Thank Nation! Pre-Lottery: Denver 9th, NY pick 7th (PART 4)

[MEDIC]

The perception of BPA on this board is based on days/months of play, not years. Portis over Wright based on 10 games. Brandon Jennings over Demar based on a single 50 point game early in his rookie year. Rodney Hood over Bruno without considering the former was 3 years older older than the latter when drafted.

Agreed, but.......

Regardless of the boards perception of things, Masai needs to come away with a good player. Not good potential.........a good player.

Even Powell is perceived to be BPA over Wright without consideration of the fact that Powell was given an opportunity through injury that Wright wasn't.

Powell has looked like the better player since Summer League. Opportunity had nothing to do with it. He was just a more NBA ready player.

[TheGoodDoctor]

Rumours of DeMar leaving?! Come on DD, let us S&T you for that Lakers pick....

#DEMARGOTUS

[DeadHorse]

Rumours of DeMar leaving?! Come on DD, let us S&T you for that Lakers pick....

#DEMARGOTUS

no need for s&t when you have cap space

[Double Helix]

Those rumors are pure BS. Stephen A Smith doesn't know Demar intimately.

[CunningLinguist]

The perception of BPA on this board is based on days/months of play, not years. Portis over Wright based on 10 games. Brandon Jennings over Demar based on a single 50 point game early in his rookie year. Rodney Hood over Bruno without considering the former was 3 years older older than the latter when drafted.

Agreed, but.......

Regardless of the boards perception of things, Masai needs to come away with a good player. Not good potential.........a good player.

Even Powell is perceived to be BPA over Wright without consideration of the fact that Powell was given an opportunity through injury that Wright wasn't.

Powell has looked like the better player since Summer League. Opportunity had nothing to do with it. He was just a more NBA ready player.

It goes without saying that we need to land a good player. We just need to have patience to wait out a player's development if we want the BPA, something that is sorely lacking with this fanbase.

If Lowry or Cojo went down instead of Carroll, it would have been Wright that got playing time instead of Powell. Powell didn't get significant P/T until Carroll's injury, his good performance in summer league and D league notwithstanding.

With Casey sitting Lowry and Cojo late in the year, Wright has shown what he can do.

Getting back to Portis, his opportunity came about as the result of injuries to the Bulls' big men. If not for that, he would have been riding the pine.

[kidr1211]

Apparently ivan rabb and jaylen brown are leaning toward staying in school

[TheGoodDoctor]

Apparently ivan rabb and jaylen brown are leaning toward staying in school

Damn I really, really hope that's bs...

Both those guys I'd be happy to take with our pick especially Brown who reminds me of a larger Powell. Losing 2 top prospects would blow and I don't understand what they're thinking as returning will only jeopardize their position in the draft, especially Rabb imo.

[BoyzNTheHood]

Not sure if people actually read the thread before posting...

[free]

I've really warmed on Ellenson this weekend. I think the issue before was that I was thinking too much about why he's not an ideal fir next to JV which is not the best thing to be doing when evaluating potentially special prospects. Now, I'm casting that aside entirely and pretending more along the lines of if we were starting from scratch which of these guys at 9 seems most interesting. Watching Kevin Love today I'm reminded of the fact that if you can become an offensive weapon at an elite level and you can do some other things (Ellenson can rebound well) you can get by with suspect D. You just need to be in the right system next to the right complimentary players. I remember doubting Kevin Love coming to the NBA. A lot of people did despite the hype. Same with Porzingas. Ellenson's offensive repertoire at age 19 at that size is not at all usual. He's very mobile and that shooting stroke looks like it will continue to grow in refinement and efficiency improvements. I really think there's a lot to like there in that kid. He's way further along at the same age and therefore has a much higher ceiling than Kelly Olynyk and even Kelly O is making a mark already. His broad shoulders look like they'll be capable of putting on terrific weight. Those turnarounds at that size look polished hard to stop. Left hook looks nice. Some nice footwork and touch. Seems to have a creative mind. I suspect he was one of those guys like Brow and Kelly O who hit a late growth spurt as evidenced by his handle in transition which is shockingly under control for a dude nearly 7'0 with that kind of frame.

Of all the bigs around us there I find him super intriguing in this small ball era. Especially if you could pair him with a defensive 4 and play him as a small ball 5. Marquette prospects seem to outperform draft position lately (Dwane Wade, Jimmy Butler, Demarre Carroll, Jae Crowder, Wes Matthews) and it wouldn't surprise me at all if people looked back on one of those redrafts 4 years from now and suggest Ellenson should have gone top 6. I know it's hard to get excited because we have JV here and the fit there defensively isn't good but the whole concept of drafting BPA is to figure that all out later so that you don't go passing on a bigger, longer Kevin Love-lite type simply because of who you already have. He seems like the type who could be a top 3 offensive weapon someday if next to a defensive 4 and perhaps a 2-way SF.

I just don't see the point in drafting at best a poor mans Kevin Love.

He's got a 9-ish foot standing reach and we have to hide him on defence? He also can't anchor us in a small ball situation. He's in that David Lee/Kanter/Love kind of mold, never quite fitting in, always has to be hidden. Don't see the point.

For me, I'd much rather take a plus defender with a high floor. I loved the Wright/Powell picks for this reason, plus defenders who at least project to be able to contribute something on offence or better. I still have nightmares about Vasquez/Lou defending last year.

To be honest, I'd rather take Brice Johnson over Ellenson.

[deeps6x]

What does Casey and Masai want out of a PF instantly if they are going to give them minutes next season?

They have to have good D. They have to rebound well, or even great if Bebe is going to be the backup C. They have to be efficient at the rim. They don't have to have 3pt range (assuming we have Powell and Ross as the SG/SF backups).

Lets take a look at the PF options:

14.8 TRB, .357 3pt%, .611 FG%, .618 eFG%, 22.0 Pts, 2.2 Ast, 0.8 Stl, 1.1 Blk, .654 TS%, 29.3 PER, ORtg 124.6, DRtg 91.2, BPM 9.0. Sabonis

14.8 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .614 FG%, .614 eFG%, 24.2 Pts, 2.1 Ast, 1.5 Stl, 2.1 Blk, .649 TS%, 33.0 PER, ORtg 130.2, DRtg 92.3, BPM 13.4. B Johnson

11.8 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .598 FG%, .598 eFG%, 16.1 Pts, 1.6 Ast, 0.6 Stl, 3.9 Blk, .601 TS%, 23.9 PER, ORtg 121.4, DRtg 90.9, BPM 10.8. D Davis

11.9 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .615 FG%, .616 eFG%, 17.5 Pts, 1.3 Ast, 0.7 Stl, 1.7 Blk, .636 TS%, 24.2 PER, ORtg 124.8, DRtg 95.3, BPM 8.7. Ivan Rabb

8.6 TRB, .350 3pt%, .530 FG%, .561 eFG%, 22.1 Pts, 1.2 Ast, 1.5 Stl, 2.2 Blk, .585 TS%, 21.7 PER, ORtg 112.0, DRtg 102.2, BPM 5.9. Chriss

8.9 TRB, .329 3pt%, .462 FG%, .510 eFG%, 25.4 Pts, 1.3 Ast, 1.0 Stl, 1.2 Blk, .567 TS%, 24.7 PER, ORtg 115.6, DRtg 99.8, BPM 6.7. Ben Bentil

11.6 TRB, .288 3pt%, .446 FG%, .480 eFG%, 20.3 Pts, 2.1 Ast, 1.0 Stl, 1.8 Blk, .534 TS%, 20.9 PER, ORtg 106.3, DRtg 98.5, BPM 3.6. Ellenson

8.0 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .516 FG%, .516 eFG%, 16.7 Pts, 0.8 Ast, 0.6 Stl, 4.2 Blk, .540 TS%, 18.5 PER, ORtg 107.8, DRtg 96.9, BPM 5.2. Skal Labissiere

*Pts, Ast, Stl, Blk, and TRB are per 40.

Sabonis and Johnson are outstanding rebounders. They both also check every need for next season.

Davis and Rabb are good rebounders. They also both check every need for next season. Davis stands out because he is also an excellent shot blocker.

Bentil and Chriss are sub par rebounders. Sub par defenders. But they both already have 3 point range. Makes them interesting, but not good picks.

Ellenson is also a good rebounder - in the Davis and Rabb league. But he pretty much sucks are every other measurable stat. He may show glimpses of various skills, but he hasn't been able to put them all together - even as well as ANY of the other PF contenders - so why the love? Why should we consider him above any of the others at #9? Smokescreen???

Skal is not a good rebounder. He is the worst one on this list. Despite being the tallest player on the list. He had 2 games this season where he was automatic from mid-range, but even those didn't lift his shooting numbers to an average level. He and Ellenson are the bottom two players in most of the measurable categories. Skal does do one thing better than all the rest. Block shots. Slightly better even than Davis. Now, if Skal could defend like Davis and rebound like Davis, and shoot as well as Davis, then I'd say we should consider him in the same range as Davis. But he doesn't. So we shouldn't. Nobody should. Not even DX. Damn fools.

Ellenson is 19 yrs old
Skal is 20
Davis is 19
Rabb is 19
Chriss hasn't even turned 19
Sabonis just turned 20
Brice Johnson is 21.6.
Bentil just turned 21.

Taking age into consideration, I like Skal even less, Chris goes 20 picks ahead of Bentil (despite being very similar players) due to the age difference. Davis and Rabb are still tied. Sabonis gets a 15 pick edge on Brice Johnson due to the age difference.

The order these PFs get picked should be
Rabb
Davis
Sabonis
Chriss

Then maybe someone reaches for Ellenson and Skal before taking the 'can contribute now', 'higher floor' pick in Brice Johnson. Or perhaps not. Maybe Brice still goes before Ellenson and Skal.

And lastly, Bentil will go in the 2nd round.

SO yeah, it would be a damn shame if Brown and Rabb went back to school for another year. Rabb looks like our pick, but if all the guys behind him move forward 2 spots due to Brown/Rabb dropping out, we might wind up with Sabonis at #9. Still very good for Bargs, but disappointing nonetheless.

Rabb, Davis, or maybe Luwawu would make me happy. Anything else at #9 will disappoint.

Trade up for Murray? Trade down with Denver for #15 and #19?

[CoachJReturns]

What does Casey and Masai want out of a PF instantly if they are going to give them minutes next season?

They have to have good D. They have to rebound well, or even great if Bebe is going to be the backup C. They have to be efficient at the rim. They don't have to have 3pt range (assuming we have Powell and Ross as the SG/SF backups).

Lets take a look at the PF options:

14.8 TRB, .357 3pt%, .611 FG%, .618 eFG%, 22.0 Pts, 2.2 Ast, 0.8 Stl, 1.1 Blk, .654 TS%, 29.3 PER, ORtg 124.6, DRtg 91.2, BPM 9.0. Sabonis

14.8 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .614 FG%, .614 eFG%, 24.2 Pts, 2.1 Ast, 1.5 Stl, 2.1 Blk, .649 TS%, 33.0 PER, ORtg 130.2, DRtg 92.3, BPM 13.4. B Johnson

11.8 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .598 FG%, .598 eFG%, 16.1 Pts, 1.6 Ast, 0.6 Stl, 3.9 Blk, .601 TS%, 23.9 PER, ORtg 121.4, DRtg 90.9, BPM 10.8. D Davis

11.9 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .615 FG%, .616 eFG%, 17.5 Pts, 1.3 Ast, 0.7 Stl, 1.7 Blk, .636 TS%, 24.2 PER, ORtg 124.8, DRtg 95.3, BPM 8.7. Ivan Rabb

8.6 TRB, .350 3pt%, .530 FG%, .561 eFG%, 22.1 Pts, 1.2 Ast, 1.5 Stl, 2.2 Blk, .585 TS%, 21.7 PER, ORtg 112.0, DRtg 102.2, BPM 5.9. Chriss

8.9 TRB, .329 3pt%, .462 FG%, .510 eFG%, 25.4 Pts, 1.3 Ast, 1.0 Stl, 1.2 Blk, .567 TS%, 24.7 PER, ORtg 115.6, DRtg 99.8, BPM 6.7. Ben Bentil

11.6 TRB, .288 3pt%, .446 FG%, .480 eFG%, 20.3 Pts, 2.1 Ast, 1.0 Stl, 1.8 Blk, .534 TS%, 20.9 PER, ORtg 106.3, DRtg 98.5, BPM 3.6. Ellenson

8.0 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .516 FG%, .516 eFG%, 16.7 Pts, 0.8 Ast, 0.6 Stl, 4.2 Blk, .540 TS%, 18.5 PER, ORtg 107.8, DRtg 96.9, BPM 5.2. Skal Labissiere

*Pts, Ast, Stl, Blk, and TRB are per 40.

Sabonis and Johnson are outstanding rebounders. They both also check every need for next season.

Davis and Rabb are good rebounders. They also both check every need for next season. Davis stands out because he is also an excellent shot blocker.

Bentil and Chriss are sub par rebounders. Sub par defenders. But they both already have 3 point range. Makes them interesting, but not good picks.

Ellenson is also a good rebounder - in the Davis and Rabb league. But he pretty much sucks are every other measurable stat. He may show glimpses of various skills, but he hasn't been able to put them all together - even as well as ANY of the other PF contenders - so why the love? Why should we consider him above any of the others at #9? Smokescreen???

Skal is not a good rebounder. He is the worst one on this list. Despite being the tallest player on the list. He had 2 games this season where he was automatic from mid-range, but even those didn't lift his shooting numbers to an average level. He and Ellenson are the bottom two players in most of the measurable categories. Skal does do one thing better than all the rest. Block shots. Slightly better even than Davis. Now, if Skal could defend like Davis and rebound like Davis, and shoot as well as Davis, then I'd say we should consider him in the same range as Davis. But he doesn't. So we shouldn't. Nobody should. Not even DX. Damn fools.

Ellenson is 19 yrs old
Skal is 20
Davis is 19
Rabb is 19
Chriss hasn't even turned 19
Sabonis just turned 20
Brice Johnson is 21.6.
Bentil just turned 21.

Taking age into consideration, I like Skal even less, Chris goes 20 picks ahead of Bentil (despite being very similar players) due to the age difference. Davis and Rabb are still tied. Sabonis gets a 15 pick edge on Brice Johnson due to the age difference.

The order these PFs get picked should be
Rabb
Davis
Sabonis
Chriss

Then maybe someone reaches for Ellenson and Skal before taking the 'can contribute now', 'higher floor' pick in Brice Johnson. Or perhaps not. Maybe Brice still goes before Ellenson and Skal.

And lastly, Bentil will go in the 2nd round.

SO yeah, it would be a damn shame if Brown and Rabb went back to school for another year. Rabb looks like our pick, but if all the guys behind him move forward 2 spots due to Brown/Rabb dropping out, we might wind up with Sabonis at #9. Still very good for Bargs, but disappointing nonetheless.

Rabb, Davis, or maybe Luwawu would make me happy. Anything else at #9 will disappoint.

Trade up for Murray? Trade down with Denver for #15 and #19?

Yep. Rabb, Davis and Luwawu are my three choices. Or whoever falls. But if Brown and Rabb go back to college, for no good reason I can think of, we're kind of screwed. Someone will reply that they may go higher next year, but I can't see the logic in risking a possible injury when your chosen career is right in front of you. These guys are both lotto picky. Like Wtf?

[artsncrafts]

Why would Rabb and Brown go back to college?

Rookie Salary:
9 $2,177,100 $2,275,000 $2,373,000 27.4% 35.5%
10 $2,068,100 $2,161,200 $2,254,200 27.5% 36.2%

......i guess basketball players aren't known to be smart.

[CoachJReturns]

Why would Rabb and Brown go back to college?

Rookie Salary:
9 $2,177,100 $2,275,000 $2,373,000 27.4% 35.5%
10 $2,068,100 $2,161,200 $2,254,200 27.5% 36.2%

......i guess basketball players aren't known to be smart.

I think Rabb is actually supposed to be a pretty bright guy and good student from what I recall reading of him. So even more of a head scratcher. Maybe they just want to be kids for another year and go to school? Still seems an unnece8huge risk to take.

The mote I think of it, the more I'm locked in to Davis at our pick if these two go back to college. Luwawu would be fine too, but Davis is slightly more appealing due to our weakness at PF. If he can shoot as well as some people have said, while having the quickness to defend the pick and roll, he's a great fit beside JV the bruiser. I'm sort of preparing myself for the worst in this playoff series, so if DeMar and Lowry are gone JV may become the man for a time. Gotta find someone who at least makes it easier.

[0 - 100]

If the Raps lay an egg in the playoffs again, I expect Masai to move up and grab Murray. Trade Lowry for pieces next year.

If Lowry is to be dealt, Demar should not be re-signed. That means Powell takes the starting spot. He can defend whoever is the best guard, which helps if Murray is picked as he is not a great defender.

I still expect Demar to be re-signed though. Masai won't give up an asset like that for nothing. Just re-sign Demar and trade him within the year for pieces.

[free]

What does Casey and Masai want out of a PF instantly if they are going to give them minutes next season?

They have to have good D. They have to rebound well, or even great if Bebe is going to be the backup C. They have to be efficient at the rim. They don't have to have 3pt range (assuming we have Powell and Ross as the SG/SF backups).

Lets take a look at the PF options:

14.8 TRB, .357 3pt%, .611 FG%, .618 eFG%, 22.0 Pts, 2.2 Ast, 0.8 Stl, 1.1 Blk, .654 TS%, 29.3 PER, ORtg 124.6, DRtg 91.2, BPM 9.0. Sabonis

14.8 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .614 FG%, .614 eFG%, 24.2 Pts, 2.1 Ast, 1.5 Stl, 2.1 Blk, .649 TS%, 33.0 PER, ORtg 130.2, DRtg 92.3, BPM 13.4. B Johnson

11.8 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .598 FG%, .598 eFG%, 16.1 Pts, 1.6 Ast, 0.6 Stl, 3.9 Blk, .601 TS%, 23.9 PER, ORtg 121.4, DRtg 90.9, BPM 10.8. D Davis

11.9 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .615 FG%, .616 eFG%, 17.5 Pts, 1.3 Ast, 0.7 Stl, 1.7 Blk, .636 TS%, 24.2 PER, ORtg 124.8, DRtg 95.3, BPM 8.7. Ivan Rabb

8.6 TRB, .350 3pt%, .530 FG%, .561 eFG%, 22.1 Pts, 1.2 Ast, 1.5 Stl, 2.2 Blk, .585 TS%, 21.7 PER, ORtg 112.0, DRtg 102.2, BPM 5.9. Chriss

8.9 TRB, .329 3pt%, .462 FG%, .510 eFG%, 25.4 Pts, 1.3 Ast, 1.0 Stl, 1.2 Blk, .567 TS%, 24.7 PER, ORtg 115.6, DRtg 99.8, BPM 6.7. Ben Bentil

11.6 TRB, .288 3pt%, .446 FG%, .480 eFG%, 20.3 Pts, 2.1 Ast, 1.0 Stl, 1.8 Blk, .534 TS%, 20.9 PER, ORtg 106.3, DRtg 98.5, BPM 3.6. Ellenson

8.0 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .516 FG%, .516 eFG%, 16.7 Pts, 0.8 Ast, 0.6 Stl, 4.2 Blk, .540 TS%, 18.5 PER, ORtg 107.8, DRtg 96.9, BPM 5.2. Skal Labissiere

*Pts, Ast, Stl, Blk, and TRB are per 40.

Sabonis and Johnson are outstanding rebounders. They both also check every need for next season.

Davis and Rabb are good rebounders. They also both check every need for next season. Davis stands out because he is also an excellent shot blocker.

Bentil and Chriss are sub par rebounders. Sub par defenders. But they both already have 3 point range. Makes them interesting, but not good picks.

Ellenson is also a good rebounder - in the Davis and Rabb league. But he pretty much sucks are every other measurable stat. He may show glimpses of various skills, but he hasn't been able to put them all together - even as well as ANY of the other PF contenders - so why the love? Why should we consider him above any of the others at #9? Smokescreen???

Skal is not a good rebounder. He is the worst one on this list. Despite being the tallest player on the list. He had 2 games this season where he was automatic from mid-range, but even those didn't lift his shooting numbers to an average level. He and Ellenson are the bottom two players in most of the measurable categories. Skal does do one thing better than all the rest. Block shots. Slightly better even than Davis. Now, if Skal could defend like Davis and rebound like Davis, and shoot as well as Davis, then I'd say we should consider him in the same range as Davis. But he doesn't. So we shouldn't. Nobody should. Not even DX. Damn fools.

Ellenson is 19 yrs old
Skal is 20
Davis is 19
Rabb is 19
Chriss hasn't even turned 19
Sabonis just turned 20
Brice Johnson is 21.6.
Bentil just turned 21.

Taking age into consideration, I like Skal even less, Chris goes 20 picks ahead of Bentil (despite being very similar players) due to the age difference. Davis and Rabb are still tied. Sabonis gets a 15 pick edge on Brice Johnson due to the age difference.

The order these PFs get picked should be
Rabb
Davis
Sabonis
Chriss

Then maybe someone reaches for Ellenson and Skal before taking the 'can contribute now', 'higher floor' pick in Brice Johnson. Or perhaps not. Maybe Brice still goes before Ellenson and Skal.

And lastly, Bentil will go in the 2nd round.

SO yeah, it would be a damn shame if Brown and Rabb went back to school for another year. Rabb looks like our pick, but if all the guys behind him move forward 2 spots due to Brown/Rabb dropping out, we might wind up with Sabonis at #9. Still very good for Bargs, but disappointing nonetheless.

Rabb, Davis, or maybe Luwawu would make me happy. Anything else at #9 will disappoint.

Trade up for Murray? Trade down with Denver for #15 and #19?

Yep. Rabb, Davis and Luwawu are my three choices. Or whoever falls. But if Brown and Rabb go back to college, for no good reason I can think of, we're kind of screwed. Someone will reply that they may go higher next year, but I can't see the logic in risking a possible injury when your chosen career is right in front of you. These guys are both lotto picky. Like Wtf?

Sabonis is that rebounding and offence style big, without a great jumper at this stage. Not really a rim protector or great defender I don't think. I really don't want him.

I don't like Murray really either, all offence without defence or passing (at this stage).

Hoping we can maybe snap up Brice with #27. Luwawu or Dunn if he falls at #9.

Or Davis/Rabb at #9 and stash someone with the 27.

[CunningLinguist]

What does Casey and Masai want out of a PF instantly if they are going to give them minutes next season?

They have to have good D. They have to rebound well, or even great if Bebe is going to be the backup C. They have to be efficient at the rim. They don't have to have 3pt range (assuming we have Powell and Ross as the SG/SF backups).

Lets take a look at the PF options:

14.8 TRB, .357 3pt%, .611 FG%, .618 eFG%, 22.0 Pts, 2.2 Ast, 0.8 Stl, 1.1 Blk, .654 TS%, 29.3 PER, ORtg 124.6, DRtg 91.2, BPM 9.0. Sabonis

14.8 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .614 FG%, .614 eFG%, 24.2 Pts, 2.1 Ast, 1.5 Stl, 2.1 Blk, .649 TS%, 33.0 PER, ORtg 130.2, DRtg 92.3, BPM 13.4. B Johnson

11.8 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .598 FG%, .598 eFG%, 16.1 Pts, 1.6 Ast, 0.6 Stl, 3.9 Blk, .601 TS%, 23.9 PER, ORtg 121.4, DRtg 90.9, BPM 10.8. D Davis

11.9 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .615 FG%, .616 eFG%, 17.5 Pts, 1.3 Ast, 0.7 Stl, 1.7 Blk, .636 TS%, 24.2 PER, ORtg 124.8, DRtg 95.3, BPM 8.7. Ivan Rabb

8.6 TRB, .350 3pt%, .530 FG%, .561 eFG%, 22.1 Pts, 1.2 Ast, 1.5 Stl, 2.2 Blk, .585 TS%, 21.7 PER, ORtg 112.0, DRtg 102.2, BPM 5.9. Chriss

8.9 TRB, .329 3pt%, .462 FG%, .510 eFG%, 25.4 Pts, 1.3 Ast, 1.0 Stl, 1.2 Blk, .567 TS%, 24.7 PER, ORtg 115.6, DRtg 99.8, BPM 6.7. Ben Bentil

11.6 TRB, .288 3pt%, .446 FG%, .480 eFG%, 20.3 Pts, 2.1 Ast, 1.0 Stl, 1.8 Blk, .534 TS%, 20.9 PER, ORtg 106.3, DRtg 98.5, BPM 3.6. Ellenson

8.0 TRB, N/A 3pt%, .516 FG%, .516 eFG%, 16.7 Pts, 0.8 Ast, 0.6 Stl, 4.2 Blk, .540 TS%, 18.5 PER, ORtg 107.8, DRtg 96.9, BPM 5.2. Skal Labissiere

*Pts, Ast, Stl, Blk, and TRB are per 40.

Sabonis and Johnson are outstanding rebounders. They both also check every need for next season.

Davis and Rabb are good rebounders. They also both check every need for next season. Davis stands out because he is also an excellent shot blocker.

Bentil and Chriss are sub par rebounders. Sub par defenders. But they both already have 3 point range. Makes them interesting, but not good picks.

Ellenson is also a good rebounder - in the Davis and Rabb league. But he pretty much sucks are every other measurable stat. He may show glimpses of various skills, but he hasn't been able to put them all together - even as well as ANY of the other PF contenders - so why the love? Why should we consider him above any of the others at #9? Smokescreen???

Skal is not a good rebounder. He is the worst one on this list. Despite being the tallest player on the list. He had 2 games this season where he was automatic from mid-range, but even those didn't lift his shooting numbers to an average level. He and Ellenson are the bottom two players in most of the measurable categories. Skal does do one thing better than all the rest. Block shots. Slightly better even than Davis. Now, if Skal could defend like Davis and rebound like Davis, and shoot as well as Davis, then I'd say we should consider him in the same range as Davis. But he doesn't. So we shouldn't. Nobody should. Not even DX. Damn fools.

Ellenson is 19 yrs old
Skal is 20
Davis is 19
Rabb is 19
Chriss hasn't even turned 19
Sabonis just turned 20
Brice Johnson is 21.6.
Bentil just turned 21.

Taking age into consideration, I like Skal even less, Chris goes 20 picks ahead of Bentil (despite being very similar players) due to the age difference. Davis and Rabb are still tied. Sabonis gets a 15 pick edge on Brice Johnson due to the age difference.

The order these PFs get picked should be
Rabb
Davis
Sabonis
Chriss

Then maybe someone reaches for Ellenson and Skal before taking the 'can contribute now', 'higher floor' pick in Brice Johnson. Or perhaps not. Maybe Brice still goes before Ellenson and Skal.

And lastly, Bentil will go in the 2nd round.

SO yeah, it would be a damn shame if Brown and Rabb went back to school for another year. Rabb looks like our pick, but if all the guys behind him move forward 2 spots due to Brown/Rabb dropping out, we might wind up with Sabonis at #9. Still very good for Bargs, but disappointing nonetheless.

Rabb, Davis, or maybe Luwawu would make me happy. Anything else at #9 will disappoint.

Trade up for Murray? Trade down with Denver for #15 and #19?

Why is the draft about next season? I think it's the wrong approach to draft someone just based on who's ready to contribute right away. Guys like Skal and Chriss have good defensive potential, they're just relatively inexperienced.

[deeps6x]

It isn't about 'next season' for the PG/C/SG/SF positions on the team because we have players in the pipeline to fill future voids.

But at PF, we have 2Pat for one season and nobody to take his place. Some project Bruno there, but that is at least 2 years away, probably 3 consider how much he still needs to learn and how much body mass he would need to add.

We need a couple PFs added NOW so that at least one can be our starter in a year (assuming we can't resign 2Pat - and realistically we won't want to when cap space peaks and everyone is bidding for him next summer).


However, even if we can't find a 'ready to start in a year' PF in this draft, at least the glut of PFs available (10 will go in the first round!) will shake loose some other more developed PFs that might not have reached their potential - and they will be available on the cheap. This is what happened in Charlotte, when they drafted Kaminsky and let Biyombo go to make room for him. The same thing will happen to 10 other PFs this summer as the drafting teams try to make room for them.

PF will become the most saturated position in the league, ahead of PGs a year from now. So at least we won't have to pay through the nose for one. Who knows, maybe we can even find the cash to retain 2Pat. But I doubt it. He will be looking to get paid. His big contract for his prime years. If we are giving DD and Kyle $50M/yr, we just won't be able to afford him. And everyone will have a new batch of cap space next summer as well. SO I'll wish 2Pat well, and hope the PFs we added this summer are ready to go.

That is why Masai will NOT consider Skal or Thon. They are too far behind at least 6 other first round PFs. 7 if Rabb stays in the draft.

[BoyzNTheHood]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/722120876032946177[/tweet]

[EJaggit]

Rumours of DeMar leaving?! Come on DD, let us S&T you for that Lakers pick....

#DEMARGOTUS

no need for s&t when you have cap space

Would we have enough to sign a significant player though?

[Dalek]

I feel like many people here are picking based on need when we should only look look at BPA and upside. In some ways you could look at our like a Least Holes Approach. A guy like Timothe Luwawu or Demetrius Jackson are guys that will do well in the NBA and have long careers because they can shoot, are athletic and can likely defend their position. So what if it duplicates what we have already?

When you get into the PF draft market there are so many question marks about size, skill, and fit into the modern NBA. The guys that can shoot leave a huge hole on defense. Do you really want a guy like Ryan Anderson? (Ellenson) Or do you want a defender at PF that can't shoot or create in the post? (Davis). Other guys are huge projects that are undersized (Chriss, Rabb, Bentil) or have some mental make-up issues (Skal).

The other option is of course to draft and stash. Korkmaz is a great option for that, but you have to establish that these players are willing to wait for the NBA.

At this stage I would take Luwawu in a heartbeat.