgia this fall). I think he may end up having a Brandon Miller type freshman year in the SEC.

[Gavin_TDThree]

if there's a time to soft tank this is it

I said it in another thread, however if we move BB and JP for pick/prospects, we will end up in the bottom 5-7 of the league. Little lottery luck and we will be drafting in the top 3 and grabbing a franchise altering talent to pair with scottie


We aren't going full "trust the process" and stripping it to the bones. But a starting lineup of IQ, RJ, GD, SB, 2024 1st round pick. That team is fun to watch but doesn't win a lot, at least not yet.

Teams that will be worse than us:

Wizards, enough said
Portland
Hornets - who knows, maybe miller is legit, Ball is healthy and they win a few more game. Most likely still worse than us

Teams that will improve:
Spurs - I think are going to surprise a lot of people this year and not be as bad
Detroit wants to get better by all accounts


So 3 teams will 100% out tank us and two others who I think will likely out tank us but we may see improvement.

Reasonably we could find our way to the bottom 5.

Just seems like if there's going to be a year to tank, this is it

[Scase]

Lay it out. What's your plan to 25 wins?

Hawks just won the lottery with the 10th best odds. They won 36 games.
Rockets just jumped into the top 3 despite winning 41 games in a tough western conference last year.

You don't have to be a bottom 5 team to be considered a part of the sweepstakes.

So since ppl are expecting to be a play-in team anyway, the idea here is to do nothing and hope for Hawks-like odds? (3%).

Didn't you know that tanking and hoping to win the lotto is stupid, but being a treadmill team and hoping for a 3% chance to win is smart. Some of you will never understand these big brain concepts, so just stop trying smdh.

[YogurtProducer]

Hawks just won the lottery with the 10th best odds. They won 36 games.
Rockets just jumped into the top 3 despite winning 41 games in a tough western conference last year.

You don't have to be a bottom 5 team to be considered a part of the sweepstakes.

So since ppl are expecting to be a play-in team anyway, the idea here is to do nothing and hope for Hawks-like odds? (3%).

Didn't you know that tanking and hoping to win the lotto is stupid, but being a treadmill team and hoping for a 3% chance to win is smart. Some of you will never understand these big brain concepts, so just stop trying smdh.

The inability to see the pros and cons of both sides is the problem here.

Worse team / better odds VS better team / worse odds.

[Scase]

Its fun to see some posters here after watching about 4 years of the team not being good enough having failures after failures expect us to be good this upcoming year with literally no real ways to improve on the roster that drastically.

As much as people liked to hate on FVV he was one of the reasons we had a respectable record. Yes it was middling and going no where with FVV but he still added Ws to the record alongside OG/Siakam/Barnes/Poeltl....That team on paper was a "play in" type of team...

Not the one we had the last half of the year or the one we are about to have this upcoming year....Lose FVV/OG/Siakam and add IQ/Barrett/Olynyk/Brown...Thats a big time drop off in terms of getting NBA Ws in the reg season.

As much as i like IQ/Barrett they are not as good as OG/Siakam was and losing FVV for nothing made us drop in the talent gap...

All the posters saying no way Masai tanks...Well imo its a pretty much made choice for us as we will not improve in the offseason enough to add enough talent to be a winning team...Will we be a bottom of the barrell team...Prolly not but we will be hovering in that mix in the top 5-6 just like last season...

Flagg/Bailey are very much in play for us next season whether MLSE or any of the fans like it or not....We just lack the talent

It’s not a question of tanking. It’s about being good enough. The team isn’t there yet and there shouldn’t be a short-sighted rush to get there either.

Masai will need his A game this off-season and next.

2025-2026. That’s when the team should be returning to league relevance again.

Yep i just don't get some of the people here that are not down for trying to go for a Flagg/Bailey...Or any other of the prospects in the upcoming draft....Imagine how good of a situation we would be in if we added another Barnes level prospect to the team...

Having IQ/Barrett/Barnes/Dick + Another Barnes level prospect...That would be exciting as heck to watch grow...I believe Barrett/IQ have alot more growth in the future imagine having Barnes and lets say a Banchero level added to the mix...

Now that would be something worth getting excited about.

Can I interest you in another 10-14 pick?

[Clutch0z24]

It’s not a question of tanking. It’s about being good enough. The team isn’t there yet and there shouldn’t be a short-sighted rush to get there either.

Masai will need his A game this off-season and next.

2025-2026. That’s when the team should be returning to league relevance again.

Yep i just don't get some of the people here that are not down for trying to go for a Flagg/Bailey...Or any other of the prospects in the upcoming draft....Imagine how good of a situation we would be in if we added another Barnes level prospect to the team...

Having IQ/Barrett/Barnes/Dick + Another Barnes level prospect...That would be exciting as heck to watch grow...I believe Barrett/IQ have alot more growth in the future imagine having Barnes and lets say a Banchero level added to the mix...

Now that would be something worth getting excited about.

Can I interest you in another 10-14 pick?

We won't be that good to be that low in the draft lottery....If we are a 10-14 pick that means we won 30 or just above 30 games....We are as constructed 20 -25 win team at best...That would be top 6

[ArthurVandelay]

if there's a time to soft tank this is it

I said it in another thread, however if we move BB and JP for pick/prospects, we will end up in the bottom 5-7 of the league. Little lottery luck and we will be drafting in the top 3 and grabbing a franchise altering talent to pair with scottie


We aren't going full "trust the process" and stripping it to the bones. But a starting lineup of IQ, RJ, GD, SB, 2024 1st round pick. That team is fun to watch but doesn't win a lot, at least not yet.

Teams that will be worse than us:

Wizards, enough said
Portland
Hornets - who knows, maybe miller is legit, Ball is healthy and they win a few more game. Most likely still worse than us

Teams that will improve:
Spurs - I think are going to surprise a lot of people this year and not be as bad
Detroit wants to get better by all accounts


So 3 teams will 100% out tank us and two others who I think will likely out tank us but we may see improvement.

Reasonably we could find our way to the bottom 5.

Just seems like if there's going to be a year to tank, this is it

I smell what you’re cooking…couldn’t agree more. I’ll add:

Utah will likely do what they’ve done last two years, compete until trade deadline
Memphis will get a lot better,,,,
Brooklyn could easily get worse

Then add a team that collapses due to injury

Long story short: Raps won’t have to do much in terms of tanking to finish bottom 8.

[WuTang_OG]

if there's a time to soft tank this is it

I said it in another thread, however if we move BB and JP for pick/prospects, we will end up in the bottom 5-7 of the league. Little lottery luck and we will be drafting in the top 3 and grabbing a franchise altering talent to pair with scottie


We aren't going full "trust the process" and stripping it to the bones. But a starting lineup of IQ, RJ, GD, SB, 2024 1st round pick. That team is fun to watch but doesn't win a lot, at least not yet.

Teams that will be worse than us:

Wizards, enough said
Portland
Hornets - who knows, maybe miller is legit, Ball is healthy and they win a few more game. Most likely still worse than us

Teams that will improve:
Spurs - I think are going to surprise a lot of people this year and not be as bad
Detroit wants to get better by all accounts


So 3 teams will 100% out tank us and two others who I think will likely out tank us but we may see improvement.

Reasonably we could find our way to the bottom 5.

Just seems like if there's going to be a year to tank, this is it

I smell what you’re cooking…couldn’t agree more. I’ll add:

Utah will likely do what they’ve done last two years, compete until trade deadline
Memphis will get a lot better,,,,
Brooklyn could easily get worse

Then add a team that collapses due to injury

Long story short: Raps won’t have to do much in terms of tanking to finish bottom 8.

I think BRK will do better and be in the play in at least. New coach, if they keep Bridges I expect him to be better under Jordi. Claxton looks like he's staying too.

TOR will try as they always do every season. But we are going to have to be 95% healthy to be a 35-40 win team and for everyone to get better and everything clicking. That's best case. A couple of injuries, we can easily be back at 25 wins. Masai will see how season goes and tank it once season is lost

Boston
76ers
Bucks
Indy
NY
Cavs
Miami
Orlando

are for sure better than us next season. That's 8 teams.

ATL ? what happens with them
Bulls ? same thing .. both are better than us today.
Both teams TBD - gotta see what they do.

We should be outside of the play in again and I'd guess back at 25-30 wins