Trade Deadline Rumours & Discussion Thread

[PhilBlackson]

Now the rumours are per Shams that both PHX & ORL would look to pursue Fred in the off-season which is BIG news because Fred WANTED to go to the Suns BEFORE re-signing with us but they had traded for CP3.

Suns obviously can't afford to sign him out-right so get that FVV + Boucher deal for Ayton done now. I'm open to working with ORL if the deal involves either of their lottery picks, if not good luck to them luring him there. Especially when my guess would be we'd just work out a S&T for him for Ayton in the off-season if Raps really wanted to hold on to him for the rest of the season for whatever reason.

[YogurtProducer]

Personally I don't wanna trade for Poeltl at all.

I see NO REASON at all why wouldn't just wait until the off-season to sign him out right. It's not like he doesn't already know through all the rumours that we want him & like Pascal couldn't push his best damn friend to come back at whatever similar contract he's being offered. Bringing him here only hurts our draft (period).

Not to mention he's not even a SOLUTION at C, people confuse an upgrade with a solution. He'd be a minimal upgrade over Precious (in fact quite redundant with bit more size) but he's STILL not big enough to really handle Giannis or Embiid and most importantly HE CAN'T SHOOT. The LAST thing this team needs is to bring in more players that further shrink the floor. Not to mention can't remain on the court in crunch time because they're not a reliable FT shooter ie/ Yak can barely hit anything aside from a layup.

Again I think the off-season is the time to go after him or preferably Myles. At least Turner SOLVES the problem at C because he IS big enough to handle the giants of the EC, DOES space the floor and CAN remain on the court in crunch time. So if we're forced to pick, I'd pray it's at least for a player that actually solves the problem, not just slightly mitigates it. Ayton to me is more a wild card if the Raps just think they can get way more out of him offensively than PHX did (which I believe is entirely possible) but is it worth the cost if you don't?!

Bruh if you want a center IDK how you possibly say Poeltl, one of the better defensive centers, is not a solution. No one is big enough to handle Giannis or Embiid that is why they are MVP candidates.

Because TURNER actually is big enough to do so plus he CAN SHOOT & he doesn't further congest the court for our already painful halfcourt offence as Yak does/would, idk why posters who want Poeltl love to just sweep that part under the rug. That in particular is why he's simply not a good fit.

Turner - 6'11 250
Poeltl - 7'1 245

I am not really worried how Poeltl fits into our offense in 2023 when I know we won't be a true contender for a few years. Fit really does not matter, it is talent and asset acquisition time. I want the BPA (Poeltl) over the better "fit". In 1 year or 2 years we might not have Siakam, Barnes might have a 3 point shot, etc. There really is no reason to stress over fit at the moment

[Oakvillehoops]

OG for multiple unprotected picks is obviously a bait. Masai will see who he can lure out, and then offer them Fred instead!

[WuTang_CMB]

I think Trent is the only one that gets traded at deadline.

Does anyone think Indy would do a Turner for Trent swap or nah

[niQ]

I think Trent is the only one that gets traded at deadline.

Does anyone think Indy would do a Turner for Trent swap or nah

I don't really follow the Pacers but my guess is that they are grooming Ben Mathurin to be their future 2. They'll likely trade Buddy Hield this season or next.

I mean, as a Raptors fan, sure, that would be a great trade for the Raps. But I don't know if Pacers would take it.

[WuTang_CMB]

I think Trent is the only one that gets traded at deadline.

Does anyone think Indy would do a Turner for Trent swap or nah

I don't really follow the Pacers but my guess is that they are grooming Ben Mathurin to be their future 2. They'll likely trade Buddy Hield this season or next.

I mean, as a Raptors fan, sure, that would be a great trade for the Raps. But I don't know if Pacers would take it.

yeah I dont think so either

[PhilBlackson]

Bruh if you want a center IDK how you possibly say Poeltl, one of the better defensive centers, is not a solution. No one is big enough to handle Giannis or Embiid that is why they are MVP candidates.

Because TURNER actually is big enough to do so plus he CAN SHOOT & he doesn't further congest the court for our already painful halfcourt offence as Yak does/would, idk why posters who want Poeltl love to just sweep that part under the rug. That in particular is why he's simply not a good fit.

Turner - 6'11 250
Poeltl - 7'1 245

I am not really worried how Poeltl fits into our offense in 2023 when I know we won't be a true contender for a few years. Fit really does not matter, it is talent and asset acquisition time. I want the BPA (Poeltl) over the better "fit". In 1 year or 2 years we might not have Siakam, Barnes might have a 3 point shot, etc. There really is no reason to stress over fit at the moment

Feel free to add their wingspans & standing reach

Nevermind their actual shot blocking numbers which of course Myles will destroy Poeltl in & Yak is most certainly NOT the BPA lol not even close. Yes talent acquisition is important, as in via top 10 in the draft for a player with a MUCH higher potential that will also easily be retained for 8+ years. Not some backup C that will provide minimal improvement hence why the Spurs haven't been competitive for years with him AND have no problem letting him go (unlike Turner who IND tried to extend & was turned down).

Especially broken is the logic that you're not concerned about him fitting with the core. If that's the case then your plans would have to involve one of them (or more) needing to be traded to better adjust the team to make Poeltl work as a fit with the roster construction. Being that OG is the best shooting/floor spacer of the bunch, it wouldn't make sense it be him, so then you're looking between which of Pascal or Scottie....and why to figure out a roster construction that work Yak in?! lol nah that's ass backwards. Get Turner who would already be a clear fit, then you can use either the remaining of Fred or Gary for the rotational pieces and/or draft capital to better build around them without a weird/funky fit that you'd have to sort out later, Yak simply makes no sense.

[agkagk]

Personally I don't wanna trade for Poeltl at all.

I see NO REASON at all why wouldn't just wait until the off-season to sign him out right. It's not like he doesn't already know through all the rumours that we want him & like Pascal couldn't push his best damn friend to come back at whatever similar contract he's being offered. Bringing him here only hurts our draft (period).

Not to mention he's not even a SOLUTION at C, people confuse an upgrade with a solution. He'd be a minimal upgrade over Precious (in fact quite redundant with bit more size) but he's STILL not big enough to really handle Giannis or Embiid and most importantly HE CAN'T SHOOT. The LAST thing this team needs is to bring in more players that further shrink the floor. Not to mention can't remain on the court in crunch time because they're not a reliable FT shooter ie/ Yak can barely hit anything aside from a layup.

Again I think the off-season is the time to go after him or preferably Myles. At least Turner SOLVES the problem at C because he IS big enough to handle the giants of the EC, DOES space the floor and CAN remain on the court in crunch time. So if we're forced to pick, I'd pray it's at least for a player that actually solves the problem, not just slightly mitigates it. Ayton to me is more a wild card if the Raps just think they can get way more out of him offensively than PHX did (which I believe is entirely possible) but is it worth the cost if you don't?!

Bruh if you want a center IDK how you possibly say Poeltl, one of the better defensive centers, is not a solution. No one is big enough to handle Giannis or Embiid that is why they are MVP candidates.

Because TURNER actually is big enough to do so plus he CAN SHOOT & he doesn't further congest the court for our already painful halfcourt offence as Yak does/would, idk why posters who want Poeltl love to just sweep that part under the rug. That in particular is why he's simply not a good fit.

thats because there is a lot more to floor spacing than the simple answer of "three point shooting". a good centre creates three point shots for shooters with spacing and movement.

heres some links to help you wrap your head around this:

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=Jr.NBA

https://theathletic.com/3977378/2022/12/07/celtics-joe-mazzulla-system/

https://www.slcdunk.com/research-statistics-analytics/2019/7/23/20700323/utah-jazz-what-is-nba-spacing-holy-spirit

" How to create “spacing” in the NBA
Many commonly believe the three point line is the be all end all to NBA spacing. If you want better spacing, you go out and sign three point shooters. That’s wrong. This is akin to seeing only one part of the pythagorean theory (a² + b² = c²) and saying that b² = c². NBA fans dig the long ball, but it throws off the scent of how spacing is really created. Spacing is a recipe, not an ingredient. Those ingredients are as follows: a big man capable of setting good screens and finishing lobs and at the rim, three wings capable of shooting above average from three, and a point guard capable of knocking down the three and penetrating. One of those wings needs to have star potential and it’s helpful if the point guard has those same abilities. But at the end of the day if you were really going to oversimplify it, the base for good floor spacing is

(Talent of Rim Runner)*Rim Running + (Talent of Shooter)*Three Point Shooting = Spacing
This is why for a team like the Utah Jazz Rudy Gobert is so valuable. Dennis Lindsey talks a lot about how Rudy Gobert is the trigger for Utah’s offense. It’s true. However, it is not necessary to have a Rudy Gobert talent of rim runner if your talent of shooters is Steph Curry, Klay Thompson, and Kevin Durant as your three point shooters, an elite rim runner—or even an above average one—is not required as shown by the Warriors’ revolving door at center during their dynasty.

Now if you’re thinking, “But how does a dude who can’t stretch the floor actually help floor spacing?” ... well ... you’re not alone. Most of us have been conditioned by Twitter, ESPN, us here at SLC Dunk, and that one friend who JUST WON’T SHUTUP about Karl Anthony-Towns that for a team to have some primo floor spacing, you gotta have a big man that can shoot like Anthony Davis, Karl Anthony-Towns, or Joel Embiid. But that isn’t actually the case.

From Model 284, they talk about the DeAndre Jordan mold from 2015 is incredibly healthy for a team as long as that’s your only player in that lineup that fits that mold:

How do we account for DeAndre Jordan, who doesn’t catch the ball outside very often? To capture the finisher at the rim, we look at scoring less than 5 feet from the hoop (minus drives). The idea behind this is to capture the inside presence that draws help defenders down low, opening the perimeter shooters.

So we have four different types of shooting: Catch and Shoot, Pull-up, Drives, and Shots at the Rim. For each of these statistics, we start at the individual player level and roll up to the lineup level. For Catch and Shoots, Pull-ups, and Drives, we average the frequency with which each player attempts each shot weighted by their usage and adjusted for efficiency, resulting in a lineup-level measure for each of the aforementioned types of shots. Next, we scale these lineup level estimates for each shot type and return a standard deviation.

With shots from less than 5 feet, we take the maximum frequency-adjusted percentage among the individual players in the lineup. This should theoretically give us an indication of the effectiveness of our center. For reference, DeAndre Jordan, Rudy Gobert, Clint Capela would all be tops in this category.

A balance is needed between outside shooting, slashing, and elite finishing at the rim. The great thing about the NBA is a team must not rely upon NBA unicorns like Kristaps Porzingis or Joel Embiid to usher them into the new NBA. Take the Houston Rockets of the past two years. They relied on the star power of two elite guards—Chris Paul and James Harden—and an elite rim runner in Clint Capela then threw in a potpourri of NBA “3 and D” wings. That mix was enough to push the Warriors to 7 games in the Western Conference Finals, and save for a last minute injury to Chris Paul, they would have been NBA Champions. Their lineup didn’t have an All-NBA stretch four or once in a generation big man unicorn. They had elite guards and the right lineup combinations to provide elite spacing. "

[ash_k]

seems like the raps are willing to trade OG for multiple unprotected 1st round picks :'(

Source? ........Jake?

I'm not sure man I'm waiting for someone to confirm if its true or not

I dont believe there is another player in the league right now that can defend 1-through-5 at DPOY level. At 25 and at his size, It would make no sense to trade him. can't see Masai doing it. I even saw an OG for Myles Turner:I have been one of the Myles-to-Raps biggest pusher, but making such a trade would defeat the purpose of acquiring Myles.

[bape_lovers]

maybe Swag is thinking Bronny, Melo's son, Bryce, ?

Why the Fck are we trying to upgrade this weak core!!!

We should be building for the future - not trading for Miles Turner or Poeltl

How old do you think Turner and Poeltl are? 26-27 year olds who will be in their prime for another 4ish years are players yuou wat

[PhilBlackson]

I think Trent is the only one that gets traded at deadline.

Does anyone think Indy would do a Turner for Trent swap or nah

I don't really follow the Pacers but my guess is that they are grooming Ben Mathurin to be their future 2. They'll likely trade Buddy Hield this season or next.

I mean, as a Raptors fan, sure, that would be a great trade for the Raps. But I don't know if Pacers would take it.

yeah I dont think so either

It would likely involve a 3rd team ie/ NYK or LAL.

Both teams have been rumoured to want Gary & both being large markets can very likely convince him to stick around.

LAL would have to part with either 25' swap or 27' or the Knicks have to give either theirs or DAL's pick + one of the other FRPs they have that are unlikely to convey or at least not as a frp (can't remember which one had crappy protection on it). IND avoids losing Myles for nothing. That's at least how I'd try to negotiate it & take our 23' entirely off the table.

[HumbleRen]

I think Trent is the only one that gets traded at deadline.

Does anyone think Indy would do a Turner for Trent swap or nah

Nah. Their entire roster is made up of guards lol.

[WuTang_CMB]

I don't really follow the Pacers but my guess is that they are grooming Ben Mathurin to be their future 2. They'll likely trade Buddy Hield this season or next.

I mean, as a Raptors fan, sure, that would be a great trade for the Raps. But I don't know if Pacers would take it.

yeah I dont think so either

It would likely involve a 3rd team ie/ NYK or LAL.

Both teams have been rumoured to want Gary & both being large markets can very likely convince him to stick around.

LAL would have to part with either 25' swap or 27' or the Knicks have to give either theirs or DAL's pick + one of the other FRPs they have that are unlikely to convey or at least not as a frp (can't remember which one had crappy protection on it). IND avoids losing Myles for nothing. That's at least how I'd try to negotiate it & take our 23' entirely off the table.

might work

[PhilBlackson]

Bruh if you want a center IDK how you possibly say Poeltl, one of the better defensive centers, is not a solution. No one is big enough to handle Giannis or Embiid that is why they are MVP candidates.

Because TURNER actually is big enough to do so plus he CAN SHOOT & he doesn't further congest the court for our already painful halfcourt offence as Yak does/would, idk why posters who want Poeltl love to just sweep that part under the rug. That in particular is why he's simply not a good fit.

Spoiler:

thats because there is a lot more to floor spacing than the simple answer of "three point shooting". a good centre creates three point shots for shooters with spacing and movement.

heres some links to help you wrap your head around this:

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=Jr.NBA

https://theathletic.com/3977378/2022/12/07/celtics-joe-mazzulla-system/

https://www.slcdunk.com/research-statistics-analytics/2019/7/23/20700323/utah-jazz-what-is-nba-spacing-holy-spirit

" How to create “spacing” in the NBA
Many commonly believe the three point line is the be all end all to NBA spacing. If you want better spacing, you go out and sign three point shooters. That’s wrong. This is akin to seeing only one part of the pythagorean theory (a² + b² = c²) and saying that b² = c². NBA fans dig the long ball, but it throws off the scent of how spacing is really created. Spacing is a recipe, not an ingredient. Those ingredients are as follows: a big man capable of setting good screens and finishing lobs and at the rim, three wings capable of shooting above average from three, and a point guard capable of knocking down the three and penetrating. One of those wings needs to have star potential and it’s helpful if the point guard has those same abilities. But at the end of the day if you were really going to oversimplify it, the base for good floor spacing is

(Talent of Rim Runner)*Rim Running + (Talent of Shooter)*Three Point Shooting = Spacing
This is why for a team like the Utah Jazz Rudy Gobert is so valuable. Dennis Lindsey talks a lot about how Rudy Gobert is the trigger for Utah’s offense. It’s true. However, it is not necessary to have a Rudy Gobert talent of rim runner if your talent of shooters is Steph Curry, Klay Thompson, and Kevin Durant as your three point shooters, an elite rim runner—or even an above average one—is not required as shown by the Warriors’ revolving door at center during their dynasty.

Now if you’re thinking, “But how does a dude who can’t stretch the floor actually help floor spacing?” ... well ... you’re not alone. Most of us have been conditioned by Twitter, ESPN, us here at SLC Dunk, and that one friend who JUST WON’T SHUTUP about Karl Anthony-Towns that for a team to have some primo floor spacing, you gotta have a big man that can shoot like Anthony Davis, Karl Anthony-Towns, or Joel Embiid. But that isn’t actually the case.

From Model 284, they talk about the DeAndre Jordan mold from 2015 is incredibly healthy for a team as long as that’s your only player in that lineup that fits that mold:

How do we account for DeAndre Jordan, who doesn’t catch the ball outside very often? To capture the finisher at the rim, we look at scoring less than 5 feet from the hoop (minus drives). The idea behind this is to capture the inside presence that draws help defenders down low, opening the perimeter shooters.

So we have four different types of shooting: Catch and Shoot, Pull-up, Drives, and Shots at the Rim. For each of these statistics, we start at the individual player level and roll up to the lineup level. For Catch and Shoots, Pull-ups, and Drives, we average the frequency with which each player attempts each shot weighted by their usage and adjusted for efficiency, resulting in a lineup-level measure for each of the aforementioned types of shots. Next, we scale these lineup level estimates for each shot type and return a standard deviation.

With shots from less than 5 feet, we take the maximum frequency-adjusted percentage among the individual players in the lineup. This should theoretically give us an indication of the effectiveness of our center. For reference, DeAndre Jordan, Rudy Gobert, Clint Capela would all be tops in this category.

A balance is needed between outside shooting, slashing, and elite finishing at the rim. The great thing about the NBA is a team must not rely upon NBA unicorns like Kristaps Porzingis or Joel Embiid to usher them into the new NBA. Take the Houston Rockets of the past two years. They relied on the star power of two elite guards—Chris Paul and James Harden—and an elite rim runner in Clint Capela then threw in a potpourri of NBA “3 and D” wings. That mix was enough to push the Warriors to 7 games in the Western Conference Finals, and save for a last minute injury to Chris Paul, they would have been NBA Champions. Their lineup didn’t have an All-NBA stretch four or once in a generation big man unicorn. They had elite guards and the right lineup combinations to provide elite spacing. "

Please stop re-hashing the same old boring "justification" with AGAIN no consideration for the roster that exists around the players. You are looking at ONLY how THAT player can be used in order to create spacing WITHOUT consideration of the actual make up of the team -- players' strengths & tendencies (ie/ all of Pascal, OG & Barnes being their most effective & most OFTEN USE around the paint area).

You live too much in THEORY vs REALITY. Yes in theory they CAN generate some floor spacing, in REALITY the team is going to look to run the same form of offence to make that core of players be their most effective, in which case Yak will be around the paint more.

More importantly it's NOT just SIMPLY ABOUT floor spacing, it's ALSO the fact that we don't even have the surrounding personnel to MAKE those jumpers. READ THIS OVER & OVER AGAIN --- we have been amongst the WORST shooting team both on contested but moreover OPEN SHOTS & by trading one of our best shooters & replacing him with an even worse shooter than any other starter, naturally you are bringing down the team's shooting percentages.

If you can't follow this concept, there's no help for you but I would suggest you look no further than the Lakers. AD does all the same things as a roll man & obviously than some...LeBron like Pascal/Scottie/OG loves to score more so in the paint BUT they're surrounded with piss poor shooters -- guess what?! Lose Fred & Gary, we are ALREADY fairly close to them but after those guys are gone we'd be just as bad or worse and with less talented players to compensate for it. At some point you have to take EVERYTHING into account & not just the part you wanna hear.

[agkagk]

Because TURNER actually is big enough to do so plus he CAN SHOOT & he doesn't further congest the court for our already painful halfcourt offence as Yak does/would, idk why posters who want Poeltl love to just sweep that part under the rug. That in particular is why he's simply not a good fit.

Spoiler:

thats because there is a lot more to floor spacing than the simple answer of "three point shooting". a good centre creates three point shots for shooters with spacing and movement.

heres some links to help you wrap your head around this:

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=Jr.NBA

https://theathletic.com/3977378/2022/12/07/celtics-joe-mazzulla-system/

https://www.slcdunk.com/research-statistics-analytics/2019/7/23/20700323/utah-jazz-what-is-nba-spacing-holy-spirit

" How to create “spacing” in the NBA
Many commonly believe the three point line is the be all end all to NBA spacing. If you want better spacing, you go out and sign three point shooters. That’s wrong. This is akin to seeing only one part of the pythagorean theory (a² + b² = c²) and saying that b² = c². NBA fans dig the long ball, but it throws off the scent of how spacing is really created. Spacing is a recipe, not an ingredient. Those ingredients are as follows: a big man capable of setting good screens and finishing lobs and at the rim, three wings capable of shooting above average from three, and a point guard capable of knocking down the three and penetrating. One of those wings needs to have star potential and it’s helpful if the point guard has those same abilities. But at the end of the day if you were really going to oversimplify it, the base for good floor spacing is

(Talent of Rim Runner)*Rim Running + (Talent of Shooter)*Three Point Shooting = Spacing
This is why for a team like the Utah Jazz Rudy Gobert is so valuable. Dennis Lindsey talks a lot about how Rudy Gobert is the trigger for Utah’s offense. It’s true. However, it is not necessary to have a Rudy Gobert talent of rim runner if your talent of shooters is Steph Curry, Klay Thompson, and Kevin Durant as your three point shooters, an elite rim runner—or even an above average one—is not required as shown by the Warriors’ revolving door at center during their dynasty.

Now if you’re thinking, “But how does a dude who can’t stretch the floor actually help floor spacing?” ... well ... you’re not alone. Most of us have been conditioned by Twitter, ESPN, us here at SLC Dunk, and that one friend who JUST WON’T SHUTUP about Karl Anthony-Towns that for a team to have some primo floor spacing, you gotta have a big man that can shoot like Anthony Davis, Karl Anthony-Towns, or Joel Embiid. But that isn’t actually the case.

From Model 284, they talk about the DeAndre Jordan mold from 2015 is incredibly healthy for a team as long as that’s your only player in that lineup that fits that mold:

How do we account for DeAndre Jordan, who doesn’t catch the ball outside very often? To capture the finisher at the rim, we look at scoring less than 5 feet from the hoop (minus drives). The idea behind this is to capture the inside presence that draws help defenders down low, opening the perimeter shooters.

So we have four different types of shooting: Catch and Shoot, Pull-up, Drives, and Shots at the Rim. For each of these statistics, we start at the individual player level and roll up to the lineup level. For Catch and Shoots, Pull-ups, and Drives, we average the frequency with which each player attempts each shot weighted by their usage and adjusted for efficiency, resulting in a lineup-level measure for each of the aforementioned types of shots. Next, we scale these lineup level estimates for each shot type and return a standard deviation.

With shots from less than 5 feet, we take the maximum frequency-adjusted percentage among the individual players in the lineup. This should theoretically give us an indication of the effectiveness of our center. For reference, DeAndre Jordan, Rudy Gobert, Clint Capela would all be tops in this category.

A balance is needed between outside shooting, slashing, and elite finishing at the rim. The great thing about the NBA is a team must not rely upon NBA unicorns like Kristaps Porzingis or Joel Embiid to usher them into the new NBA. Take the Houston Rockets of the past two years. They relied on the star power of two elite guards—Chris Paul and James Harden—and an elite rim runner in Clint Capela then threw in a potpourri of NBA “3 and D” wings. That mix was enough to push the Warriors to 7 games in the Western Conference Finals, and save for a last minute injury to Chris Paul, they would have been NBA Champions. Their lineup didn’t have an All-NBA stretch four or once in a generation big man unicorn. They had elite guards and the right lineup combinations to provide elite spacing. "

Please stop re-hashing the same old boring "justification" with AGAIN no consideration for the roster that exists around the players. You are looking at ONLY how THAT player can be used in order to create spacing WITHOUT consideration of the actual make up of the team -- players' strengths & tendencies (ie/ all of Pascal, OG & Barnes being their most effective & most OFTEN USE around the paint area).

You live too much in THEORY vs REALITY. Yes in theory they CAN generate some floor spacing, in REALITY the team is going to look to run the same form of offence to make that core of players be their most effective, in which case Yak will be around the paint more.

More importantly it's NOT just SIMPLY ABOUT floor spacing, it's ALSO the fact that we don't even have the surrounding personnel to MAKE those jumpers. READ THIS OVER & OVER AGAIN --- we have been amongst the WORST shooting team both on contested but moreover OPEN SHOTS & by trading one of our best shooters & replacing him with an even worse shooter than any other starter, naturally you are bringing down the team's shooting percentages.

If you can't follow this concept, there's no help for you but I would suggest you look no further than the Lakers. AD does all the same things as a roll man & obviously than some...LeBron like Pascal/Scottie/OG loves to score more so in the paint BUT they're surrounded with piss poor shooters -- guess what?! Lose Fred & Gary, we are ALREADY fairly close to them but after those guys are gone we'd be just as bad or worse and with less talented players to compensate for it. At some point you have to take EVERYTHING into account & not just the part you wanna hear.

Pick one ranting narrative and stick to it all mighty teacher. Just yesterday you said are only problem was our shooters weren’t good enough? Waaaah haaaaappened?

We were an above average 3 pt shooting team just one season ago with the exact same shooters. what happened? scouting reports happened

Anyways regarding your actual post about how you were confused as to the benefit of poeltl heeeeeeres the aaaaaaaannsweeeeeer:

How to create “spacing” in the NBA
Many commonly believe the three point line is the be all end all to NBA spacing. If you want better spacing, you go out and sign three point shooters. That’s wrong. This is akin to seeing only one part of the pythagorean theory (a² + b² = c²) and saying that b² = c². NBA fans dig the long ball, but it throws off the scent of how spacing is really created. Spacing is a recipe, not an ingredient. Those ingredients are as follows: a big man capable of setting good screens and finishing lobs and at the rim, three wings capable of shooting above average from three, and a point guard capable of knocking down the three and penetrating. One of those wings needs to have star potential and it’s helpful if the point guard has those same abilities. But at the end of the day if you were really going to oversimplify it, the base for good floor spacing is

(Talent of Rim Runner)*Rim Running + (Talent of Shooter)*Three Point Shooting = Spacing
This is why for a team like the Utah Jazz Rudy Gobert is so valuable. Dennis Lindsey talks a lot about how Rudy Gobert is the trigger for Utah’s offense. It’s true. However, it is not necessary to have a Rudy Gobert talent of rim runner if your talent of shooters is Steph Curry, Klay Thompson, and Kevin Durant as your three point shooters, an elite rim runner—or even an above average one—is not required as shown by the Warriors’ revolving door at center during their dynasty.

Now if you’re thinking, “But how does a dude who can’t stretch the floor actually help floor spacing?” ... well ... you’re not alone. Most of us have been conditioned by Twitter, ESPN, us here at SLC Dunk, and that one friend who JUST WON’T SHUTUP about Karl Anthony-Towns that for a team to have some primo floor spacing, you gotta have a big man that can shoot like Anthony Davis, Karl Anthony-Towns, or Joel Embiid. But that isn’t actually the case.

From Model 284, they talk about the DeAndre Jordan mold from 2015 is incredibly healthy for a team as long as that’s your only player in that lineup that fits that mold:

How do we account for DeAndre Jordan, who doesn’t catch the ball outside very often? To capture the finisher at the rim, we look at scoring less than 5 feet from the hoop (minus drives). The idea behind this is to capture the inside presence that draws help defenders down low, opening the perimeter shooters.

So we have four different types of shooting: Catch and Shoot, Pull-up, Drives, and Shots at the Rim. For each of these statistics, we start at the individual player level and roll up to the lineup level. For Catch and Shoots, Pull-ups, and Drives, we average the frequency with which each player attempts each shot weighted by their usage and adjusted for efficiency, resulting in a lineup-level measure for each of the aforementioned types of shots. Next, we scale these lineup level estimates for each shot type and return a standard deviation.

With shots from less than 5 feet, we take the maximum frequency-adjusted percentage among the individual players in the lineup. This should theoretically give us an indication of the effectiveness of our center. For reference, DeAndre Jordan, Rudy Gobert, Clint Capela would all be tops in this category.

A balance is needed between outside shooting, slashing, and elite finishing at the rim. The great thing about the NBA is a team must not rely upon NBA unicorns like Kristaps Porzingis or Joel Embiid to usher them into the new NBA. Take the Houston Rockets of the past two years. They relied on the star power of two elite guards—Chris Paul and James Harden—and an elite rim runner in Clint Capela then threw in a potpourri of NBA “3 and D” wings. That mix was enough to push the Warriors to 7 games in the Western Conference Finals, and save for a last minute injury to Chris Paul, they would have been NBA Champions. Their lineup didn’t have an All-NBA stretch four or once in a generation big man unicorn. They had elite guards and the right lineup combinations to provide elite spacing.

[agkagk]

double post

[WuTang_CMB]

Watch on YouTube

[HumbleRen]

Poeltl aint it man.

[PhilBlackson]

The very article his YMCA coach put him on discusses the ROSTER CONSTRUCTION (ie/ the need for BALANCE including the perimeter shooting) but I guess he only skim read the parts he thought were relevant without actually looking at the exact contradictions I'm pointing to which only makes it more hilarious he's relying on information that only further contradicts his own stance & strengthens mine lol can't make this up.

This also without having any of his own rationalization of how bad of an idea it would be in the Playoffs to use Poeltl as a roll man where the opposing team will GLADLY allow us to either pitch out to non-shooters under pressure or even more so welcome them to drop the ball off to Poeltl, foul & make him make FTs in crunch time lol absolutely clueless.

[HumbleRen]

The very article his YMCA coach put him on discusses the ROSTER CONSTRUCTION (ie/ the need for BALANCE including the perimeter shooting) but I guess he only skim read the parts he thought were relevant without actually looking at the exact contradictions I'm pointing to which only makes it more hilarious he's relying on information that only further contradicts his own stance & strengthens mine lol can't make this up.

This also without having any of his own rationalization of how bad of an idea it would be in the Playoffs to use Poeltl as a roll man where the opposing team will look to force us to either pitch out to non-shooters under pressure or allow them to GLADLY drop the ball off to Poeltl, foul & make him make FTs in crunch time lol absolutely clueless.

There's a reason why even JV who is way more talented than Poeltl can't even touch the floor when Zion is healthy.

The spacing would be horrendous for everyone on the floor.