CMB or someone else?

[HumbleRen]

We are doing a lot of premature crowning of Flagg, which…I think is folly. The funny thing is that he’s a similar player to Barnes — versatile, high energy defender, who has a good understanding of how to facilitate an offence…but lacks true scoring prowess on an island. It’ll be interesting to see it play out, but I stand by what I’ve said before that Flagg’s best role in the future will be as a super role player third option on a contender. He’s not a guy you’re going to be able to give the ball to late in a game and say, “get me a bucket.” He will excel at most other things, however.
.

I’m not sure why there’s a sentiment around Flagg that he’s similar to Scottie. Flagg as an 18 year old is already more polished on offence than Scottie is in year 5, like it’s not even close lol.

I think Cooper is going to be what BI is offensively with Scottie Barnes’s defence.

[Psubs]

We are doing a lot of premature crowning of Flagg, which…I think is folly. The funny thing is that he’s a similar player to Barnes — versatile, high energy defender, who has a good understanding of how to facilitate an offence…but lacks true scoring prowess on an island. It’ll be interesting to see it play out, but I stand by what I’ve said before that Flagg’s best role in the future will be as a super role player third option on a contender. He’s not a guy you’re going to be able to give the ball to late in a game and say, “get me a bucket.” He will excel at most other things, however.
.

I’m not sure why there’s a sentiment around Flagg that he’s similar to Scottie. Flagg as an 18 year old is already more polished on offence than Scottie is in year 5, like it’s not even close lol.

I think Cooper is going to be what BI is offensively with Scottie Barnes’s defence.

More like Paulo Banchero with Barnes' defense.

[Johnny Bball]

Only other player I’d consider at that spot is Carter Bryant.

He was my choice on draft night and I'd still go with him, but CMB looks solid.

There was lots to like about both, and they measured pretty similar in lots of ways, but agility/mobility has to be a big part of why CMB was taken first. He was way quicker in the drill and showed way quicker playing. Between that and his mindset, he stands out as better projected 2 way player.

[MoneyBall]

Only other player I’d consider at that spot is Carter Bryant.

He was my choice on draft night and I'd still go with him, but CMB looks solid.

There was lots to like about both, and they measured pretty similar in lots of ways, but agility/mobility has to be a big part of why CMB was taken first. He was way quicker in the drill and showed way quicker playing. Between that and his mindset, he stands out as better projected 2 way player.

I trust Masai and co., they have a formidable track record for drafting.

[HiJiNX]

We are doing a lot of premature crowning of Flagg, which…I think is folly. The funny thing is that he’s a similar player to Barnes — versatile, high energy defender, who has a good understanding of how to facilitate an offence…but lacks true scoring prowess on an island. It’ll be interesting to see it play out, but I stand by what I’ve said before that Flagg’s best role in the future will be as a super role player third option on a contender. He’s not a guy you’re going to be able to give the ball to late in a game and say, “get me a bucket.” He will excel at most other things, however.
.

I’m not sure why there’s a sentiment around Flagg that he’s similar to Scottie. Flagg as an 18 year old is already more polished on offence than Scottie is in year 5, like it’s not even close lol.

I think Cooper is going to be what BI is offensively with Scottie Barnes’s defence.

Respectfully, Flagg shows nothing that makes him comparable to BI. Like literally zero. They play nothing alike. They’re mostly opposite players.

As for why I think Flagg and Barnes are similar, it’s because they’re both versatile jack of all trades defensive guys who understand where the ball needs to go. Are they identical players? Of course not. But neither are guys who think score first when they have the ball and neither are guys who are really competent at breaking down the D with their dribble on the perimeter.

Again, the narrative around Flagg is bigger than his talent. That’s not to say he won’t be a really strong player in the league — he will be. But if you’re expecting a superstar who can lead his team by scoring the ball, well I have a bridge to sell you.

[HiJiNX]

We are doing a lot of premature crowning of Flagg, which…I think is folly. The funny thing is that he’s a similar player to Barnes — versatile, high energy defender, who has a good understanding of how to facilitate an offence…but lacks true scoring prowess on an island. It’ll be interesting to see it play out, but I stand by what I’ve said before that Flagg’s best role in the future will be as a super role player third option on a contender. He’s not a guy you’re going to be able to give the ball to late in a game and say, “get me a bucket.” He will excel at most other things, however.
.

I’m not sure why there’s a sentiment around Flagg that he’s similar to Scottie. Flagg as an 18 year old is already more polished on offence than Scottie is in year 5, like it’s not even close lol.

I think Cooper is going to be what BI is offensively with Scottie Barnes’s defence.

More like Paulo Banchero with Barnes' defense.

Again, what about Flagg resembles Banchero? Much different players. If Banchero had Flagg’s intangibles and awareness on both sides of the ball he’d be an MVP candidate.

Similarly, if Flagg had Banchero’s scoring instinct he’d be a future MVP candidate.

[HiJiNX]

We are doing a lot of premature crowning of Flagg, which…I think is folly. The funny thing is that he’s a similar player to Barnes — versatile, high energy defender, who has a good understanding of how to facilitate an offence…but lacks true scoring prowess on an island. It’ll be interesting to see it play out, but I stand by what I’ve said before that Flagg’s best role in the future will be as a super role player third option on a contender. He’s not a guy you’re going to be able to give the ball to late in a game and say, “get me a bucket.” He will excel at most other things, however.

As for the conversation at hand, I’m happy we got CMB. And I’m glad we didn’t draft Malauch who didn’t show much in terms of heart when things got tough in the NCAA tournament.

My impression of Flagg is that he has shown a capacity for actualizing his potential; I never watched him in high school or college, but I've gotten the impression that his game in college demonstrates that he is clearly not averse to putting work in. Huge green flag! Since he'd have been able to dominate with solely his athleticism. I feel like he may have the courage to think that he could be the best player to ever pick up a basketball.

That being said becoming an elite iso scorer seems to be the most difficult thing in the league to become (more people try it than anything else, since they realize that a scorer who can't do anything else will get paid tens of millions more throughout their career than a player who can't do anything else but say rebound).

The rizz of FLAG.... the hard worker...

I absolutely believe Flagg is a hard worker. And has heart. And all the other intangibles you look for in a player.

But I’ve been around enough basketball to know that learning a bunch of skills in practice doesn’t necessarily translate to game situations. Do we think RJ doesn’t work on his right hand? That Barnes doesn’t work on his dribble moves? Etc. Everybody who plays competitive sports works on stuff. Not everyone can actualize it. And instincts, whether they pertain to rebounding, passing, scoring, defending etc. are usually required for any skill that players work on to translate to real games (especially at the highest level).

And with Flagg, I just don’t see the iso scoring instinct. Maybe I’ll be wrong. But I think I’ll be right.

[HiJiNX]

We are doing a lot of premature crowning of Flagg, which…I think is folly. The funny thing is that he’s a similar player to Barnes — versatile, high energy defender, who has a good understanding of how to facilitate an offence…but lacks true scoring prowess on an island. It’ll be interesting to see it play out, but I stand by what I’ve said before that Flagg’s best role in the future will be as a super role player third option on a contender. He’s not a guy you’re going to be able to give the ball to late in a game and say, “get me a bucket.” He will excel at most other things, however.

As for the conversation at hand, I’m happy we got CMB. And I’m glad we didn’t draft Malauch who didn’t show much in terms of heart when things got tough in the NCAA tournament.

Flagg is still 18...his offensive game is very refined and he absolutely has the potential to develop a 1on1 game.

It doesn’t matter how old he is. He’s not a score first guy.

[HiJiNX]

We are doing a lot of premature crowning of Flagg, which…I think is folly. The funny thing is that he’s a similar player to Barnes — versatile, high energy defender, who has a good understanding of how to facilitate an offence…but lacks true scoring prowess on an island. It’ll be interesting to see it play out, but I stand by what I’ve said before that Flagg’s best role in the future will be as a super role player third option on a contender. He’s not a guy you’re going to be able to give the ball to late in a game and say, “get me a bucket.” He will excel at most other things, however.

As for the conversation at hand, I’m happy we got CMB. And I’m glad we didn’t draft Malauch who didn’t show much in terms of heart when things got tough in the NCAA tournament.

Cooper Flagg in college - 19.2ppg/7.5rpg/4.2apg - .481/.385/.840 as a 17 year old
Scottie Barnes in college - 10.3ppg/4.0rpg/4/1apg - .503/.275/.621 as a 19 year old

There is a reason why he is much more heralded.

I would say current Barnes is Flagg's floor.

Numbers without context don’t mean a damn thing and you know that.

I’m not even sure why you’re comparing their numbers.

And it’s wild to me, ABSOLUTELY WILD, that you’re basically saying that Flagg is as good as Barnes right now. I mean, I know we’re down on Scottie but…wow.

This is exactly why I’m saying Flagg’s narrative is larger than his talent.

Just wow.

[YogurtProducer]

We are doing a lot of premature crowning of Flagg, which…I think is folly. The funny thing is that he’s a similar player to Barnes — versatile, high energy defender, who has a good understanding of how to facilitate an offence…but lacks true scoring prowess on an island. It’ll be interesting to see it play out, but I stand by what I’ve said before that Flagg’s best role in the future will be as a super role player third option on a contender. He’s not a guy you’re going to be able to give the ball to late in a game and say, “get me a bucket.” He will excel at most other things, however.

As for the conversation at hand, I’m happy we got CMB. And I’m glad we didn’t draft Malauch who didn’t show much in terms of heart when things got tough in the NCAA tournament.

Cooper Flagg in college - 19.2ppg/7.5rpg/4.2apg - .481/.385/.840 as a 17 year old
Scottie Barnes in college - 10.3ppg/4.0rpg/4/1apg - .503/.275/.621 as a 19 year old

There is a reason why he is much more heralded.

I would say current Barnes is Flagg's floor.

Numbers without context don’t mean a damn thing and you know that.

I’m not even sure why you’re comparing their numbers.

And it’s wild to me, ABSOLUTELY WILD, that you’re basically saying that Flagg is as good as Barnes right now. I mean, I know we’re down on Scottie but…wow.

This is exactly why I’m saying Flagg’s narrative is larger than his talent.

Just wow.

What context do you need? Cooper did that on a final four team in the ACC.

And is what you mean down on Scottie? You think Scottie is better…? Flagg is really, really good man. I struggle to actually think of something Barnes is a lock to be superior at?

Flagg might surpass Barnes as early as like, December lol

[HiJiNX]

Cooper Flagg in college - 19.2ppg/7.5rpg/4.2apg - .481/.385/.840 as a 17 year old
Scottie Barnes in college - 10.3ppg/4.0rpg/4/1apg - .503/.275/.621 as a 19 year old

There is a reason why he is much more heralded.

I would say current Barnes is Flagg's floor.

Numbers without context don’t mean a damn thing and you know that.

I’m not even sure why you’re comparing their numbers.

And it’s wild to me, ABSOLUTELY WILD, that you’re basically saying that Flagg is as good as Barnes right now. I mean, I know we’re down on Scottie but…wow.

This is exactly why I’m saying Flagg’s narrative is larger than his talent.

Just wow.

What context do you need? Cooper did that on a final four team in the ACC.

And is what you mean down on Scottie? You think Scottie is better…? Flagg is really, really good man. I struggle to actually think of something Barnes is a lock to be superior at?

Flagg might surpass Barnes as early as like, December lol

The Raptors fanbase is absolutely down on Scottie, which is why these types of convos are happening everywhere.

All I remember from that NCAA tournament was Flagg dominating until he had to face guys who could match his athleticism. And then in the game where Duke got eliminated Flagg had a bevy of iso opportunities and failed on mostly all of them. The tape is there if you want to watch it.

And I’ve never regarded Flagg as a can’t miss superstar. There are 5 to 7 superstars in the league. You have to be REALLY REALLY good to be a superstar in the NBA. And in today’s league, being a superstar means being a top iso scorer and I just don’t see it with Flagg.

And as far as the Barnes/Flagg comparison goes, Barnes in my opinion will always be the better defender. There is little doubt in my mind about that.

[YogurtProducer]

Numbers without context don’t mean a damn thing and you know that.

I’m not even sure why you’re comparing their numbers.

And it’s wild to me, ABSOLUTELY WILD, that you’re basically saying that Flagg is as good as Barnes right now. I mean, I know we’re down on Scottie but…wow.

This is exactly why I’m saying Flagg’s narrative is larger than his talent.

Just wow.

What context do you need? Cooper did that on a final four team in the ACC.

And is what you mean down on Scottie? You think Scottie is better…? Flagg is really, really good man. I struggle to actually think of something Barnes is a lock to be superior at?

Flagg might surpass Barnes as early as like, December lol

The Raptors fanbase is absolutely down on Scottie, which is why these types of convos are happening everywhere.

All I remember from that NCAA tournament was Flagg dominating until he had to face guys who could match his athleticism. And then in the game where Duke got eliminated Flagg had a bevy of iso opportunities and failed on mostly all of them. The tape is there if you want to watch it.

And I’ve never regarded Flagg as a can’t miss superstar. There are 5 to 7 superstars in the league. You have to be REALLY REALLY good to be a superstar in the NBA. And in today’s league, being a superstar means being a top iso scorer and I just don’t see it with Flagg.

And as far as the Barnes/Flagg comparison goes, Barnes in my opinion will always be the better defender. There is little doubt in my mind about that.

So you’re basing this on a couple games? Scottie would’ve failed even harder in Those scenarios. FWIW - this isn’t a Knock on Barnes. Flagg is just that generational.

Flagg put up 27/7/4 on 59TS% in the game you’re referring to btw lol. His “bad game” was still incredible. His teammates scored 43 points on 13/34 shooting lol

And sure, except Flagg is a great defensive prospect who projects to be a terrific on ball and team defender. There’s really no guarantee Barnes is better on that end either.

[Yallbecrazy]

We are doing a lot of premature crowning of Flagg, which…I think is folly. The funny thing is that he’s a similar player to Barnes — versatile, high energy defender, who has a good understanding of how to facilitate an offence…but lacks true scoring prowess on an island. It’ll be interesting to see it play out, but I stand by what I’ve said before that Flagg’s best role in the future will be as a super role player third option on a contender. He’s not a guy you’re going to be able to give the ball to late in a game and say, “get me a bucket.” He will excel at most other things, however.

As for the conversation at hand, I’m happy we got CMB. And I’m glad we didn’t draft Malauch who didn’t show much in terms of heart when things got tough in the NCAA tournament.

Flagg is still 18...his offensive game is very refined and he absolutely has the potential to develop a 1on1 game.

It doesn’t matter how old he is. He’s not a score first guy.

Not currently, but there's a reason he's the best prospect since Doncic.

[HumbleRen]

We are doing a lot of premature crowning of Flagg, which…I think is folly. The funny thing is that he’s a similar player to Barnes — versatile, high energy defender, who has a good understanding of how to facilitate an offence…but lacks true scoring prowess on an island. It’ll be interesting to see it play out, but I stand by what I’ve said before that Flagg’s best role in the future will be as a super role player third option on a contender. He’s not a guy you’re going to be able to give the ball to late in a game and say, “get me a bucket.” He will excel at most other things, however.
.

I’m not sure why there’s a sentiment around Flagg that he’s similar to Scottie. Flagg as an 18 year old is already more polished on offence than Scottie is in year 5, like it’s not even close lol.

I think Cooper is going to be what BI is offensively with Scottie Barnes’s defence.

Respectfully, Flagg shows nothing that makes him comparable to BI. Like literally zero. They play nothing alike. They’re mostly opposite players.

As for why I think Flagg and Barnes are similar, it’s because they’re both versatile jack of all trades defensive guys who understand where the ball needs to go. Are they identical players? Of course not. But neither are guys who think score first when they have the ball and neither are guys who are really competent at breaking down the D with their dribble on the perimeter.

Again, the narrative around Flagg is bigger than his talent. That’s not to say he won’t be a really strong player in the league — he will be. But if you’re expecting a superstar who can lead his team by scoring the ball, well I have a bridge to sell you.

I mean respectfully Scottie at 18 isn’t doing this. Scottie is 5 years older than current Flagg and he can’t look this fluid on offence. I just don’t think they’re similar at all outside of their defensive skillset.

[Thaddy]

I’m not sure why there’s a sentiment around Flagg that he’s similar to Scottie. Flagg as an 18 year old is already more polished on offence than Scottie is in year 5, like it’s not even close lol.

I think Cooper is going to be what BI is offensively with Scottie Barnes’s defence.

Respectfully, Flagg shows nothing that makes him comparable to BI. Like literally zero. They play nothing alike. They’re mostly opposite players.

As for why I think Flagg and Barnes are similar, it’s because they’re both versatile jack of all trades defensive guys who understand where the ball needs to go. Are they identical players? Of course not. But neither are guys who think score first when they have the ball and neither are guys who are really competent at breaking down the D with their dribble on the perimeter.

Again, the narrative around Flagg is bigger than his talent. That’s not to say he won’t be a really strong player in the league — he will be. But if you’re expecting a superstar who can lead his team by scoring the ball, well I have a bridge to sell you.

I mean respectfully Scottie at 18 isn’t doing this. Scottie is 5 years older than current Flagg and he can’t look this fluid on offence. I just don’t think they’re similar at all outside of their defensive skillset.

Scottie is 6'9 with a wingspan of a 7 footer. He can't exactly move like a guard. It's kind of like when we were trying to make Bruno a wing but he was closer to a big man. Flagg doesn't have the defense, grab and go, and vision that Barnes has in transition. Players who can play intense defense and turn it into quick and minimal effort points are the best players in this league.

[CPT]

Flagg having a 99% chance of being better than Barnes and possibly being there already is not some kind of hater position, lol.

I’m betting the pushback on this will look insane by this time next year.

[ATLTimekeeper]

Flagg averaged 25p/40 as a 17 year old. That's not looking to score first? It's incredibly hard to accomplish this rate.

[YogurtProducer]

Flagg having a 99% chance of being better than Barnes and possibly being there already is not some kind of hater position, lol.

I’m betting the pushback on this will look insane by this time next year.

It looks insane to say today IMO.

Flagg is just better. It doesn’t mean Scottie sucks, it’s jusd Scottie isn’t a generational talent.

[Los_29]

Flagg isn’t a generational talent either. But he is a way better prospect than Scottie.

[canada_dry]

Maybe a reach for Hansen but other than that im good. I was definitely expecting the maluach pick to happen. Wouldn't have minded that either.

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