[Smith] No Raptors Trade Imminent - Could Wait Until End Of Summer League To Find Backup Center

[Tor_Raps]

keep poeltl healthy

Such an unserious franchise, who rides their entire seasons success on a role player (Poeltl) lol. While a Barnes/CMB lineup could be fun at times, you want to be prepared for when you need to play big or if there's an injury to Poeltl.

The 2019 raptors were great because the team could literally play every style (big/normal/small) depending on the opponent/situation. Not saying we are the 2019 raptors but the thought process remains as you want to be dynamic and be able to adjust no matter what a full nba season throws at you...

[kalel123]

So, everybody's 6' 8" and under except Poeltl. Or 6' 7" and under if you exclude Ingram.

Yeah, that's gonna go great.

[Shakril]

A Backup Center should not be that hard to find:

He needs to be able to play 10-16 minutes
Grab Rebounds
Be At least decent at rim protection
Be young with a little upside, so he can learn from poeltl

Everything else is just a bonus.

[tsherkin]

So, everybody's 6' 8" and under except Poeltl. Or 6' 7" and under if you exclude Ingram.

Yeah, that's gonna go great.

Every strategy/decision has pros and cons. The point isn't to not address this at all, though; it's not to panic and rush into a trade just for the sake of adding size. You can add a minimum player with real size and they may not actually be any good (wherefore being available at the minimum). We need to exercise a little patience and good sense.

[Shakril]

I'm not really concerned about this. I want to see Barnes, CBM, and Mogbo playing minutes at C in smaller, more athletic lineups. We actually need to learn what lineups work and which ones don't.

I don't love the idea of Barnes at the 5 for various reasons. The other guys, we need to at least try. And we likely aren't going to find a conventionally-sized center who has the tools we want, so it's likely going to be some flier or someone like our end-season 10-days fleshing out the roster. We'll probably just deal with being a donut team and hope to shore things up elsewhere, I'd imagine.

And as you say, a minimum signing playing over our guys probably doesn't make a lot of sense. You get what you pay for, after all. Like, it would be awesome to have a Hartenstein-level player... but that's a starter, not a backup. We just need someone to eat bench minutes and back up Yak. We aren't chasing a title this year, so we don't have to be perfect.

Why the other guys and not Barnes? Isn’t he the tallest, heaviest, biggest wingspan, and most athletic (per combine testing)?

Nothing Barnes has shown, gives me confidence he is able to play the 5. As a help defender, great, he made many defensive plays that way, but not as a primary rim protector. He has troubles dealing with bigger bodies - on defense and offense.

[Basketball_Jones]

ORob is out?

[tsherkin]

Nothing Barnes has shown, gives me confidence he is able to play the 5. As a help defender, great, he made many defensive plays that way, but not as a primary rim protector. He has troubles dealing with bigger bodies - on defense and offense.

This. I suppose this is the nicer way to say it, heh. I don't mind Barnes at the 4, in fact I think we should probably look to use him there a little more so we can tolerate him as a non-shooter a bit better. But we need a little more from the 5, and he's just not physical enough at this point.

[Tor_Raps]

So, everybody's 6' 8" and under except Poeltl. Or 6' 7" and under if you exclude Ingram.

Yeah, that's gonna go great.

If you haven't learned the previous 5 years then why adjust right loll. Its almost like our management team became completely stupid after winning the 2019 championship and forgot what type of team it took to go all the way.

Is it a coincidence that our success fell off a cliff when we went from:
JV/Amir, JV/Poeltl, JV/Ibaka, Gasol/Ibaka
To
Baynes/Len

Obviously this wasn't the only reason but it was an important reason.

[TimeForChange]

So, everybody's 6' 8" and under except Poeltl. Or 6' 7" and under if you exclude Ingram.

Yeah, that's gonna go great.

how many teams around the nba have 2 legit 7 footers?

3? maybe 4?

[tsherkin]

So, everybody's 6' 8" and under except Poeltl. Or 6' 7" and under if you exclude Ingram.

Yeah, that's gonna go great.

If you haven't learned the previous 5 years then why adjust right loll. Its almost like our management team became completely stupid after winning the 2019 championship and forgot what type of team it took to go all the way.

Is it a coincidence that our success fell off a cliff when we went from:
JV/Amir, JV/Poeltl, JV/Ibaka, Gasol/Ibaka
To
Baynes/Len

Obviously this wasn't the only reason but it was an important reason.

We definitely need to improve on the defensive boards. But we were actually top-10 in causing turnovers last season. We have some specific issues here and there, but we hit the O-boards well enough, and we're not going to find a post scoring threat with the resources we have available to move anyway, so that's not really a concern of note.

SIZE isn't the largest issue we have right now. We need to improve a lot more on the offensive side of things than we need to worry about size... and a backup 5 isn't going to be a primary influence for such, especially since we were already 4th in the league in offensive rebounding.

[manjusaka]

With Temple back on a one-year deal that will pay him about $3.6 million (U.S.), Toronto has 12 players on fully guaranteed contracts (including Wednesday’s No. 9 draft pick Collin Murray-Boyles) and has to decide what to do with second-round pick Alijah Martin.

They have non-guaranteed contracts in place with Jamison Battle, A.J. Lawson and Colin Castleton, plus two-way deals with Ulrich Chomche, Jared Rhoden and Chucky Hepburn, an undrafted guard signed after the draft ended Thursday night.

The dozen guarantees: Immanuel Quickley, RJ Barrett, Scottie Barnes, Jakob Poeltl, Jamal Shead, Ochai Agbaji, Gradey Dick, Jonathan Mogbo, Ja’Kobe Walter, Ingram, Murray-Boyles and Temple.

That’s 19 players under consideration already. Teams can have 15 full roster spots and three players on two-way deals.

12 Guarantees

IQ/Shead
IG/JKW/Temple
RJB/Dick/Agbaji
SB/CMB/Mogbo
Poeltl/

2 ways
Ulrich Chomche,
Jared Rhoden
Chucky Hepburn,

Non Guaranteed:
Jamison Battle,
A.J. Lawson
Colin Castleton

Alijah Martin

Exhibit 10
Tyson Degenhar
Clifford Omoruyi


Our summer league is going to be a test for the players to grab those final roster spots.

[Tor_Raps]

So, everybody's 6' 8" and under except Poeltl. Or 6' 7" and under if you exclude Ingram.

Yeah, that's gonna go great.

If you haven't learned the previous 5 years then why adjust right loll. Its almost like our management team became completely stupid after winning the 2019 championship and forgot what type of team it took to go all the way.

Is it a coincidence that our success fell off a cliff when we went from:
JV/Amir, JV/Poeltl, JV/Ibaka, Gasol/Ibaka
To
Baynes/Len

Obviously this wasn't the only reason but it was an important reason.

We definitely need to improve on the defensive boards. But we were actually top-10 in causing turnovers last season. We have some specific issues here and there, but we hit the O-boards well enough, and we're not going to find a post scoring threat with the resources we have available to move anyway, so that's not really a concern of note.

SIZE isn't the largest issue we have right now. We need to improve a lot more on the offensive side of things than we need to worry about size... and a backup 5 isn't going to be a primary influence for such, especially since we were already 4th in the league in offensive rebounding.

Or course but those things you outlined are a skill issue that isnt so easy to acquire or develop. We have a lot of questions to answer like can we be good without a true number 1 option, can scottie be more efficient, can IQ remain healthy and be an actual PG, etc.

Finding a good backup C shouldn't be as hard as the above so thats why some of us are getting on the front office for not being able to fill this void.

[kalel123]

So, everybody's 6' 8" and under except Poeltl. Or 6' 7" and under if you exclude Ingram.

Yeah, that's gonna go great.

how many teams around the nba have 2 legit 7 footers?

3? maybe 4?

Last I checked, there's more than a bit of a difference between 6' 7" and 7' 0". Something in-between would be nice? I don't need another 7-footer. Just someone who can spell Poeltl when he sits or worse, when he's out with injury. There's nobody that can do that on this team and some minimum guy from scrap heap isn't the answer.

[ArthurVandelay]

ORob is out?

Definitely

Don’t think Darko was a fan

[kalel123]

So, everybody's 6' 8" and under except Poeltl. Or 6' 7" and under if you exclude Ingram.

Yeah, that's gonna go great.

Every strategy/decision has pros and cons. The point isn't to not address this at all, though; it's not to panic and rush into a trade just for the sake of adding size. You can add a minimum player with real size and they may not actually be any good (wherefore being available at the minimum). We need to exercise a little patience and good sense.

Like how Raps didn't panic and rush into a trade and legit sucked ass?

Nobody wants panic and rush but some urgency would be appreciated after few years of being undersized and pushed around and being in more trouble than they should be whenever Poeltl is out.

[tsherkin]

Or course but those things you outlined are a skill issue that isnt so easy to acquire or develop. We have a lot of questions to answer like can we be good without a true number 1 option, can scottie be more efficient, can IQ remain healthy and be an actual PG, etc.

Finding a good backup C shouldn't be as hard as the above so thats why some of us are getting on the front office for not being able to fill this void.

I mean, it isn't easy to find a quality backup 5 with size. That's why we have nothing but undersized guys at the moment, and had end-season action like OR and Castleton. It isn't easy to find someone who hasn't been appreciated and will have the skill to be of value. It's not like you can snap your fingers and summon a guy who can fill the role, after all. Or we'd have done so already.

Yes, we have lots of questions... but we also don't have to solve all of them at once. Building into a perennially-dangerous team doesn't happen overnight, remember.

[TimeForChange]

So, everybody's 6' 8" and under except Poeltl. Or 6' 7" and under if you exclude Ingram.

Yeah, that's gonna go great.

how many teams around the nba have 2 legit 7 footers?

3? maybe 4?

Last I checked, there's more than a bit of a difference between 6' 7" and 7' 0". Something in-between would be nice? I don't need another 7-footer. Just someone who can spell Poeltl when he sits or worse, when he's out with injury. There's nobody that can do that on this team and some minimum guy from scrap heap isn't the answer.

ok how many teams have 2 legit centers on their roster?

I would think it's less than half the league.

A back up center is not the be all and end all to win.

[Scase]

The thing is CMB has played C throughout his college career in a very good conference. He’s used to playing that position and playing guys bigger than him and he still dominated. Yes the NBA is a different beast, but when you’re comparing him to some of the back up Cs we’ve tried over the years, I’m very confident he’ll be better than them. He’s strong, he’s tough, he’s a good defender and he’s a good rebounder. He’ll be fine. And even if he struggles at least he’ll be getting the playing time to develop and learn.

This is the angle a lot of pro-CMB guys take. That and "he has handles and can dribble penetrate."

So hopefully this is the case. He's pretty solid at like 6'8ish in shoes and 240 lbs, with great reach. So maybe if he had a longer neck, we'd think about him differently, but he definitely has good base and knows how to use his body in the lane. Maybe he'll do, especially as a backup. It would also mitigate some of the issues with his problematic shooting.

While I have zero belief in the whole Draymond comparison, at the very least he shows that you can be undersized and still do the job, you just need all the other intangibles to make it work. If there is nothing else I have always defaulted to trusting, it's been this FOs ability to draft even as much as I hate adding yet another non shooter, they must've seen something in CMB.

Hopefully we scale back Jaks minutes down to the usual 26mpg, and let CMB show us what he can do.

[Tor_Raps]

Or course but those things you outlined are a skill issue that isnt so easy to acquire or develop. We have a lot of questions to answer like can we be good without a true number 1 option, can scottie be more efficient, can IQ remain healthy and be an actual PG, etc.

Finding a good backup C shouldn't be as hard as the above so thats why some of us are getting on the front office for not being able to fill this void.

I mean, it isn't easy to find a quality backup 5 with size. That's why we have nothing but undersized guys at the moment, and had end-season action like OR and Castleton. It isn't easy to find someone who hasn't been appreciated and will have the skill to be of value. It's not like you can snap your fingers and summon a guy who can fill the role, after all. Or we'd have done so already.

Yes, we have lots of questions... but we also don't have to solve all of them at once. Building into a perennially-dangerous team doesn't happen overnight, remember.

We have been such a joke in trying to fill the Center spot since 2020 that Orlando Robinson was the 2nd best Center weve had during that time and we let him go.

While I loved Masai, this is a results based Industry and he had none since the glory years. We dont need to hear excuses for being unable to fill a void for THAT long, do your job better.

[LoveMyRaps]

I am the complete opposite of the people ok with some min guy. F that!

Go get an actual GOOD backup so we don't have to have this major drop in team play when Yak sits.

Assuming our top 5 guys start...

Shead, Walter, Ochai, Dick, Battle, CMB, Mogbo are fighting for the 2nd unit. We CLEARLY have extra 2's/3's/4's....go move one for a legit backup.

Not only will it give us a better 2nd unit but someone we can start when Yak misses games....and he will miss games.

And it doesn't force guys like Barnes and CMB to take a beating vs 5's keeping them healthier.

And it thins out the middle of the lineup freeing up that logjam a bit.

Adding that C is a MUST IMO if they want to get the most out of this team.

I think Castleton will Poeltl’s backup next season, which is unfortunate because the guy stinks.