PG: Scottie overwhelms Celtics

[gojoorange]

I think we were watching different games here.
Pretty much he got schooled again by Schrodar. Nurse has him hide against Horford, and we double team Horford on that, so I am not sure in which part you saw him stayed in front of his man and make you feel he has been impressive on defense.

I don't know that he was hiding Gary on Horford. I can remember at least one time Gary turned Horford over. The Celts also didn't try to have Horford go at Gary in the post after it failed a couple times. They started targeting Fred after that. Which was also a pretty big mistake.

Celtics didn't try to have Horford, only a few times. One was that he passed out of double, another one in a semi-transition where Trent fouls him. Not sure if you have access to this, but in particular the 3rd quarter, you can see the rotation, where Trent was rotating from Horford:
https://www.nba.com/stats/events/?ContextMeasure=FGA&EndPeriod=0&EndRange=28800&GameID=0022100020&PlayerID=201143&RangeType=0&Season=2021-22&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&StartPeriod=0&StartRange=0&TeamID=1610612738&flag=3&sct=plot&section=game&CF=p*E*3

Yup, Tatum targeted VanVleet more often than not. It started 2 years ago during the playoffs. But Barnes did a good job against Tatum, and our super big lineup got a lot of rebounds.

Good call, I didn't notice this one.

[WeThe2019Champs]

Length.

[Boogie!]

You wanted Jeremy Lin playing over VanVleet in the 2019 playoffs....trusting this kind of player assessment could easily have cost the Raps the championship.

Yeah in both the Orlando series and sixes series where he was basically unplayable... if kawhi doesn't make that shot and we lose to the sixers everyone would've been bitching about fvv and he doesn't even get a chance to redeem himself in the following series... keep it coming.

Sometimes you fall in love with your own player assessments to a point where it starts clouding your better judgement.

You’re initial comeback again was super flawed so you’re gonna resort to an ad hominem… fvv was garbage and unplayable the first 2 playoff series… he brought nothing to the table everyone and their mother saw it, people were clamouring for nurse to play someone different even us commentators were questioning why nurse wasn’t using someone different… kawhi a miracle shot saved our season and in a parallel universe the sixers beat us and fvv and nurse get flamed for the stupidity… again thank god for kawhi that we moved on and fvv redeemed himself by going berserk the next few rounds…

Number one that doesn’t change that he’s still a super flawed player as most people are finally coming around to now. Number two you’re somehow arguing that I was wrong that someone else should’ve been getting fvvs minutes during the sixers and Orlando series because he brought absolutely nothing to the table especially against philly where their size was a problem for him. That’s a terrible argument and does not disprove anything I originally said. Like I said I’ll trust my player assessments because they also happen to be the more sound and objective analysis. It just takes people a few years to realize, but like I said you can keep coming at me. I’m still here. You’ll eventually agree with what I’m saying 3 years later and still pretend I’m delusional and a hater and come up with new reasons why Idk what I’m talking about even though it goes against better judgement.

[KrazyP]

Yeah in both the Orlando series and sixes series where he was basically unplayable... if kawhi doesn't make that shot and we lose to the sixers everyone would've been bitching about fvv and he doesn't even get a chance to redeem himself in the following series... keep it coming.

Sometimes you fall in love with your own player assessments to a point where it starts clouding your better judgement.

You’re initial comeback again was super flawed so you’re gonna resort to an ad hominem… fvv was garbage and unplayable the first 2 playoff series… he brought nothing to the table everyone and their mother saw it, people were clamouring for nurse to play someone different even us commentators were questioning why nurse wasn’t using someone different… kawhi a miracle shot saved our season and in a parallel universe the sixers beat us and fvv and nurse get flamed for the stupidity… again thank god for kawhi that we moved on and fvv redeemed himself by going berserk the next few rounds…

Number one that doesn’t change that he’s still a super flawed player as most people are finally coming around to now. Number two you’re somehow arguing that I was wrong that someone else should’ve been getting fvvs minutes during the sixers and Orlando series because he brought absolutely nothing to the table. That’s a terrible argument and does not disprove anything I originally said. Like I said I’ll trust my player assessments because they also happen to be the more sound and objective analysis. It just takes people a few years to realize, but like I said you can keep coming at me. I’m still here. You’ll eventually agree with what I’m saying 3 years later and still pretend I’m delusional and a hater and come up with new reasons why Idk what I’m talking about even though it goes against better judgement.

My initial argument wasnt super flawed at all.

Dude, you wanted to bench VanVleet in the playoffs for Jeremy Lin. Nothing else needs to be said here.

[Quattro]

Yeah in both the Orlando series and sixes series where he was basically unplayable... if kawhi doesn't make that shot and we lose to the sixers everyone would've been bitching about fvv and he doesn't even get a chance to redeem himself in the following series... keep it coming.

Sometimes you fall in love with your own player assessments to a point where it starts clouding your better judgement.

You’re initial comeback again was super flawed so you’re gonna resort to an ad hominem… fvv was garbage and unplayable the first 2 playoff series… he brought nothing to the table everyone and their mother saw it, people were clamouring for nurse to play someone different even us commentators were questioning why nurse wasn’t using someone different… kawhi a miracle shot saved our season and in a parallel universe the sixers beat us and fvv and nurse get flamed for the stupidity… again thank god for kawhi that we moved on and fvv redeemed himself by going berserk the next few rounds…

Number one that doesn’t change that he’s still a super flawed player as most people are finally coming around to now. Number two you’re somehow arguing that I was wrong that someone else should’ve been getting fvvs minutes during the sixers and Orlando series because he brought absolutely nothing to the table especially against philly where their size was a problem for him. That’s a terrible argument and does not disprove anything I originally said. Like I said I’ll trust my player assessments because they also happen to be the more sound and objective analysis. It just takes people a few years to realize, but like I said you can keep coming at me. I’m still here. You’ll eventually agree with what I’m saying 3 years later and still pretend I’m delusional and a hater and come up with new reasons why Idk what I’m talking about even though it goes against better judgement.

You’ve been writing this same trash for 2 years now and you’re no more right today than you were when you wrote it the first time.

[DelAbbot]

But GTJ's steals man! Dont you check box scores!!!!

Gary has been impressive defensively both games. He is still figuring out the schemes a bit but the effort and ability is there. 4 steals tonight and +21. On top of 3 steals in game 1.

GTJ was also a +3 in 26.5 minutes against the Wizards. His shot was off in that game and early to start tonight, but he is having a big impact because of his defensive effort and hustle. Love to see it.

Sent from my Pixel 4 using RealGM mobile app

I think we were watching different games here.
Pretty much he got schooled again by Schrodar. Nurse has him hide against Horford, and we double team Horford on that, so I am not sure in which part you saw him stayed in front of his man and make you feel he has been impressive on defense.

[lebron stopper]

I am anything but a Trent fan but this might have been the best game I've ever seen him play, on both ends.

Yeah, Trent toned down the chucking and gambling on defense, and had some really nice drives to the basket tonight.

FVV also had some really slick passes tonight. In particular, a couple of skilled no look passes that I almost never see from him (one of those was in the 2nd quarter).

[10giz]

I wouldn't worry about OG too much, he will get going.

He probably isn't a top 2 player on an elite team and he might not ever be a true bluechip player but he will get out of this slump and play much better soon.

He is in a more uncomfortable role right now but it will improve his game.

He's already surpassed all expectations.

To me he's absolutely a blue chip player, but more like a blue chip role player. He plays winning basketball and has proven his worth and ethic time and time again. How many comparable guys are there in the league? At his size, strength, IQ, elite defence, most versatile defender, 40% 3P shooter with volume now...He's almost one of a kind. I value a unique overall package far more than generalized labels and scoring ability.

Dude just turned 24 he is nowhere near a finished product. I hate the idea of #1, #2, #3 on winning teams because it's just such a simplistic take. The successfully teams will start adapting to roles, situations and specialties.

[Boogie!]

Sometimes you fall in love with your own player assessments to a point where it starts clouding your better judgement.

You’re initial comeback again was super flawed so you’re gonna resort to an ad hominem… fvv was garbage and unplayable the first 2 playoff series… he brought nothing to the table everyone and their mother saw it, people were clamouring for nurse to play someone different even us commentators were questioning why nurse wasn’t using someone different… kawhi a miracle shot saved our season and in a parallel universe the sixers beat us and fvv and nurse get flamed for the stupidity… again thank god for kawhi that we moved on and fvv redeemed himself by going berserk the next few rounds…

Number one that doesn’t change that he’s still a super flawed player as most people are finally coming around to now. Number two you’re somehow arguing that I was wrong that someone else should’ve been getting fvvs minutes during the sixers and Orlando series because he brought absolutely nothing to the table. That’s a terrible argument and does not disprove anything I originally said. Like I said I’ll trust my player assessments because they also happen to be the more sound and objective analysis. It just takes people a few years to realize, but like I said you can keep coming at me. I’m still here. You’ll eventually agree with what I’m saying 3 years later and still pretend I’m delusional and a hater and come up with new reasons why Idk what I’m talking about even though it goes against better judgement.

My initial argument wasnt super flawed at all.

Dude, you wanted to bench VanVleet in the playoffs for Jeremy Lin. Nothing else needs to be said here.

This is how people who have no comeback argue. One liner bazinga statements. Don’t let your hate for Jeremy lin cloud your better judgement. He would’ve been better than fvv the first two series. At the very least there’s no way he could’ve been worse. That’s how bad your boi was. Nurse was too stubborn and in love with him to try something different. Just like how posters on this board are so Infatuared with certain players that they fail to see their limitations.

[rapsincr]

I've made statements 3 years ago regarding specific player's games that I caught flack for...

I literally got warned for "trolling" because I complained about fvv for the same flaws most people are finally seeing now, when most of the board was still on his nuts... now you have posters saying that the board has an anti Fred problem...

I said ogs potential was more a 3 and d role player possible Shawn Marion type, and that siakam had more overall potential than him because of siakams natural ability and fluidity... again to a lot of anger for putting such limitations on a potential star...

For years I said norman Powell deserved a bigger role on the team because of his skillset and that he was being neutered and should be developed more, again with the majority of the board telling me hecsucked couldn't finish in traffic etc ... then 2 years ago eith a consistent role he makes a big leap and then last year, the first time he was consistently a starter due to injuries he blows up...

I said demar needed to be traded in order for us to take the next step because we had all the right pieces around a star but were building around the wrong star...

You guys can all come at me ill trust my player assessments...

You wanted Jeremy Lin playing over VanVleet in the 2019 playoffs....trusting this kind of player assessment could easily have cost the Raps the championship.

Yeah in both the Orlando series and sixes series where he was basically unplayable... if kawhi doesn't make that shot and we lose to the sixers everyone would've been bitching about fvv and he doesn't even get a chance to redeem himself in the following series... keep it coming.

im no FVV hater typically(except hating his offensive decisions) but ye, until midway through the milwaukee series he was straight doodoo.

[Madhouse]

I wouldn't worry about OG too much, he will get going.

He probably isn't a top 2 player on an elite team and he might not ever be a true bluechip player but he will get out of this slump and play much better soon.

He is in a more uncomfortable role right now but it will improve his game.

He's already surpassed all expectations.

To me he's absolutely a blue chip player, but more like a blue chip role player. He plays winning basketball and has proven his worth and ethic time and time again. How many comparable guys are there in the league? At his size, strength, IQ, elite defence, most versatile defender, 40% 3P shooter with volume now...He's almost one of a kind. I value a unique overall package far more than generalized labels and scoring ability.

Dude just turned 24 he is nowhere near a finished product. I hate the idea of #1, #2, #3 on winning teams because it's just such a simplistic take. The successfully teams will start adapting to roles, situations and specialties.

I guess, scratch that, I'm trying to say don't worry about OG too much. He will soon make some of those shots he made in the preseason. And when he does that he has 20 points on like 8/17 shooting. He played good defense and got to the line.

[Boogie!]

Sometimes you fall in love with your own player assessments to a point where it starts clouding your better judgement.

You’re initial comeback again was super flawed so you’re gonna resort to an ad hominem… fvv was garbage and unplayable the first 2 playoff series… he brought nothing to the table everyone and their mother saw it, people were clamouring for nurse to play someone different even us commentators were questioning why nurse wasn’t using someone different… kawhi a miracle shot saved our season and in a parallel universe the sixers beat us and fvv and nurse get flamed for the stupidity… again thank god for kawhi that we moved on and fvv redeemed himself by going berserk the next few rounds…

Number one that doesn’t change that he’s still a super flawed player as most people are finally coming around to now. Number two you’re somehow arguing that I was wrong that someone else should’ve been getting fvvs minutes during the sixers and Orlando series because he brought absolutely nothing to the table especially against philly where their size was a problem for him. That’s a terrible argument and does not disprove anything I originally said. Like I said I’ll trust my player assessments because they also happen to be the more sound and objective analysis. It just takes people a few years to realize, but like I said you can keep coming at me. I’m still here. You’ll eventually agree with what I’m saying 3 years later and still pretend I’m delusional and a hater and come up with new reasons why Idk what I’m talking about even though it goes against better judgement.

You’ve been writing this same trash for 2 years now and you’re no more right today than you were when you wrote it the first time.

In what way. Instead of calling it trash do me a favour and break down exactly what I said is wrong and why. Prove it with some examples please. Thanks.

It seems this is all most people on this board know how to do when they disagree with something. Prove me wrong or don’t reply. Otherwise it’s your opinion that’s trash.

In case you still don’t know what you’re supposed to be arguing against, I’ll sum it up:

“Fvv was unplayable the first two series, and someone else should’ve taken his minutes especially against the sixers where the matchups were not in his favour.”

Go ahead tell me why that’s wrong.

[Dalek]

I wouldn't worry about OG too much, he will get going.

He probably isn't a top 2 player on an elite team and he might not ever be a true bluechip player but he will get out of this slump and play much better soon.

He is in a more uncomfortable role right now but it will improve his game.

I am not sure if it is the new role or the offseason "level up."

I honestly hate the offseason work that these guys do sometimes. They come into the new year trying to do too much because they expanded their handle or learned some creative ways to get their shot off.

OG's strength is his strength. The kid is 245 lbs at least and he should be bullying his way to the rim, not trying to do Harden stepbacks. Let Barnes and Siakam handle the ball a bit and OG do his work inside a bit more. The jumper will come, but he has to get back to basics.

[Boogie!]

I wouldn't worry about OG too much, he will get going.

He probably isn't a top 2 player on an elite team and he might not ever be a true bluechip player but he will get out of this slump and play much better soon.

He is in a more uncomfortable role right now but it will improve his game.

I am not sure if it is the new role or the offseason "level up."

I honestly hate the offseason work that these guys do sometimes. They come into the new year trying to do too much because they expanded their handle or learned some creative ways to get their shot off.

OG's strength is his strength. The kid is 245 lbs at least and he should be bullying his way to the rim, not trying to do Harden stepbacks. Let Barnes and Siakam handle the ball a bit and OG do his work inside a bit more. The jumper will come, but he has to get back to basics.

Og been trying. He is bullying people. In fact he’s so physical that he’s literally running into them and pushing them with his off hand.

That’s the problem though. He just doesnt have the savvy or composure or coordination to really finish in the paint consistently. He’s strong when he can gather and go up with two hands. But he’s telegraphed in his movements. It’s easy to see what he’s gonna do he has no craftiness or touch inside, every time I see him go up I know it’s getting blocked or it’s a brick.

But you’re right he shouldn’t be trying harden setbacks consistently either. So where does that leave him? Catch and shoot 3s, cutting, putbacks, maybe the occasional drive downhill off a handoff. But I just don’t trust his awareness. He’s a bull in a China shop… he’ll either bulldoze right through you or just run into you and force up an awkward shot and get blocked.

[Potential]

HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Am I the only one that can't sleep????????? I just waved the big raptors flag out the car window during the drive home. This team might fulfill my expectations of 60 wins led by Mr. SCOTTIE PIPPEN !!!!!!!!!

[Potential]

Magic Barnes deserves a record breaking sigs thread.

Brunoskull is back !

[Potential]

Boston Celtics worst home loss since 2007

[Dalek]

I wouldn't worry about OG too much, he will get going.

He probably isn't a top 2 player on an elite team and he might not ever be a true bluechip player but he will get out of this slump and play much better soon.

He is in a more uncomfortable role right now but it will improve his game.

I am not sure if it is the new role or the offseason "level up."

I honestly hate the offseason work that these guys do sometimes. They come into the new year trying to do too much because they expanded their handle or learned some creative ways to get their shot off.

OG's strength is his strength. The kid is 245 lbs at least and he should be bullying his way to the rim, not trying to do Harden stepbacks. Let Barnes and Siakam handle the ball a bit and OG do his work inside a bit more. The jumper will come, but he has to get back to basics.

Og been trying. He is bullying people. In fact he’s so physical that he’s literally running into them and pushing them with his off hand.

That’s the problem though. He just doesnt have the savvy or composure or coordination to really finish in the paint consistently. He’s strong when he can gather and go up with two hands. But he’s telegraphed in his movements. It’s easy to see what he’s gonna do he has no craftiness or touch inside, every time I see him go up I know it’s getting blocked or it’s a brick.

But you’re right he shouldn’t be trying harden setbacks consistently either. So where does that leave him? Catch and shoot 3s, cutting, putbacks, maybe the occasional drive downhill off a handoff. But I just don’t trust his awareness. He’s a bull in a China shop… he’ll either bulldoze right through you or just run into you and force up an awkward shot and get blocked.

Yup. He isn't that coordinated and misses that offensive awareness at times. I was hoping this would be his Jaylen Brown growth year, but got to give him some time. He looked better in preseason so I think we just have to ride out the awkwardness. He seems like he is overthinking everything.

Honestly, this team is mostly ugly so far. The offensive is clunky, and guys are not even getting much in the way of open shots. Once they settle into how they want to play, I'd expect OG to be a major impact. He might not need to be a 20 PPG scorer for thsi team to win. This is a depth team.

[sycammer]

this is what we were missing from the 2019-20 team in the playoffs, we lacked a player (Kawhi...or his type) to face off with Tatum, now we do; so its all good..

lol@ the board, 1 loss, the sky is falling & now, everything is good.

i have posted less & less over the years but i doubt any of the older ones can let go of not reading normal reactions.

[RalphWiggum]

Watching the highlites we really gotta give Fred a break.

He does things offensively that are criminal and hopefully get reigned in.

At the same time he's a defensive disruptor. FVV gives serious issues to guys he has no business giving issues to.