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Houston readying full-court press for Bosh

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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#541 » by Ripp » Fri May 7, 2010 7:27 pm

The Franchise_ wrote: How about we still have Scola and Hill? Our worst case scenario is we draft a backup C (hopefully Solomon Alabi) and go forward with the team we have and our NY picks. We would still be a contender with or without Bosh.


Sorry, I found this comment very odd. Why Alabi? He isn't ranked anywhere near 14 on the draft boards? What do you see in him? Draft Express has Orton and Whiteside @ 13 and 14, Alabi all the way down at 21st.

Just curious for your motivation behind this particular choice..Alabi seems pretty raw.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#542 » by Skeebs » Fri May 7, 2010 7:41 pm

If alabi 'seems' raw then what do you think whiteside is.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#543 » by Contract Season » Fri May 7, 2010 8:09 pm

Ripp wrote:
The Franchise_ wrote: How about we still have Scola and Hill? Our worst case scenario is we draft a backup C (hopefully Solomon Alabi) and go forward with the team we have and our NY picks. We would still be a contender with or without Bosh.


Sorry, I found this comment very odd. Why Alabi? He isn't ranked anywhere near 14 on the draft boards? What do you see in him? Draft Express has Orton and Whiteside @ 13 and 14, Alabi all the way down at 21st.

Just curious for your motivation behind this particular choice..Alabi seems pretty raw.


Alabi's not that raw. He's most NBA-ready out of Whiteside-Orton-Alabi, imo.
He's skinny, not raw.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#544 » by Ripp » Fri May 7, 2010 8:13 pm

^--- I see, thanks for clarifying. I'll read up more on him and the other prospects. BTW, why do you think he is ranked much lower than Orton/Whiteside? Limited upside/poor motor/etc?
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#545 » by panthermark » Fri May 7, 2010 8:19 pm

I think Amare has a higher ceiling, but a lower floor (if that makes sense for someone that old).

He is bigger, stronger, more dynamic, and more explovise than Bosh. But he can also be very unmotivated at times...and has had some serious injuries.

Bosh over Amare...but only by a hair.

And in case anyone is even thinking it...no...I'm not the new poster.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#546 » by Skeebs » Fri May 7, 2010 8:20 pm

Amare is what bosh wishes he was. Strong, explosive and can score with the best of them.

I can guarantee you bosh will NEVER avg 28 ppg in his lifetime.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#547 » by Rhettmatic » Fri May 7, 2010 8:23 pm

Skeebs wrote:Amare is what bosh wishes he was. Strong, explosive and can score with the best of them.

I can guarantee you bosh will NEVER avg 28 ppg in his lifetime.


Neither has Amare?
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#548 » by dacrusha » Fri May 7, 2010 8:24 pm

Skeebs wrote:Amare is what bosh wishes he was. Strong, explosive and can score with the best of them.

I can guarantee you bosh will NEVER avg 28 ppg in his lifetime.


Neither will Amare.

Further more, Bosh has outscored Amare in 4 of his 7 seasons in the league... and that's WITHOUT an MVP caliber PG playing at his side.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#549 » by Contract Season » Fri May 7, 2010 8:30 pm

Ripp wrote:^--- I see, thanks for clarifying. I'll read up more on him and the other prospects. BTW, why do you think he is ranked much lower than Orton/Whiteside? Limited upside/poor motor/etc?


I think it's mostly upside. Alabi is what he is, a poor man's Dalembert. At best he might be as good as Sammy D.
The other two guys have very high ceilings. Not DeMarcus Cousins or Andrew Bynum-high, but pretty high.
Brendan Haywood is a pretty good centre and Orton and Whiteside both could potentially be a fair bit better than him. Alabi won't be.

Alabi is more advanced than either, but is skinnier and lacks the offensive upside of either. He's also 2-3 years older.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#550 » by Contract Season » Fri May 7, 2010 8:31 pm

dacrusha wrote:
Skeebs wrote:Amare is what bosh wishes he was. Strong, explosive and can score with the best of them.

I can guarantee you bosh will NEVER avg 28 ppg in his lifetime.


Neither will Amare.

Further more, Bosh has outscored Amare in 4 of his 7 seasons in the league... and that's WITHOUT an MVP caliber PG playing at his side.


Not to mention Bosh is a much better defender than Amare (the matador).
Maybe pre-injury Amare was better, but I take Bosh every time these days.
Bosh playing with Nash would be a second-team all-NBA player.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#551 » by Ripp » Fri May 7, 2010 8:32 pm

panthermark wrote:I think Amare has a higher ceiling, but a lower floor (if that makes sense for someone that old).

He is bigger, stronger, more dynamic, and more explovise than Bosh. But he can also be very unmotivated at times...and has had some serious injuries.

Bosh over Amare...but only by a hair.

And in case anyone is even thinking it...no...I'm not the new poster.


^-- That is just way too simplistic and fuzzy a way of looking at things. How does "bigger, stronger, more dynamic" show up on the floor? He doesn't rebound, defend, or block shots as well as Bosh. The shot-blocking and rebounding are especially damning for the following reasons:
a) Amare gets off the ground almost instantaneously
b) CB is a mediocre shot-blocker.
c) The Suns play in a face-paced system, so his rebounds/blocked shots are inflated.

It is nice to have athletic gifts, but they are wasted unless used. Beasley is supposed to have a crazy vertical, but doesn't rebound and plays strictly below the rim.

The concrete issue I have with Amare is will he be able to maintain his offensive productivity (both volume, and efficiency, a key second parameter that many seem to ignore, since high volume, low-efficiency scoring from a big man is highly undesirable) without a Steve Nash-level PG setting him up? There are very few players in the league with Nash's pure point skills...

With Bosh, there is no risk of this. He has never played with an elite guard...thus, you can reasonably expect elite guard-play to improve his scoring. This is the main reason I assume CB is a more highly-sought after commodity than Amare (or at least was, before the All-NBA teams, and the Suns surprising post-season success occured.)
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#552 » by neurotik » Fri May 7, 2010 8:36 pm

Amare has a better body for a big man, he is stronger and more explosive than Bosh. But Bosh has more talent. Bosh can create his own shot better than Amare. Also Bosh has more drive than Stoudemire (who can coast at times).

The talent and determination to reach his potential is what makes Bosh the better player.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#553 » by Skeebs » Fri May 7, 2010 8:52 pm

Rhettmatic wrote:
Skeebs wrote:Amare is what bosh wishes he was. Strong, explosive and can score with the best of them.

I can guarantee you bosh will NEVER avg 28 ppg in his lifetime.


Neither has Amare?


Oh my bad he averaged 26 ppg on 559 field goal accuracy. With 1.6 blocks a game. Something bosh would never dream of accomplishing. Amares career fg% if .554 bosh has only been above .500 two times and his highest was .518 which was last year.

Bosh is just a stat stuffer.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#554 » by Skeebs » Fri May 7, 2010 8:54 pm

dacrusha wrote:
Skeebs wrote:Amare is what bosh wishes he was. Strong, explosive and can score with the best of them.

I can guarantee you bosh will NEVER avg 28 ppg in his lifetime.


Neither will Amare.

Further more, Bosh has outscored Amare in 4 of his 7 seasons in the league... and that's WITHOUT an MVP caliber PG playing at his side.


Thats because bosh is a volume shooter, the ball goes through his hands every damn possession. Amare had multiple 20 ppg game scorers to work with his entire career and still put up amazing %s
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#555 » by whysoserious » Fri May 7, 2010 8:56 pm

Skeebs wrote:
Rhettmatic wrote:
Skeebs wrote:Amare is what bosh wishes he was. Strong, explosive and can score with the best of them.

I can guarantee you bosh will NEVER avg 28 ppg in his lifetime.


Neither has Amare?


Oh my bad he averaged 26 ppg on 559 field goal accuracy. With 1.6 blocks a game. Something bosh would never dream of accomplishing. Amares career fg% if .554 bosh has only been above .500 two times and his highest was .518 which was last year.

Bosh is just a stat stuffer.



Switch Amare with Bosh over the last seven seasons and Bosh's career looks more successful and Amare faces all the problems Bosh has had here of being a lone star. Give Bosh Nash and Marion before and now Nash, J-Rich and he has a much more successful personal career and team career over the past 5 or 6 seasons.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#556 » by The Franchise_ » Fri May 7, 2010 8:58 pm

Ripp wrote:Sorry, I found this comment very odd. Why Alabi? He isn't ranked anywhere near 14 on the draft boards? What do you see in him? Draft Express has Orton and Whiteside @ 13 and 14, Alabi all the way down at 21st.

Just curious for your motivation behind this particular choice..Alabi seems pretty raw.


Alabi is very raw on the offensive side of the ball, but as a defensive backup he can be plugged right in immediately. He is not a great rebounder for his size, but he is a good shotblocker, and plays excellent post defense. Another positive is his desire to learn, positive attitude and work ethic which is rare in a player with the potential that he has. The only offense I see him contributing this year is cleanup around the rim, but as long as he can protect the paint that's all we'll need from him. After the Kevin Martin trade our offense was very fluid, but we were a revolving door on defense (that was true even before the trade). With the return of Yao and Alabi backing him up our biggest weakness is totallly eliminated. As far as taking him over Whiteside an Orton well there are different reasons for each of them.

Orton would be a good project, but he's not as NBA ready defensively, and his offensive game may be even rawer (did I say that right?) than Alabi's. Solomon is also 3 inches taller with a longer wingspan which can only help him. To be honest the only reason I think Orton is rated higher than Alabi is because he went to Kentucky. As far as Whiteside goes, I can understand some of the hype. He has ridiculous athleticism, a nice midrange jumper, can put the ball on the floor and score, and is a shotblocking monster. He is also a below average defender, a horrible passer, is to small to hold his position in the post, and is not very intelligent. He doesn't seem to have the bbiq to grasp Rick Adelman's system. He wasn't able to fully grasp the high school offense they ran at Marshall, can you imagine him having any luck with complicated NBA sets? I wouldn't be too disappointed getting Orton but I think Alabi fits our needs a little better. The only future I see for Whiteside is a taller Stromile Swift. I want NO parts of that. :lol:
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#557 » by Skeebs » Fri May 7, 2010 8:58 pm

People that say bosh is a better rebounder, thats just not true. They both have career 2.9 offensive rebounds per game.

Anyways how can bosh go from 1.4 blocks a game in 33 mins his rookie year to now supposedly being this better player who averages 1 block per game in 38 minutes? Did he just forget or was he too busy trying to staff his stats grabbing garbage rebounds and boring isos all game long.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#558 » by Skeebs » Fri May 7, 2010 9:01 pm

whysoserious wrote:

Switch Amare with Bosh over the last seven seasons and Bosh's career looks more successful and Amare faces all the problems Bosh has had here of being a lone star. Give Bosh Nash and Marion before and now Nash, J-Rich and he has a much more successful personal career and team career over the past 5 or 6 seasons.


You have to be good to be the second best player on a stacked team and leading that stacked team in fg% rebounds and ppg and blocks per game. Amare was putting up numbers that were nuts. Before his microfracture he was a freaking beast. Still is a good player, so fun to watch. Bosh is just a boring player.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#559 » by LarsV8 » Fri May 7, 2010 9:07 pm

Why are you so intent on comparing Bosh and Amare ^ It doesnt really matter for the purposes of this discussion. Both are good players, both have thier strengths and weaknesses.
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Re: Houston readying full-court press for Bosh 

Post#560 » by dacrusha » Fri May 7, 2010 9:08 pm

LarsV8 wrote:Why are you so intent on comparing Bosh and Amare ^ It doesnt really matter for the purposes of this discussion. Both are good players, both have thier strengths and weaknesses.


He's comparing Bosh to Amare because a comparison of Bargs to Amare would be just too hilarious to comprehend.
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