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Young Moosehead wrote:mihaic wrote:C_Money wrote:
And how do you kill two birds with one stone?
Easier than you may think. You can go pick up the stone that killed the first bird.
Option 2) Ricochet
Option 3) Really big stone. Birds standing kinda close.
KenoP13 wrote:OakleyDokely wrote:Los_29 wrote:
Pascal is our best player and he just turned 28 years old. If you trade him you'll just be spending the next few years trying to get a player as good as he is. We didn't need to trade Lowry when he was 29 years old in 2015 and we don't need to trade Pascal. Pascal is an ALL-NBA caliber player who can easily be the 2nd option on a championship team.
Yes, it'd be great if Scottie became our franchise player but you don't force him to become one when he's not one at this point in time. And that also doesn't mean you trade everyone that is ahead of him on the pecking order. If Scottie truly becomes a franchise player then no moves will need to be made because he will take over the team and the other players will take on less responsibility.
I don't think people realize just how disastrous it is to trade ALL-NBA caliber players in their prime. It never works out and Scottie will be signing somewhere else in 3-4 years after numerous trips to the lottery because we traded our best players for picks and unproven prospects. LOL.
Trading ALL-NBA talent in their prime never happens because teams aren't dumb enough to trade them unless they request a trade LOL. Garnett and Pierce were in their mid-30's when they were dealt, not in their prime. The reason you don't see teams trade ALL-NBA players in their prime is because you're never going to get equal value for them. You can get back all the picks in the world but there is a 99% chance that those picks don't end up ever netting you a player as good as the player you are trading. The Garnett/Pierce trade was one of the worst trades in history simply because they were well past their prime and the Nets became a lottery team because of it. But if that trade was made even three years earlier, the Nets would've had some reasonably successful playoff runs and the Celtics would have never landed Brown and Tatum as they would've been picking in the late 20's instead of the high lottery.
Celtics are also a good example. They had Tatum/Brown but still went out and acquired Kyrie, signed Hayward and then when Kyrie wanted out they replaced him with Kemba. Notice how they not only didn't trade their best players but they actually went out and acquired more pieces. Do you think that hurt Tatum and Brown's development? I'd say it helped their development because they weren't given a ton of a responsibility earlier in their careers and were able to progress properly. Tatum/Brown don't know what it's like to lose. They've been a part of a winning culture their entire career.
It's like saying the Celts should've traded away Horford prior to the season because he's older than the core group and he'd take minutes away from Williams. Good teams have players in all age brackets and they have multiple good players at all positions.
Horford plays a very particular role on the team. He is not a high usage player taking 15-20 shots per game. I think they are very different situations.
Chandan wrote:Young Moosehead wrote:mihaic wrote:
Easier than you may think. You can go pick up the stone that killed the first bird.
Option 2) Ricochet
Option 3) Really big stone. Birds standing kinda close.
The first bird could have swallowed the small bird while it's still alive. And when you hit it with a stone it penetrates both birds (the big one and the small one inside of it) killing both at the same time.
manjusaka wrote:cedric76 wrote:Bleacher report just proposed this:
The Sign-and-Trade: OG Anunoby for Mo Bamba, Chuma Okeke and a 2023 first-round pick (via Chicago)
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2956628-trade-packages-and-landing-spots-for-toronto-raptors-forward-og-anunoby
It is just speculation at this point but this trade proposal looks good.
KenoP13 wrote:720 wrote:brownbobcat wrote:Age 32 season and later:
Lowry - 2 AS appearance, 0 seasons of VORP > 3
Duncan - 5 AS appearance, 5 seasons of VORP > 3
Garnett - 4 AS appearance, 2 seasons of VORP > 3
Nowitzki - 4 AS appearance (excluding his "special" selection), 3 seasons of VORP > 3
Siakam's not those HOFer - less talented and he probably can't transition to C as easily. I think the bigger question, though, is what do you trade him for if you want to re-shuffle the timelines? I think a lotto pick could really backfire just as easily as losing him to age.
I feel like you can only trade Siakam for an instant impact type player, someone with star potential or a package of 2-3 1st rounders (the picks gotta be high so not a trade to a contender for picks).
As each year goes by and he’s 1 year older obviously depending on how he plays this’ll change. But atm he should warrant a big package of picks and or prospects.
This is why Ujiri needs to become best friends with Divac in the next few weeks. Take him out drinking.. Pamper him up.. And get him to give us their fourth pick, Davion Mitchell and a few more first rounds picks.. Knowing their dysfunctional management.. Those picks could all be in the top 10.
Update- Oh, I had no clue Divac was out.. That really puts a hamper on everything..
WuTang_OG wrote:I just checked the nba cap is going to $122M for next season (from $112M) .. $10M increase.
Does this do anything to our situation or nah?
If we dont trade Trent this off-season then we likely are retaining him
lobosloboslobos wrote:WuTang_OG wrote:I just checked the nba cap is going to $122M for next season (from $112M) .. $10M increase.
Does this do anything to our situation or nah?
If we dont trade Trent this off-season then we likely are retaining him
One thing about GTj is nobody ever thinks about him getting better. maybe it is because he sort of seems like a finished product already in the way he plays. He just looks like an older guy. But he is only 22! he could and almost certainly will improve, and maybe by quite a bit in the coming years. Who really knows what his ceiling is? It could be very high.
Mikistan wrote:Chandan wrote:Young Moosehead wrote:
Option 2) Ricochet
Option 3) Really big stone. Birds standing kinda close.
The first bird could have swallowed the small bird while it's still alive. And when you hit it with a stone it penetrates both birds (the big one and the small one inside of it) killing both at the same time.
you could also throw the rock at a very critical component of a running combustion enginge/nuclear reactor, thereby triggering a large explosion which could also kill at least 2 birds
Young Moosehead wrote:Mikistan wrote:Chandan wrote:
The first bird could have swallowed the small bird while it's still alive. And when you hit it with a stone it penetrates both birds (the big one and the small one inside of it) killing both at the same time.
you could also throw the rock at a very critical component of a running combustion enginge/nuclear reactor, thereby triggering a large explosion which could also kill at least 2 birds
I wonder how many birds were killed by the stone that wiped out the dinosaurs? It may be the unofficial record holder.
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WuTang_OG wrote:lobosloboslobos wrote:WuTang_OG wrote:I just checked the nba cap is going to $122M for next season (from $112M) .. $10M increase.
Does this do anything to our situation or nah?
If we dont trade Trent this off-season then we likely are retaining him
One thing about GTj is nobody ever thinks about him getting better. maybe it is because he sort of seems like a finished product already in the way he plays. He just looks like an older guy. But he is only 22! he could and almost certainly will improve, and maybe by quite a bit in the coming years. Who really knows what his ceiling is? It could be very high.
He will most definitely get better. Can he enter the same group as a Beal or Klay? He's got to work on his handle and finishing at the rim, those are key areas for him.
I just have no idea if they intend to pay him and OG $50m
Young Moosehead wrote:WuTang_OG wrote:lobosloboslobos wrote:
One thing about GTj is nobody ever thinks about him getting better. maybe it is because he sort of seems like a finished product already in the way he plays. He just looks like an older guy. But he is only 22! he could and almost certainly will improve, and maybe by quite a bit in the coming years. Who really knows what his ceiling is? It could be very high.
He will most definitely get better. Can he enter the same group as a Beal or Klay? He's got to work on his handle and finishing at the rim, those are key areas for him.
I just have no idea if they intend to pay him and OG $50m
If by 50M, you mean 25M/year each, then yes I think we will pay them that happily. GTJ will sign in 1 year, and OG in year 2. In year 3 the cap is expected to go up to 175 million. Two of your top five make ~1/7th of your cap is pretty decent cap management. SO while a brief overpay, the deals will be bargains by the end of the contract, just like what happened with the deals we gave Norm and DD. They always felt like an overpay in year 1 and a bargain in year 4.
lobosloboslobos wrote:Young Moosehead wrote:WuTang_OG wrote:He will most definitely get better. Can he enter the same group as a Beal or Klay? He's got to work on his handle and finishing at the rim, those are key areas for him.
I just have no idea if they intend to pay him and OG $50m
If by 50M, you mean 25M/year each, then yes I think we will pay them that happily. GTJ will sign in 1 year, and OG in year 2. In year 3 the cap is expected to go up to 175 million. Two of your top five make ~1/7th of your cap is pretty decent cap management. SO while a brief overpay, the deals will be bargains by the end of the contract, just like what happened with the deals we gave Norm and DD. They always felt like an overpay in year 1 and a bargain in year 4.
Totally agree with this. I also think Masai pays his guys on the basis of "I'm going to give you what you want because I know that you will deserve it and more when you become great in the next few years". It's part of his winning culture approach. "I'm not going to dick you around with money, because I believe in you. I'm also not going to lock you in. I trust you will want to stay because this is the best place for you and nobody treats players as well as me. Now go win a title." etc. And imo it generally has worked. He has hardly signed any contracts, and no big ones that i can think of, that became problems or big overpays. On the contrary almost everyone has been well worth what we paid them. Which is a lot more than you can say for most GMs.
WuTang_OG wrote:lobosloboslobos wrote:Young Moosehead wrote:
If by 50M, you mean 25M/year each, then yes I think we will pay them that happily. GTJ will sign in 1 year, and OG in year 2. In year 3 the cap is expected to go up to 175 million. Two of your top five make ~1/7th of your cap is pretty decent cap management. SO while a brief overpay, the deals will be bargains by the end of the contract, just like what happened with the deals we gave Norm and DD. They always felt like an overpay in year 1 and a bargain in year 4.
Totally agree with this. I also think Masai pays his guys on the basis of "I'm going to give you what you want because I know that you will deserve it and more when you become great in the next few years". It's part of his winning culture approach. "I'm not going to dick you around with money, because I believe in you. I'm also not going to lock you in. I trust you will want to stay because this is the best place for you and nobody treats players as well as me. Now go win a title." etc. And imo it generally has worked. He has hardly signed any contracts, and no big ones that i can think of, that became problems or big overpays. On the contrary almost everyone has been well worth what we paid them. Which is a lot more than you can say for most GMs.
If the cap is going up by that much then Trent isnt going anywhere.
TGM wrote:tripa wrote:TGM wrote:OG you don't trade man. This guy is a unicorn. He doesn't have that obnoxious demeanor, but he wins us games.
No one is untouchable maybe except for Scottie, but if you get a kings ransom you need to consider the trade.
Do you know what the word unicorn means?
I'm not being fickle like most of you changing your stance on a player over who is the flavor of the month.
You that legit two way players like OG don't grow on trees? You might have guys that have amazing offense or defense, but playing the two way game OG can in the shadow of Kawhi is next level. He also has the body and athleticism to impact the game in the way the league is played now.
I'll give you an example, OG's value in the league is sort of like Jimmy Butler back with the Bulls. He is viewed as a good two way player, but not a go to guy. Look at Jimmy B now. Trading OG at the age he is act, is one of those things that you regret as a franchise 2-3 years later. Wiggins is sort of also going down that path slowly. Look at Demar. Some guys don't blossom as fast, but have an extended ceiling where you give time they keep on improving. That's who OG is.
Trent, sure let him go. Apart from get some steals, he actually isn't a great defender. Guys like him you can easily replace. What OG can become don't just give up.
Also, OG has one of those quiet demeanors. I'm sure if he was loud obnoxious like a Joel, right away people would think he is a better player. We saw what OG could do when he has the ball and can be a focal part of the offense. Its Nurse's job to figure out how to extract the most out of the guy. But don't question the talent.
WuTang_OG wrote:
WuTang_OG wrote:
