The Official Cunningham vs Suggs Thread #Tank4Either

[HeadtopChunes]

wonder if Ziaire Williams could be a faller, poor college season but hes got all the tools and talent of a wing scorer, kind of high ceiling prospect we need

Reminds me too much of Cam Reddish. People said the exact same things about Reddish having all of the tools and talent of a modern wing. I might give him the benefit of the doubt and reserve judgement until the season is over because he is coming off of a knee injury.

im the wrong guy for that comp lol, i still wholly believe in Reddish (to an extent, dont think hes a star or anything but i think theres a player there)

[Psubs]

wonder if Ziaire Williams could be a faller, poor college season but hes got all the tools and talent of a wing scorer, kind of high ceiling prospect we need

Reminds me too much of Cam Reddish. People said the exact same things about Reddish having all of the tools and talent of a modern wing. I might give him the benefit of the doubt and reserve judgement until the season is over because he is coming off of a knee injury.

im the wrong guy for that comp lol, i still wholly believe in Reddish (to an extent, dont think hes a star or anything but i think theres a player there)

Maybe Josh Jackson is a better comp?

[HeadtopChunes]

Reminds me too much of Cam Reddish. People said the exact same things about Reddish having all of the tools and talent of a modern wing. I might give him the benefit of the doubt and reserve judgement until the season is over because he is coming off of a knee injury.

im the wrong guy for that comp lol, i still wholly believe in Reddish (to an extent, dont think hes a star or anything but i think theres a player there)

Maybe Josh Jackson is a better comp?

nah Zaire is a shooter (or supposed to be anyway)

Jackson was a slasher.

[HeadtopChunes]

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Prob a top 20 guy for me, bonus for being Canadian but Mathurin has almost got it all, defense, athleticism and shooting, going under the radar right now. Def take him over Bouknight

[Psubs]

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Prob a top 20 guy for me, bonus for being Canadian but Mathurin has almost got it all, defense, athleticism and shooting, going under the radar right now. Def take him over Bouknight

Ah ya, I thin posted a week or so in the Canadian prospect thread and he's doing well. He's just really really inconsistent.

What's crazy is that even with the up and down games, the numbers average out to 49/42/84. He's like a much bigger version of Jahmi'us Ramsey that could play some SF. Ramsey was selected at #43.

This draft is so stacked he should stay 1 more year and be guaranteed 1st round pick next year. He's only averaging 11ppg, next year put up 16-20.

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https://ftw.usatoday.com/2021/02/arizona-wildcats-bennedict-mathurin-2021-nba-draft-nba-academy

Mathurin, who is averaging 11.6 points per game while shooting 42.7% from 3-point range, has made the most of the opportunities that he has been given.

Overall, he is averaging 1.16 points per possession, per Synergy, which ranks in the 96th percentile among all players in D-I college basketball. He also currently ranks as the most efficient high-volume player (minimum: 120 possessions) in the uber-competitive Pac-12 conference.

[HeadtopChunes]

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Prob a top 20 guy for me, bonus for being Canadian but Mathurin has almost got it all, defense, athleticism and shooting, going under the radar right now. Def take him over Bouknight

Ah ya, I thin posted a week or so in the Canadian prospect thread and he's doing well. He's just really really inconsistent.

What's crazy is that even with the up and down games, the numbers average out to 49/42/84. He's like a much bigger version of Jahmi'us Ramsey that could play some SF.

This draft is so stacked he should stay 1 more year and be guaranteed 1st round pick next year. He's only averaging 11ppg, next year put up 16-20.

teams would be dumb not to draft him this year but teams are dumb often so def possible, we'll see how his stock looks like in a month or two I guess.

I don't see how you can leave an athletic 18-year-old who is putting up almost 50/40/90 and one of the best defenders in the class out of the first round but NBA teams frequently make decisions that puzzle me lol.

[Dalek]

Garuba has been with Real Madrid since age 16. He has had two full years playing in a men's league which is pretty much unheard of in Europe unless you are Luka Doncic. He is pretty much the best prospect Europe has to offer. The guy he plays with, Carlos Alocen is one of my favorite PGs in the draft.

Just because he's the best young player in Europe right now doesn't mean he should be taken middle of the 1st round.

It feels like lottery level talent from Europe is more in waves. Some drafts in the past have had zero Euros pan out. Like 1 year Mario Hezonja was the best Euro and another year it was

Unless they are clear like Luka or heck even Rubio, don't let that sway you. Can find a Jokic in the 2nd round. Just take BPA and if outside the lottery take positional need into consideration.

I don't see why Garuba, Sengun or Prkacin (all short bigs) are better prospects than Petrusev? I guess Petrusev is 2 years older, but are any of the other players going to grown 2 more inches at age 19 before they stop?

I should not have put the part in about him being the best prospect in Europe. It is true he is the best, but it does make one think he is not a high value pick.

I put a value on his defensive IQ, athleticism and size; along with some decent passing as being good reasons to draft him. The list of guys who can play in that Bam/Green role is low in the NBA. Garuba at age 18 has all the skills and smarts to achieve that status.

If you don't believe in defensive IQ, just think of OG when he got draft at 20 by the Raptors. He was expressively thought to be a quality athlete who was the best defender in his class. Garuba is coming up in a very offensive-minded class which in a way overshadows his skills, but it should not deter Toronto from picking him in that 15-20 range. Definitely in consideration as BPA in that range by my own thoughts, and many others (Rating Bleacher: 15; ESPN 17; Tankathon 18).

[Psubs]

Garuba has been with Real Madrid since age 16. He has had two full years playing in a men's league which is pretty much unheard of in Europe unless you are Luka Doncic. He is pretty much the best prospect Europe has to offer. The guy he plays with, Carlos Alocen is one of my favorite PGs in the draft.

Just because he's the best young player in Europe right now doesn't mean he should be taken middle of the 1st round.

It feels like lottery level talent from Europe is more in waves. Some drafts in the past have had zero Euros pan out. Like 1 year Mario Hezonja was the best Euro and another year it was

Unless they are clear like Luka or heck even Rubio, don't let that sway you. Can find a Jokic in the 2nd round. Just take BPA and if outside the lottery take positional need into consideration.

I don't see why Garuba, Sengun or Prkacin (all short bigs) are better prospects than Petrusev? I guess Petrusev is 2 years older, but are any of the other players going to grown 2 more inches at age 19 before they stop?

I should not have put the part in about him being the best prospect in Europe. It is true he is the best, but it does make one think he is not a high value pick.

I put a value on his defensive IQ, athleticism and size; along with some decent passing as being good reasons to draft him. The list of guys who can play in that Bam/Green role is low in the NBA. Garuba at age 18 has all the skills and smarts to achieve that status.

If you don't believe in defensive IQ, just think of OG when he got draft at 20 by the Raptors. He was expressively thought to be a quality athlete who was the best defender in his class. Garuba is coming up in a very offensive-minded class which in a way overshadows his skills, but it should not deter Toronto from picking him in that 15-20 range. Definitely in consideration as BPA in that range by my own thoughts, and many others (Rating Bleacher: 15; ESPN 17; Tankathon 18).

If he's really just 6'8, I'd consider taking 6'7 Mathurin with more versatility. He played PF in HS.

Do you think he can play C? Is he like Okongwu?

[Reeko]

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Prob a top 20 guy for me, bonus for being Canadian but Mathurin has almost got it all, defense, athleticism and shooting, going under the radar right now. Def take him over Bouknight

Ah ya, I thin posted a week or so in the Canadian prospect thread and he's doing well. He's just really really inconsistent.

What's crazy is that even with the up and down games, the numbers average out to 49/42/84. He's like a much bigger version of Jahmi'us Ramsey that could play some SF.

This draft is so stacked he should stay 1 more year and be guaranteed 1st round pick next year. He's only averaging 11ppg, next year put up 16-20.

teams would be dumb not to draft him this year but teams are dumb often so def possible, we'll see how his stock looks like in a month or two I guess.

I don't see how you can leave an athletic 18-year-old who is putting up almost 50/40/90 and one of the best defenders in the class out of the first round but NBA teams frequently make decisions that puzzle me lol.

Nice find, he's been flying under the radar for sure. Would be nice to have a big, athletic shooting guard next to Fred.

Team Canada is going to be stacked at the guard positions for the foreseeable future.

[HeadtopChunes]

Just because he's the best young player in Europe right now doesn't mean he should be taken middle of the 1st round.

It feels like lottery level talent from Europe is more in waves. Some drafts in the past have had zero Euros pan out. Like 1 year Mario Hezonja was the best Euro and another year it was

Unless they are clear like Luka or heck even Rubio, don't let that sway you. Can find a Jokic in the 2nd round. Just take BPA and if outside the lottery take positional need into consideration.

I don't see why Garuba, Sengun or Prkacin (all short bigs) are better prospects than Petrusev? I guess Petrusev is 2 years older, but are any of the other players going to grown 2 more inches at age 19 before they stop?

I should not have put the part in about him being the best prospect in Europe. It is true he is the best, but it does make one think he is not a high value pick.

I put a value on his defensive IQ, athleticism and size; along with some decent passing as being good reasons to draft him. The list of guys who can play in that Bam/Green role is low in the NBA. Garuba at age 18 has all the skills and smarts to achieve that status.

If you don't believe in defensive IQ, just think of OG when he got draft at 20 by the Raptors. He was expressively thought to be a quality athlete who was the best defender in his class. Garuba is coming up in a very offensive-minded class which in a way overshadows his skills, but it should not deter Toronto from picking him in that 15-20 range. Definitely in consideration as BPA in that range by my own thoughts, and many others (Rating Bleacher: 15; ESPN 17; Tankathon 18).

If he's really just 6'8, I'd consider taking 6'7 Mathurin with more versatility. He played PF in HS.

Do you think he can play C? Is he like Okongwu?

Just wanna say Mathurin is def not 6’7, that’s a stretch of a listing lol

Here’s his measurements from earlier https://games.nbaacademy.nba.com/federation/18/team/3460/players

6’5.5 in shoes with a 6’8 wingspan about the same measurements as Lavine

[Psubs]

Just wanna say Mathurin is def not 6’7, that’s a stretch of a listing lol

Here’s his measurements from earlier https://games.nbaacademy.nba.com/federation/18/team/3460/players

6’5.5 in shoes with a 6’8 wingspan about the same measurements as Lavine

I just thought it might be legit with him playing PF in HS. Thought maybe he grew. He is after all still 18 for 4 more months.

The won that will hurt is Jalen Green who is 6'4 tops where some places had him at 6'6 I guess with platform shoes. He's barely taller than Jarrett Jack (6'3).


As for SF's, I was just thinking a comp for Wagner could be Shane Battier on defense and Mike Dunleavy Jr on offense.

[Mark_83]

Why is Scottie Barnes a better prospect than Franz Wagner? Barnes should be 10-15 but after Wagner.

Wagner is a sophomore but is actually 1 month younger than Barnes. His A/T is 2.75 better than Barnes' good 2.5. Wagner rebounds better, shoots 85% FTs to Barnes in the 50's and gets 1 whole block more per game.

I would be ecstatic if Barnes fell to the 15th pick. He really fits the new NBA game of positionless basketball. As far as why he's ranked higher, I guess it would be a combination of elite measurements and physical profile (6'9 with a chiseled frame and 7'3 wingspan) plus one elite skill: defense. He can legitimately defend all 5 positions on the court (especially if his height listed is accurate. Add that a projectable handle and play making game.

He's not Bam obviously, but has many of the same qualities. Same size, same handles and play making. He's got rare talent. I can imagine a front court of Barnes, OG, and Pascal, with Boucher as the backup would give offenses fits with their switchability.

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[BoyzNTheHood]

Why is Scottie Barnes a better prospect than Franz Wagner? Barnes should be 10-15 but after Wagner.

Wagner is a sophomore but is actually 1 month younger than Barnes. His A/T is 2.75 better than Barnes' good 2.5. Wagner rebounds better, shoots 85% FTs to Barnes in the 50's and gets 1 whole block more per game.

I would be ecstatic if Barnes fell to the 15th pick. He really fits the new NBA game of positionless basketball. As far as why he's ranked higher, I guess it would be a combination of elite measurements and physical profile (6'9 with a chiseled frame and 7'3 wingspan) plus one elite skill: defense. He can legitimately defend all 5 positions on the court (especially if his height listed is accurate. Add that a projectable handle and play making game.

He's not Bam obviously, but has many of the same qualities. Same size, same handles and play making. He's got rare talent. I can imagine a front court of Barnes, OG, and Pascal, with Boucher as the backup would give offenses fits with their switchability.

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He definitely fits the modern NBA, and although I doubt he will be available when we pick I too would be ecstatic if Barnes was available when we pick. If he adds a reliable jump shot he will be quite the issue for opposing defenses. I'd say Jalen Johnson is probably the better prospect, but if we're high on Johnson we should be high on Barnes as well.

[BoyzNTheHood]

Also, while we're on the subject of Scottie Barnes and FSU players let me just say that Raiquan Gray is freakin' amazing. He has a big beefy body at 6'8" 260 lbs, similar to Zion Williamson size wise, and he is exceptionally mobile at the same time. No, he won't be Zion, but I don't see why he can't be a high end role player in the mold of a Draymond Green.

He's only playing 26 minutes per game, but in that time he's highly effective shooting over 50% from the field, a few decimal points short of 80% from the free throw line and he goes for 11/6/2/1/1 per game. I know those stats look pedestrian as it comes, but he's not a box score guy.

I wouldn't take him with our first rounder, but a lot of you guys want a big but to also play small ball and this kid fits anything you want to do. Strong enough to guard big guys, but quick enough to play with small guys.

Check out some of the plays he can make

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

[Dalek]

Also, while we're on the subject of Scottie Barnes and FSU players let me just say that Raiquan Gray is freakin' amazing. He has a big beefy body at 6'8" 260 lbs, similar to Zion Williamson size wise, and he is exceptionally mobile at the same time. No, he won't be Zion, but I don't see why he can't be a high end role player in the mold of a Draymond Green.

He's only playing 26 minutes per game, but in that time he's highly effective shooting over 50% from the field, a few decimal points short of 80% from the free throw line and he goes for 11/6/2/1/1 per game. I know those stats look pedestrian as it comes, but he's not a box score guy.

I wouldn't take him with our first rounder, but a lot of you guys want a big but to also play small ball and this kid fits anything you want to do. Strong enough to guard big guys, but quick enough to play with small guys.

Check out some of the plays he can make

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

Never heard of this guy before but he looks impressive. Very Ben Wallace like the way he moves and can recover quite well with guards. Florida State is always one of the best defensive teams so he is going to showcase that ability. I could see this guy go undrafted then become a fringe NBA guy with GLeague experience. 260 is pretty heavy, so he is going to have to get his weight down.

[BoyzNTheHood]

Also, while we're on the subject of Scottie Barnes and FSU players let me just say that Raiquan Gray is freakin' amazing. He has a big beefy body at 6'8" 260 lbs, similar to Zion Williamson size wise, and he is exceptionally mobile at the same time. No, he won't be Zion, but I don't see why he can't be a high end role player in the mold of a Draymond Green.

He's only playing 26 minutes per game, but in that time he's highly effective shooting over 50% from the field, a few decimal points short of 80% from the free throw line and he goes for 11/6/2/1/1 per game. I know those stats look pedestrian as it comes, but he's not a box score guy.

I wouldn't take him with our first rounder, but a lot of you guys want a big but to also play small ball and this kid fits anything you want to do. Strong enough to guard big guys, but quick enough to play with small guys.

Check out some of the plays he can make

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

Never heard of this guy before but he looks impressive. Very Ben Wallace like the way he moves and can recover quite well with guards. Florida State is always one of the best defensive teams so he is going to showcase that ability. I could see this guy go undrafted then become a fringe NBA guy with GLeague experience. 260 is pretty heavy, so he is going to have to get his weight down.

The first time I saw him I was so impressed by how quick he was for his size. But you're right, he needs to get his weight down to about 245-250 which shouldn't be out of the question with NBA nutrition plans and weight rooms. If I were picking at the back end of the first round I'd give him a look, and definitely in the 2nd round, but I can see him going undrafted. I think he'll find his way into the NBA somehow though, he's just too good.

[PhilBlackson]

I know its so far out but I'm starting to almost feel locked into our "realistic" pick being either Christopher or Bouknight. We REALLY need someone with the potential to create their own shot.

But we continue to climb with our fake Ws right to a 1st rd exit. Started with dreaming of tanking for Cade, praying to stop at Johnson or Barnes and now just hopeful for one of Christopher or Bouknight and eventually worried it will continue where we're looking at Ayo or Wagner.

#1stroundordietrying

[Indeed]

I think some of those prospects maybe out of our reach. We may probably drafting around 20, and those prospects may not drop that low.

Garuba, Kai Jones, Isaiah Jackson maybe around if we are taking PF/C, while I am unsure any guards who can create their own shot would drop this low.

And I really wish to get a 2nd round pick, but I doubt teams are selling any.

[720]

I know its so far out but I'm starting to almost feel locked into our "realistic" pick being either Christopher or Bouknight. We REALLY need someone with the potential to create their own shot.

But we continue to climb with our fake Ws right to a 1st rd exit. Started with dreaming of tanking for Cade, praying to stop at Johnson or Barnes and now just hopeful for one of Christopher or Bouknight and eventually worried it will continue where we're looking at Ayo or Wagner.

#1stroundordietrying

This season is a lost cause. We’ll see what Bobby and Masai do this offseason. They have to pick a direction. Either you land a star here or do something to get us closer to one.

[Indeed]

I know its so far out but I'm starting to almost feel locked into our "realistic" pick being either Christopher or Bouknight. We REALLY need someone with the potential to create their own shot.

But we continue to climb with our fake Ws right to a 1st rd exit. Started with dreaming of tanking for Cade, praying to stop at Johnson or Barnes and now just hopeful for one of Christopher or Bouknight and eventually worried it will continue where we're looking at Ayo or Wagner.

#1stroundordietrying

This season is a lost cause. We’ll see what Bobby and Masai do this offseason. They have to pick a direction. Either you land a star here or do something to get us closer to one.

They got to start during this trade deadline. Most of our players are expiring, not much assets we can retain. And our cap space is in between, not enough with a max nor have enough salary to trade one.