ESPN 2022 player rankings(Pascal #30 FVV #38 Scottie #39)

[pingpongrac]

Speaking to outliers doesnt strengthen your case.

VVV could you add Capela to your table? Show 720 that Capelas the outlier because he only ranks in the 90+% in one stat and not across multiple catch all advanced stats?

Cheers

It’s okay, I guess Al Horford, Desmond Bane, Porzingis, Mike Conley, etc, are all top 20 players in this league too according to ESPN real plus minus. Totally sane opinions to have I guess. /s

Or are those guys outliers too? If they are, a stat where 5 guys are outliers in the top 20 is a joke stat. Actually watch games people.

Again, you're literally looking at one stat. How many of those players are near the top of the league in virtually every impact stat? And how many of those players are posting elite impact stats while being a top option for a ~50-win team? Porzingis (great numbers for a terrible Washington team and decent numbers for an at the time pretty good Dallas team) and Bane (very good numbers as a 2nd/3rd option for a great Memphis team) are the only ones that come remotely close to FVV's impact + traditional stats.

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[HumbleRen]

Siakam 5-10 spots too low and we all know this lol.

Fred about right but im surprised he ranks above certain pgs like Garland.

Scottie, love him, but on one hand it seems to high, and on the other hand he should be above mobley and even Cunningham , so what does that say about them? Weird.

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They're all very close to each other. We gotta stop acting like Scottie winning ROTY suddenly makes him a better prospect over Mobley and Cade.

All of them would of won ROTY is we drafted them.

But these ranks aren't about who they think the best prospects are. They are about who they think will be the best next year. All three of those players are returning to the same teams they were on last year. From an analytics perspective, Scottie was quite clearly the best rookie last year and he should have an even larger role next year. Cade should be much improved but his team is likely to be really bad again and he's probably going to be wildly inefficient once again. If you're going to have a 50% TS% and win 25 games you don't belong anywhere near the top 30. LOL.

I actually agree with Scottie's placing at 39 but some of the players ahead of him like Mobley and Cade should be lower.

Regardless of where you have them ranked, I don't think it's ridiculous at all to think Cade and Mobley can have a better season than Barnes, nor would I think it would be ridiculous to think Barnes would be better than them. They're both very plausible situations.

I don't think it's a slanderous thing against Scottie is what I'm trying to say. Frankly they're all about 10 spots too high anyways IMO.

[bballsparkin]

As usual, CBSsports is better. https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-top-100-player-rankings-giannis-stephen-curry-kevin-durant-vie-for-no-1-lebron-james-slips/

Gary Trent Jr #75, OG #59, Scottie #48 ahead of Domantas by two spots, FVV #38, and Pascal #24. Seems pretty good to me.

[HumbleRen]

As usual, CBSsports is better. https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-top-100-player-rankings-giannis-stephen-curry-kevin-durant-vie-for-no-1-lebron-james-slips/

Gary Trent Jr #75, OG #59, Scottie #48 ahead of Domantas by two spots, FVV #38, and Pascal #24. Seems pretty good to me.

Looks pretty good to me. I’d probably swap CP3 and Siakam though.

[KrazyP]

VVV could you add Capela to your table? Show 720 that Capelas the outlier because he only ranks in the 90+% in one stat and not across multiple catch all advanced stats?

Cheers

It’s okay, I guess Al Horford, Desmond Bane, Porzingis, Mike Conley, etc, are all top 20 players in this league too according to ESPN real plus minus. Totally sane opinions to have I guess. /s

Or are those guys outliers too? If they are, a stat where 5 guys are outliers in the top 20 is a joke stat. Actually watch games people.

Again, you're literally looking at one stat. How many of those players are near the top of the league in virtually every impact stat? And how many of those players are posting elite impact stats while being a top option for a ~50-win team? Porzingis (great numbers for a terrible Washington team and decent numbers for an at the time pretty good Dallas team) and Bane (very good numbers as a 2nd/3rd option for a great Memphis team) are the only ones that come remotely close to FVV's impact + traditional stats.

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I'd also add that Al Horford actually made a massive, underappreciated impact on how that Celtic team functions. Some times these older, non-flashy impact players go unnoticed by fans that might be too focused on highlight reels and iso scoring.

I liken Horford to a non washed up version of the Raptors Marc Gasol....a guy that actually makes more basketball impact related to winning than several of the players that show up on top 50 lists.

[Parataxis]

No. 30: Pascal Siakam

Toronto Raptors | PF

2021 NBArank: 38

Swing skill: 3-point shooting. After making just 30% of his 3s during a frustrating 2020-21 campaign, Siakam bounced back to 34% last season, making the All-NBA third team for the second time in three years. Siakam reduced his dependence on the 3, attempting just 3.2 per game -- his lowest mark since 2018-19.

It would be nice if they took the time to get basic facts right, at least. This is not his second time making the 3rd team. Even when they're hyping him up, they're downplaying his achievements.

[LoveMyRaps]

How can you possibly list a guy like Ingram ahead of Siakam?

Makes zero sense...

[Mikistan]

How can you possibly list a guy like Ingram ahead of Siakam?

Makes zero sense...

ingram is 3 years younger and has pretty damn comparable stats - yes he is less efficient offensively but is more of a 3pt threat and gets to the FT line more - the TS percentages are a lot closer than you think - Siakam gets more rebounds - well except for this past playoffs where they have basically the same stats thru 6 games each - per 36 mins adjusted the gap narrows even more statistically
meanwhile Ingram has a higher usage% than siakam, which means he is carrying just as much of an offensive load as a defacto number 1 option?

[canada_dry]

How can you possibly list a guy like Ingram ahead of Siakam?

Makes zero sense...

ingram is 3 years younger and has pretty damn comparable stats - yes he is less efficient offensively but is more of a 3pt threat and gets to the FT line more - the TS percentages are a lot closer than you think - Siakam gets more rebounds - well except for this past playoffs where they have basically the same stats thru 6 games each - per 36 mins adjusted the gap narrows even more statistically
meanwhile Ingram has a higher usage% than siakam, which means he is carrying just as much of an offensive load as a defacto number 1 option?

All that to say....you cant.

Funny in all that you made no mention of the defensive gap between the two, while saying "hey at least offensively its close!"

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[JustLucky]

did gtj not crack the top 100? a little surprised

[Kingsway_fan]

How can you possibly list a guy like Ingram ahead of Siakam?

Makes zero sense...

Same for Middleton, imo...

[PoundTown]

Siakam 5-10 spots too low and we all know this lol.

Fred about right but im surprised he ranks above certain pgs like Garland.

Scottie, love him, but on one hand it seems to high, and on the other hand he should be above mobley and even Cunningham , so what does that say about them? Weird.

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They're all very close to each other. We gotta stop acting like Scottie winning ROTY suddenly makes him a better prospect over Mobley and Cade.

All of them would of won ROTY is we drafted them.

I agree They're very close but the fact that one of them WAS the ROY, he should be ranked above them until proven otherwise. I think the reason scottie is ranked as he is , is because he cant be too far behind mobley or cade, even though They're both way too high. As a result...all 3 are too high. And its lame.

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I mean they are also projecting these players when some people are interpreting based on what we've already seen. These look like the mid season rankings, not rankings based on last year.

[Raps in 4]

May be the worst player ranking list I've seen in my life.

[douggood]

They're all very close to each other. We gotta stop acting like Scottie winning ROTY suddenly makes him a better prospect over Mobley and Cade.

All of them would of won ROTY is we drafted them.

I agree They're very close but the fact that one of them WAS the ROY, he should be ranked above them until proven otherwise. I think the reason scottie is ranked as he is , is because he cant be too far behind mobley or cade, even though They're both way too high. As a result...all 3 are too high. And its lame.

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I mean they are also projecting these players when some people are interpreting based on what we've already seen. These look like the mid season rankings, not rankings based on last year.

exactly. this is a prediction for 22-23 season. says right there in the writeup

We asked, "Which player will be better in 2022-23?" Voters had to predict what they expected from each player during the season.

[douggood]

25-11 list is out
https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/34626241/nbarank-2022-ranking-best-players-2022-23-25-11

25 - anthony edwards
24 - donovan mittechll
23 - bam abedayo
22- jaylen brown
21 - cp3
20 - AD
19 - beal
18 - gobert
17 - butler
16 - trey young
15- pg13
14- lillard
13 - kat
12 - kawhi
11 - harden

[Young Moosehead]

As usual, CBSsports is better. https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-top-100-player-rankings-giannis-stephen-curry-kevin-durant-vie-for-no-1-lebron-james-slips/

Gary Trent Jr #75, OG #59, Scottie #48 ahead of Domantas by two spots, FVV #38, and Pascal #24. Seems pretty good to me.

Much better list. Assuming perfect health across the league, I wouldn't move any of our guys more than 5-7 or so spots, but I can see why the author put people where he did.

[execoftheyear]

wow lol...Pascal being all NBA should automatically make him at least top 15

[HumbleRen]

wow lol...Pascal being all NBA should automatically make him at least top 15

Not really.

Gobert has been all nba 4 times now, I don't think anyone would say he's been an "atleast top 15 player" caliber of a player.

[pingpongrac]

wow lol...Pascal being all NBA should automatically make him at least top 15

Not really.

Gobert has been all nba 4 times now, I don't think anyone would say he's been an "atleast top 15 player" caliber of a player.

I don't know about that. If you took a poll around the league in the last few years, Gobert likely would have been in the top 15 range more often than not seeing as he placed 11th in MVP voting in 18/19 and 10th in 20/21 while he made 3 straight All-NBA teams. In the same span, there has also been a "top 25 players" poll on the GB and Gobert has ranked 14th (18/19 offseason), 13th, 21st, 16th and 13th (this offseason) which averages out to 15.4. It seems pretty universal that Gobert has been expected to be a top 15ish player and rated as such for the past 5 seasons.

Again, if a player makes 0 or 1 All-NBA teams over a 3-5 year-stretch, it's pretty safe to assume they're not a top 15 player unless they've only been in the league a few seasons and they've taken a big leap (like Tatum after the bubble playoffs or Ja this past season). Randle (20/21) and Kemba (18/19) are a few recent examples who had great one-off years but haven't played like top 15 players in any other seasons. On the flip side, once a player makes 2-3 All-NBA teams over a 3-5 year-stretch, it's pretty safe to assume they are a top 15ish player. There are very few anomalies or players that stick out as anything but a bonafide star (DeAndre Jordan/Gobert who were both top defensive players + league leaders in rebounding, DeRozan who was scoring 25 PPG for very good regular season teams and Siakam who put up 22.8/8.0/4.5 in his two All-NBA seasons while being a two-way player).

[Johnny Bball]

We the other.