Patrick McCaw Apology Thread

[Randle McMurphy]

it is not. people believing Patrick is actually good, good defensively, solid, not bad, a hard worker, or any combination thereof, is diametrically one of the biggest finesse jobs we've seen in the 21st century. McCaw has almost everyone fooled. but dont be fooled. he trash.

I don't even understand where the myth that the guy is actually good is coming from. This isn't even a guy just starting out. He's literally done nothing in a 4 year NBA career so far.

Like, would anybody ever be saying such a thing about Stanley Johnson (who, for the record, unlike McCaw, has shown himself to be a good NBA defender)?

Looks like McCaw is the new Chris (soon to be HOFer) Bosh - at least in the narrow sense that he gets Randle banned again.

I'm not saying that Nick and Masai are above criticism for their personnel/rotation choices this seas ... hang on, that's exactly what I'm saying!

No one is ever above getting criticized for any given decision, least of all playing a proven scrub 30 minutes a game over a legit prospect.

[The_Hater]

Unfortunately Nurse has his favourites no matter how they are playing or what the stats say.

Sometimes it works out. FVV and Powell have had awful stretches since he became coach but both have proved their worth.

Then there are occasions where a player has cart blanche or Nurse goes with rotations that make no sense..

You’re making this sound like Nurse has been doing crazy, mind boggling stuff with his rotations for the past year and a half and that would be false. We’re talking about an elite coach who has done nothing but win games during that same frame.

Other than his recent overuse of McCaw, who has he played that didn’t deserve the minutes they received? Powell has a TS% of almost 60.0 last season so he deserved to play. He had 4 bad games to start the current season and everyone went bonkers for some reason. Everyone else has been a proven player or played well when given the minutes and you don’t bench proven players just because they have a tough stretch, that’s what bad coaches do, not good coaches.

The problem with McCaw is he’s never proven himself to be either a good player or a reliable player. Big, big difference.

[AkelaLoneWolf]

Unfortunately Nurse has his favourites no matter how they are playing or what the stats say.

Sometimes it works out. FVV and Powell have had awful stretches since he became coach but both have proved their worth.

Then there are occasions where a player has cart blanche or Nurse goes with rotations that make no sense..

You’re making this sound like Nurse has been doing crazy, mind boggling stuff with his rotations for the past year and a half and that would be false. We’re talking about an elite coach who has done nothing but win games during that same frame.

Other than his recent overuse of McCaw, who has he played that didn’t deserve the minutes they received? Powell has a TS% of almost 60.0 last season so he deserved to play. He had 4 bad games to start the current season and everyone went bonkers for some reason. Everyone else has been a proven player or played well when given the minutes and you don’t bench proven players just because they have a tough stretch, that’s what bad coaches do, not good coaches.

The problem with McCaw is he’s never proven himself to be either a good player or a reliable player. Big, big difference.

That's not true. He's played productive minutes for a championship Warriors team. And he's never got enough of a run here in Toronto to definitively say that he's been bad. Either he's been injured or buried on the rotation chart.
Now we have a chance to fully assess him and raps should take that opportunity.
Imagine him and TDII backing up the bench. If he can get that 3 point shot going, you'll have 2 ball handlers and shooters coming off the bench and having a good defensive player at 6'7" and playing the point would be great. And that's in addition of Matt Thomas also.

[AkelaLoneWolf]

Not to mention your role players generally tend to always look better when they're on good to great teams. The Warriors made Alfonzo McKinnie look like he may have been a lost gem at one point. The fact that McCaw has essentially been on the 3 greatest teams in the last 3 years and have not really stood out at any point says everything. If this guy was not so lucky and fortunate to enter the league and be put in the absolute best conditions to thrive and succeed, he'd be be struggling to find rotation minutes across the league right about now.

so he played well enough to play with the best and that's supposed to be a bad thing now?

[OAKLEY_2]

Not to mention your role players generally tend to always look better when they're on good to great teams. The Warriors made Alfonzo McKinnie look like he may have been a lost gem at one point. The fact that McCaw has essentially been on the 3 greatest teams in the last 3 years and have not really stood out at any point says everything. If this guy was not so lucky and fortunate to enter the league and be put in the absolute best conditions to thrive and succeed, he'd be be struggling to find rotation minutes across the league right about now.

so he played well enough to play with the best and that's supposed to be a bad thing now?

I do not think he has the ability to strike fear in anybody in the playoffs. Davis is not only "a player" but a real tank of an athlete. Cannot see how we choose McCaw over Davis unless it is simply about time already logged in Nursing school. If that is the case I do not expept this experimental situation to keep bumping Davis long term.

[ATLTimekeeper]

McCaw started 20 games for a 67 win team as a rookie. He can certainly backfill a 5th starter role, even as an offensive minus. If everyone was healthy, I don't think he should be in the rotation, but right now they need bodies. Have they been wildly outplayed with McCaw on the floor recently? Just his first game back against the Clippers when Nurse tried that foolish Ibaka-Boucher-Rondae-McCaw-Davis line-up to start the 4th. So for the most part, if he's used correctly he's been neutral at worst.

[The_Hater]

Unfortunately Nurse has his favourites no matter how they are playing or what the stats say.

Sometimes it works out. FVV and Powell have had awful stretches since he became coach but both have proved their worth.

Then there are occasions where a player has cart blanche or Nurse goes with rotations that make no sense..

You’re making this sound like Nurse has been doing crazy, mind boggling stuff with his rotations for the past year and a half and that would be false. We’re talking about an elite coach who has done nothing but win games during that same frame.

Other than his recent overuse of McCaw, who has he played that didn’t deserve the minutes they received? Powell has a TS% of almost 60.0 last season so he deserved to play. He had 4 bad games to start the current season and everyone went bonkers for some reason. Everyone else has been a proven player or played well when given the minutes and you don’t bench proven players just because they have a tough stretch, that’s what bad coaches do, not good coaches.

The problem with McCaw is he’s never proven himself to be either a good player or a reliable player. Big, big difference.

That's not true. He's played productive minutes for a championship Warriors team. And he's never got enough of a run here in Toronto to definitively say that he's been bad. Either he's been injured or buried on the rotation chart.
Now we have a chance to fully assess him and raps should take that opportunity.
Imagine him and TDII backing up the bench. If he can get that 3 point shot going, you'll have 2 ball handlers and shooters coming off the bench and having a good defensive player at 6'7" and playing the point would be great. And that's in addition of Matt Thomas also.

He played some minutes for the Warriors as a rookie when they had no depth on the roster, however he was NOT productive. Don’t confuse those 2 things as being one and the same. And one year later as a sophomore he wasn’t playing at all for the Warriors come playoffs and just last season the Cavs released him he was so terrible.

But what is the point of ‘imagine if he gets his 3 point shot going’? He’s never been a 3 point shooter and he’s not one right now and misses badly on most of his attempts. He’s 29% for his career and 25% for the current season on a low rate of attempts. Other than expecting things to magically and suddenly change I just don’t see how this is a realistic expectation? Until then, he kills the spacing because nobody guards him at all. He’s a huge negative on offense in every way similar and possibly worse than Nitikina in NYK

[ATLTimekeeper]

He shot 36% in college over 2 seasons on pretty good volume. He's not someone that entered the league a non-shooter, so there's definitely hope there. Oddly his corner shooting has been very good in the NBA (.455 + .555 the last two seasons), but this year he's only at .250. 7 games in and the last two have been decent. Let's see how he looks in a week.

[2019nbachamps]

I laugh at the argument that playing for the Warriors proves McCaw is a valuable player.

You could've slotted me next to Steph, Klay, Dray, and Durant and they would still be a 60+ win team.

Now that I think of it, McCaw's numbers on the GSW were even more underwhelming considering he played next to 3 HOFers. This season he's averaging 7 more MPG than with the Warriors yet he's still averaging 4 PPG. Dude is a complete liability on offense. Unlike GSW, the Raptors can't afford to play -1 on offense for 48 minutes every game.

[AkelaLoneWolf]

I laugh at the argument that playing for the Warriors proves McCaw is a valuable player.

You could've slotted me next to Steph, Klay, Dray, and Durant and they would still be a 60+ win team.

Now that I think of it, McCaw's numbers on the GSW were even more underwhelming considering he played next to 3 HOFers. This season he's averaging 7 more MPG than with the Warriors yet he's still averaging 4 PPG. Dude is a complete liability on offense. Unlike GSW, the Raptors can't afford to play -1 on offense for 48 minutes every game.

you'll never understand mccaw's value if all you do is watch boxscores.

[AkelaLoneWolf]

Not to mention your role players generally tend to always look better when they're on good to great teams. The Warriors made Alfonzo McKinnie look like he may have been a lost gem at one point. The fact that McCaw has essentially been on the 3 greatest teams in the last 3 years and have not really stood out at any point says everything. If this guy was not so lucky and fortunate to enter the league and be put in the absolute best conditions to thrive and succeed, he'd be be struggling to find rotation minutes across the league right about now.

so he played well enough to play with the best and that's supposed to be a bad thing now?

I do not think he has the ability to strike fear in anybody in the playoffs. Davis is not only "a player" but a real tank of an athlete. Cannot see how we choose McCaw over Davis unless it is simply about time already logged in Nursing school. If that is the case I do not expept this experimental situation to keep bumping Davis long term.

davis and mccaw are not competing against each other.

[Lateral Quicks]

McCaw doesn't do anything well enough to deserve the minutes he's been getting. Also he doesn't have the size to play SF - he's a string bean out there despite 4 years in the league. He's slightly above average defensively due to his length and lateral quicks, but whatever he gives you on the defensive end he takes from you on the offensive end. He's a sub 30% 3-pt shooter in his NBA career, with an eFG% mark of sub .500.

RHJ should be getting the bulk of McCaw's minutes. And when everyone is healthy, McCaw should be a 3rd stringer who ideally doesn't see the floor except in garbage time.

[Dalek]

I like McCaw for all the reasons listed with handsy defense, playmaking and cutting.

That said, this is the time to let a variety of options play out and not be too fixed on one lineup or rotation. We need Nick Nurse -Mad Scientist back.

Would like to see a Boucher-Ibaka front court, today maybe use RHJ and Ibaka to chase Porzingis around. Have Davis start with Lowry a few games to see if he responds as a starter.

Key is to use the time to experiment. No need to overplay Lowry and FVV when crunch time scoring is going to dry up. McCaw playing is actually showing that Nurse has begun the experiment.

I don't think McCaw will be a permanent starter unless he really knocks it out of the park. For that to happen, he would be in range of 12 PPG 4 AST and 2.5 STL.

[Randle McMurphy]

I laugh at the argument that playing for the Warriors proves McCaw is a valuable player.

You could've slotted me next to Steph, Klay, Dray, and Durant and they would still be a 60+ win team.

Now that I think of it, McCaw's numbers on the GSW were even more underwhelming considering he played next to 3 HOFers. This season he's averaging 7 more MPG than with the Warriors yet he's still averaging 4 PPG. Dude is a complete liability on offense. Unlike GSW, the Raptors can't afford to play -1 on offense for 48 minutes every game.

you'll never understand mccaw's value if all you do is watch boxscores.

I guess this scrub has apparently become the Marc Gasol of guards (despite all metrics indicating that he's absolutely terrible in every way).

[RoLo]

I laugh at the argument that playing for the Warriors proves McCaw is a valuable player.

You could've slotted me next to Steph, Klay, Dray, and Durant and they would still be a 60+ win team.

Now that I think of it, McCaw's numbers on the GSW were even more underwhelming considering he played next to 3 HOFers. This season he's averaging 7 more MPG than with the Warriors yet he's still averaging 4 PPG. Dude is a complete liability on offense. Unlike GSW, the Raptors can't afford to play -1 on offense for 48 minutes every game.

you'll never understand mccaw's value if all you do is watch boxscores.

Plenty of people watch games and know exactly what the hell they are seeing. Do not equate not making mistakes to being good. Basketball is a game of flow and creativity. its about risk and reward. there is always a balance. its like eating plain toast every day for the rest of your life. will it have consequences? Probably not. will it bring any real tangible benefit? Absolute f*cking not. the best this guys going to ever be is garrett temple. thats not a damn compliment. the career highlight of garrett freakin temple is he's Vice President of the NBPA

maybe adjust your own lens and accept the possibility that u, even u, have been finessed by Patrick 3 Ringzzz himself. The greatest victories in life are admitting one's own failures.

[AkelaLoneWolf]

^^^lol y'all seriously need to stop being triggered about a player who is getting minutes and is most likely being evaluated by coaching and gm staff.

[GordanFreeman]

McCaw needs to redeem himself...

[ATLTimekeeper]

I thought he had another nice game. The hefty minus wasn't on him. 4 steals and hit his shots. The defensive energy was great to start the game and he was a big part of it. I'd like to see him grab more rebounds.

[C_Money]

He shouldn’t be starting. We’ve replaced Siakam’s 25 PPG with a guy who can barely score. No wonder the starting lineup looked like sh*t.

[rrdjutriurt]

Both games we didn't mount comebacks until McCaw was taken off the floor for good. Would have been better off with Boucher in the starting lineup because he would at least help contest the ridiculous number of threes the Pacers hit. Don't see the benefit in playing McCaw when you have both Lowry and Freddie in the starting lineup.