Raptors NBA Draft Thread: Damian Lillard (POR)

[malachii]

Yeah, that's a solid argument - I suppose 6 is where Lillard may go if he measures out well at the combine. Too bad we can't trade them Calderon + 8 for 6 + bad contract. Or can we?

[malachii]

With no playing making from the wing to speak of this board really wants to draft a kid who really aint a nba pg? With all the negative comments about bayless im shocked yall just want a clone. Mabe lilliard being a rookie makes it sexier? Ill give it half a year regardless of who drafts the kid before the board hates him.

Just because their stats are similar doesn't make them the same player. Everything that happens between their ears is where the real differentiation occurs, and while no expert, I believe that Lillard will far surpass Bayless in this regard.

[DG88]

With no playing making from the wing to speak of this board really wants to draft a kid who really aint a nba pg? With all the negative comments about bayless im shocked yall just want a clone. Mabe lilliard being a rookie makes it sexier? Ill give it half a year regardless of who drafts the kid before the board hates him.

Just because their stats are similar doesn't make them the same player. Everything that happens between their ears is where the real differentiation occurs, and while no expert, I believe that Lillard will far surpass Bayless in this regard.

When looking at stats you need to be subjective. I can pull stats of many players and say well because they have similar stats does not make them similar players. Bayless plays more hero ball where he tries to do everything by himself, while Lillard plays more of a team game and makes the right basketball play and is willing to give up the ball if there is a better scoring opportunity. We all know that Bayless won't be the starter come next season that right has been earned by Calderon. We also know that Bayless is terrible off the bench and both he and Calderon will be free agents. The option of taking Lillard to me makes sense since he has a tighter handle and dribbling ability to actually shift the defense.

[neurotik]

I don't think anyone on this board has or will be able to get an accurate forecast of Lillards talents.

He played in a small conference, against weaker competition, and the games weren't televised.

All that RealGMers, including myself, have to evaluate Lillard as a prospect is the analysis and projections of Professionals such as Givony, Ford, etc. Even then I have to question how many of his games they actually saw and how well they will be able to determine which of Lillard's skills will translate from Big Sky competition to NBA competion.

So to sum up, people on this board should stop pretending to know whether Lillard will be great, average, or a bust.

[UN-Owen]

Yeah, that's a solid argument - I suppose 6 is where Lillard may go if he measures out well at the combine. Too bad we can't trade them Calderon + 8 for 6 + bad contract. Or can we?

No, because they don't have any bad contracts

[cdel00]

Nice little write up: http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketb ... basketball

Rahe said that Portland, which has the Nos. 6 and 11 picks, has been calling quite often. Utah, which doesn't have a first-round selection, would love to find a way to get involved. Rahe said he has talked to Cleveland, although the Cavaliers already have Kyrie Irving, so selecting Lillard may not make as much sense at No. 4, which is also deemed too high for Lillard to get drafted. Golden State, which has the No. 7 pick, has also called Rahe. That might be a starting point for him, but the latest team that Rahe has heard from is Toronto, which picks at No. 8.
"There were people in his ear about leaving,'' Rahe said. "But he wouldn't do it. He was loyal. Thank God for it. We could have lost him.''
Rahe said Lillard grew up with two parents who instilled a strong work ethic in him, saying they "did a great job of putting the values in with him. He works his ass off, and he knows right from wrong. He treats people the way he wants to be treated. He's a self-made player.''
"The thing about Damian is that he's obsessed with improving his weaknesses,'' Rahe said. "He's got such a great sense of his maturity. Every year, he would be in the gym and work on what his weaknesses were.

"He was a scorer when we got him, and he couldn't run off a stagger screen to catch and shoot it,'' Rahe said. "Then it was his middle game. That was important to him and [he] worked on that, too, as well as his pick-and-roll offense. He worked on all of that. He takes the weaknesses and becomes obsessed with it. He never thinks he's good enough. It drives him crazy.''

[DG88]

Nice little write up: http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketb ... basketball

Rahe said that Portland, which has the Nos. 6 and 11 picks, has been calling quite often. Utah, which doesn't have a first-round selection, would love to find a way to get involved. Rahe said he has talked to Cleveland, although the Cavaliers already have Kyrie Irving, so selecting Lillard may not make as much sense at No. 4, which is also deemed too high for Lillard to get drafted. Golden State, which has the No. 7 pick, has also called Rahe. That might be a starting point for him, but the latest team that Rahe has heard from is Toronto, which picks at No. 8.
"There were people in his ear about leaving,'' Rahe said. "But he wouldn't do it. He was loyal. Thank God for it. We could have lost him.''
Rahe said Lillard grew up with two parents who instilled a strong work ethic in him, saying they "did a great job of putting the values in with him. He works his ass off, and he knows right from wrong. He treats people the way he wants to be treated. He's a self-made player.''
"The thing about Damian is that he's obsessed with improving his weaknesses,'' Rahe said. "He's got such a great sense of his maturity. Every year, he would be in the gym and work on what his weaknesses were.

"He was a scorer when we got him, and he couldn't run off a stagger screen to catch and shoot it,'' Rahe said. "Then it was his middle game. That was important to him and [he] worked on that, too, as well as his pick-and-roll offense. He worked on all of that. He takes the weaknesses and becomes obsessed with it. He never thinks he's good enough. It drives him crazy.''

This I like

[Ditchweed]

He certainly seems like a solid prospect that I would be happy with if BC takes him. This team needs someone who can score.

[Onlykiwirapsfan]

Is there any way to filter for players by their college stats? Be interesting to see how players with those kind of ridiculous shooting numbers (3pt/FT especially) and say at least x amount of field goal attempts translate to the NBA? His shooting percentages are such a nice indication that he will be successful, but i'm not sure if historically that is the case.

I do quite like Lillard as our pick. I think both Lamb and Lillard I will be happy with, and I wouldn't be upset if we drafted Sully (but only if we are successful in getting value for Ed/Amir/Both, otherwise it is poor asset management imo).

As other people have mentioned, it is probably harder to score as a leading scorer in Lillard's conference than it is as a secondary/tertiary scorer for a top team, a la Barnes. I think defense is something that is less skill based, and more hustle/coaching, so the smaller decrease in defensive quality conference to conference would be more than made up for by the constant double teams and lack of open looks. I think this point applies even more here, in that Lillard is the PG AND primary shot creator, so he almost NEVER has open looks.

[phailing101]

Lillard would be an awesome pick but I would prefer Lamb at this point. That being said, either player brings the scoring abilities I desperately want the Raps to have at the guard positions.

[DG88]

Lillard would be an awesome pick but I would prefer Lamb at this point. That being said, either player brings the scoring abilities I desperately want the Raps to have at the guard positions.

I'm still not sold on Lamb, he's got a nice skill set but plays with no aggression. He doesn't look like a guy that has fire in his gut. He seems too laid back too me and I still question his mental toughness.

[Double Helix]

I don't think anyone on this board has or will be able to get an accurate forecast of Lillards talents.

He played in a small conference, against weaker competition, and the games weren't televised.

All that RealGMers, including myself, have to evaluate Lillard as a prospect is the analysis and projections of Professionals such as Givony, Ford, etc. Even then I have to question how many of his games they actually saw and how well they will be able to determine which of Lillard's skills will translate from Big Sky competition to NBA competion.

So to sum up, people on this board should stop pretending to know whether Lillard will be great, average, or a bust.

There's actually a surprising amount of video available of him online, including misses, poor passes, makes, layups, floaters, 3 point form, stepbacks... Him working out... Him practicing on his game... This isn't like a Barbosa draft situation where there was only one grainy VHS tape going around and a lot of hype. Nothing compares to being able to watch him off the ball over an entire game, or seeing how he defends, but if you watch enough NBA basketball, enough college basketball, enough international basketball, and you've followed enough drafts... like some of us on here have (yourself included probably) you'd be surprised what advanced stats in conjuction with at least 15-20 minutes of video footage (including pros and cons) can tell you about a guy.

College coaches sometimes watch 1 or 2 games from a HS prospect and then offer scholarships. When you love the game as much as most of us do you can sometimes "just tell' if somebody's got it or not. Perhaps not enough to tell definitively if a guy will be a star or simply an above average player but I'd be very surprised if this guy didn't amount to anything given all of his skills, work ethic, shooting %s and prototype height/build/speed.

I predict sort of a Jameer Nelson type of career from him. It's hard to imagine him becoming a strue PG star in the NBA but after watching how other hard working, mature PGs like Isiah Thomas and Jameer Nelson have adjusted to the pros I'm expecting a career trajectory closer to that. I personally think we can do better at 8 given the talent in this draft. I think he should be going more in the 10-13 range but I will be very surprised if he's a complete bust/bench player. I think he's got enough to make his mark.

[OAKLEY_2]

I wouldn't predict anything for him except him to be an upstanding hard working scorer. An excellent character acquisition much like Barnes. I like him better than Lamb but I think we would have to land Nash to get full value for him. 2 or 3 years of Nash tutoring is something that would really add value to the pick IMO. I do think if we keep the pick and let us hope that we do, we should have a long term view and Waiters fits that approach best.

[OAKLEY_2]

My personal backcourt solution would be Lowry/Waiters. That's a BC home run IMO.

[Al_Oliver]

My personal backcourt solution would be Lowry/Waiters. That's a BC home run IMO.

boom! sign me up. if he pulls that off he can GM my team... haha

[BillyGM]

My personal backcourt solution would be Lowry/Waiters. That's a BC home run IMO.

boom! sign me up. if he pulls that off he can GM my team... haha

That's actually not so hard as they want to get rid of him
8th pick + filler for Lowry + 16th pick.

[SwiftyV]

DraftExpress video breakdown:

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Dam ... um=twitter

[Double Helix]

Right off the top they throw out the better Jeff Teague comparison. That's certainly compelling especially with his work ethic, character and leadership potential.

Good teams need superstars but it's conceivable to imagine a better Jeff Teague with a good head on his shoulders helping to lead a good playoff team someday if he was surrounded by a couple other players better than him.

Raptors fans want to hit a home run because it's happened before at 8 and beyond and because we so desperately need it. It's really too bad we didn't have a couple picks in our range. I'd love to pick up Lillard and groom him based on his personality/work ethic/talent combination alone. However, I also want to hit a home run here somehow and I'm not convinced that Lillard's it. I've said it before but he has the work ethic of an NBA role player vet while having the size and talent of a late lotto pick. You don't see that very often these days. Guys like this have long careers in the NBA and eventually find themselves on good teams.

[Al_Oliver]

My personal backcourt solution would be Lowry/Waiters. That's a BC home run IMO.

boom! sign me up. if he pulls that off he can GM my team... haha

That's actually not so hard as they want to get rid of him
8th pick + filler for Lowry + 16th pick.

Morey is a smart dude, we're not going to be able to dump our trash on him with the #8 to get Lowry and their 16th pick. I assume filler could be Ed Davis + some other asset(s)?
More likely it is with our cap space, that he makes us absorb a less than stellar contract to get at Lowry and the 16th.

Interesting few weeks ahead

[cdel00]

DraftExpress video breakdown:

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Dam ... um=twitter

Now that was a heck of a scouting video!

Love the analysis on both strengths and weaknesses.