Official Raptors 2011 NBA Draft Thread, Part 4

AkelaLoneWolf · Post #41 » by **AkelaLoneWolf** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:39 pm

rapsrealm wrote:Chad Ford talks NBA Draft Prospects in the tournament:

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/player?rd= ... id=6227027

I posted this in the last thread, but he does a podcast with Bill Simmons where he makes similar points but in more detail. A good listen if you have the time.
Also,looks like Fredette is this year's Avery Bradley.

Rude Boy 1 · Post #42 » by **Rude Boy 1** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:44 pm

dagger wrote:Another note for Rude Boy on Valanciunas:

After Rytas blew out a Russian team today (the game wasn't very consequential so I am not going to make much of a deal of it), I asked the author of LithuanianBasketball.com whether Jonas has tipped his hand on entering the draft.
LithuaniaBasket
@accfanto Haven't heard anything, though I personally saw at least five scouts walking with his agent after the game. Could've been more.

So NBA teams are interested. This game was little more than a scrimmage and the scouts are sniffing around him constantly.

SO WHAT! I could care less what some author from LithuanianBasketball.com has to say :lol:

And who knows who those scouts are they could very easily be from teams not in the lottery! or more likely european scouts who's job it is to try report about the players overseas. That doesn't put Valanciunas any higher on my draft board just because scouts are at his game doing due diligence.

Rude Boy 1 · Post #43 » by **Rude Boy 1** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:51 pm

fredericklove wrote:Did anyone watch TJ today? He didn't play that great, scored a few buckets off isolation play and strong drives...but dude doesn't play with intensity and fire. Had some good defensive plays but he's just doesn't have the killer instinct when the game is on the line. So far he's struggled in last 5-6 games...I'm starting to have doubts about him.

This coming from a Harrison Barnes backer? lol

dagger · Post #44 » by **dagger** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:51 pm

Rude Boy 1 wrote:
dagger wrote:
Rude Boy 1 wrote:Can you show me some quotes? I haven't heard any teams declare they are salivating over Val.

Cleveland, which has two top 10 picks as things stand, is said to be looking at him as one of their two picks.

Listen, the Caliper test is not a test of basketball talent, but of one's likelihood to withstand pressure. Lots of teams use it, to supplement their assessment of the individuals they are draft rating.

By the way, it's reasonable to assume we use it on our other first round picks, so if that's the reason for opposing Valanciunas, you had better be anti-Irving and anti-Barnes and anti-Jones and anti-Sullinger, because we will probably give them the test, too.

So stop being a jackass.

That may be a word associated with you but not me my friend and I would advise you to use your words with a little more discretion.

You think I don't know what the caliper test is? It was made very clear its function and use during the drafting of the worst rebounding (and possibly defensive) bigman in the history of the game! When BC clearly stated that when he saw his scores were through the roof he had to select him. lol.

Euro basketball players play in a wack league with either NBA cast offs or worse European role players. When Europe says it has the next Gasol or Dirk I don't sleep but I tend to hit the snooze button a few times until we get an honest assessment of their true ability. No doubt the drafting of Roko Ukic, Andrea Bargnani, Alex Radojevic, Rafael Araujo have tainted my opinion on selecting European(or International if you will) players as it should, haven't been able to identify any studs like say Houston or San Antonio. And to go even further than that how many in the last 10 years selected in a lottery position have been anything more than just moderately serviceable?

2001
Pau Gasol
Dasagna Diop
Vlad Radmanovic

2002
Yao Ming
Nene
Nikoloz Tskitishvili

2003
Darko Miličić
Mickael Pietrus

2004
Andris Biedriņš

2005
Fran Vázquez
Yaroslav Korolev

2006
Andrea Bargnani
Mouhamed Sene
Thabo Sefolosha

2007
Yi Jianlian

2008
Danilo Gallinari

So now you're pulling up guys we drafted in the second round, or out of US junior college or college, and claim that that's an explanation for something in particular about foreign players. If you are extending it that far, how about:

Curiously your list omits certain people as well. Luol Deng, Serge Ibaka, Nicolas Batum, Rudy Fernandez, Anderson Varajeo, Luis Scola, as examples of guys playing well for their draft position.

Rude Boy 1 · Post #45 » by **Rude Boy 1** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 9:55 pm

dagger wrote:
So now you're pulling up guys we drafted in the second round, or out of US junior college or college, and claim that that's an explanation for something in particular about foreign players. If you are extending it that far, how about:

Curiously your list omits certain people as well. Luol Deng, Serge Ibaka, Nicolas Batum, Rudy Fernandez, Anderson Varajeo, Luis Scola, as examples of guys playing well for their draft position.

How many of those guys were taken in the lottery? No doubt Europe has role players who can develop into nice players, but we're dealing with franchise altering picks! In Europe those come once every Haley's Comet!

And to further my point, I'm not talking about the luck other teams have had I'm talking about our luck mainly. Every European we've drafted has been a complete disappointment we have had MUCH more luck with north American players.

dagger · Post #46 » by **dagger** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:03 pm

Rude Boy 1 wrote:
How many of those guys were taken in the lottery? No doubt Europe has role players who can develop into nice players, but we're dealing with franchise altering picks! In Europe those come once every Haley's Comet!

And to further my point, I'm not talking about the luck other teams have had I'm talking about our luck mainly. Every European we've drafted has been a complete disappointment we have had MUCH more luck with north American players.

How many Europeans have been rated as lottery worthy in the past. It's not like you are taking a high failure rate into consideration. In the last couple of years, the only European rated in the lottery has been Gallinari, and he's progressing along well for a guy who wasn't draft top 3 or 5.

As for our luck with North American players, Michael Bradley, Joey Graham and Chris Jeffries say hi. Even Charlie V. The players we have had great luck with in the lottery have been Carter, McGrady and Bosh. Carter and Bosh were selected fourth overall in the deepest drafts of the past 15 years. McGrady was a ninth overall pick. The 2006 draft was weak because it was the first without high schoolers like McGrady. Had that not been the case, that would have been the Oden and Durant draft, and we probably would have taken Oden since we wouldn't have known his future injury history.

fredericklove · Post #47 » by **fredericklove** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:10 pm

Rude Boy 1 wrote:
fredericklove wrote:Did anyone watch TJ today? He didn't play that great, scored a few buckets off isolation play and strong drives...but dude doesn't play with intensity and fire. Had some good defensive plays but he's just doesn't have the killer instinct when the game is on the line. So far he's struggled in last 5-6 games...I'm starting to have doubts about him.

This coming from a Harrison Barnes backer? lol

Oh look who's here, a dude who hates every 2011 prospects and one that's hated by everyone.

Rude Boy 1 · Post #48 » by **Rude Boy 1** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:12 pm

dagger wrote:
Rude Boy 1 wrote:
How many of those guys were taken in the lottery? No doubt Europe has role players who can develop into nice players, but we're dealing with franchise altering picks! In Europe those come once every Haley's Comet!

And to further my point, I'm not talking about the luck other teams have had I'm talking about our luck mainly. Every European we've drafted has been a complete disappointment we have had MUCH more luck with north American players.

How many Europeans have been rated as lottery worthy in the past. It's not like you are taking a high failure rate into consideration. In the last couple of years, the only European rated in the lottery has been Gallinari, and he's progressing along well for a guy who wasn't draft top 3 or 5.

As for our luck with North American players, Michael Bradley, Joey Graham and Chris Jeffries say hi. Even Charlie V. The players we have had great luck with in the lottery have been Carter, McGrady and Bosh. Carter and Bosh were selected fourth overall in the deepest drafts of the past 15 years. McGrady was a ninth overall pick. The 2006 draft was weak because it was the first without high schoolers like McGrady. Had that not been the case, that would have been the Oden and Durant draft, and we probably would have taken Oden since we wouldn't have known his future injury history.

I would also say Camby, Stoudamire and Peterson were solid picks. Hello!

A lot of Euros have been rated lottery worthy I would expect you to know that. What about Darko(in the deepest draft) what about Rubio(who is struggling to play in the league that hyped him) and of course Bargnani. Every year there is at least one Euro who is projected to be a lottery pick and they usually suck.

Rude Boy 1 · Post #49 » by **Rude Boy 1** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:14 pm

fredericklove wrote:
Rude Boy 1 wrote:
fredericklove wrote:Did anyone watch TJ today? He didn't play that great, scored a few buckets off isolation play and strong drives...but dude doesn't play with intensity and fire. Had some good defensive plays but he's just doesn't have the killer instinct when the game is on the line. So far he's struggled in last 5-6 games...I'm starting to have doubts about him.

This coming from a Harrison Barnes backer? lol

Oh look who's here, a dude who hates every 2011 prospects and one that's hated by everyone.

Not everyone just the one's that have have relied strictly on the hype machine to capture the hearts of nut huggers.

Yeezus_ · Post #50 » by **Yeezus_** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:21 pm

RudeBoy you can't say X player wont be a star because of the past players selected from Europe. Thats horrible logic.

Rude Boy 1 · Post #51 » by **Rude Boy 1** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:27 pm

raptorsnation_5 wrote:RudeBoy you can't say X player wont be a star because of the past players selected from Europe. Thats horrible logic.

I'm not saying that. I'm saying we can't afford to run the risk of being wrong again.

yayotube · Post #52 » by **yayotube** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:47 pm

Kawhi Leonard was nice today, 20 pts 10 boards. T Jones wasn't really.. I'd rather have Leonard at SF at this point, he's been doing it all year

Rude Boy 1 · Post #53 » by **Rude Boy 1** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:00 pm

yayotube wrote:Kawhi Leonard was nice today, 20 pts 10 boards. T Jones wasn't really.. I'd rather have Leonard at SF at this point, he's been doing it all year

Ya he's been consistent all year. Actually for the last two years. Its not the best conference to play in but can't with success. He needs to show he can make an NBA 3

yayotube · Post #54 » by **yayotube** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:07 pm

Rude Boy 1 wrote:
yayotube wrote:Kawhi Leonard was nice today, 20 pts 10 boards. T Jones wasn't really.. I'd rather have Leonard at SF at this point, he's been doing it all year

Ya he's been consistent all year. Actually for the last two years. Its not the best conference to play in but can't with success. He needs to show he can make an NBA 3

He was 3 of 5 from three point land today so that's encouraging. Hopefully he has a good tourney and his stock rises. I wanna see more from T Jones though cuz I still think he can be a nice player, but the last few games he hasn't really stood out

Silk Wilkes · Post #55 » by **Silk Wilkes** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:13 pm

Look at a Kawhi Leonard interview and tell me his personality does not remind you of Amir Johnson.

fredericklove · Post #56 » by **fredericklove** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:15 pm

Rude Boy 1 wrote:
This coming from a Harrison Barnes backer? lol

Oh look who's here, a dude who hates every 2011 prospects and one that's hated by everyone.[/quote]

Not everyone just the one's that have have relied strictly on the hype machine to capture the hearts of nut huggers.[/quote]

What a troll, I guess it's just too bad that he had to hit every clutch shots and scored 40 on an important game.

WhatsaTDot · Post #57 » by **WhatsaTDot** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:17 pm

Leonard will be another swingman without a mid range or an outside game. High on the do not want list.

Rude Boy 1 · Post #58 » by **Rude Boy 1** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:18 pm

fredericklove wrote:What a troll, I guess it's just too bad that he had to hit every clutch shots and scored 40 on an important game.

stay on those nuts kiddo. :wink:

Mr.Raptorsingh · Post #59 » by **Mr.Raptorsingh** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:20 pm

Should I watch Kemba or Jimmer?

Rude Boy 1 · Post #60 » by **Rude Boy 1** » Thu Mar 17, 2011 11:20 pm

yayotube wrote:
Rude Boy 1 wrote:
yayotube wrote:Kawhi Leonard was nice today, 20 pts 10 boards. T Jones wasn't really.. I'd rather have Leonard at SF at this point, he's been doing it all year

Ya he's been consistent all year. Actually for the last two years. Its not the best conference to play in but can't with success. He needs to show he can make an NBA 3

He was 3 of 5 from three point land today so that's encouraging. Hopefully he has a good tourney and his stock rises. I wanna see more from T Jones though cuz I still think he can be a nice player, but the last few games he hasn't really stood out

I hear that. Though 4-8 including a clutch three in his 1st tournament game ain't all that bad.

T. Jones is a nice player who isn't relied on to carry his team, they play to the matchups and did so today.