2021-22 Season: Draft, Trades, and FA Ideas Thread

[agkagk]

Ahhh ic. You don't actually have a value for OG. Just NOT this proposal. Very insightful.

Isaac - valuation by agkagk = non-tendered.
6th overall pick in 2017
Last heathy season at age 22 (in 29 min/g):
11.9 PPG, 6.8 REB, 1.4 AST, 1.6 STL, 2.3 BLK, 0.34 3pt%
WS/48 = 0.120

OG at 22 (in 30 min/g)
10.6 PPG, 5.3 REB, 1.6 AST, 1.4 STL, 0.7 BLK, 0.39 3pt%
WS/48 = 0.134 (followed by 0.104 and 0.101 on increased usage the subsequent 2 yrs)

Health and self creation obviously count in OGs favor, but the actual production and impact (and possibly trajectory?) of Isaac and OG was quite similar prior to the injury.

Basically, I think you are undervaluing the Orl guys.

That said, I typically project full recoveries for these athletes. Durant, Embiid, Steph and his ankles. I think most of these guys come back strong, and are undervalued because of overly conservative risk assessments. I concede that some guys never recover (Brand, Boogie, Porzingis etc.).

Can you offer up a suitable player that you would accept in a trade for OG? I'm curious.

youre trade proposal is garbage, shows little understanding of play evaluations, contract values, both perceived and actual.

you can project full recoveries all you want, but i dont have copies of their xrays or medicals so i cant. I can only go by their production and the cost to resign them based on their current scale deals.

If you think committing to resigning fultz, bamba and issac to 50 - 75 million dollar deals is a good idea, which is what trading og's exceptionally valuable contract for is doing, then good luck and good night!

Merry christmas!

IMO, your rebuttal is garbage.
Not a mention of what OG is worth.
Is he worth all stars only? Super stars? Top 5 pick plus salary ballast?

just admit it, youre secretly an orlando homer.

[billy_hoyle]

youre trade proposal is garbage, shows little understanding of play evaluations, contract values, both perceived and actual.

you can project full recoveries all you want, but i dont have copies of their xrays or medicals so i cant. I can only go by their production and the cost to resign them based on their current scale deals.

If you think committing to resigning fultz, bamba and issac to 50 - 75 million dollar deals is a good idea, which is what trading og's exceptionally valuable contract for is doing, then good luck and good night!

Merry christmas!

IMO, your rebuttal is garbage.
Not a mention of what OG is worth.
Is he worth all stars only? Super stars? Top 5 pick plus salary ballast?

just admit it, youre secretly an orlando homer.

Haha nice

[tecumseh18]

With the emergence of Dort and Giddey hitting the ground running, I wonder if OKC is ready to make a level up move? They sure have a ton of cap space, on top of all those (late, >15) FRPs. How about trading Pascal there? All we would need back is Favors, Tre Mann and, uh, four FRPs. It would open up a lot of room to bring someone else in, using said draft capital.

[isyed]

Posted this in the trades forum:

I would do a three way or 4 team trade to bring sga to Toronto while keeping barnes.

Siakam + Willie cauley-stein to gsw
Dragic to mavs
Moody, Wiseman, kuminga, Flynn, raps 2022 1st, mavs second and Moses brown to okc
Sga + Powell + Wiggins + Dort to Toronto

Everyone gets wuss they want.

Okc can tank properly while they develop their young guys all on the same time line. They immediately add 3 Lotto level talent to match up with giddey and garuntee a top 4 pick plus their other picks.

Mavs get Dragic to keep Luka happy.

Gsw gets to truly contend with their super depth lineup of steph/klay/poole/Siakam/draymond

Raptors gets 4 Canadians to come play at home and get a potential Second star to play with Barnes and og.

Fvv/banton
Sga/gtjr/Wiggins
Og/dort
Barnes/powell
Birch/precious

All Canadian lineup of

Banton
Sga
Wiggins
Dort
Birch or Powell

Okc might ask for a bit more such as another future first or pick swap but that's pretty much all it should take.








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[Jim Todd Jr.]

Tank as much as required to secure Jalen Duren

[Morris_Shatford]

Tank as much as required to secure Jalen Duren

I am cold on all Jalen's after the 2021 draft

[Morris_Shatford]

With the emergence of Dort and Giddey hitting the ground running, I wonder if OKC is ready to make a level up move? They sure have a ton of cap space, on top of all those (late, >15) FRPs. How about trading Pascal there? All we would need back is Favors, Tre Mann and, uh, four FRPs. It would open up a lot of room to bring someone else in, using said draft capital.

I think OKC likely waits till at least summer to think about their short term future;
While some of their young guys are pushing forward at a good clip they are still positioned for a potential top 5 pick.

If they get some lotto luck maybe you consider adding a good piece around those young guys?

[sogood]

Posted this in the trades forum:

I would do a three way or 4 team trade to bring sga to Toronto while keeping barnes.

Siakam + Willie cauley-stein to gsw
Dragic to mavs
Moody, Wiseman, kuminga, Flynn, raps 2022 1st, mavs second and Moses brown to okc
Sga + Powell + Wiggins + Dort to Toronto

Everyone gets wuss they want.

Okc can tank properly while they develop their young guys all on the same time line. They immediately add 3 Lotto level talent to match up with giddey and garuntee a top 4 pick plus their other picks.

Mavs get Dragic to keep Luka happy.

Gsw gets to truly contend with their super depth lineup of steph/klay/poole/Siakam/draymond

Raptors gets 4 Canadians to come play at home and get a potential Second star to play with Barnes and og.

Fvv/banton
Sga/gtjr/Wiggins
Og/dort
Barnes/powell
Birch/precious

All Canadian lineup of

Banton
Sga
Wiggins
Dort
Birch or Powell

Okc might ask for a bit more such as another future first or pick swap but that's pretty much all it should take.








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Extremely lopsided trade, you know that.

OKC spend years developing SGA and Dort.... just to try and maybe do it all over again?

SGA is 23 and Dort is 22. This makes no sense for them.

[Spida888]

With the emergence of Dort and Giddey hitting the ground running, I wonder if OKC is ready to make a level up move? They sure have a ton of cap space, on top of all those (late, >15) FRPs. How about trading Pascal there? All we would need back is Favors, Tre Mann and, uh, four FRPs. It would open up a lot of room to bring someone else in, using said draft capital.

I think OKC likely waits till at least summer to think about their short term future;
While some of their young guys are pushing forward at a good clip they are still positioned for a potential top 5 pick.

If they get some lotto luck maybe you consider adding a good piece around those young guys?

I agree with this. OKC is likely bad enough this season for another top pick. Don't think they will make any moves this season.

One would think they will ultimately need to trade their picks for a star, they got way too many picks to fit on a roster.

[agkagk]

With the emergence of Dort and Giddey hitting the ground running, I wonder if OKC is ready to make a level up move? They sure have a ton of cap space, on top of all those (late, >15) FRPs. How about trading Pascal there? All we would need back is Favors, Tre Mann and, uh, four FRPs. It would open up a lot of room to bring someone else in, using said draft capital.

I think OKC likely waits till at least summer to think about their short term future;
While some of their young guys are pushing forward at a good clip they are still positioned for a potential top 5 pick.

If they get some lotto luck maybe you consider adding a good piece around those young guys?

I agree with this. OKC is likely bad enough this season for another top pick. Don't think they will make any moves this season.

One would think they will ultimately need to trade their picks for a star, they got way too many picks to fit on a roster.

I don’t think the op is far off, a trade like this will eventually be okc’s strategy, just not for another year or two.

The roster is awaiting them drafting a potential superstar. Once that happens, presti should use his draft capital to essentially handpick the rest of his core through trade.

Much like San Diego in baseball; the only good use for this much draft/prospect capital is trading for veterans.

You can’t develop 10 rookie scale players at once, more like three.

So, expect presti to eventually use his leverage to control the trade market for a couple years and overpay by a good 10 - 20% in trades to get the guys he essentially handpicks.

The alternative is Danny ainge in Boston.

[Madhouse]

I think OKC likely waits till at least summer to think about their short term future;
While some of their young guys are pushing forward at a good clip they are still positioned for a potential top 5 pick.

If they get some lotto luck maybe you consider adding a good piece around those young guys?

I agree with this. OKC is likely bad enough this season for another top pick. Don't think they will make any moves this season.

One would think they will ultimately need to trade their picks for a star, they got way too many picks to fit on a roster.

I don’t think the op is far off, a trade like this will eventually be okc’s strategy, just not for another year or two.

The roster is awaiting them drafting a potential superstar. Once that happens, presti should use his draft capital to essentially handpick the rest of his core through trade.

Much like San Diego in baseball; the only good use for this much draft/prospect capital is trading for veterans.

You can’t develop 10 rookie scale players at once, more like three.

So, expect presti to eventually use his leverage to control the trade market for a couple years and overpay by a good 10 - 20% in trades to get the guys he essentially handpicks.

The alternative is Danny ainge in Boston.

I think that superstar needs to come for them in next years draft as they will probably improve enough after that with their young players to be too good for a top 5 pick in 2023.

If they fail to seize their moment, they could be a 35-40 win team for years to come.

So either he trades SGA next season to start the clock again if he fails to draft a superstar and they can truly suck again or he finds that superstar and starts trading for proven vets.

I expect major movement by OKC next year.

[canada_dry]

Serge ibaka incoming.

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[Duffman100]

Serge ibaka incoming.

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For?

[bluerap23]

Serge ibaka incoming.

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For?

Serge has been frustrated. He has been a healthy scratch and is getting very few mins. I would welcome a return. It would be difficult to make it work under cap though. Boucher for Serge would put us into the tax.

[Rapsfan07]

Serge ibaka incoming.

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For?

Serge has been frustrated. He has been a healthy scratch and is getting very few mins. I would welcome a return. It would be difficult to make it work under cap though. Boucher for Serge would put us into the tax.

Don't see the point. Serge doesn't fix our problems long term and all our moves need to be focused on the future.

Even Boucher for a second rounder or a throw in for a bigger deal is better than bringing back Serge

[Spida888]

Pacers owner supposedly doesn't want to tank, part of it could be because he's 87 years old.
https://nba.nbcsports.com/2021/12/17/pacers-owner-herb-simon-i-dont-want-to-rebuild/

How about the following shake up:

TOR out: Siakam
TOR in: Sabonis, Warren, Wanamaker

IND out: Sabonis, Warren, Wanamaker
IND in: Simmons

PHI out: Simmons
PHI in: Siakam

I didn't add Levert to the deal because that puts us over the tax, and sending out more salary can put Indy over the tax which they want to avoid as well.

Some may prefer Turner coming back instead of Sabonis. I would think Turner can be had for less, so maybe Indy sends back a FRP in that case?

[Ell Curry]

Tank as much as required to secure Jalen Duren

Not sure we'll have to.

https://www.tankathon.com/mock_draft

I think Duren will go closer to 10 or 15 than 5. He's a center under 7 feet who's shooting 59% from the line and putting up 11-8-3.

And if you look at the lottery, the teams picking outside of the big tanking 4 teams all have centers (Valanciaunas, Holmes, Sabonis/Turner, Robinson, Towns) except Portland (Nurkic a free agent and even if he re-signs I could see them going for a center, though finally getting an athletic forward is surely their #1 draft priority unless Dame leaves), Charlotte (50% likely to pick after us) and San Antonio, who do have Poeltl, though he's only got one year left and also they need a starting forward more if they plan on keeping Poeltl, which I assume they will because they have cap space and lots of guards already, and it's hard to see them finding a good forward in free agency who will want to go there.

Sengun is a very different player, but he had the dominant pro resume (hard to think of someone other than Luka who produced what he did at his age over there) to go no lower 7th or 8th and he went 16th, below guys like Ziaire Williams, Primo and Kispert who were probably expected to go in the 20s by most people.

One of the reason Masai punting on getting a center makes sense is that by the time we're good enough for it to really matter we might have fallen into one from a draft slippage, a trade, free agency or the development of Precious or a center not yet on the roster like Sacramento did with Richaun Holmes. Hell, if we'd offered Noel the 7M we gave Baynes last year and then Hartenstein 3M a year this summer we might already have gotten by alright at center these past 2 seasons: https://www.clipsnation.com/2021/12/5/22815675/isaiah-hartenstein-first-los-angeles-clippers-season-constant-impact-rockets-nuggets-cavaliers

TLDR: If we pick 12th Duren might be available.

[KL78192020]

With the emergence of Dort and Giddey hitting the ground running, I wonder if OKC is ready to make a level up move? They sure have a ton of cap space, on top of all those (late, >15) FRPs. How about trading Pascal there? All we would need back is Favors, Tre Mann and, uh, four FRPs. It would open up a lot of room to bring someone else in, using said draft capital.

I think they tank one more year, especially this year theres lots of good bigs in this draft. Probably start trading those bigs in the following years.

[Los_29]

With the emergence of Dort and Giddey hitting the ground running, I wonder if OKC is ready to make a level up move? They sure have a ton of cap space, on top of all those (late, >15) FRPs. How about trading Pascal there? All we would need back is Favors, Tre Mann and, uh, four FRPs. It would open up a lot of room to bring someone else in, using said draft capital.

The problem is the picks they have are all low value except for their own. I know we drafted Siakam late but it’s not reasonable to assume we can just draft another all-star with a late FRP. So from our perspective it’s a really bad trade.

And the problem with OKC is they have no top end talent. Giddey is a solid piece but won’t ever be a superstar player because of his limitations. I hate to say it but even in year 3 of their rebuild they are still in the beginning stages.

[Zeno]

I know THT has had a down year, but we were apparently interested in him. I wonder if a combo of Svi or Flynn plus Boucher would interest the Lakers for him.