Official RJ Barrett Thread Part 2

MEDIC · Post #341 » by **MEDIC** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 3:59 am

I really like RJ as a 2nd or 3rd option.

Not a fan of his game/ mentality when he is expected to be "the guy". His game isn't built for that.

Having said that, he is the only player that can create something right now, so it's not entirely his fault. I do wish he would kick it out more rather than force up a shot down low when he is out-sized.....especially in crunch time.

He really has to work on a floater & a mid range shot if he wants to be that guy.

Having our primary faciliators (Scottie & IQ) injured all season hasn't been good for his game.

Indeed · Post #342 » by **Indeed** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 12:17 pm

MEDIC wrote:I really like RJ as a 2nd or 3rd option.

Not a fan of his game/ mentality when he is expected to be "the guy". His game isn't built for that.

Having said that, he is the only player that can create something right now, so it's not entirely his fault. I do wish he would kick it out more rather than force up a shot down low when he is out-sized.....especially in crunch time.

He really has to work on a floater & a mid range shot if he wants to be that guy.

Having our primary faciliators (Scottie & IQ) injured all season hasn't been good for his game.

He showed a floater near the end of 2nd quarter.

nikster · Post #343 » by **nikster** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 1:18 pm

HangTime wrote:Call me crazy, but with Scottie out, I'd rather increase Mogbo and Walter's (1st option) usage and keep RJ in the secondary role.

Your crazy

WaltFrazier · Post #344 » by **WaltFrazier** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 1:29 pm

MEDIC wrote:I really like RJ as a 2nd or 3rd option.

Not a fan of his game/ mentality when he is expected to be "the guy". His game isn't built for that.

Having said that, he is the only player that can create something right now, so it's not entirely his fault. I do wish he would kick it out more rather than force up a shot down low when he is out-sized.....especially in crunch time.

He really has to work on a floater & a mid range shot if he wants to be that guy.

Having our primary faciliators (Scottie & IQ) injured all season hasn't been good for his game.

Or maybe it's been good for his game, to see how far he can stretch as a number one option. As long as he can readjust to a more limited role when Scottie and IQ return.

ATLTimekeeper · Post #345 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 1:33 pm

It's good for the Raptors that RJ and Gradey can attract so much defensive attention.

RJ has lost us a lot of games in the clutch this year, but he's gotten us the opportunity to fail in the clutch. It's been a strange year with all the injuries.

Psubs · Post #346 » by **Psubs** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 2:20 pm

It's like all of his turnovers are live-ball. He did split 2 defenders on a break for a dunk but then killed rallies in the 2nd half by turning the ball over. With IQ and Barnes healthy his tertiary ball-handling is less of a time bomb.

Hair Canada · Post #347 » by **Hair Canada** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 2:52 pm

Per 36:

RJ Barrett (age 24):
24.7ppg (54.6% TS)
7.2 rpg
6.4 apg
3.7 TOs
1.4 STOCKS

Cade Cunnigham (age 23):
23.5ppg (54.6% TS)
7.3 rpg
9.3 apg
4.6 TOs
1.6 STOCKS

To be clear, Cade is already a better player, with clearly a higher upside as a true big PG.

But my point is that many here would be happy to give away half the team and mortgage the Raptors' future to bring in Cade if Detroit were willing to part ways with him (which they won't).

At the same time, people are suggesting to send RJ (+ Mitchell and Boucher) to Chicago for the cadaver of Lonzo Ball and Patrick Williams (one of the worst starters in the league, signed to one of the worst long-term contracts).

TorontoBarneys · Post #348 » by **TorontoBarneys** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 2:56 pm

Shooting 35% on almost 6 attempted 3's per game is genuinely decent. I think RJ has room to improve even more in this area. I'm really happy we got him last year. Man that OG trade was liquid gold.

Airmiess · Post #349 » by **Airmiess** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 3:03 pm

ATLTimekeeper wrote:It's good for the Raptors that RJ and Gradey can attract so much defensive attention.

RJ has lost us a lot of games in the clutch this year, but he's gotten us the opportunity to fail in the clutch. It's been a strange year with all the injuries.

This is pretty much it.

People are looking at a flawed player and expecting them to do elite things consistently like moving mountains. I look at it like a guy who's getting the reps to test his capabilities, same with Dick.

RJ is currently rivaling Giannis in paint point production, its not all doom and gloom. This is a support player that you want on the floor when everyone else is healthy.

TorontoBarneys · Post #350 » by **TorontoBarneys** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 3:05 pm

Airmiess wrote:
ATLTimekeeper wrote:It's good for the Raptors that RJ and Gradey can attract so much defensive attention.

RJ has lost us a lot of games in the clutch this year, but he's gotten us the opportunity to fail in the clutch. It's been a strange year with all the injuries.

This is pretty much it.

People are looking at a flawed player and expecting them to do elite things consistently like moving mountains. I look at it like a guy who's getting the reps to test his capabilities, same with Dick.

RJ is currently rivaling Giannis in paint point production, its not all doom and gloom. This is a support player that you want on the floor when everyone else is healthy.

Yeah. From what I can tell, we are developing RJ a lot more effectively than NY did. He's not gonna be a finished product for another 3-4 years.

MiamiSPX · Post #351 » by **MiamiSPX** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 3:30 pm

More notable to me is that Masai has twice said "we need another Scottie". That doesn't sound like someone who thinks his top 2-3 guys has been settled. RJ is playing this role due to injuries, and injuries only. The team is not trying to masquerade him as someone he is not.

To me it was way more frustrating when we were trotting Siakam out there as our top guy because I knew there was no other option. We have a guy that is way better than RJ, he is just injured. We can also be hopeful of a few other guys being better than RJ (Dick, Ja'Kobe, 2025 1st rounder). The more some of those guys progress, the more likely RJ is moved down a notch or two, to a more suitable slot in which he can thrive.

Worrying about his next contract is premature when he still has 2 and 2/3rd seasons left on his current one. Worrying about whether he can be part of the core of a contender is WAY premature, given that we may not exceed last season's win total. Let's worry about winning 30+ games again first, before imagining what life will be like as a contender lol.

MEDIC · Post #352 » by **MEDIC** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 3:30 pm

WaltFrazier wrote:
MEDIC wrote:I really like RJ as a 2nd or 3rd option.

Not a fan of his game/ mentality when he is expected to be "the guy". His game isn't built for that.

Having said that, he is the only player that can create something right now, so it's not entirely his fault. I do wish he would kick it out more rather than force up a shot down low when he is out-sized.....especially in crunch time.

He really has to work on a floater & a mid range shot if he wants to be that guy.

Having our primary faciliators (Scottie & IQ) injured all season hasn't been good for his game.

Or maybe it's been good for his game, to see how far he can stretch as a number one option. As long as he can readjust to a more limited role when Scottie and IQ return.

Anything is a possibility I guess. So far I haven't seen him make too many adjustments though. It's basically been the same thing over and over. If he does make adjustments, it will most likely be in the offseason after some video review & self reflection.

I am curious what the coaching staff are encouraging him to do this season.

I kind of see him like a Kevin Love. A guy who can put up monster numbers & really pack the stat sheet if you let him..............but if your team is contending, he has to be a 2nd, 3rd or 4th option. I think 3rd is his sweet spot.

nikster · Post #353 » by **nikster** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 4:03 pm

Hair Canada wrote:Per 36:

RJ Barrett (age 24):
24.7ppg (54.6% TS)
7.2 rpg
6.4 apg
3.7 TOs
1.4 STOCKS

Cade Cunnigham (age 23):
23.5ppg (54.6% TS)
7.3 rpg
9.3 apg
4.6 TOs
1.6 STOCKS

To be clear, Cade is already a better player, with clearly a higher upside as a true big PG.

But my point is that many here would be happy to give away half the team and mortgage the Raptors' future to bring in Cade if Detroit were willing to part ways with him (which they won't).

At the same time, people are suggesting to send RJ (+ Mitchell and Boucher) to Chicago for the cadaver of Lonzo Ball and Patrick Williams (one of the worst starters in the league, signed to one of the worst long-term contracts).

I had someone tell me RJ doesn't have haters, Just people that are critical of his game. Then I see complete garbage trade situations like the one for Lonzo and Williams

ConSarnit · Post #354 » by **ConSarnit** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 4:43 pm

Indeed wrote:
MEDIC wrote:I really like RJ as a 2nd or 3rd option.

Not a fan of his game/ mentality when he is expected to be "the guy". His game isn't built for that.

Having said that, he is the only player that can create something right now, so it's not entirely his fault. I do wish he would kick it out more rather than force up a shot down low when he is out-sized.....especially in crunch time.

He really has to work on a floater & a mid range shot if he wants to be that guy.

Having our primary faciliators (Scottie & IQ) injured all season hasn't been good for his game.

He showed a floater near the end of 2nd quarter.

I don't have a lot of confidence his floater game is ever going to come around. In his best season RJ has shot 38% on driving floaters (for comparison, someone with a good floater game, Jalen Brunson, consistently shoots mid-50% from floater range). His game outside of 5ft is pretty much relegated to open 3's. Everything else has been extremely inefficient.

WuTang_CMB · Post #355 » by **WuTang_CMB** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 4:45 pm

RJ would be a perfect guy off the bench and just punish opposing team's benches

ConSarnit · Post #356 » by **ConSarnit** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 4:59 pm

Airmiess wrote:
ATLTimekeeper wrote:It's good for the Raptors that RJ and Gradey can attract so much defensive attention.

RJ has lost us a lot of games in the clutch this year, but he's gotten us the opportunity to fail in the clutch. It's been a strange year with all the injuries.

This is pretty much it.

People are looking at a flawed player and expecting them to do elite things consistently like moving mountains. I look at it like a guy who's getting the reps to test his capabilities, same with Dick.

RJ is currently rivaling Giannis in paint point production, its not all doom and gloom. This is a support player that you want on the floor when everyone else is healthy.

How are you measuring this? By all accounts Giannis is producing nearly 10 more paint ppg than RJ (and he's doing it on much higher efficiency)

Giannis is making 10.7 FG in the paint while shooting 67%

RJ is making 6.3 FG in the paint while shooting 51% (one of the worst numbers in the league for high volume paint attempts)

brownbobcat · Post #357 » by **brownbobcat** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 5:00 pm

Indeed wrote:
MEDIC wrote:I really like RJ as a 2nd or 3rd option.

Not a fan of his game/ mentality when he is expected to be "the guy". His game isn't built for that.

Having said that, he is the only player that can create something right now, so it's not entirely his fault. I do wish he would kick it out more rather than force up a shot down low when he is out-sized.....especially in crunch time.

He really has to work on a floater & a mid range shot if he wants to be that guy.

Having our primary faciliators (Scottie & IQ) injured all season hasn't been good for his game.

He showed a floater near the end of 2nd quarter.

I hope I'm wrong, but I'm skeptical. He doesn't have good touch inside and is a poor shooter - that's not a good combination for an on-ball wing.

Airmiess · Post #358 » by **Airmiess** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 5:29 pm

ConSarnit wrote:
Airmiess wrote:
ATLTimekeeper wrote:It's good for the Raptors that RJ and Gradey can attract so much defensive attention.

RJ has lost us a lot of games in the clutch this year, but he's gotten us the opportunity to fail in the clutch. It's been a strange year with all the injuries.

This is pretty much it.

People are looking at a flawed player and expecting them to do elite things consistently like moving mountains. I look at it like a guy who's getting the reps to test his capabilities, same with Dick.

RJ is currently rivaling Giannis in paint point production, its not all doom and gloom. This is a support player that you want on the floor when everyone else is healthy.

How are you measuring this? By all accounts Giannis is producing nearly 10 more paint ppg than RJ (and he's doing it on much higher efficiency)

Giannis is making 10.7 FG in the paint while shooting 67%

RJ is making 6.3 FG in the paint while shooting 51% (one of the worst numbers in the league for high volume paint attempts)

I meant fast break points, my mistake

Indeed · Post #359 » by **Indeed** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 5:30 pm

ConSarnit wrote:
Indeed wrote:
MEDIC wrote:I really like RJ as a 2nd or 3rd option.

Not a fan of his game/ mentality when he is expected to be "the guy". His game isn't built for that.

Having said that, he is the only player that can create something right now, so it's not entirely his fault. I do wish he would kick it out more rather than force up a shot down low when he is out-sized.....especially in crunch time.

He really has to work on a floater & a mid range shot if he wants to be that guy.

Having our primary faciliators (Scottie & IQ) injured all season hasn't been good for his game.

He showed a floater near the end of 2nd quarter.

I don't have a lot of confidence his floater game is ever going to come around. In his best season RJ has shot 38% on driving floaters (for comparison, someone with a good floater game, Jalen Brunson, consistently shoots mid-50% from floater range). His game outside of 5ft is pretty much relegated to open 3's. Everything else has been extremely inefficient.

Do you want him to take mid range even he can do it?
Most teams are looking to score either at rim or from 3 for better efficiency. If someone (regardless of Barrett) can make those mid-50% from floater, do you still prefer to make that? Or make a pass to someone for a higher efficient shot?

MEDIC · Post #360 » by **MEDIC** » Tue Dec 17, 2024 5:32 pm

brownbobcat wrote:
Indeed wrote:
MEDIC wrote:I really like RJ as a 2nd or 3rd option.

Not a fan of his game/ mentality when he is expected to be "the guy". His game isn't built for that.

Having said that, he is the only player that can create something right now, so it's not entirely his fault. I do wish he would kick it out more rather than force up a shot down low when he is out-sized.....especially in crunch time.

He really has to work on a floater & a mid range shot if he wants to be that guy.

Having our primary faciliators (Scottie & IQ) injured all season hasn't been good for his game.

He showed a floater near the end of 2nd quarter.

I hope I'm wrong, but I'm skeptical. He doesn't have good touch inside and is a poor shooter - that's not a good combination for an on-ball wing.

Yeah. Hitting one floater doesn't really mean anything..

I am not suggesting that he can't get better, but he has a long ways to go.

If he comes back next season with a new tool in the toolbox, it will be very encouraging. If he comes back and hasn't really added anything, I think we'll all know what his full potential is. It will just be a matter of refining his existing skills & utilizing them efficiently within the offense.