Official CBA/Labour Talks Discussion Thread II

[Twinkie defense]

So if the season gets cancelled does that mean the next draft will follow the same order? Hmmmm...

[ranger001]

I'd rather they come back after half a season than suffer through another tanking season.

I'm worried about suffering through a tanking season only to see a new age limit implemented under a new CBA. The benefits of tanking are greatly diminished if we're stuck hoping for Barnes at the top, with Perry Jones, Terrence Jones, Sullinger, Jeremy Lamb, and Thomas Robinson (who only today suffered an injury I believe) as the only other real options. Taking guys like Drummond/Davis/Miller/Gilchrist/Kabongo/Wroten/Rivers/Teague/Beal/A.Thomas out of the mix will really impact the quality and depth of this draft.

I had an idea on this. What if freshmen could only be drafted in the 2nd round? Would that make it too lopsided for lottery teams? I think it would increase parity quickly though. And most freshmen would stay longer if they are lottery quality.

[Ponchos]

Suppose NFL stadiums where horrendously expensive to maintain compared to NBA stadiums. Then if revenues were similar 52% in the NFL wouldn't be the same as 52% in the NBA.

Yep I get that. I disagree on the facts of your example but it doesn't really matter for my point, so I'll give it to you (can't compare NFL to NBA).

How about the NHL? Exactly the same number of games, in regular season and playoffs. Exactly the same type of arenas (Often shared between the NBA and NHL).

So why is 53%-57% ok for the NHL but not the NBA?

[Coach Smiley]

the score ran on their ticker all afternoon that a deal would be done today, bastards

[J-Roc]

Hallelujah!! Talks broken down. Let's get a different system. Something tangibly different.

And don't worry about age limits Raptor fans. Our GM is good at sending out teams who finish near the bottom. We can keep Andrea as our starting C for a few more seasons yet! Other teams don't have that.

[Ponchos]

Hallelujah!! Talks broken down. Let's get a different system. Something tangibly different.

And don't worry about age limits Raptor fans. Our GM is good at sending out teams who finish near the bottom. We can keep Andrea as our starting C for a few more seasons yet! Other teams don't have that.

Do you really honestly believe that talks breaking down improves the chances at a "different system"?

Really?

[J-Roc]

Hallelujah!! Talks broken down. Let's get a different system. Something tangibly different.

And don't worry about age limits Raptor fans. Our GM is good at sending out teams who finish near the bottom. We can keep Andrea as our starting C for a few more seasons yet! Other teams don't have that.

Do you really honestly believe that talks breaking down improves the chances at a "different system"?

Really?

In case you're still not sure.....yes.

[Ponchos]

Hallelujah!! Talks broken down. Let's get a different system. Something tangibly different.

And don't worry about age limits Raptor fans. Our GM is good at sending out teams who finish near the bottom. We can keep Andrea as our starting C for a few more seasons yet! Other teams don't have that.

Do you really honestly believe that talks breaking down improves the chances at a "different system"?

Really?

In case you're still not sure.....yes.

Reality has bad news for you then.

[I_Like_Dirt]

I had an idea on this. What if freshmen could only be drafted in the 2nd round? Would that make it too lopsided for lottery teams? I think it would increase parity quickly though. And most freshmen would stay longer if they are lottery quality.

I think that's pretty much an age limit in and of itself. I think the only players who would leave as a freshmen at this point would be the horribly raw ones who had burned out their college coaches with their antics who just wanted to leave college and head to the NBA even if it meant sacrificing a bunch of money. Isn't the whole point of the age limit to keep those the kinds of players out of the league until they've matured a little?

[J-Roc]

WojYahooNBA Adrian Wojnarowski
Stern confirms NBA schedule is cancelled through November 30th.
12 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

[Orsk]

In my opinion the players union just continue to look worse and worse. The NBA admits that the current system doesn't work, is trying to come up with something to make the league more competitive and by default more entertaining and are simply trying to get a better return on the huge, risky investments as any business should.

The players on the other hand simply want to get paid the most money they possibly can with the most possible destinations they can possibly get. The Union doesn't give a rats about the fans who actually make it possible for them to play, or the league that organizes for them to play, or even the competitiveness of the league - considering every superstar says "I just want to win". I call BS. I hope the owners lock them out until next June.

[J-Roc]

People like to say that Owners can decide how much to pay players. They don't. GM's do. And GM's are just like coaches, trying to save their hide by making bold moves to build winning teams. If they spend too much....oh well, they get fired and move to the next team.

The reason a better system is needed is so that GM's can be held in check. So that "market value" is redefined as something that can let an owner go to sleep at night. There is no real advantage to fans for players to have a strong union. But there *could* be an advantage to fans for the union to be broken once and for all.

And since the Raptors truly suck donkey balls these days and for the forseeable future, might as well do it now.

[dagger]

In my opinion the players union just continue to look worse and worse. The NBA admits that the current system doesn't work, is trying to come up with something to make the league more competitive and by default more entertaining and are simply trying to get a better return on the huge, risky investments as any business should.

The players on the other hand simply want to get paid the most money they possibly can with the most possible destinations they can possibly get. The Union doesn't give a rats about the fans who actually make it possible for them to play, or the league that organizes for them to play, or even the competitiveness of the league - considering every superstar says "I just want to win". I call BS. I hope the owners lock them out until next June.

I don't blame the union's approach, just that as an old labour negotiator myself, I know that there is a time to fold em. As my old labour boss used to say, you are paid to make tough decisions, or as he put it, "It's time to shiat or get off the pot."

[J-Roc]

Keep in mind folks, a lot of the media rhetoric you'll hear now will be from people who are trying to save their own jobs. So the media will make it sound like the player or the owners should just give in, their so close, etc, etc.

The truth is that if either side is not happy, and if they think they can withstand the consequences, they should stand strong, as they're doing now.

[Indeed]

In my opinion the players union just continue to look worse and worse. The NBA admits that the current system doesn't work, is trying to come up with something to make the league more competitive and by default more entertaining and are simply trying to get a better return on the huge, risky investments as any business should.

The players on the other hand simply want to get paid the most money they possibly can with the most possible destinations they can possibly get. The Union doesn't give a rats about the fans who actually make it possible for them to play, or the league that organizes for them to play, or even the competitiveness of the league - considering every superstar says "I just want to win". I call BS. I hope the owners lock them out until next June.

I don't blame the union's approach, just that as an old labour negotiator myself, I know that there is a time to fold em. As my old labour boss used to say, you are paid to make tough decisions, or as he put it, "It's time to shiat or get off the pot."

Indeed, but union is not looking at money, they seem to be looking at contract length, which hurts the competitive of each team (bad contracts). The union could target young players or development teams to provide more talents and expansion for basketball itself, instead of focusing on middle class players.

[dagger]

Keep in mind folks, a lot of the media rhetoric you'll hear now will be from people who are trying to save their own jobs. So the media will make it sound like the player or the owners should just give in, their so close, etc, etc.

I often disagree with you, but I think you are right here. bloggers are the most insecure because most of them have no fallback.

Today's cancellations cover three more home games: Boston, Milwaukee and Phoenix.

[dd2410]

Stephen A Smith reported on ESPN radio that Fisher and Kobe are willing to accept 50%, while other players (KG & Pierce) would not

[C Court]

The players holding out for 52% is not a good bargaining stance at this point. They have to move to 51% or 50% to get a deal. The owners can out wait the players and will.

[Hassassin]

Stephen A Smith reported on ESPN radio that Fisher and Kobe are willing to accept 50%, while other players (KG & Pierce) would not

Another reason to hate the Celtics

[ronleroy]

well, we don't know where smith is getting his info from, throwing kobe out of no where.