Jonas Valanciunas 11/12 Season Thread II

[Elastic]

It looks like Alex McKechnie (Raps strength and conditioning coach) was sent to Vilnius to evaluate/work with Valanciunas.

Yea, BC mentioned it the other day. That they were going to send him to see Val to give him plan to get bigger.

Is that Maurizio ahead of him?

Yes, Maurizio and some members of NBA or Raps TV crew. More photos:

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set= ... 444&type=3

[PapeSowish]

V finishes with 18/10

[Anatomize]

Jonas is becoming so consistent now it's scary..

I was telling a friend the other day.. there really isn't a C with his skill level in the league right now.. he is different in a lot of ways.. he has the finishing ability of some of the top bigs, he hits his freethrows at an insane clip for a big man.. great motor.. I can go on and on.. but rather.. as he keeps growing.. it's becoming more difficult to say "he plays like (insert name)".. he's a hybrid of a lot of players.. I haven't seen a true C in the last decade who can shoot so effectively percentages wise and still pad stats in all the other categories.. the closest guy I guess would be a Joakim Noah and even then Jonas is a much better shooter..

I'm really excited

[FTW]

Release point on his shot looks pretty low. Almost seems to shoot it from his neck. Slightly worried that may not work against longer/quicker defences in the NBA - retooling a shot so significantly is a big deal.

[UcanUwill]

Release point on his shot looks pretty low. Almost seems to shoot it from his neck. Slightly worried that may not work against longer/quicker defences in the NBA - retooling a shot so significantly is a big deal.

Thats true, he cant shoot contested shots. Last time he attempted it, Marc Gasol blocked the crap out of him.

[malachii]

I'm pretty sure his role would be to only shoot open jumpers to keep defences honest. So I'm not too worried about his shot being blocked. He'll be rolling most of the time, or using post moves.

[KG1585]

I'm pretty sure his role would be to only shoot open jumpers to keep defences honest. So I'm not too worried about his shot being blocked. He'll be rolling most of the time, or using post moves.

Yup, Amir has a really slow release, but it doesn't matter when he takes open jumpers.

[UcanUwill]

I'm pretty sure his role would be to only shoot open jumpers to keep defences honest. So I'm not too worried about his shot being blocked. He'll be rolling most of the time, or using post moves.

Thats true. Even the best mid range shooting bigs are usually taking only open shots. Bigmen are not used to shoot while contested in general.

Jonas' form is odd, although very easy to imitate. You never know when he pulls it off, he usually keeps the ball high, and thats all it needs to attempt that shot, no routine, nothing. And that release is very quick, when you sag off of him just a sec, he can shoot it, if you play tight, he beats you with his first step. As simple as it is, it works.

Look at his highlights against Spain for example.

At 1:10 he hits his first uncontested mid range shot, so they start to play tight, the result, Jonas totally schools Pau at 1:30

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tX8mJ_el6c[/youtube]

[Darknemo2000]

He wont rely on his midrange. He will just shoot occasional uncontested jumpers to keep other C's close so he can roll to the basket easier (like in that episode against Gasol - he shot it, and then once he hit it he neveer shot but started going to the basket strong as now Gasol had to come up to defend him in case he hits another midrange).

[Raptor_Claw]

OK, I have been reading through this thread, and I realize and understand Raptors fans will naturally be homers regarding Valanciunas. It's natural. But, this has to be said. I've seen so many posts claiming that Valanciunas is "the best rebounder in Europe" and a lot of arguing if this was questioned.

It's stated as if it is an absolute guaranteed accepted fact in Europe. OK, seriously, this is not true in any way at all. The best rebounder in Europe, universally accepted across Europe is Mirsad Turkcan. He is UNIVERSALLY regarded as the best rebounder in Europe throughout all of European basketball.

Valanciunas is a very good rebounder, especially on offense, but let's at least stick to actual facts here. He is definitely not considered the best rebounder in Europe. That title is 100% given to Mirsad Turkcan. It's not even something that would ever be debated in Europe. It's not even a contest really.

So come on guys, Valanciunas is a great young player, and like him quite a lot, but let's drop some of the ridiculous over hype on him with stuff that just isn't true.

[UcanUwill]

You put so much effort just to promote Turkcan? Turkcan is 36 years old now, and is always injured and inactive most of the time.

And did you watch Jonas play? Mirsad was most dominant rebounder ever in Europe, but now its debatable which one is actually better.


In fact, Jonas had better rebounding season in last years Euroleague. Not too shabby for 18 year old Euroleague rookie.

Jonas was first in TR% 22.5. Mirsad was third - 20.5 TR%.

very good rebounder, especially on offense

Jonas is excellent OFF rebounder, but why everyones keeps underrating his DEF rebounding? I think hes even better defensive rebounder...

Mirsad had better OR%, which was 16.2%, compare to Jonas' 13.9%

Instead, Jonas' was second in DTR%, 31.2% Mirsad on the other hand was 7th, 24.6 DTR%


Jonas was second in rebounds per minutes, averaged 13.4 rebounds per 36 minutes, Mirsad finished third, averaged 12.6.

Jonas was leading Euroleague in rebounds per 100 possessions, 20.8. Turkcan was third, 19.1.


So yeah... Here you go. Fatality.

[Raptor_Claw]

You put so much effort just to promote Turkcan? Turkcan is 36 years old now, and is always injured and inactive most of the time.

And did you watch Jonas play? Mirsad was most dominant rebounder ever in Europe, but now its debatable which one is actually better.


In fact, Jonas had better rebounding season in last years Euroleague. Not too shabby for 18 year old Euroleague rookie.

Jonas was first in TR% 22.5. Mirsad was third - 20.5 TR%.

very good rebounder, especially on offense

Jonas is excellent OFF rebounder, but why everyones keeps underrating his DEF rebounding? I think hes even better defensive rebounder...

Mirsad had better OR%, which was 16.2%, compare to Jonas' 13.9%

Instead, Jonas' was second in DTR%, 31.2% Mirsad on the other hand was 7th, 24.6 DTR%


Jonas was second in rebounds per minutes, averaged 13.4 rebounds per 36 minutes, Mirsad finished third, averaged 12.6.

Jonas was leading Euroleague in rebounds per 100 possessions, 20.8. Turkcan was third, 19.1.


So yeah... Here you go. Fatality.

I don't want to to start an argument. Bottom line. Turkcan is the Euroleague Dennis Rodman. He is 10 times a better rebounder then Valanciunas is. I am sorry, but you are going too far into posting falsehoods to keep claiming he is the best reounder in Europe.

There are some things I can let go, but that is homerism on unprecedented levels. We should not be telling blatantly and egregiously untrue things here to Canadian Raptor fans that will not know any better. It's blowing expectations out of the water for Valanciunas. Unreasonable pressure to put on such a young player.

No. He's not a better rebounder than Turkcan, and I can guarantee that at no time in his career will he be. Turkcan is Dennis Rodman level rebounding wise. Valanciunas is not even in the same discussion. Please don't go crazy with what you claim about him.

Yes, he is a very good rebounder, especially on offense, but you are going into an extreme exaggeration as to the level of his rebounding.

[UcanUwill]

You know the difference between is and was?

You just riding the reputation. Turkcan sure was most dominant European rebounder of all time. Time to let it go...

He is 10 times a better rebounder then Valanciunas is

No. He's not a better rebounder than Turkcan, and I can guarantee that at no time in his career will he be.

You are ridiculous, WTF was that? 10 times better rebounder? And after all, I am the one whos going into an extreme exaggeration..?

Jonas playing his JUST second season of high level basketball, and as far as I know, he is dominates Eurocup, LKL and VTB in rebounding, as usual. He actually outrebound Turkcan being 18, 230 lbs. Thats a fact, how about stop being ignorant for a second.
But hey... you already know he will never gonna be as good as Turkcan ''is''... Thats a fact, how about stop being ignorant for a second.

Funny fact, Jonas played his very first Euroleague game ever against Fenerbache and Mirsad Turkcan... And you know what happened, he got double double in under 17 minutes... Thats what happened... Mirsad played limited minutes, but he finished with 0 rebounds...

I dont know why I even typing this. You showed incredible ingorance and bias towards Lord Turkcan. Turkcan is just man, and hes putting worse rebounding numbers than Valanciunas for a 2 years now. Stats don't lie.
Turkcan is 35 years old injury prone, Jonas is 19 years old junior superstar. Stop looking back at the past, new king was crown. Jonas is a leading rebounder in all competitions he is playing

[5DOM]

lol at 10 times better.

[RPzB]

I'm European and I honestly never heard anyone ever say that Mirsad Turkcan is best rebounder in here. Seriously, I've never heard anyone say anything about him in any context when talking about players who are top rated at anyhting. IDK where did you get the info that Turkcan is regarded as best rebounder UNIVERSALLY.

[UcanUwill]

I'm European and I honestly never heard anyone ever say that Mirsad Turkcan is best rebounder in here. Seriously, I've never heard anyone say anything about him in any context when talking about players who are top rated at anyhting. IDK where did you get the info that Turkcan is regarded as best rebounder UNIVERSALLY.

Seriously? You totally lack knowledge then... Turkcan was the best rebounder by far... By far...

But Jonas came into Euroleague at age 18, actually had better rebounding numbers than washed up Mirsad Turkcan, and the guy still lives in the past, and says Turkcan is 10 times better reboudner than Jonas.
Maybe Turkcan is better at this point, but he needs to prove it again, The guy can barely stay healthy and is washed up. He once again had dominant rebounding numbers this season, but he played very few games. Jonas constanly dominating the boards, and is number one rebounder in my book for sure.

[Tofubeque]

Look at his highlights against Spain for example.

At 1:10 he hits his first uncontested mid range shot, so they start to play tight, the result, Jonas totally schools Pau at 1:30

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tX8mJ_el6c[/youtube]

Man, why you gotta remind me of that game. Now I'm all impatient for him to be on the Raptors again.

That Spanish national team is better than a lot of NBA teams. Jonas will be our saviour

[UcanUwill]

This shoot out made me busy.

Mirsad Turkcan is simply known as Euroleague's best rebounder of all time.
Troll came here to state this, which is D'uh. But then he said some BS. And I say - this is BS.

So, i did what any lonely idiot would do. I counted it... I counted everything. Now I have all Turkcan's Euroleague numbers of the last 10 years. Back then he was 25, his prime and everything, its legit.

I'll show you his per minute rebound number and per 36 rebound average, starting with 2001-02 season and so on..

2002 : 17 games played, .38 per minute; 13.68 per36

2003 : 21 games played, .33 per minute; 11.9 per36

2004 : 20 games played, .408 per minute; 14.69 per36

2005 : 11 games played, .304 per minute; 10.96 per36 (EUROCUP)

2006 : 16 games played, .3 per minute; 10.8 per36

2007 : 11 games played, .354 per minute; 12.76 per36

2008 : 12 games played, .337 per minute; 12.14 per36

2009 : 14 games played, .315 per minute; 11.35 per36

2010 : 1 game played 10 minutes/2 rebounds, exclude this one

2011 : 12 games played, .348 per minute; 12.54 per36

2012 : 3 games played, .579 per minute; 20.87 per36[/color]

Mirsads Prime goat season was a 2004 one, 14.7 per36 is unbelievable. Back then he was 27 years old. His current season's numbers were, well you can see, but it was 3 games, so i would not go crazy about it.
Finaly. his Euroleague average of the last 10 years is :

.345 per minute; 12.5 per 36

GOAT rebounder.

But now lets back to Jonas Valanciunas.


2011 : 16 games played, .375 per minute; 13.53 per36

2012 : 10 games played so far, .338 per minute; 12.19 per36 (Eurocup)



I would say those are very similar numbers... Definitely not 10 times worse or anything....

Of course... Numbers cant tell the whole story, but I think it says a lot... At age 19, Jonas is putting Mirsad Turkcan's alike numbers, so... in your face, and that is all.

[GreatWhiteStiff]

So I guess Jonas Valanciunas is the greatest rebounder in the history of europe.

[dagger]

He wont rely on his midrange. He will just shoot occasional uncontested jumpers to keep other C's close so he can roll to the basket easier (like in that episode against Gasol - he shot it, and then once he hit it he neveer shot but started going to the basket strong as now Gasol had to come up to defend him in case he hits another midrange).

Maybe so, but there are big men who make a good living making their jump shots when they take them. It really depends on the offensive strategy.

Zydrunas Ilgauskus had this infuriatingly reliable baseline and elbow jumper that probably added several years to his career after serious foot injuries made him largely earthbound. That jumper was money, and a deliberate part of Cleveland's offence.

Lamarcus Aldridge makes a nice living with an elbow jumper. His game has broadened since, but the elbow jumper made him respectable early on in his career. Again, that was just a function of Aldridge taking that shot when it was presented to him, it was a function of the team getting them ball in that position.

I think Valanciunas can develop a mid-range game like that, but it's going to depend on whether Casey wants him near the basket where he is a dangerous offensive rebounder, or spending some time away from the basket to present a mid-range threat. My suspicion is that initially, Jonas will stick close the basket, but 2-3 years into his NBA career I expect a baseline or elbow jumper to be part of the team's standard offence, something they create for him on occasion and encourage him to take on others.