Patrick McCaw is not a NBA caliber player

[Randle McMurphy]

Maybe they’re trying to keep TD under wraps so they can sign him to a decent extension. He doesn’t have a rookie contract so I think he becomes an unrestricted FA after next season.

Perhaps, but that doesn't explain why McCaw plays more than Thomas either (who, while obviously not anywhere near TD's level, is also far better than McCaw).

[Basketball_Jones]

I appreciate McCaws hot potato Jose Calderon type of game.

[Alfred]

Patrick McCaw after every victory:

Watch on YouTube

[Asif16]

This dude literally does nothing on the floor lmao. He's out there to throw some side to side passes and then go chill on the bench.

Doesnt even show any emotion on the bench either. No cheering for teammates. Nothing.

This dude is seriously starting to piss me off

[WaltFrazier]

In the 2nd period stretch tonight where the bench mob extended the lead, McCaw did some good things. 2 great passes on the break, then hit a 3. Solid effort. The lack of basketball knowledge here among his critics is amusing.

[Randle McMurphy]

In the 2nd period stretch tonight where the bench mob extended the lead, McCaw did some good things. 2 great passes on the break, then hit a 3. Solid effort. The lack of basketball knowledge here among his critics is amusing.

The Marc Gasol of guards.

[dgr81]

In the 2nd period stretch tonight where the bench mob extended the lead, McCaw did some good things. 2 great passes on the break, then hit a 3. Solid effort. The lack of basketball knowledge here among his critics is amusing.

agreed.

thought mccaw played very well tonight, especially in that 2nd quarter.

[Asif16]

In the 2nd period stretch tonight where the bench mob extended the lead, McCaw did some good things. 2 great passes on the break, then hit a 3. Solid effort. The lack of basketball knowledge here among his critics is amusing.

The Marc Gasol of guards.

Not even close

[Randle McMurphy]

In the 2nd period stretch tonight where the bench mob extended the lead, McCaw did some good things. 2 great passes on the break, then hit a 3. Solid effort. The lack of basketball knowledge here among his critics is amusing.

The Marc Gasol of guards.

Not even close

I take it you haven't read any of my posts in this thread. The guy is barely better than Brissett and one of the worst players statistically in the league despite occasionally being able to make a pass or two without fumbling it out of bounds.

[Tor_Raps]

In the 2nd period stretch tonight where the bench mob extended the lead, McCaw did some good things. 2 great passes on the break, then hit a 3. Solid effort. The lack of basketball knowledge here among his critics is amusing.

Come on man, the crap you're citing are normal basketball plays. We're going to give him kudos because he made a normal fast break pass?

This isnt the make a wish foundation league... it's the friggin NBA. Pretty much everyone on the team can provide these skills AND MORE. Much much more lol.

[spicy4MVP]

ya'll talk about McCaw being crap, how about we congratulate him on an accomplishment. Today he officially became a positive player in plus minus category.
He's now overall +3. Only stanley Johnson is worse on the team with overall -19. In comparison to other 3rd stringers, Chris Boucher is +83, Malcolm Miller +43, Hollis Jefferson +58 and Terence Davis is +257. No wonder NN gives Mccaw more minutes than TD. who the hell wants 2nd highest +/- player on the team to take almighty Mccaw's minutes?

[J-Roc]

Why is this thread still open? The guy is an NBA caliber player. /thread

[Johnny Bball]

It’s his great defence that somehow doesn’t show up in any advanced statistic whatsoever. What a player.

Great? No. Above average, yeah.

You're the one that started with RPM... do DRPM again. Do it for the entire year round now and do it so there's zero context from you like the rest of this thread. Or do it for the last month alone. Either I'm good with if that's your metric. What do you think it is from the last month when he doesn't start and everyone isn't injured? I'm not sure how often every other metric you picked is updated, whether PIPM and VORP and WS is updated daily, but you can look and see if it changed since early January when everyone came back. I bet December sucks and January doesn't if you could bust it out. Btut is he the worst player in the league now if cumulativey and not even just say January 8th and on?

I just know that there was a complete failure to understand what was happening with him starting in December (and completely no context used) and you're still stuck on December when pretty much any metric from early January til now will tell you you're wrong about his defense and tells another story. I dunno... I just look at what I see though still like I did all year. P

And at the end of the year if I look at the end result and subtract every metric you posted in December to what it ends up with, so we get an idea of what he is with the bench and on, which is his real role, and I go with the ORIGINAL idea of this thread that HE'S NOT AN NBA PLAYER, Is he still going to be "not an NBA player"? Y

I don't love McCaw or think he's good offensively but he's a 5th option most minutes with the starters. He does not need the ball at all when he's that. I don't dislike TD at all and kind of love what he's doing, but I get the few reasons they would play other guys ahead of him when they did, and when they did only, and at what position. I don't think PM can back this team up at anywhere but SF and maybe bench guard part time right now (excluding injuries which filling in for is most of his minutes) and that's mostly just from a lack of depth at SF/PF.

And I have to say....its gone from not an NBA player (the name of the thread), to cut his minutes, to play him less than anyone, , to cut his minutes more, to play him less that TD. THIS IS MY POINT ONLY, and you can tell me where it's going next. Just move the final goalpost where you like for a pretty average bench player and tell me where we want to measure it.

I mean.... I don't get why the guy that is probably the 8-10 guy on the roster and why it's a problem so damn much. 14 wins too much? And hell of a game when TD2 gets Norms minutes or Kyle's. But that wasn't what the tread started as, it was he isn;t an NBA player, that's the title.

http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/page/5/sort/DRPM

... that would be above average for a bench guy right?

And fwiw I think RPM and especially DRPM is semi useless outside of maybe positional comparison, teammates comparison, and with a ton of context, but it's you guys so...

I think this is what you referenced after December....kind of forget... thi sis cumulative now and not just January wher he plays where he supposed to.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2020_advanced.html 112th dBPM vorp, 200th, ws/48 248th BPM 210th (gotta click hide non-qualified)

You tell me when you want him to be top 150 and a starter.

[Randle McMurphy]

Why is this thread still open? The guy is an NBA caliber player. /thread

From last week:

Patrick McCaw this season has a 0.079 WS/48, a -1.0 BPM, a 0.2 VORP, a -2.24 PIPM (431st out of 495 eligible players in the NBA), a -2.07 RPM (417th out of 474 eligible players in the NBA), and a -3.8 RAPTOR rating (14th on the Raptors and 26th worst in NBA among players with more than 600 minutes played).

Calling that "NBA caliber" seems more than a bit generous. He'll be out of the league in a few years (and more likely than not after the ill-conceived contract the Raptors gave him runs out).

[Randle McMurphy]

It’s his great defence that somehow doesn’t show up in any advanced statistic whatsoever. What a player.

Great? No. Above average, yeah.

Let's examine that a little closer. It's true that to his credit he's now got a 1.2 DBPM this season, but that's about it for positives there. He also has a 0.03 D-PIPM this season (222nd out of 495 eligible players), a 0.31 DRPM this season (195th out of 483 eligible players), and a -0.7 defensive RAPTOR rating (13th out of 14th among Raptors who have played 100 minutes, only ahead of Matt Thomas on the season, a guy who is obviously blowing McCaw out of the water overall due to the offensive value).

Add it all up and he's playing passable defense that we could maybe say is right at or near the league average. Combine that league average defence with being one of the worst offensive players in the league and you have the major net negative contributor that is Patrick McCaw. He has no business playing minutes for this contending team at all, let alone 25 a game.

[GreatWhiteStiff]

ya'll talk about McCaw being crap, how about we congratulate him on an accomplishment. Today he officially became a positive player in plus minus category.
He's now overall +3. Only stanley Johnson is worse on the team with overall -19. In comparison to other 3rd stringers, Chris Boucher is +83, Malcolm Miller +43, Hollis Jefferson +58 and Terence Davis is +257. No wonder NN gives Mccaw more minutes than TD. who the hell wants 2nd highest +/- player on the team to take almighty Mccaw's minutes?

He's a nice plus minus streak going during our win streak. His most 7 recent games played he's @ +7.3 a game. Not sure how fluky plus minus is overall, but he's been on the right side of it recently for sure. Possibly had a top 5 or top 3 ranked defence during those minutes if i had to make an unqualified pure guess.

RPM is a bizarre stat over the short term, it has yak puertl as one of the leaders for center's offensive RPM, however Joel Embiid is somehow a negative this year. So they're not even close in ranking. Yak's played a solid 52 games thus far as well, nearly 20 minutes per game.

[TheProfessor]

McCaw is an Nba player, he just isnt a Toronto Raptorr level player. He is clearly the worst player the raptors play, I would love to see his minutes get cut to like 10.

[ratul]

Amazing the hate for McCaw. He plays solid defense on the wing, can hit an occasional three and ca bring up the ball. Its weird people are hating on him.

[Duckrice]

I think McCaw has played pretty well since he came back from that broken nose. He's been more aggressive with his shot, looked to attack the defence more off the dribble, and kept the ball moving when it's come to him. I liked what he did off the bench last night.
Before we went on that 2nd Q run I counted at least 3 open looks he generated for other players where they missed, and then they started making those shots.

It's funny how every time the team goes on a run when he's on the floor it's never about him, but if the team struggles when he's on the floor it's always about him.

[Kevin Willis]

It’s his great defence that somehow doesn’t show up in any advanced statistic whatsoever. What a player.

Great? No. Above average, yeah.

Let's examine that a little closer. It's true that to his credit he's now got a 1.2 DBPM this season, but that's about it for positives there. He also has a 0.03 D-PIPM this season (222nd out of 495 eligible players), a 0.31 DRPM this season (195th out of 483 eligible players), and a -0.7 defensive RAPTOR rating (13th out of 14th among Raptors who have played 100 minutes, only ahead of Matt Thomas on the season, a guy who is obviously blowing McCaw out of the water overall due to the offensive value).

Add it all up and he's playing passable defense that we could maybe say is right at or near the league average. Combine that league average defence with being one of the worst offensive players in the league and you have the major net negative contributor that is Patrick McCaw. He has no business playing minutes for this contending team at all, let alone 25 a game.

His DRPM is around P. George and K. Middleton. It's better than Poeltl. His stats show that he is a slightly above average defender in the NBA. Which answers the question is he a NBA caliber player - he is. He's also 10th man on a loaded championship team who was forced to play more minutes due to injury. When we had our full team back for 2-3 games his playing time dipped. Like it should.

In terms of offense - we have enough offensive weapons. I am happy he's not so trigger happy. OG is similar in not being trigger happy. As our 10th man, as you said league average defender, guard their best man saving our scorers legs. Shoot the open 3. Keep the ball moving and that's about it.

I think Johnny Bball's post should end this thread but if there are some who are still mad, compare his stats with 10th man from other team. (Note: MPG are skewed because of injuries. Normally he would be getting their minutes on good teams. Bad teams he would probably score more points.)

LAC - Rodney McGruder

https://ca.global.nba.com/players/vs/#!/rodney_mcgruder/patrick_mccaw

Bos - Semi

https://ca.global.nba.com/players/vs/#!/semi_ojeleye/patrick_mccaw

Phi - Matisse Thybulle (similar minutes)

https://ca.global.nba.com/players/vs/#!/matisse_thybulle/patrick_mccaw

Two bad teams

Was - Isaac Bonga

https://ca.global.nba.com/players/vs/#!/isaac_bonga/patrick_mccaw

GSW - Jordan Poole

https://ca.global.nba.com/players/vs/#!/jordan_poole/patrick_mccaw