Official Raptors 2011 NBA Draft Thread Part 9

[Reignman]

Nah their body of work proves otherwise. Kanter... not so much

LOL, you really have no idea what you're talking about. I told you to go watch some footage from the U-18s and watch the defense Kanter played, much better than those clips. SAme with the hoops summit, much better than those clips as well.

You've jumped to way too many conclusions on 30 seconds of clips HIGHLIGHTING bad defensive plays.

Does that mean he's going to be a great defender in the league? Of course not. Does that mean his defense is always going to be the way it was in those clips? Of course not. That's where scouting / interviews will come into play.

I think the same can be said about you! You chastise people for watching footage of bad defense then you tell them they should go watch clips of his "good" defense. Its the same thing, point I'm making is we as fans have a very small amount to go on to formulate opinions on. I would temper my enthusiasm especially if scouts are strongly questioning if he can indeed play centre.

Again, go back and find a quote where I've said Kanter will be a great defender. I've never said it.

[Reignman]

You're making a judgment off of a 30 second clip of HIGHLIGHTS where the author specifically did that to analysis his bad plays. You don't know what you're talking about.

Yes Reignman only you know what makes a solid prospect... Only you!

Thanks, I wish your eye for talent worked on NBA prospects as well.

[ty123]

Don't excuse bad defense. Stop trying to sugarcoat Kanter.

[Reignman]

There has been no sugar coating and I've said he looked terrible in some of those sequences but that's all you can take out of that. That video was his bad plays highlighted. Like I said, go watch him in the U-18s and his defense looked MUCH better. Even in the Hoops Summit.

Again, this is a puny sample from 2 years ago at age 16/17. Since then he has worked with Coach Cal, Tim Grover and will soon be in an NBA program.

[FlyingRat]

I'm watching Vesely right now in the Serbian final, and he's really bad.

[Kevin Willis]

I've watched him play a few times and he's horrible at almost everything. He can jump high but he isn't a good defender, he can't dribble, he can't shoot and he's 21. I simply don't see the appeal, on any level.

I don't know why people seem to get so excited about white prospects who happen to be really athletic (see also: Joe Alexander, who was very popular on this board despite sucking at basketball). Vesely just seems to lack every crucial basketball skill you can name and he's older than the rest of the class. I would stay far away.

Hey, by the way, Chad Ford's latest mock is up and we're taking... Vesely. Yay.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft201 ... aft-110608

Well I can't disagree with you, his skill level is not where it needs to be. Joe Alexander was wrong in between the ears. That and he was drafted by Milwaukee where he couldn't develop his skills under Skiles. Vesely is an average defender. His dribbling skills needs work. He's not a lights out 3p shooter but he hits the occasional three. He's a skinny, white Josh Smith to me without the blocks. And if Knight and Kanter are off the board he's a legit choice. Remember Rhett, this draft is not that strong and he has more 'potential' than Leonard.

[Mr.Raptorsingh]

I'm watching Vesely right now in the Serbian final, and he's really bad.

Well, BC is there too, so if he's watching what you are, then Vesely might drop further down on our board...but's it's just one game.

[T_Biggums]

Again, go back and find a quote where I've said Kanter will be a great defender. I've never said it.

So then why are you all over his nuts? If you have the same question marks I do about his defense and ability to play centre what is it that you actually like beyond his size?

I'm a firm believer that the most important thing when considering drafting a big to play centre at the 5 spot has got to be defensive awareness. In the limited footage we've seen he doesn't possess much of it and furthermore nor does he want to play centre.

Its seems as though he can give you good mins at centre in a limited role but to ask him to defend the paint, rebound and also go on offense and showcase his real talent seems like a bit of a stretch.

[Rhettmatic]

I'm watching Vesely right now in the Serbian final, and he's really bad.

Is there a legal link? For those who haven't seen him play and are relying on scouting reports, well, it can be eye-opening to, y'know, actually watch him. I agree with your take, btw.

Well I can't disagree with you, his skill level is not where it needs to be. Joe Alexander was wrong in between the ears. That and he was drafted by Milwaukee where he couldn't develop his skills under Skiles. Vesely is an average defender. His dribbling skills needs work. He's not a lights out 3p shooter but he hits the occasional three. He's a skinny, white Josh Smith to me without the blocks. And if Knight and Kanter are off the board he's a legit choice. Remember Rhett, this draft is not that strong and he has more 'potential' than Leonard.

I think the Josh Smith comparison is pretty bad, KW. Smith is an elite defender. Right now, Vesely is somewhere south of "bad." He would have to get way, way, way better to be as good a defender as Josh Smith, and that's Smith's greatest asset.

BTW, when Josh Smith was 21 he was averaging 16.4/8.6/3.3 with nearly 3 blocks in the NBA. Vesely is 21 and averaging 9/3.4/1.1 with 0.7 blocks in the Euroleague. Really, I think that comparison needs to be retired.

[Kevin Willis]

I'm watching Vesely right now in the Serbian final, and he's really bad.

What are his stats like? Looks like we won't draft him after all Rhett.

[Rhettmatic]

I'm watching Vesely right now in the Serbian final, and he's really bad.

What are his stats like? Looks like we won't draft him after all Rhett.

Just as a sidenote, because I forgot to respond to it before, I didn't mean to present drafting Leonard as a good alternative to Vesely. I don't want either of them and would much rather take either Valanciunas or Biyombo or Walker at 5.

[Kevin Willis]

Well, I meant a poor man's Josh Smith. Josh Smith is an all-star and Vesely will never be one. But the draft isn't deep, that's what makes him intriguing. If he was Josh Smith he would go No.1.

Who would you compare him too? And don't say the guy at the YMCA who 40 yrs old and looks like Newman.

[bboyskinnylegs]

I wonder if Bismack is going to go to the Eurocamp in Treviso in addition to these workouts in Spain with the Raps/Wiz/Pistons/Jazz.

[Reignman]

Again, go back and find a quote where I've said Kanter will be a great defender. I've never said it.

So then why are you all over his nuts? If you have the same question marks I do about his defense and ability to play centre what is it that you actually like beyond his size?

I'm a firm believer that the most important thing when considering drafting a big to play centre at the 5 spot has got to be defensive awareness. In the limited footage we've seen he doesn't possess much of it and furthermore nor does he want to play centre.

Its seems as though he can give you good mins at centre in a limited role but to ask him to defend the paint, rebound and also go on offense and showcase his real talent seems like a bit of a stretch.

First of all the exact quote was "I can play forward too".

Secondly, all I'm saying is that taking 30 seconds worth of clips from 2years ago, made to highlight bad plays, isn't a good way to project a player down the road. You could easily make a 30 sec highlight clip of good defensive plays from the U-18s / Hoopsummit and say he'll be the next Bogut.

Basically, I'm guessing pro scouts will take a less amateurish approach to projecting him as a player.

[T_Biggums]

Again, go back and find a quote where I've said Kanter will be a great defender. I've never said it.

So then why are you all over his nuts? If you have the same question marks I do about his defense and ability to play centre what is it that you actually like beyond his size?

I'm a firm believer that the most important thing when considering drafting a big to play centre at the 5 spot has got to be defensive awareness. In the limited footage we've seen he doesn't possess much of it and furthermore nor does he want to play centre.

Its seems as though he can give you good mins at centre in a limited role but to ask him to defend the paint, rebound and also go on offense and showcase his real talent seems like a bit of a stretch.

First of all the exact quote was "I can play forward too".

Secondly, all I'm saying is that taking 30 seconds worth of clips from 2years ago, made to highlight bad plays, isn't a good way to project a player down the road. You could easily make a 30 sec highlight clip of good defensive plays from the U-18s / Hoopsummit and say he'll be the next Bogut.

Basically, I'm guessing pro scouts will take a less amateurish approach to projecting him as a player.

Agreed. Kelly came away saying he is a very nice prospect with huge question marks about whether or not he can play the 5

[jrsmith]

Basically, I'm guessing pro scouts will take a less amateurish approach to projecting him as a player.

Oh dang, I was hoping they would take a look at that "free throw" line dunk and think hes the next Dwight (with a shooting touch of course).

[ty123]

Again, go back and find a quote where I've said Kanter will be a great defender. I've never said it.

So then why are you all over his nuts? If you have the same question marks I do about his defense and ability to play centre what is it that you actually like beyond his size?

I'm a firm believer that the most important thing when considering drafting a big to play centre at the 5 spot has got to be defensive awareness. In the limited footage we've seen he doesn't possess much of it and furthermore nor does he want to play centre.

Its seems as though he can give you good mins at centre in a limited role but to ask him to defend the paint, rebound and also go on offense and showcase his real talent seems like a bit of a stretch.

First of all the exact quote was "I can play forward too".

Secondly, all I'm saying is that taking 30 seconds worth of clips from 2years ago, made to highlight bad plays, isn't a good way to project a player down the road. You could easily make a 30 sec highlight clip of good defensive plays from the U-18s / Hoopsummit and say he'll be the next Bogut.

Basically, I'm guessing pro scouts will take a less amateurish approach to projecting him as a player.

It's more than 30 seconds of footage and also highlights a few good plays. Don't kidd yourself. He sucks at Defense.

[Truthrising]

So then why are you all over his nuts? If you have the same question marks I do about his defense and ability to play centre what is it that you actually like beyond his size?

I'm a firm believer that the most important thing when considering drafting a big to play centre at the 5 spot has got to be defensive awareness. In the limited footage we've seen he doesn't possess much of it and furthermore nor does he want to play centre.

Its seems as though he can give you good mins at centre in a limited role but to ask him to defend the paint, rebound and also go on offense and showcase his real talent seems like a bit of a stretch.

First of all the exact quote was "I can play forward too".

Secondly, all I'm saying is that taking 30 seconds worth of clips from 2years ago, made to highlight bad plays, isn't a good way to project a player down the road. You could easily make a 30 sec highlight clip of good defensive plays from the U-18s / Hoopsummit and say he'll be the next Bogut.

Basically, I'm guessing pro scouts will take a less amateurish approach to projecting him as a player.

It's more than 30 seconds of footage and also highlights a few good plays. He sucks at Defense.

As i've said to 5dom, it wouldn't be that hard to compile lowlights of Jonas Valnciunas defence when he was 16-17.

[ty123]

^^^ It's already there. Go youtube David Locke.

[T_Biggums]

As i've said to 5dom, it wouldn't be that hard to compile lowlights of Jonas Valnciunas defence when he was 16-17.

Agreed. I don't want him at 5 either