Pascal is on the brink of SUPERSTARDOM...

[Los_29]

We won a chip with him as the second option in his 3rd season. Anyone think scotty's third year is gonna outshine pascal and fred showing out in the nba finals during their third year?

Fred having the best 3 game shooting streak in nba playoff history? Pascal dropping +30 in game one of the nba finals? Pascal scoring the chip clinching bucket? Fred making three 3's in the final 8 minutes of game 6 and out--dueling Steph Curry?

Fact is...if scotty EVER has the high points that fred and Pascal had then he'd be serving well. I'm skeptical scotty will ever have those moments....much less next season.

No sane person believes it. That team had Kawhi, Lowry, Marc Gasol, Danny Green, Ibaka. Pascal was damn lucky to play with that group so there was no pressure on him.

Veteran savvy allowed for him to be the 2nd leading scorer. His responsibilities were minor compared to that of Kawhi, Lowry, and Gasol. This drives me crazy too. Pascal is talented but he is functioning in a totally different capacity than 2019. He has to mold to the circumstance, molding your roster around his current role would be a disaster. Frankly, he's not that good at creating consistent and resilient offense. And so people claim he's a #2. Well how is he contributing as a #2 when the #1 is controlling the offense? Pascal doesn't space the floor, he rarely rolls or pops after screens. It's similar to DeMar where they're developing to be a focal point but their weaknesses prevent them from an effective secondary role. People keep clamoring for retaining him and building but without painting a realistic picture of what that looks like. All I hear is shooting and guard play. Easier said than done. Where is that coming from?

Watch on YouTube

You can see how he can contribute as a 2nd option here.

[YogurtProducer]

It's been quite a transition for Siakam this season. From superstar to top 15 to all star to 2nd option and now talk of just a 3rd option?

Trade rumor can't be far around the corner at this rate.

Siakam was never a superstar.
He was a top 15-20 player.
And a #3 option on a contending team. (Kawhi, Lowry)

Siakam as a #1 option means that team is a non-playoff team (now)

I don’t think it’s fair the say Siakam as a #1 option is a non playoff team. We’ve seen previous iterations be playoff teams (2022) or even borderline elite (2020) but that’s a damn good all around team.

He’s obviously better suited in a complimentary #2 role, and any team where he is a #3 would be absolutely elite (like we were in 2019 when he was half the player he is now).

Siakam getting so much flask after playing a very good play-in game is honestly just weird. He wasn’t why we lost and he certainly is not to blame for us going 41-41

[HiJiNX]

A lot of y’all turn into, well to be nice, not very rational people, when things aren’t going well.

To be fair, I've never been highly impressed with the new Pascal. Honestly, I think simply having more of his shots assisted would please me. About 40% of his shots are assisted. That's near top of league on unassisted looks. Not sure he is quite that good. Could be system, could be surrounding talent. I'm less interested in finding out than most.

I would agree in the sense that I don’t think the Raptors have developed Siakam properly. He’s not a natural scorer. And he doesn’t have physical and mental tools to mold him into a more natural scorer. His best value is as a guy who can get into the paint and set up others primarily and to score when passing opportunities aren’t present. Our team is generally much better over the past two seasons when Siakam plays that way than when he tries to be a top scorer because he’s not efficient enough to play that role. My favourite version of Siakam is when he’s decisive with the ball and finding teammates and scoring within the flow of the offence. I would also say that our coach and system haven’t went in this direction of usage for our top players. I’m not sure why we built an iso centric offence with guys who can’t iso, can’t contested shots off the dribble and generally only shoot well when open off catch and shoot jumpers. Developing Siakam in this way has led him to being a player that doesn’t know how to manage the momentum of the game and can sometimes ice his teammates out of the game with his ball stopping.

[Spates]

No sane person believes it. That team had Kawhi, Lowry, Marc Gasol, Danny Green, Ibaka. Pascal was damn lucky to play with that group so there was no pressure on him.

Veteran savvy allowed for him to be the 2nd leading scorer. His responsibilities were minor compared to that of Kawhi, Lowry, and Gasol. This drives me crazy too. Pascal is talented but he is functioning in a totally different capacity than 2019. He has to mold to the circumstance, molding your roster around his current role would be a disaster. Frankly, he's not that good at creating consistent and resilient offense. And so people claim he's a #2. Well how is he contributing as a #2 when the #1 is controlling the offense? Pascal doesn't space the floor, he rarely rolls or pops after screens. It's similar to DeMar where they're developing to be a focal point but their weaknesses prevent them from an effective secondary role. People keep clamoring for retaining him and building but without painting a realistic picture of what that looks like. All I hear is shooting and guard play. Easier said than done. Where is that coming from?

Watch on YouTube

You can see how he can contribute as a 2nd option here.

If you read my posts you'll know that I LOVE that version of Siakam. He doesn't play like that anymore. 2nd leading scorer but not secondary creator. There are so many subtle and significant differences to his game between then and now. For better and for worse. Shot selection, pace, and speed of attack.... He had like very limited bad shots and didn't over dribble.

[HiJiNX]

The reality is that Siakam is an inconsistent jump shooter off the dribble and a fairly average FT shooter, and not strong enough to finish in heavy traffic, and can have shaky confidence at times. You obviously can’t rely on him to be a go to player in the clutch. He just doesn’t have the qualities. That doesn’t mean he’s a role player or whatever ridiculous label y’all want to put on him. It’s just he can’t be the focal point of your offence in the clutch, especially when your team has no competent shooting so opponents can just load up on Siakam without fear of consequence.

So my concern is what he provides in the clutch. He's not spacing, he's no longer cutting, he doesn't pick and pop. Will he just corner watch and play lazy defense.

The thing is what you’re describing isn’t just a Siakam problem, that’s a team wide issue. Nobody can guard at the end of games because they’re being overplayed. Nobody is spacing because our shooters are inconsistent. Nobody is cutting because our offence doesn’t feed cutters. Nobody is pick and popping because our screen setting is generally awful (not to mention the shooting).

If you swapped out Siakam with any superstar 3/4 type player you’re not gonna see a huge improvement in the team’s results, assuming Nurse is still playing guys into the ground. Maybe we win 48 games instead of 41 but we ain’t getting out the second round and maybe not even the first. Without better offensive players across the board the ceiling for this team is low. The only way this core works is if Barnes takes a massive leap and guys like Precious and OG and Trent take smaller ones.

[Spates]

A lot of y’all turn into, well to be nice, not very rational people, when things aren’t going well.

To be fair, I've never been highly impressed with the new Pascal. Honestly, I think simply having more of his shots assisted would please me. About 40% of his shots are assisted. That's near top of league on unassisted looks. Not sure he is quite that good. Could be system, could be surrounding talent. I'm less interested in finding out than most.

I would agree in the sense that I don’t think the Raptors have developed Siakam properly. He’s not a natural scorer. And he doesn’t have physical and mental tools to mold him into a more natural scorer. His best value is as a guy who can get into the paint and set up others primarily and to score when passing opportunities aren’t present. Our team is generally much better over the past two seasons when Siakam plays that way than when he tries to be a top scorer because he’s not efficient enough to play that role. My favourite version of Siakam is when he’s decisive with the ball and finding teammates and scoring within the flow of the offence. I would also say that our coach and system haven’t went in this direction of usage for our top players. I’m not sure why we built an iso centric offence with guys who can’t iso, can’t contested shots off the dribble and generally only shoot well when open off catch and shoot jumpers. Developing Siakam in this way has led him to being a player that doesn’t know how to manage the momentum of the game and can sometimes ice his teammates out of the game with his ball stopping.

I entirely agree. I'm not sure where we'll see his game go next. I love to see a reversion to his old habits alongside his refined skillset. That's a matter of coaching and his own willingness to play a certain way. I feel it's a situation where players need a new setting to revise their style. I could be guilty of lacking imagination but at this point I can hardly envision schematic differences in how this squad plays. Players revert to what they know under pressure.

The system dates back to DeRozan too. I remember fans being divided over the lack of ball movement. I think it's time this team moves towards a balanced attack with well rounded players. Isocentrism only works for the best of the best.

I loved that 2019 team for it's incredible defense. The offense was stressful at times aside from Kawhi's singular greatness. In comparison the 2014 Spurs are a blessing to watch.

[Spates]

The reality is that Siakam is an inconsistent jump shooter off the dribble and a fairly average FT shooter, and not strong enough to finish in heavy traffic, and can have shaky confidence at times. You obviously can’t rely on him to be a go to player in the clutch. He just doesn’t have the qualities. That doesn’t mean he’s a role player or whatever ridiculous label y’all want to put on him. It’s just he can’t be the focal point of your offence in the clutch, especially when your team has no competent shooting so opponents can just load up on Siakam without fear of consequence.

So my concern is what he provides in the clutch. He's not spacing, he's no longer cutting, he doesn't pick and pop. Will he just corner watch and play lazy defense.

The thing is what you’re describing isn’t just a Siakam problem, that’s a team wide issue. Nobody can guard at the end of games because they’re being overplayed. Nobody is spacing because our shooters are inconsistent. Nobody is cutting because our offence doesn’t feed cutters. Nobody is pick and popping because our screen setting is generally awful (not to mention the shooting).

If you swapped out Siakam with any superstar 3/4 type player you’re not gonna see a huge improvement in the team’s results, assuming Nurse is still playing guys into the ground. Maybe we win 48 games instead of 41 but we ain’t getting out the second round and maybe not even the first. Without better offensive players across the board the ceiling for this team is low. The only way this core works is if Barnes takes a massive leap and guys like Precious and OG and Trent take smaller ones.

Again, I agree. And it's a reason why I'm ready to move on from Pascal and Fred. I'm partial to drafting quality players. Consolidation will only empty an already limited pipeline.

[mdenny]

The reality is that Siakam is an inconsistent jump shooter off the dribble and a fairly average FT shooter, and not strong enough to finish in heavy traffic, and can have shaky confidence at times. You obviously can’t rely on him to be a go to player in the clutch. He just doesn’t have the qualities. That doesn’t mean he’s a role player or whatever ridiculous label y’all want to put on him. It’s just he can’t be the focal point of your offence in the clutch, especially when your team has no competent shooting so opponents can just load up on Siakam without fear of consequence.

I generally agree with this description.

I think this franchise needs to add a more traditional basketball player to the mix. We have glut of "unique" player styles. Many of which aren't American which is part of it.
.
Everyone talking about Wemby but in my dream scenario we'd get Scoot.

It's been a hot minute since this franchise had a straight hooper who grew up playing one on one in an American city. Fred is kinda traditional. Poetl is kinda traditional (for their positions). Our other guys are kinda hard to describe and don't have clear comparables.

I have no idea why OG escapes all criticism here. He makes pretty much the same money as fred but if you listened to most ppl on this board....there's no such thing as a bad OG game. I've come to the conclusion that fans simply don't attribute any responsibility to him in regards to wins and losses which is strange given that he's no longer on a rookie contract and how much money he makes.

[GreatWhiteStiff]

Og doesn't get criticism because he's probably the best wing lock in the league and gives you efficient offense, his contract is a steal by today's nba standards. Outisde of that fire away. Also people criticize (and criticized) him all the time and he was the whipping boy for a while, and people gradually took a liking to him.

[Sidthekid87]

The reality is that Siakam is an inconsistent jump shooter off the dribble and a fairly average FT shooter, and not strong enough to finish in heavy traffic, and can have shaky confidence at times. You obviously can’t rely on him to be a go to player in the clutch. He just doesn’t have the qualities. That doesn’t mean he’s a role player or whatever ridiculous label y’all want to put on him. It’s just he can’t be the focal point of your offence in the clutch, especially when your team has no competent shooting so opponents can just load up on Siakam without fear of consequence.

I generally agree with this description.

I think this franchise needs to add a more traditional basketball player to the mix. We have glut of "unique" player styles. Many of which aren't American which is part of it.
.
Everyone talking about Wemby but in my dream scenario we'd get Scoot.

It's been a hot minute since this franchise had a straight hooper who grew up playing one on one in an American city. Fred is kinda traditional. Poetl is kinda traditional (for their positions). Our other guys are kinda hard to describe and don't have clear comparables.

I have no idea why OG escapes all criticism here. He makes pretty much the same money as fred but if you listened to most ppl on this board....there's no such thing as a bad OG game. I've come to the conclusion that fans simply don't attribute any responsibility to him in regards to wins and losses which is strange given that he's no longer on a rookie contract and how much money he makes.

Scoot is a pretty terrible shooter. Not really sure if he warrants the hype he's been getting.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Superstar confirmed

[Vampirate]

Superstar confirmed

He's averaging about the same stats as he was in the regular season which are not superstar numbers, the one thing he hasn't done is shrink though.

[theonlyeastcoastrapsfan]

Congrats Pascal!! Champ and a winner!!

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Superstar confirmed

He's averaging about the same stats as he was in the regular season which are not superstar numbers, the one thing he hasn't done is shrink though.

Hahahaha, keep reaching for straws, while Pascal reaches for the ECF MVP trophy

[Childs]

Watch on YouTube

[Public_Enemy101]

Disagree. He was given the keys to the franchise and couldn’t carry them. Now he’s surrounded by a MUCH BETTER team and can flourish. Halliburton was a legit superstar and Pascal benefitted from it greatly.

[LoveMyRaps]

Superstar confirmed

He loves the spotlight.

Elevates his game on the big stage.

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Disagree. He was given the keys to the franchise and couldn’t carry them. Now he’s surrounded by a MUCH BETTER team and can flourish. Halliburton was a legit superstar and Pascal benefitted from it greatly.

No, he was called spoiled and was disrespected by the the organization and this fanbase. He is a superstar, Barnes is not. Pascal Siakam HOF

[Public_Enemy101]

Disagree. He was given the keys to the franchise and couldn’t carry them. Now he’s surrounded by a MUCH BETTER team and can flourish. Halliburton was a legit superstar and Pascal benefitted from it greatly.

No, he was called spoiled and was disrespected by the the organization and this fanbase. He is a superstar, Barnes is not. Pascal Siakam HOF

He was spoiled and I agree so is Barnes. Pascal didn’t do sh*t for the Raptors after Lowry and Kawhi left.

[james vincent]

It is bittersweet but I’m happy for pascal and I hope the pacers go all the way. It’s unfortunate that it didn’t work in Toronto but I hold no malice towards him and the team’s situation (at the time); it wasn’t meant to be. However, they won a ring with him but he couldn’t be the guy here with the questionable roster construction and transitioning team direction.