Raptors NBA Draft Thread: Meyers Leonard

fredericklove · Post #41 » by **fredericklove** » Tue May 22, 2012 11:07 pm

That's right guys, I don't get why the OP makes such a big fuss about Leonard. He shouldn't even be projected as 11-15th range, nor will he end up in top 5 which is unrealistic and unimaginable. However, if he was in the mid-20s, or early 2nd round, I'd definitely look to draft him at that range. So I don't mind using our 2nd round pick on him. He's supposed to be in that range, but scouts are really into those athletic type big guy hence the reason for his rising stock at the 15th-to-late 20s range. Imo, he's just a 2nd round prospect to me. Nothing about him that displays any special ability. Just another garbage minutes type of player, if lucky he can come off as 1st big off the bench.

lander · Post #42 » by **lander** » Wed May 23, 2012 5:37 am

edquantum wrote:
Dr Mufasa wrote:He reminds me a lot of a more athletic/jacked Valanciunas offensively, with elite hands and efficiency and both players liking those hookshots. Leonard looks better in the post and also hits those midrange shots in the way we expect Valanciunas can learn to but don't know about yet. I consider Leonard to be the better offensive prospect outright, while Valanciunas has him in rebounding and likely defensive aggressiveness.

Lithuania U19 Team 108, USA U19 Team 75

Leonard: ZERO points, ZERO rebounds, FOULED OUT in 8 min.
Valanciunas: 23 points, 11 rebounds in 25 min.

Lithuania U19 Team 105, USA U19 Team 107

Leonard: 3 points, 3 rebounds in 13 min.

Valanciunas: 30 points, 15 rebounds, 4 blocks in 38 min.

You are definitely right.

Wow that's epic :lol:

Elastic · Post #43 » by **Elastic** » Wed May 23, 2012 7:40 am

lolwut wrote:
Dr Mufasa wrote:

I've never seen this guy play, but one look at this picture and I can tell you he sucks.

This picture reminds me of this:

Prestige · Post #44 » by **Prestige** » Wed May 23, 2012 10:32 am

During my time on this board I've never seen such a mediocre prospect so hyped up by a poster..A few years ago I remember some posters having a huge man crush on Cole Aldrich but this takes the cake.

If this guy busts you might as well delete your account.

Post #45 » by **DG88** » Wed May 23, 2012 12:56 pm

I know people want to hear it but I wouldn't bet any of my personal money on Leonard being in the NBA after his rookie contract. I'm not saying I'd predict that happens just that I wouldn't feel good about my money being on the line in that scenario. Just MO, feel free to hate.

Mediocrity · Post #46 » by **Mediocrity** » Wed May 23, 2012 1:11 pm

edquantum wrote:
Dr Mufasa wrote:He reminds me a lot of a more athletic/jacked Valanciunas offensively, with elite hands and efficiency and both players liking those hookshots. Leonard looks better in the post and also hits those midrange shots in the way we expect Valanciunas can learn to but don't know about yet. I consider Leonard to be the better offensive prospect outright, while Valanciunas has him in rebounding and likely defensive aggressiveness.

Lithuania U19 Team 108, USA U19 Team 75

Leonard: ZERO points, ZERO rebounds, FOULED OUT in 8 min.
Valanciunas: 23 points, 11 rebounds in 25 min.

Lithuania U19 Team 105, USA U19 Team 107

Leonard: 3 points, 3 rebounds in 13 min.
Valanciunas: 30 points, 15 rebounds, 4 blocks in 38 min.

You are definitely right.

ATLTimekeeper · Post #47 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Wed May 23, 2012 1:28 pm

I think people are having a hard time separating the player from the guy that's boosting him the most. Leonard's a good center prospect. It's hard to argue otherwise, as there just aren't that many athletic, skilled 7 footers around that aren't complete morons. I'd feel comfortable if he was our pick, but at the same time I think there will be better options available.

God Squad · Post #48 » by **God Squad** » Wed May 23, 2012 1:37 pm

ATLTimekeeper wrote:I think people are having a hard time separating the player from the guy that's boosting him the most. Leonard's a good center prospect. It's hard to argue otherwise, as there just aren't that many athletic, skilled 7 footers around that aren't complete morons. I'd feel comfortable if he was our pick, but at the same time I think there will be better options available.

I really wouldn't feel comfortable at all drafting him at 8. I'd rather have Bargs/Val to be honest. I'm even getting tired of Bargs. But I think Andrea is way better than Leonard. I'd be fine if we drafted him late-mid teens. Even then I'd rather go Terrence Ross 8-)

.

edquantum · Post #49 » by **edquantum** » Wed May 23, 2012 2:14 pm

I would feel comfortable if he was our pick in 2nd round.

MacDaddy · Post #50 » by **MacDaddy** » Wed May 23, 2012 4:28 pm

edquantum wrote:
Dr Mufasa wrote:He reminds me a lot of a more athletic/jacked Valanciunas offensively, with elite hands and efficiency and both players liking those hookshots. Leonard looks better in the post and also hits those midrange shots in the way we expect Valanciunas can learn to but don't know about yet. I consider Leonard to be the better offensive prospect outright, while Valanciunas has him in rebounding and likely defensive aggressiveness.

Lithuania U19 Team 108, USA U19 Team 75

Leonard: ZERO points, ZERO rebounds, FOULED OUT in 8 min.
Valanciunas: 23 points, 11 rebounds in 25 min.

Lithuania U19 Team 105, USA U19 Team 107

Leonard: 3 points, 3 rebounds in 13 min.
Valanciunas: 30 points, 15 rebounds, 4 blocks in 38 min.

You are definitely right.

Exactly what I was thinking for the first 3 pages of this thread. I like Leonard for someone in the 15-20 range, but his upside is maybe in by the end of his rookie deal he'll be Jeff Foster. Not terrible, especially if you need a big center, but...

Dr Positivity · Post #51 » by **Dr Positivity** » Wed May 23, 2012 5:14 pm

Meyers averaged 15.2 pts, 11.5 rebs, 3.4 blks, 1.96 asts, 63.4% FG per 36 minutes in the U19 tournament. If you're actually using something as fallable as a tiny statistical sample size U19 tournament to judge a player as a bust, make sure his stats were actually bad, lol

xprt · Post #52 » by **xprt** » Wed May 23, 2012 5:37 pm

People are saying he sucked against Jonas not whole competition though his numbers aren't impressive if you consider he come from bench and played against bench C's. Yea he was backup of 6'9'' Patric Young who played better than him... Btw Jonas per 36 26.7 pts 16.1 rebs 3.7blks 59.8fg% and he was double tripple teamed unlike Leonard. So yea.

Dr Positivity · Post #53 » by **Dr Positivity** » Wed May 23, 2012 5:59 pm

U19 stats are ultimately meaningless, I was just pointing out Meyers' weren't even bad

If you want my justification for thinking Meyers is a tier above Jonas as a center prospect, I see him as being far more athletic and having more impact with his length, more skilled, and having much better court vision and basketball IQ on both ends. I'm not even sold on Jonas being a better rebounder than him at the next level considering Jonas' how and not what in terms of rebounding doesn't impress me. He has as much lift as Bargnani, doesn't have a ton of quick burst to get to boards, and gets overpowered [physically by opposing players - that's an extremely troubling group of signs for a rebounder. To me Jonas' rebounding doesn't scream "will work in the NBA".

edquantum · Post #54 » by **edquantum** » Wed May 23, 2012 6:10 pm

Dr Mufasa wrote:U19 stats are ultimately meaningless, I was just pointing out Meyers' weren't even bad

If you want my justification for thinking Meyers is a tier above Jonas as a center prospect, I see him as being far more athletic and having more impact with his length, more skilled, and having much better court vision and basketball IQ on both ends. I'm not even sold on Jonas being a better rebounder than him at the next level considering Jonas' how and not what in terms of rebounding doesn't impress me. He has as much lift as Bargnani, doesn't have a ton of quick burst to get to boards, and gets overpowered [physically by opposing players - that's an extremely troubling group of signs for a rebounder. To me Jonas' rebounding doesn't scream "will work in the NBA".

Just let it go. We'll talk in 3 years. Leonard probably will play in Phillipines. Good luck.

fredericklove · Post #55 » by **fredericklove** » Wed May 23, 2012 6:19 pm

Per 36 statistic is brought up for someone who played so poorly and got fouled out in little minutes and played unproductively lol. Just give it up. Its the most terrible comeback argument IMO.

Dr Positivity · Post #56 » by **Dr Positivity** » Wed May 23, 2012 6:29 pm

Hey fredericklove, I'll make you a sig bet since you have been on my back for some time - First year PER between Meyers Leonard and Jonas Valanciunas. (my bet Leonard, your bet Valanciunas) Winner gets to select the other's sig from the end of next year's season until the start of the following one (so the offseason)

wanker · Post #57 » by **wanker** » Wed May 23, 2012 6:35 pm

Dr Mufasa wrote:Hey fredericklove, I'll make you a sig bet since you have been on my back for some time - First year PER between Meyers Leonard and Jonas Valanciunas. (my bet Leonard, your bet Valanciunas) Winner gets to select the other's sig from the end of next year's season until the start of the following one (so the offseason)

Leonards' number of DNPs will be likely be much higher than his PER. He will be lucky to average 8-10 minutes a game.

Post #58 » by **Morris_Shatford** » Wed May 23, 2012 6:35 pm

Dr Mufasa wrote:If you want my justification for thinking Meyers is a tier above Jonas as a center prospect, I see him as being far more athletic and having more impact with his length, more skilled, and having much better court vision and basketball IQ on both ends.

I will give Leonard credit for going from a lean 7' 215lbs super athletic center prospect as a freshman to a legit and strong 7' 245lb center in his sophomore year but the athletic handle didn't quite come along for the ride.

Leonard has the size to bang with proper fives sometimes; other times he looks like a scared girl on prom night. The problem all season was pretty consistent when he got shut down, the other team threw a faster, athletic and undersized five or four on him he didn't just suffer on just defense, he suffered on offense.

Nebraska shut him down twice with the exact same routine, they sicked Ubel on him and nearly every shot he was about to take on offense he kicked out to the perimeter and when he went to the basket he took stupid fouls or turned it over, its like he doesn't realize he is 7' at times.

The same thing happened with Michigan, UNLV, Purdue, Michigan State, etc etc.

The reality is that the best team that Leonard looked like a solid offensive/defensive stud was against Missouri where he tossed up 14/13. He feasted on the Coppin State, Northwestern, Iowa and Cornell hardly the elites of the NCAA world.

I'm not saying that Leonard will be a bust; but he is a guy who can't seem to play offense consistently against smaller players and takes stupid fouls against them on defense over and over again, that to me doesn't define basketball IQ, it shows me a kid who either had a terrible coach who doesn't watch film or a player who simply didnt listen to his coach.

He is the type of the guy you take a flyer on at 20 because he fell, at a minimum because of his size you can use him to set screens and absorb contact under the basket but I guess I just don't see what you see in this guy on the floor or otherwise to warrant a lottery selection on him.

He looks in his second year with Illinois pretty similar to Aaron Gray in his last season in Pittsburgh, Leonard just happens to be younger and smaller.

Dr Positivity · Post #59 » by **Dr Positivity** » Wed May 23, 2012 6:35 pm

I'll also accept an avatar bet from dagger if he is interested.

fredericklove · Post #60 » by **fredericklove** » Wed May 23, 2012 6:36 pm

Dr Mufasa wrote:Hey fredericklove, I'll make you a sig bet since you have been on my back for some time - First year PER between Meyers Leonard and Jonas Valanciunas. (my bet Leonard, your bet Valanciunas) Winner gets to select the other's sig from the end of next year's season until the start of the following one (so the offseason)

BRING IT ON!!!!! Don't regret what you just said today.