2020-21 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread V2

[AussieRaptor]

if this was tweaked to the raptors getting ingram and the 14th pick and Pelicans getting wiseman, wiggins, #7 and a late future pick from toronto, I could see it possibly being more fair.

That would be heavily skewed towards the Raptors. I already think Pelicans say no in this scenario. No chance they’re giving away Ingram for less. Also, they can’t take on Wiseman’s salary in this trade. Would have to have more outgoing.

….you think the 14th pick is worth more than wiseman?

Ah, you’re trying to make it more fair for Pelicans. I thought you were just trying to give the Raptors the #14 pick.

For the record, I didn’t give Pelicans Wiseman because they can’t take on his salary in that deal. Would need to have more outgoing.

Do I think the #14 pick is worth more than Wiseman? I don’t know. Draft picks are generally over-valued. Obviously Wiseman was the #2 pick just last year, however many seem to view him in a negative light. I think some of the shine is gone from him, however different organizations will view him differently. I’m not sure if teams would rather Wiseman or the chance to draft Sengun for example. There’s also the cap hold of Wiseman vs that of the #14 pick.

[Raptors_128]

How off is the value here?

Raptors get: Wiggins + Wood + 2 + 14
Warriors get: Siakam
Rockets get: Wiseman + 4 + 7

Maybe make another move for Simmons and re-sign Lowry.

Sixers get: FVV + Wiggins + 2022 Raps 1st (lottery protected)
Raptors get: Simmons + Hill + filler

Lowry/Green/OG/Simmons/Wood
Flynn/GTJ/Moody/Boucher/Birch

I think we contend next year with this lineup.

[Kingsway_fan]

How off is the value here?

Raptors get: Wiggins + Wood + 2 + 14
Warriors get: Siakam
Rockets get: Wiseman + 4 + 7

Maybe make another move for Simmons and re-sign Lowry.

Sixers get: FVV + Wiggins + 2022 Raps 1st (lottery protected)
Raptors get: Simmons + Hill + filler

Lowry/Green/OG/Simmons/Wood
Flynn/GTJ/Moody/Boucher/Birch

I think we contend next year with this lineup.

Nope. Want no part of Simmons or Wiggins.

[ash_k]

I am looking at all those teams in the playoffs:
HOW can we possibly end up with
PG FVV
SG OG
SF Simmons
PF Siakam
C Turner
We cannot win with offense against Brooklyn and OG, Ben and Pascal are built to shut down Middleton and Wall-off Giannis with Turner waiting.
Best defending PG in the league in FVV
3 Players with DPOY potential in OG, Ben and Turner
With the proper attitude back, Pascal can be right up there with the best of them.
With Genius cNN at the helm, maximizing everybody's talent. We will be right up there to contend.
HOW?

[Rapsfan07]

I am looking at all those teams in the playoffs:
HOW can we possibly end up with
PG FVV
SG OG
SF Simmons
PF Siakam
C Turner
We cannot win with offense against Brooklyn and OG, Ben and Pascal are built to shut down Middleton and Wall-off Giannis with Turner waiting.
Best defending PG in the league in FVV
3 Players with DPOY potential in OG, Ben and Turner
With the proper attitude back, Pascal can be right up there with the best of them.
With Genius cNN at the helm, maximizing everybody's talent. We will be right up there to contend.
HOW?

I'm not sure it's going to be possible to get both Simmons and Turner while keeping OG, FVV and Siakam.

And I wouldn't want to do anyway. Nobody on that team is an elite shot creator and no one here projects to be a top 10-15 player in the league, which history shows is absolutely necessary to win a title.

Oh and shooting would be a major issue here as well.

[billy_hoyle]

I am looking at all those teams in the playoffs:
HOW can we possibly end up with
PG FVV
SG OG
SF Simmons
PF Siakam
C Turner
We cannot win with offense against Brooklyn and OG, Ben and Pascal are built to shut down Middleton and Wall-off Giannis with Turner waiting.
Best defending PG in the league in FVV
3 Players with DPOY potential in OG, Ben and Turner
With the proper attitude back, Pascal can be right up there with the best of them.
With Genius cNN at the helm, maximizing everybody's talent. We will be right up there to contend.
HOW?

I'm not sure it's going to be possible to get both Simmons and Turner while keeping OG, FVV and Siakam.

And I wouldn't want to do anyway. Nobody on that team is an elite shot creator and no one here projects to be a top 10-15 player in the league, which history shows is absolutely necessary to win a title.

Oh and shooting would be a major issue here as well.

Asset wise:
No.4 pick + Lowry gets you Simmons easily

Boucher + GTJ + future 1sts can get you Turner I would imagine

I wouldn't do either deal if I were the Raps. That said, the team could be really good if Simmons learns how to shoot, and OG goes supernova

[ash_k]

I am looking at all those teams in the playoffs:
HOW can we possibly end up with
PG FVV
SG OG
SF Simmons
PF Siakam
C Turner
We cannot win with offense against Brooklyn and OG, Ben and Pascal are built to shut down Middleton and Wall-off Giannis with Turner waiting.
Best defending PG in the league in FVV
3 Players with DPOY potential in OG, Ben and Turner
With the proper attitude back, Pascal can be right up there with the best of them.
With Genius cNN at the helm, maximizing everybody's talent. We will be right up there to contend.
HOW?

I'm not sure it's going to be possible to get both Simmons and Turner while keeping OG, FVV and Siakam.

And I wouldn't want to do anyway. Nobody on that team is an elite shot creator and no one here projects to be a top 10-15 player in the league, which history shows is absolutely necessary to win a title.

Oh and shooting would be a major issue here as well.

I certainly cannot deny that history. IMO, A defensive powerhouse the likes of which the league has never seen (3xDPOY potential+best PG defender+another versatile defender in Pascal) would be the kind of team that could "change" that history
(with that genius of a coach.)

FVV and OG are .400 3pt shooter and Myles is a "pure" Stretch 5 game in today's game. It is not a popular view right now but with spacing that FVV, OG, Myles and Pascal would offer Ben can beat any men off the dribble thus forcing defenses to collapse.
I just think we need to become that defensive juggernaut to give us a chance, even if it means sacrificing some offense. As we will never be able to match KD/Harden/Kyrie offensively.
Fair points though!

[billy_hoyle]

I am looking at all those teams in the playoffs:
HOW can we possibly end up with
PG FVV
SG OG
SF Simmons
PF Siakam
C Turner
We cannot win with offense against Brooklyn and OG, Ben and Pascal are built to shut down Middleton and Wall-off Giannis with Turner waiting.
Best defending PG in the league in FVV
3 Players with DPOY potential in OG, Ben and Turner
With the proper attitude back, Pascal can be right up there with the best of them.
With Genius cNN at the helm, maximizing everybody's talent. We will be right up there to contend.
HOW?

I'm not sure it's going to be possible to get both Simmons and Turner while keeping OG, FVV and Siakam.

And I wouldn't want to do anyway. Nobody on that team is an elite shot creator and no one here projects to be a top 10-15 player in the league, which history shows is absolutely necessary to win a title.

Oh and shooting would be a major issue here as well.

I certainly cannot deny that history. IMO, A defensive powerhouse the likes of which the league has never seen (3xDPOY potential+best PG defender+another versatile defender in Pascal) would be the kind of team that could "change" that history
(with that genius of a coach.)

FVV and OG are .400 3pt shooter and Myles is a "pure" Stretch 5 game in today's game. It is not a popular view right now but with spacing that FVV, OG, Myles and Pascal would offer Ben can beat any men off the dribble thus forcing defenses to collapse.
I just think we need to become that defensive juggernaut to give us a chance, even if it means sacrificing some offense. As we will never be able to match KD/Harden/Kyrie offensively.
Fair points though!

I agree with this premise. Everybody trying to catch up to these super offensively gifted teams. It's probably better to zag when everyone else zigs.

Triple-down on D

[WWSRD]

PJ Tucker punched Rasho Nesterovic in the face in practive and was cut immediately after.

Obviously, he needed to develop a 3, but he was showing potential before they cut him.

After the incident, he was a 2nd round pick with red flags that no one wanted to give a chance anymore.

[Spida888]

How off is the value here?

Raptors get: Wiggins + Wood + 2 + 14
Warriors get: Siakam
Rockets get: Wiseman + 4 + 7

Maybe make another move for Simmons and re-sign Lowry.

Sixers get: FVV + Wiggins + 2022 Raps 1st (lottery protected)
Raptors get: Simmons + Hill + filler

Lowry/Green/OG/Simmons/Wood
Flynn/GTJ/Moody/Boucher/Birch

I think we contend next year with this lineup.

I like the idea. I'm on board trading Siakam if it means we have a chance to move up to get Jalen Green and also getting assets. I'm also fine with using the GSW trade return to acquire #5 from Orlando as well.

Thing is I'm not sure Houston bites because Wiseman at this point is likely seen as a negative asset, let alone also giving up Wood. If Houston is down with it, I'm fine giving up #4 + #7 for #2 (presuming Raptors FO also believes in Green as much).

[Asif16]

Myles Turner would be a lethal fit with the Raptors.

Have to assume the Pacers are going to move one of Sabonis or Turner. They're just not a good fit. Turner most likely.

Jalen Suggs
Fred Vanvleet
OG Anunoby
Pascal Siakam
Myles Turner

Thats a really good starting 5.

[Rapsfan07]

Myles Turner would be a lethal fit with the Raptors.

Have to assume the Pacers are going to move one of Sabonis or Turner. They're just not a good fit. Turner most likely.

Jalen Suggs
Fred Vanvleet
OG Anunoby
Pascal Siakam
Myles Turner

Thats a really good starting 5.

I've always agreed that Turner was a great fit here in Toronto. Here's to hoping it gets done this offseason.

Weirdly enough, I have a strange feeling it might.

[Asif16]

Myles Turner would be a lethal fit with the Raptors.

Have to assume the Pacers are going to move one of Sabonis or Turner. They're just not a good fit. Turner most likely.

Jalen Suggs
Fred Vanvleet
OG Anunoby
Pascal Siakam
Myles Turner

Thats a really good starting 5.

I've always agreed that Turner was a great fit here in Toronto. Here's to hoping it gets done this offseason.

Weirdly enough, I have a strange feeling it might.

Well if Turner becomes available...Im sure multiple teams will be interested. Question becomes if we can beat a bidding war.

Boucher would most likely have to be included. One of Flynn and Harris? And Future Picks. We have Baynes and Rodney Hood for COntract matching purposes. Idk if that's gonna be enough

[Rapsfan07]

I'm not sure it's going to be possible to get both Simmons and Turner while keeping OG, FVV and Siakam.

And I wouldn't want to do anyway. Nobody on that team is an elite shot creator and no one here projects to be a top 10-15 player in the league, which history shows is absolutely necessary to win a title.

Oh and shooting would be a major issue here as well.

I certainly cannot deny that history. IMO, A defensive powerhouse the likes of which the league has never seen (3xDPOY potential+best PG defender+another versatile defender in Pascal) would be the kind of team that could "change" that history
(with that genius of a coach.)

FVV and OG are .400 3pt shooter and Myles is a "pure" Stretch 5 game in today's game. It is not a popular view right now but with spacing that FVV, OG, Myles and Pascal would offer Ben can beat any men off the dribble thus forcing defenses to collapse.
I just think we need to become that defensive juggernaut to give us a chance, even if it means sacrificing some offense. As we will never be able to match KD/Harden/Kyrie offensively.
Fair points though!

I agree with this premise. Everybody trying to catch up to these super offensively gifted teams. It's probably better to zag when everyone else zigs.

Triple-down on D

I don't think we need to "catch up" with the elite offensive teams in the NBA, but we do need someone who we can throw the ball to and they'll get us a bucket.

FVV is shooting sub 40% from the field
Pascal has proven he's not that guy
Simmons has proven he's not that guy
Turner has proven he's not that guy.

So unless you think OG is going to become a prime Ron Artest/LBJ, I'm not sure this is the best idea. For years, the Raptors have been in the top tier of defenses in the NBA and we only went all the way when we had an elite scorer.

That isn't a coincidence. Defense is important in the postseason and we know that but the team that scores the more points wins the game.

[S_Beezy]

https://play.acast.com/s/raptorsovereverything/whocantheraptorsaddinthedraftandsiakam-warriorstradeproposalw-adamspinella

I know another posted touched on this podcast with William Lou and Adam Spinella, my apologies as I can't find the post. He is spot on with his Assessments of the top 4. Mainly, Suggs has the "IT" factor. I frankly don't see it with Mobley or Green. Suggs passes the eye test. When I listen to him speak, he has an aura of a WINNING player. I know they are young, but Mobley and Green aren't as polished as he is and they are all the same age.

[billy_hoyle]

I certainly cannot deny that history. IMO, A defensive powerhouse the likes of which the league has never seen (3xDPOY potential+best PG defender+another versatile defender in Pascal) would be the kind of team that could "change" that history
(with that genius of a coach.)

FVV and OG are .400 3pt shooter and Myles is a "pure" Stretch 5 game in today's game. It is not a popular view right now but with spacing that FVV, OG, Myles and Pascal would offer Ben can beat any men off the dribble thus forcing defenses to collapse.
I just think we need to become that defensive juggernaut to give us a chance, even if it means sacrificing some offense. As we will never be able to match KD/Harden/Kyrie offensively.
Fair points though!

I agree with this premise. Everybody trying to catch up to these super offensively gifted teams. It's probably better to zag when everyone else zigs.

Triple-down on D

I don't think we need to "catch up" with the elite offensive teams in the NBA, but we do need someone who we can throw the ball to and they'll get us a bucket.

FVV is shooting sub 40% from the field
Pascal has proven he's not that guy
Simmons has proven he's not that guy
Turner has proven he's not that guy.

So unless you think OG is going to become a prime Ron Artest/LBJ, I'm not sure this is the best idea. For years, the Raptors have been in the top tier of defenses in the NBA and we only went all the way when we had an elite scorer.

That isn't a coincidence. Defense is important in the postseason and we know that but the team that scores the more points wins the game.

Our team that went all the way got rid of two mediocre to poor defenders in JV and DD, and replaced them with Gasol and Green/Leonard. That was a doubling down on defence IMO. We no longer had a weak link that could be targeted in the playoffs, which is what continuously happened in previous years. I'm not saying that having an elite shot maker didn't help, I just think it might not be as important as it seems.

I think we went iso-centric in that run to the detriment to our overall team offense (I.e. we leaned way too hard on Kawhi). What was our playoff O rating that year compared to the year we made the Eastern Conference finals, or last year; I wonder if it was much better?

We lost to the Celtics last year because Siakam forgot how to play basketball.

[Raptors_128]

How off is the value here?

Raptors get: Wiggins + Wood + 2 + 14
Warriors get: Siakam
Rockets get: Wiseman + 4 + 7

Maybe make another move for Simmons and re-sign Lowry.

Sixers get: FVV + Wiggins + 2022 Raps 1st (lottery protected)
Raptors get: Simmons + Hill + filler

Lowry/Green/OG/Simmons/Wood
Flynn/GTJ/Moody/Boucher/Birch

I think we contend next year with this lineup.

I like the idea. I'm on board trading Siakam if it means we have a chance to move up to get Jalen Green and also getting assets. I'm also fine with using the GSW trade return to acquire #5 from Orlando as well.

Thing is I'm not sure Houston bites because Wiseman at this point is likely seen as a negative asset, let alone also giving up Wood. If Houston is down with it, I'm fine giving up #4 + #7 for #2 (presuming Raptors FO also believes in Green as much).

Yeah I really like Simmons fit with that starting lineup. It hides all of his flaws and really showcases his talent. He can focus on passing in transition, kick-outs on drives, and defense. In the half-court we have Lowry for the playmaking and Lowry/Green as the ball handlers.

As you said this only works if Houston still values Wiseman as a top pick. Wood is turning 26 and has 2 years left on his deal.

[provecy15]

If we do the Wiseman, Wiggins and # 7 Deal, and we resign Trent. I let Lowry walk and sign Mo Wagner to a minimum contract. I'm also looking to package both 2nd round picks along with the 7th pick and a protected top 20 2023 pick to Orlando for the 5th pick. I just do not see this group with Siakam as " the guy" being competitive next year when the Nets, Bucks, Philly, Celtics, Hawks, and the Knicks are currently better than us. I would like us to have a mixture of veterans and young players with high end talent moving forward.

With the 4th pick: Jalen Suggs- A winner. A leader. I believe he's a hybrid of Deron Williams and Jason Kidd.
with the 5th pick: Scottie Barnes.- arguably has the highest upside of anyone in the draft. I see a hybrid of Draymond Green and Giannis. He's long like Giannis (wingspan), but passes and defends like Draymond (or hope to be). Major upside, but does need to work on his offensive game.

Wiseman/Boucher/ Freddie
OG/Barnes/ Wagner
Wiggins/ Yuta/Harris
Trent/Suggs/Watson
Fred/Malachi

Wiggins, Fred, OG and Trent can score. Boucher, Suggs and Barnes can provide energy and upside from the bench while developing at the same time. Wiggins is a risk (everybody knows it), but playing for team Canada and possibly coming home could give him the chance to be the player we all hoped he could be. He just needs to score consistently. We have size and a small ball 5 lineup (Boucher,Barnes,OG,Suggs, Fred) or (Barnes, OG, Wiggins, Trent, Suggs). Switch everything on D

[djsunyc]

Read on Twitter

?s=20

[MessiahUjiri]

Forbes did an article on how the Warriors roster might end up costing $500M(!), which might force their hand.

This proposal is specifically accounting for talent plus salary considerations. Here’s the deal:

Pascal Siakam, Deandre Bembry, 46th pick, 47th pick
for
Andrew Wiggins, James Wiseman, 7th pick, 14th pick


Siakam is the main prize, but the second rounders allow GSW to add some cheap talent to the back of the roster (which every team needs). Bembry is a good secondary ball handler and defender at the 2/3, who would be reprising the role of a poor mans Iguodala.

I don’t have the exact math, but the salary drop from the 7+14 to 46+47 should be significant, in addition to the ~8.5 Million (before repeater tax) savings from the main players. Assuming they’ll add some min vets to round out the roster and resign Oubre, this deal structure can save them $35-40M, while upgrading the roster for a win-now position.

For the Raptors, it’s a win-later move. They essentially walk out of draft night with 4 lottery picks (their own + wiseman/7/14). That’s a lot of high end young talent, which would be primed to peak when the current super teams age out.


New Warriors:
Curry / Klay / Oubre / Siakam / Draymond
(Vet PG) / Poole / Bembry / Paschall / Looney
Add in 46+47 and a Min vet C.


New Raptors
Fred / Trent Jr / Wiggins / Anunoby / Wiseman
Flynn / Suggs (4th pick) / (7th pick) / Boucher / Birch
Add in 14th pick and maybe another vet C.


Link to Forbes article

Spoiler:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/patrickmurray/2021/03/14/why-the-golden-state-warriors-salary-cap-might-force-them-to-make-a-big-trade/amp/