Official Raptors 2012 NBA Draft Thread, Part 3

_MidNight_ · Post #861 » by **_MidNight_** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 9:15 pm

I haven't had the chance to see MKG play too many time so I wont say he'd be perfect fit for this team.
With that being said, the general consensus is he's only a jump shot away and I know it's one of the more easier things in this game to develop if you put in the time and effort, .
My question for the people how's seen both Barns and MKG play is who has the better handle?
I'm just tired of us having a wing with suspect handles that can't create his own shots or have a clear out play ran for him.

fredericklove · Post #862 » by **fredericklove** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 9:18 pm

Consequence wrote:I'd say all of that and the fact that if he goes through the interview process, teams will fall in love.

I can picture him saying "its a blessing, wow, like...amazing" repeatedly after every 5 seconds mute pause :lol:

JN · Post #863 » by JN » Wed Jan 4, 2012 9:21 pm

I don't know who any of these guys are.

Sincerely,
Andre Drummond

fredericklove · Post #864 » by **fredericklove** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 9:29 pm

_MidNight_ wrote:I haven't had the chance to see MKG play too many time so I wont say he'd be perfect fit for this team.
With that being said, the general consensus is he's only a jump shot away and I know it's one of the more easier things in this game to develop if you put in the time and effort, .
My question for the people how's seen both Barns and MKG play is who has the better handle?
I'm just tired of us having a wing with suspect handles that can't create his own shots or have a clear out play ran for him.

MKG has better handle, he's not flashy going change of pace type but because of his athleticism, he can blow by you with a few dribbles and takes off str8 to the rim. He's careful with his dribble though, he won't go out of control and when he dribbles he looks to either drive str8 to the basket or takes few dribbles, patiently look for his teammates, that's the good thing about him and also he's very good handling the ball in transition, dishing to open men for layups, even in half court set he occasionally finds an open man in the lane or in the paint.

Barnes still has trouble with it, he can't blow by people, he seems to do in & out move and hesitation moves quite abit but due to his lack of first step explosiveness he can't really blow by using those moves. Despite poor ball-handles, Barnes can still create spaces, he just needs to master the shots when he has spacing, but so often he takes tough shots with hand in the face but he's still got a pretty sweet stroke though... but if you expect him to create off the dribble...its tough.

Kevin Willis · Post #865 » by **Kevin Willis** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 9:42 pm

fredericklove wrote:
BlackFalcon wrote:
Live Free wrote:^ Scorers are natural, you can become a better scorer by understanding the game but it's highly unlikely ANYONE develops into a prime T-Mac or JJ with the skillset MGK has.. it's just not his game.

I know, the comparison wasn't really to compare them scoring wise, they just fit into the do-it-all category. But to be fair, T-Mac wasn't a scorer in his first few seasons which would have shown through with or without Vince Carter being in Toronto.

but T-mac always knew how to score in the early years in raptors, his mid-range was already good in the raps, he just never consistently drives and draw for contact. In the later years he learns to exploit using his advanced handles and expand his offensive repertoires...I still can't expect him to turn out to be a superstar wow...i knew he was a defensive prowess and a capable scorer but wow he caught everyone by surprise.

I think for MKG, he sees the floor really well, the guy can pass and is aggressive on the glass. His offensive level is somewhat patient and not flashy. I like the fact that he doesn't force things and that's rare for a freshman. I don't really see him turning into an elite scorer. That's not his game. He's geared toward to the defense, rebounding and attack off the dribble aggressively and only attacks when he sees little opening in the lane during half court set. He has quite a conservative approach to offense. His offensive game reminds me of John Salmon, without the jumpshot. Someone that attacks in the lane. However I wouldn't be surprise if MKG expands his offensive repertoire in his prime. Overall, he's definitely a Gerald Wallace type, someone that crashes the board, drives to the lane and plays tough hard nose defense. But MKG sees the floor better, I think he can average at least 3-4 assists in the game since he's very patient and constantly looks for his teammates like he did to Davis and the white boy.

I think MKG will be better than Barnes for many of the points you said and Rhett said. Watching Barnes is so boring. Then you believe he had a bad game but his number stick out. NC is stacked. Kentucky is stacked. But who stands out more when watching them play and MKG is 18 yrs old. Remember Kobe and T-Mac at that age? Not super impressive. I'm not saying he's going to be good but I think with his motor and with his mind set/motor he'll become Gerald Wallace really quickly and then surpass it making him an all-star. I saw Wallace play defense on Durant and it was such a joy to watch. I could picture MKG doing the same thing.

Post #866 » by **Undefeated** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 10:16 pm

What I'm most intrigued by Kidd-Gilchrist is his ability to initiate a one man fast break because he's such a terrific ball hawk on the glass. MKG is the real deal, I've seen him crown his defender (against Indiana I think) when he started the fast break by himself. On another note, I believe MKG has the most posters so far. He might not be LeBron James who can sprint down from one of the floor to the other within 3 seconds finishing through contact or drawing the foul, but MKG's finishing at the rim is still superb. Not to mention, he's a willing passer whe he finds "passing windows" like he does with Anthony Davis for nasty dimes.

Marlo Stanfield · Post #867 » by **Marlo Stanfield** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 10:19 pm

I'm getting super high on that MKG

_MidNight_ · Post #868 » by **_MidNight_** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 10:33 pm

fredericklove wrote:
_MidNight_ wrote:I haven't had the chance to see MKG play too many time so I wont say he'd be perfect fit for this team.
With that being said, the general consensus is he's only a jump shot away and I know it's one of the more easier things in this game to develop if you put in the time and effort, .
My question for the people how's seen both Barns and MKG play is who has the better handle?
I'm just tired of us having a wing with suspect handles that can't create his own shots or have a clear out play ran for him.

MKG has better handle, he's not flashy going change of pace type but because of his athleticism, he can blow by you with a few dribbles and takes off str8 to the rim. He's careful with his dribble though, he won't go out of control and when he dribbles he looks to either drive str8 to the basket or takes few dribbles, patiently look for his teammates, that's the good thing about him and also he's very good handling the ball in transition, dishing to open men for layups, even in half court set he occasionally finds an open man in the lane or in the paint.

Barnes still has trouble with it, he can't blow by people, he seems to do in & out move and hesitation moves quite abit but due to his lack of first step explosiveness he can't really blow by using those moves. Despite poor ball-handles, Barnes can still create spaces, he just needs to master the shots when he has spacing, but so often he takes tough shots with hand in the face but he's still got a pretty sweet stroke though... but if you expect him to create off the dribble...its tough.

Thanks for the breakdown of their perspective ball handling skills frederick. It sounds like they might not be too far apart when it comes to handling the rock, for some reason I keep thinking Barns (maybe MKG?) is more a product of the system he plays in tho. Barnes more so looks like he's been asked to be more of a spot up shooter, I could really see him shocking people come draft workout time with his intangibles.

Doctorb23 · Post #869 » by **Doctorb23** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 10:36 pm

I watched most of the UNC game specifically to see Barnes but I was really impressed with MKG.. would be so happy to see us get him.

Young_Buc · Post #870 » by **Young_Buc** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 10:42 pm

MKG doesn't have "fancy" handles but they are tight. He also has a VERY quick first step and will take 3 dribbles to get to the basket. If he develops an outside J I'd say he's comparable to..... I'm not sure.

dTox · Post #871 » by **dTox** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 11:01 pm

BlackFalcon wrote:I'm getting super high on that MKG

deuce on that

ATLTimekeeper · Post #872 » by **ATLTimekeeper** » Wed Jan 4, 2012 11:59 pm

Young_Buc wrote:MKG doesn't have "fancy" handles but they are tight. He also has a VERY quick first step and will take 3 dribbles to get to the basket. If he develops an outside J I'd say he's comparable to..... I'm not sure.

I disagree. He can dribble the ball up the court like Sonny Weems and about a 100 other wings. There's no first step. He's almost never given the ball with the intention of driving, and that offense is completely geared toward the dribble-drive. I haven't seen him in any press situations yet, either. They usually chose Miller or Lamb to help Teague.

I don't think he'll ever be a #1 option on offense in the NBA, but he could definitely chip in 15 points just by hustling, slashing and hitting open threes.

CunningLinguist · Post #873 » by **CunningLinguist** » Thu Jan 5, 2012 12:26 am

Young_Buc wrote:MKG is also compared to Pippen depending on who you ask.

I don't think Wallace has the floor skills to be considered a good comparison.

I remember Wallace was said to be "The Michael Jordan of the small forward position" from the guy who scouted him (I used to read Slam magazine a lot in high school) and was probably a higher ranked high school kid.

At Alabama though, he completely shat the bed. Went late first round on potential alone.

I think every reasonably athletic SF gets compared to Pippen at some point. Chris Jeffries, of all people, was compared to him once. I think a reasonable comparison is Iguodala in terms of athleticism, size and skillset. MKG is a much better passer than Wallace, though his offensive game is similar.

CunningLinguist · Post #874 » by **CunningLinguist** » Thu Jan 5, 2012 12:40 am

JN wrote:I don't know who any of these guys are.

Sincerely,
Andre Drummond

I still say Drummond has the most potential in this draft. I would describe him almost as a basketball savant. On one hand he's very unpolished in term of fundamentals (not establishing post position, failure to box out), but on the other hand he's very naturally skilled. In last nights game, I counted at least 4 incredible passes that displayed his court sense.

He's flashed the ability to score in the post off turnarounds, has shown a step back jumper, has shown good dribbling skills for his size and the aforementioned passing ability. He moves his feet well on defense, can guard the high screen showing quick hands for the steal and has great shotblocking instincts. This is all wrapped up in a large strong athletic body. He can play C or PF at the next level. He's really a blank canvas that I'm sure any coach would love to work with.

I understand people having reservations due to his lack of consistent production, but I would choose him at #1 with the understanding that the choice may look wrong in the short-term, but could pay off huge in the long term. He may be the only guy in the draft with franchise changing potential at both ends of the floor.

CunningLinguist · Post #875 » by **CunningLinguist** » Thu Jan 5, 2012 12:42 am

Young_Buc wrote:
Rhettmatic wrote:I really like Barnes except when I'm watching him play.

Doesn't mean I'll be opposed to drafting him, depending on where we're selecting. But I've still seen little first-hand to justify predictions that he'll be a superstar. I just don't see it.

EXACTLY how I feel. I look at his numbers and highlights and will say "wow this guy's a great shooter! and LOOK at those percentages!" Perfect SF body, perfect form on his shot, prodigy recruit.

Then you look at him, and it's like "okay? that's it?" Barnes with a motor is Kevin Durant.

I like Barnes, but his game is nothing like Kevin Durant

JamesNaismith · Post #876 » by **JamesNaismith** » Thu Jan 5, 2012 2:51 am

Young_Buc wrote:
Rhettmatic wrote:I really like Barnes except when I'm watching him play.

Doesn't mean I'll be opposed to drafting him, depending on where we're selecting. But I've still seen little first-hand to justify predictions that he'll be a superstar. I just don't see it.

EXACTLY how I feel. I look at his numbers and highlights and will say "wow this guy's a great shooter! and LOOK at those percentages!" Perfect SF body, perfect form on his shot, prodigy recruit.

Then you look at him, and it's like "okay? that's it?" Barnes with a motor is Kevin Durant.

Barnes with HANDLES is Carmelo Anthony....too bad he doesn't have any.

He is seriously nothing like Durant and it has nothing to do with his "motor".

sweetcity · Post #877 » by **sweetcity** » Thu Jan 5, 2012 3:02 am

Based on how bad the east is, I think we are realistically staring at a pick anywhere from 6-12. Based on this, Barnes is out of the question. We need a SF, probably a shut down guy, or at least a great defender. It looks like Demar and Andrea are going to be the primary scoring options. I'd address the PG situation through free agency, ie a max deal for Deron Williams, whom is smart and used to playing in a cold climate.

Draft wise, I think we are looking at MKG, Perry Jones, or Q Miller if he comes out, any of those guys is a solid pick 6-12. The highest upside guys are clearly Drummond, Davis, and Perry Jones in my opinion based on physical talent alone. I personally dont think this draft is as deep as everyone else after watching intently all year (I like to handicap NCAA ball).

Young_Buc · Post #878 » by **Young_Buc** » Thu Jan 5, 2012 3:05 am

JamesNaismith wrote:
Young_Buc wrote:
Rhettmatic wrote:I really like Barnes except when I'm watching him play.

Doesn't mean I'll be opposed to drafting him, depending on where we're selecting. But I've still seen little first-hand to justify predictions that he'll be a superstar. I just don't see it.

EXACTLY how I feel. I look at his numbers and highlights and will say "wow this guy's a great shooter! and LOOK at those percentages!" Perfect SF body, perfect form on his shot, prodigy recruit.

Then you look at him, and it's like "okay? that's it?" Barnes with a motor is Kevin Durant.

Barnes with HANDLES is Carmelo Anthony....too bad he doesn't have any.

He is seriously nothing like Durant and it has nothing to do with his "motor".

I mean impact in the NCAA scoring wise. Not game.

sweetcity · Post #879 » by **sweetcity** » Thu Jan 5, 2012 3:09 am

is MKG big enough to play SF in the NBA?

Rejected · Post #880 » by **Rejected** » Thu Jan 5, 2012 3:18 am

I was really high on Barnes and certain he was our guy. And I still think he will be great. However MKG just strikes me as they type of guy that will ultimately win more than Barnes. Its a gut thing so I can't explain why. Barnes may have Granger/Gay like seasons or better, but I see MKG on contender like teams always. Im starting to lean more towards MKG. Well, my gut is.

Who do you want the Raptors to draft in the 2012 NBA Draft?