Elephant in the room but isn't Barnes suppose to be getting better?

[Merit]

Idk gimme a franchise player who also isn’t the teams best scorer? And to add to that, tell me how that team succeeded/do or did they have championship potential

The joker and Murray? Haven’t checked but they come to mind immediately.

lol what? You're saying Jokic isn't their best scorer?

I’m just thinking in terms of PPG, not on court impact. I agree that scoring isn’t the only/best measure of player impact.

Edit: I checked. This example doesn’t work. Joker has more points too.

[mdenny]

Oh my god the Scottie barnes ppl are so crazy lol.

It's officially the worst delusion in franchise history. Worse than Bargnani. Worse than Jonas.

Mostly because there was never a toxic element of the fanbase that threw championship raptor players under the bus for bargnani or Jonas.

I mean...I'm not gonna do it. But we could have an absolute feast by pulling up old threads.

I feel bad for scotty because it's not his fault.

But it has literally been insane the amount of excuses and narratives and biases that have favored him since he came into the league. He might not be equipped for the backlash. It's kinda crazy how much of a golden child path he's been blessed with.

It may well be why he doesn't last in toronto.

[Boogie!]

Oh my god the Scottie barnes ppl are so crazy lol.

It's officially the worst delusion in franchise history. Worse than Bargnani. Worse than Jonas.

Mostly because there was never a toxic element of the fanbase that threw championship raptor players under the bus for bargnani or Jonas.

I mean...I'm not gonna do it. But we could have an absolute feast by pulling up old threads.

I feel bad for scotty because it's not his fault.

But it has literally been insane the amount of excuses and narratives and biases that have favored him since he came into the league. He might not be equipped for the backlash. It's kinda crazy how much of a golden child path he's been blessed with.

It may well be why he doesn't last in toronto.

I never thought I’d agree with you but here we are.

The thing is I actually want him to succeed.

[Tha Cynic]

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=PK_PTsLkYYyXkyf21hlLzg

It’s just practice, and it’s just one on one, but maybe this is what they’re seeing…it just isn’t manifesting in game situations yet.

Anyway we’ll see how it goes moving forward.

It’s not as complicated as all these threads. Barnes came in with scoring as his weakest attribute. It remains his weakest attribute. He played behind others in previous years. This season he became the top scoring option. His efficiency which was already not good has gotten even worse. He’s slowly working on new things. His defense definitely looks even better this season, but we only care about his scoring right now because that is what will vault this team to higher heights. His offensive efficiency has been **** and he’s not as aggressive getting to the hoop and drawing free throws as he needs to be when you look at it overall.

I still think he’s our best bet to improve offensively as he has a lot there to figure out and refine and he has shown flashes in the past of being able to get to his spots when needed. He needs to add to his repertoire and refine his finishing. I don’t see a lot of room for most of our other starters to improve offensively as they’re already in the refining stages of their career when you watch them play.

Let’s hope he improves and enjoy our summer lol.

[CazOnReal]

Idk gimme a franchise player who also isn’t the teams best scorer? And to add to that, tell me how that team succeeded/do or did they have championship potential

Magic Johnson for most of his career, 2020 LeBron, Steve Nash, Kyle Lowry

Just to name a few and aside from Nash, they would go on to win a championship (Nash would take a sub-20 win team to over 60 wins and the Western Conference Finals)

I dont know if Lowry is a franchise player

His nickname is literally Mr. Raptor.

[John Murdoch]

Just a bigger Jaden Mcdaniels

[nikster]

Magic Johnson for most of his career, 2020 LeBron, Steve Nash, Kyle Lowry

Just to name a few and aside from Nash, they would go on to win a championship (Nash would take a sub-20 win team to over 60 wins and the Western Conference Finals)

I dont know if Lowry is a franchise player

His nickname is literally Mr. Raptor.

Sure he has a special place in Rsptors hearts because of pretty unique circumstances. He was a high impact player, all star etc.. i don't think he meets the criteria for franchise player in the usual on court criteria of the term

[Merit]

Oh my god the Scottie barnes ppl are so crazy lol.

It's officially the worst delusion in franchise history. Worse than Bargnani. Worse than Jonas.

Mostly because there was never a toxic element of the fanbase that threw championship raptor players under the bus for bargnani or Jonas.

I mean...I'm not gonna do it. But we could have an absolute feast by pulling up old threads.

I feel bad for scotty because it's not his fault.

But it has literally been insane the amount of excuses and narratives and biases that have favored him since he came into the league. He might not be equipped for the backlash. It's kinda crazy how much of a golden child path he's been blessed with.

It may well be why he doesn't last in toronto.

Isn’t this what Fred Van Vleet said?

I don’t agree because he represents a contrarian position. By this I mean he represented rebuilding when the fan base wanted to go in that direction. Since the choice was made not to do that, he represented the “other” aka the “alternative” path. For that reason, he was criticized less, because the path of rebuilding is what many in the fan base wanted.

I am interested to see how Scottie succeeds and what his ideal offensive role is. I’m cheering for his success.

[Merit]

Just a bigger Jaden Mcdaniels

LOL

[Merit]

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=PK_PTsLkYYyXkyf21hlLzg

It’s just practice, and it’s just one on one, but maybe this is what they’re seeing…it just isn’t manifesting in game situations yet.

Anyway we’ll see how it goes moving forward.

It’s not as complicated as all these threads. Barnes came in with scoring as his weakest attribute. It remains his weakest attribute. He played behind others in previous years. This season he became the top scoring option. His efficiency which was already not good has gotten even worse. He’s slowly working on new things. His defense definitely looks even better this season, but we only care about his scoring right now because that is what will vault this team to higher heights. His offensive efficiency has been **** and he’s not as aggressive getting to the hoop and drawing free throws as he needs to be when you look at it overall.

I still think he’s our best bet to improve offensively as he has a lot there to figure out and refine and he has shown flashes in the past of being able to get to his spots when needed. He needs to add to his repertoire and refine his finishing. I don’t see a lot of room for most of our other starters to improve offensively as they’re already in the refining stages of their career when you watch them play.

Let’s hope he improves and enjoy our summer lol.

Basically this. He’s still developing his scoring in a developmental year.

[Indeed]

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=PK_PTsLkYYyXkyf21hlLzg

It’s just practice, and it’s just one on one, but maybe this is what they’re seeing…it just isn’t manifesting in game situations yet.

Anyway we’ll see how it goes moving forward.

It’s not as complicated as all these threads. Barnes came in with scoring as his weakest attribute. It remains his weakest attribute. He played behind others in previous years. This season he became the top scoring option. His efficiency which was already not good has gotten even worse. He’s slowly working on new things. His defense definitely looks even better this season, but we only care about his scoring right now because that is what will vault this team to higher heights. His offensive efficiency has been **** and he’s not as aggressive getting to the hoop and drawing free throws as he needs to be when you look at it overall.

I still think he’s our best bet to improve offensively as he has a lot there to figure out and refine and he has shown flashes in the past of being able to get to his spots when needed. He needs to add to his repertoire and refine his finishing. I don’t see a lot of room for most of our other starters to improve offensively as they’re already in the refining stages of their career when you watch them play.

Let’s hope he improves and enjoy our summer lol.

Basically this. He’s still developing his scoring in a developmental year.

You got to convince me his progress, so far it has been regressed, and to me, his new found skills are more due his previous skills not progressing and started alternative.

[Merit]

It’s not as complicated as all these threads. Barnes came in with scoring as his weakest attribute. It remains his weakest attribute. He played behind others in previous years. This season he became the top scoring option. His efficiency which was already not good has gotten even worse. He’s slowly working on new things. His defense definitely looks even better this season, but we only care about his scoring right now because that is what will vault this team to higher heights. His offensive efficiency has been **** and he’s not as aggressive getting to the hoop and drawing free throws as he needs to be when you look at it overall.

I still think he’s our best bet to improve offensively as he has a lot there to figure out and refine and he has shown flashes in the past of being able to get to his spots when needed. He needs to add to his repertoire and refine his finishing. I don’t see a lot of room for most of our other starters to improve offensively as they’re already in the refining stages of their career when you watch them play.

Let’s hope he improves and enjoy our summer lol.

Basically this. He’s still developing his scoring in a developmental year.

You got to convince me his progress, so far it has been regressed, and to me, his new found skills are more due his previous skills not progressing and started alternative.

I hear you. You could be right. I think he’s trying new things and building counters, but then again - I’m not to huffed when the aim of this season is strategic losing. Regardless, I think we both want to see him improve - and that’s the key at the end of the day.

[Vampirate]

Oh my god the Scottie barnes ppl are so crazy lol.

It's officially the worst delusion in franchise history. Worse than Bargnani. Worse than Jonas.

Mostly because there was never a toxic element of the fanbase that threw championship raptor players under the bus for bargnani or Jonas.

I mean...I'm not gonna do it. But we could have an absolute feast by pulling up old threads.

I feel bad for scotty because it's not his fault.

But it has literally been insane the amount of excuses and narratives and biases that have favored him since he came into the league. He might not be equipped for the backlash. It's kinda crazy how much of a golden child path he's been blessed with.

It may well be why he doesn't last in toronto.

Face the facts, once Kawhi left it was officially over, and we were heading into tradmill territory.

I've said this, had we rebuilt sooner, we likely save more money on Barnes current contract and are in a better position moving forwards (and who knows maybe draft Wemby if the stars align)

Had we just tore it down earlier and Barnes sank instead, it would've ended up in better draft picks regardless.

Summarizing things, Masai half assed the rebuild.

[brownbobcat]

Face the facts, once Kawhi left it was officially over, and we were heading into tradmill territory.

I've said this, had we rebuilt sooner, we likely save more money on Barnes current contract and are in a better position moving forwards (and who knows maybe draft Wemby if the stars align)

Had we just tore it down earlier and Barnes sank instead, it would've ended up in better draft picks regardless.

Summarizing things, Masai half assed the rebuild.

Rebuilding when you're still winning is a really, really difficult choice, so I'll never blame Masai for not blowing it up after 2019. Winning 50+ games is meaningful basketball.

2020-21: acceptable due to Tampa circumstances
2021-22: mostly acceptable because there was a glimmer of a decent core, though I hated the Thad trade
2022-23: completely unacceptable for obvious reasons, won't rehash
2023-24: outcome largely determined beforehand, an acceptable tank
2024-25: see above, jury's out on BI

The inflection point of 2022-23 really screwed things up, everything since then has been mostly window dressing.

[youngRAPZ]

Oh my god the Scottie barnes ppl are so crazy lol.

It's officially the worst delusion in franchise history. Worse than Bargnani. Worse than Jonas.

Mostly because there was never a toxic element of the fanbase that threw championship raptor players under the bus for bargnani or Jonas.

I mean...I'm not gonna do it. But we could have an absolute feast by pulling up old threads.

I feel bad for scotty because it's not his fault.

But it has literally been insane the amount of excuses and narratives and biases that have favored him since he came into the league. He might not be equipped for the backlash. It's kinda crazy how much of a golden child path he's been blessed with.

It may well be why he doesn't last in toronto.

Face the facts, once Kawhi left it was officially over, and we were heading into tradmill territory.

I've said this, had we rebuilt sooner, we likely save more money on Barnes current contract and are in a better position moving forwards (and who knows maybe draft Wemby if the stars align)

Had we just tore it down earlier and Barnes sank instead, it would've ended up in better draft picks regardless.

Summarizing things, Masai half assed the rebuild.

Scottie was getting that rookie max regardless. If the front office was going to squeeze him for 10mil over 5 years then
You’d be right about them being bad management.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mdenny]

Oh my god the Scottie barnes ppl are so crazy lol.

It's officially the worst delusion in franchise history. Worse than Bargnani. Worse than Jonas.

Mostly because there was never a toxic element of the fanbase that threw championship raptor players under the bus for bargnani or Jonas.

I mean...I'm not gonna do it. But we could have an absolute feast by pulling up old threads.

I feel bad for scotty because it's not his fault.

But it has literally been insane the amount of excuses and narratives and biases that have favored him since he came into the league. He might not be equipped for the backlash. It's kinda crazy how much of a golden child path he's been blessed with.

It may well be why he doesn't last in toronto.

Face the facts, once Kawhi left it was officially over, and we were heading into tradmill territory.

I've said this, had we rebuilt sooner, we likely save more money on Barnes current contract and are in a better position moving forwards (and who knows maybe draft Wemby if the stars align)

Had we just tore it down earlier and Barnes sank instead, it would've ended up in better draft picks regardless.

Summarizing things, Masai half assed the rebuild.

The best regular season in the history of the raptor franchise was the year after kawhi left.

[mdenny]

Oh my god the Scottie barnes ppl are so crazy lol.

It's officially the worst delusion in franchise history. Worse than Bargnani. Worse than Jonas.

Mostly because there was never a toxic element of the fanbase that threw championship raptor players under the bus for bargnani or Jonas.

I mean...I'm not gonna do it. But we could have an absolute feast by pulling up old threads.

I feel bad for scotty because it's not his fault.

But it has literally been insane the amount of excuses and narratives and biases that have favored him since he came into the league. He might not be equipped for the backlash. It's kinda crazy how much of a golden child path he's been blessed with.

It may well be why he doesn't last in toronto.

I never thought I’d agree with you but here we are.

The thing is I actually want him to succeed.

My opinion hasn't changed about scotty since his rookie season. Nice to see that you have been persuaded to see things my way.

There is still a chance that we fire darko and sign Fred Vanvleet as player coach next season. We'd be attaining the best player development veteran in the league. Plus giving him a chance to prove himself as a premier coach.

I'd love to see fred blowing a whistle during the play when Scotty starts losing focus.

I also commend your humility for recognizing being wrong about Fred for so many years and so many reasons.

[mdenny]

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=PK_PTsLkYYyXkyf21hlLzg

It’s just practice, and it’s just one on one, but maybe this is what they’re seeing…it just isn’t manifesting in game situations yet.

Anyway we’ll see how it goes moving forward.

It’s not as complicated as all these threads. Barnes came in with scoring as his weakest attribute. It remains his weakest attribute. He played behind others in previous years. This season he became the top scoring option. His efficiency which was already not good has gotten even worse. He’s slowly working on new things. His defense definitely looks even better this season, but we only care about his scoring right now because that is what will vault this team to higher heights. His offensive efficiency has been **** and he’s not as aggressive getting to the hoop and drawing free throws as he needs to be when you look at it overall.

I still think he’s our best bet to improve offensively as he has a lot there to figure out and refine and he has shown flashes in the past of being able to get to his spots when needed. He needs to add to his repertoire and refine his finishing. I don’t see a lot of room for most of our other starters to improve offensively as they’re already in the refining stages of their career when you watch them play.

Let’s hope he improves and enjoy our summer lol.

Now compare your comments on a 4th year player who has never done anything to 4th year players like Pascal siakam and fred vanvleet.

Y'know....the guys who won toronto a championship. You think we will ever see one again? Maybe you should've never been so dismissive about what fred and Pascal did.

Let's imagine we are 20 years in the future. Is scotty a better raptor than Fred or Pascal? I SERIOUSLY doubt it.

[HangTime]

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=PK_PTsLkYYyXkyf21hlLzg

It’s just practice, and it’s just one on one, but maybe this is what they’re seeing…it just isn’t manifesting in game situations yet.

Anyway we’ll see how it goes moving forward.

It’s not as complicated as all these threads. Barnes came in with scoring as his weakest attribute. It remains his weakest attribute. He played behind others in previous years. This season he became the top scoring option. His efficiency which was already not good has gotten even worse. He’s slowly working on new things. His defense definitely looks even better this season, but we only care about his scoring right now because that is what will vault this team to higher heights. His offensive efficiency has been **** and he’s not as aggressive getting to the hoop and drawing free throws as he needs to be when you look at it overall.

I still think he’s our best bet to improve offensively as he has a lot there to figure out and refine and he has shown flashes in the past of being able to get to his spots when needed. He needs to add to his repertoire and refine his finishing. I don’t see a lot of room for most of our other starters to improve offensively as they’re already in the refining stages of their career when you watch them play.

Let’s hope he improves and enjoy our summer lol.

Now compare your comments on a 4th year player who has never done anything to 4th year players like Pascal siakam and fred vanvleet.

Y'know....the guys who won toronto a championship. You think we will ever see one again? Maybe you should've never been so dismissive about what fred and Pascal did.

Let's imagine we are 20 years in the future. Is scotty a better raptor than Fred or Pascal? I SERIOUSLY doubt it.

Yes

[dballislife]

yes of course barnes had a disappointing season, but please do not act like hes a finished product...i dont even think rj is a finished product, he improved a lot since new york and why cant they polish it up some more and be better in their primes...a players prime is 25-32 and they not even in it yet