Jonas Valanciunas 11/12 Season Thread II

[UcanUwill]

So I guess Jonas Valanciunas is the greatest rebounder in the history of europe.

Mr. Sarcastic?
No, but hes the best rebounder right now, and thats what is all about. i believe Turkcan played only 9 games this season, 3 Euroleague games, 6 Turkish league games. He pulled a 13 rebound game against Panathinaikos, and his EL sample size numbers are insane, but his sample size Turkish league numbers, which are 4.5rpg. kills the buzz, and in general, the guy does not played enough games to be called the best at something. The guy is Yao Ming durable lately, talking about last 3 years.

Jonas on the other hand has the best TS% among all, Euroleague and Eurocup players, 22.4TS%.

He had a sloppy Eurocup start, but he is first in rebounds per minute anyway, and his top 16 numbers are insane, 9.8 rbs. in over 24 minutes so far.

Maybe so, but there are big men who make a good living making their jump shots when they take them. It really depends on the offensive strategy.

Zydrunas Ilgauskus had this infuriatingly reliable baseline and elbow jumper that probably added several years to his career after serious foot injuries made him largely earthbound. That jumper was money, and a deliberate part of Cleveland's offence.

As already said, most of the bigs shoots only open jumpers, and thats fine with Jonas, his jumper is easily blockable, but release is quick. The same Ilgauskas had similar form, his height helped him a little bit, its hard to block a 7'3 guy.
Theres also more space in NBA basketball, so I dont think theres really a problem, unless Jonas has the ball in his hands at the end of clock and is forced to shoot a contested shot.

[HangTime]

Look at his highlights against Spain for example.

At 1:10 he hits his first uncontested mid range shot, so they start to play tight, the result, Jonas totally schools Pau at 1:30

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tX8mJ_el6c[/youtube]

Man, why you gotta remind me of that game. Now I'm all impatient for him to be on the Raptors again.

That Spanish national team is better than a lot of NBA teams. Jonas will be our saviour

At 1:33, I think an NBA ref would call foul on that arm over the back.

I love his enthusiasm, and that he is a good FT shooter. Also, it doesn't seem like he'll back down from anyone.

The Olympics will be awesome if they make it. 2 Raptors on Lithuania.

[theSkinny]

I have decided that every good thing Jonas brings to the Raps next year I will refer to as the, "Jonas Bonus"

[Raptor_Claw]

This season, in 19.0 minutes per game, Turkcan is averaging 11.0 rebounds per game in the Euroleague.

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/p ... ubcode=ULK

This season, in 22.4 minutes, Valanciunas is averaging 7.6 rebounds per game in the Eurocup.

http://www.eurocupbasketball.com/eurocu ... ubcode=LIE

The Eurocup is simply not even close to the level of the Euroleague. Even at age 35, Turkcan is clearly a much better rebounder than Valanciunas is. And using stats from last season for Turkcan is very disingenuous, because he had a severe knee injury and had to have a season ending surgery.

Really, he just came back to the court like a month ago. After the surgery, coming back into shape, at age 35, he is a far better rebounder per minute, in a much tougher and better league.

Again, Valanciunas is a very good rebounder. But saying he is the best rebounder in Europe is simply untrue. He's not in any way as good of a rebounder as Turkcan is. Yes, he's old at age 35, and look at the stats. A lot more rebounds, in less minutes, in a much better league.

Let's just keep it real with Jonas. He IS a very good rebounder, but there is no need to just push him so hard, just for the sake of hyping him. If Canadians are all expecting "the best rebounder by far in Europe", then that is placing an UNFAIR expectation on him.

[SkywalkerAC]

how about "almost the best rebounder by far in Europe."

or

one of the best rebounders not in the NBA.

or

extremely good rebounder.

is that unfair?

[raptor21_85]

i had asked a couple of questions.. first is can he still grow??? and other one is what is his ceilling, Jermaine O Neal???

[SkywalkerAC]

Jonas is going to be a much better offensive player than JO ever was.

[UcanUwill]

To Raptor_Claw

Again, I even counted it for you. Jonas' career numbers so far looks just as good as Turkcan's career numbers, actually even better.

Last years comparison is disingenuous, but its totally fine to compare this season, even though Turkcan played 3 EUROLEAGUE GAMES... You just used 3 games size to prove your point... Whats your problem, you just being ridiculous.

Jonas was a better rebounder last year, buts its disingenuous, because Turkcan was just coming back after serious injury, but its totally fair to call Turkcan best rebounder today, although he cant even play this season at all and is more injured than he ever was?
He should not be in the conversation, its like saying Joel Przybilla is the best low post defender in the NBA today, it doesnt even make sense...

If you want to prove Jonas is not the best rebounder in Europe, give me some actual players, who rebounds better than him. Last years Mirsad was as healthy as he can be, the guys is totally washed up and theres a high chance, he already played his last basketball game, at least in international competition.

Eurocup is nowhere close to Euroleague. How nowhere? You suggest that Euroleague and Eurocup rebounding numbers are totally irrelevant and that Eurocup numbers are expanded? Players migrates from Eurocup to Eurleague and vice versa, and I never seen a significant difference.
IN FACT, as you can see, the same Mirsad Turkcan did played in Eurocup back in 2005, and it was his WORST rebounding season, I already counted it for you.

[UcanUwill]

i had asked a couple of questions.. first is can he still grow??? and other one is what is his ceilling, Jermaine O Neal???

He said hes still growing, he grown one CM from the last time he was measured. I do believe he can still grow, hes under 20, men can grow till they are like 22. Danilo Gallinari was 20 when he came over, and he grown at least an inch since then. Not sure Paul George rumors were true, but the point is, you cant tell u 20 guy he cant grow more...
Jonas is already tall, so you know he grows, and he never had major growing spurt, he just kept growing little by little...

ANd I dont know about his ceiling, JO looks fair, but if we talking about ceilings and best possible scenario, he has a shot to be better than JO I think.

[Al_Oliver]

i had asked a couple of questions.. first is can he still grow??? and other one is what is his ceilling, Jermaine O Neal???

He said hes still growing, he grown one CM from the last time he was measured. I do believe he can still grow, hes under 20, men can grow till they are like 22. Danilo Gallinari was 20 when he came over, and he grown at least an inch since then. Not sure Paul George rumors were true, but the point is, you cant tell u 20 guy he cant grow more...
Jonas is already tall, so you know he grows, and he never had major growing spurt, he just kept growing little by little...

ANd I dont know about his ceiling, JO looks fair, but if we talking about ceilings and best possible scenario, he has a shot to be better than JO I think.

I was thinking maybe a Brad Daugherty-type, but JV is already a better shot-blocker...

[Laowai]

Jonas will be his own player and everything is speculation at this point in time. Will he be the best re bounder in the NBA will I don't think so a Love type player will likely be. What Jonas will be is a extremely solid all round C as he develops size and hopefully doesn't lose foot speed he can be a top 3 C and maybe #!. Why I say a possibility at #1 Dwight is a beast but he has areas where he doesn't excel. The obvious is his lack of skill at the foul line which can make him a liability in close games. He is also foul prone and he lacks range with most of his points within 6ft.

Jonas also will have early trouble with fouls but he is a student of the game and will learn and quickly will get star treatment by the referees. He will develop a more complete range of shots than Dwight has and to put JV to the line isn't a good idea he will become a 80% shooter there. With him and Bargs the defense of most teams will be stretched allowing current players like DD, Bayless and JJ much more freedom to penetrate at will. Hopefully with our pick we can add Barnes?MKG and hopefully a PG.

Many of us wanted Lin when he was 1st released by GS can you imagine a LIN, DD, Barnes, JV, AB starting 5 with Jose, Weems, JJ, Amir, Dais second team with Bayless, as 6th man and Klieza, Gray, Forbes as depth.

Thats why we need to get Kabongo I don't think he will be the scorer Lin is but he will also make it easier for us to be a very good if not great team in a couple of years.

[SkywalkerAC]

Why will JV only be an 80% free throw shooter in the NBA, are Euro free throws that much easier to get?

[Laowai]

Why will JV only be an 80% free throw shooter in the NBA, are Euro free throws that much easier to get?

+1

True just career minimum if that's the only complaint on the low side I can live with that LOL

[UcanUwill]

Why will JV only be an 80% free throw shooter in the NBA, are Euro free throws that much easier to get?

+1

True just career minimum if that's the only complaint on the low side I can live with that LOL

He attempted 145 FT shots this season, made 119. 82% shooting.


80% sounds about right. Its approximate number anyway.


He is not that automatic from the line. He can hit 10 in a row and then miss 3 in a row... Kinda nervous I would say. When he misses the first one, there is a high chance he misses the second too.

he had a 87.5 FT% season in Euroleague, but I am not convinced he can shoot at this % constantly.

[raptor21_85]

Im okay with him being the good JO was

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVYkVsZq300[/youtube]

[Eating a Book]

One of my favourite things about JV thus far is how much he gives a ****. He and Casey are gonna get along stupidly well.

[DG88]

Im okay with him being the good JO was

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVYkVsZq300[/youtube]

I don't think JV will be anything like JO. As good as JO was defensively his was inefficient offensively. JV is almost money around the hoop and imo way more mobile than JO.

[Raptor_Claw]

Eurocup is nowhere close to Euroleague. How nowhere? You suggest that Euroleague and Eurocup rebounding numbers are totally irrelevant and that Eurocup numbers are expanded? Players migrates from Eurocup to Eurleague and vice versa, and I never seen a significant difference.

There is a huge difference between the level of the Euroleague and the Eurocup. Teams in the bottom 1/3 of domestic leagues like Greece, Italy, and Spain regularly make the Last 16 of Eurocup.

It's not even close to the same level.

I'm not talking about what stats might look like necessarily, in some cases similar, in others a huge discrepancy. But I'm really just talking about the difference in the level of the competition. It is much different.

The last couple of years, there have been 10th-12th placed Greek League teams making it to the Last 16 of Eurocup. It's simply not even in the same discussion with the level of the Euroelague.

[RaptorReloaded]

Im okay with him being the good JO was

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVYkVsZq300[/youtube]

I don't think JV will be anything like JO. As good as JO was defensively his was inefficient offensively. JV is almost money around the hoop and imo way more mobile than JO.

Damn I used to watch that mix all the time when he got traded here .
I don't see any J.O in J.V at all. More of a Gasol - Chandler hybrid.

[dbenalal]

Haven't read the whole thread but some people say he's overrated


Is he the real deal or not fuuuuu?