Official Covid-19 Discussion Thread

[Fairview4Life]

The 30th of January, the WHO declares a global health emergency and a day later Trump suspends travel from China. This is well before it was listed as a pandemic and way before Canada or ANY OTHER COUNTRY IN THE WORLD did the same sort of measure.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travel_restrictions_related_to_the_COVID-19_pandemic

There's a listing of when countries instituted travel bans. The US was the first. Siginifcantly ahead of the rest of the world.

Fact checking as an industry is fairly dumb, but this is a handy run down of the actual restrictions put in place: https://www.factcheck.org/2020/03/the-facts-on-trumps-travel-restrictions/
https://www.cato.org/blog/timeline-list-us-immigration-actions-covid-19

So yeah that's not actually true. The United States didn't suspend travel from China on January 31st. They also never instituted a "travel ban" from China. On Jan 31st, the US announced that effective on Feb. 2nd, "all non citizens who were in China in the last 14 days, except for LPRs, spouses of LPRs or U.S. citizens, unmarried children under 21, siblings under 21 of U.S. citizens or LPRs under 21, child of U.S. citizens or LPRs, crewmembers, government officials, or those exempted by the Secretary of State or DHS." were going to be denied entry. And everyone who was able to travel to the US from China had to self quarantine for 14 days. Then on Feb 1 they announced they would stop processing visas in China from Feb 3rd until Feb 7th. Then on Feb 10th they announced suspension of regular visa processing in Chengdu, Guangzhou, Shanghai and Shenyang. That's it. Those are the restrictions for travel from China. There's also an obvious exception for shipping and transport of goods because that could never be shutdown. And then there has been a lot of hindsight and studies showing that those restrictions didn't actually do much, or were inconclusive, when it comes to preventing infection transmission in the US because of the hundreds of thousands of travelers that came before the restrictions were put in place, and that places like NY were seeded by travelers from Europe not China. Repeating Trump's lie about his foresight and banning travel from China doesn't make it a fact, and it also ignores how effective it was.

All of that aside, just in general trying to pretend that Trump has responded quickly or well to covid is insane on it's face. We've all been alive for the last 5 months. No amount of goal post shifting or hand waving is going to change that.

[Bomboclot416]

The 30th of January, the WHO declares a global health emergency and a day later Trump suspends travel from China. This is well before it was listed as a pandemic and way before Canada or ANY OTHER COUNTRY IN THE WORLD did the same sort of measure.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travel_restrictions_related_to_the_COVID-19_pandemic

There's a listing of when countries instituted travel bans. The US was the first. Siginifcantly ahead of the rest of the world.

Fact checking as an industry is fairly dumb, but this is a handy run down of the actual restrictions put in place: https://www.factcheck.org/2020/03/the-facts-on-trumps-travel-restrictions/
https://www.cato.org/blog/timeline-list-us-immigration-actions-covid-19

So yeah that's not actually true. The United States didn't suspend travel from China on January 31st. They also never instituted a "travel ban" from China. On Jan 31st, the US announced that effective on Feb. 2nd, "all non citizens who were in China in the last 14 days, except for LPRs, spouses of LPRs or U.S. citizens, unmarried children under 21, siblings under 21 of U.S. citizens or LPRs under 21, child of U.S. citizens or LPRs, crewmembers, government officials, or those exempted by the Secretary of State or DHS." were going to be denied entry. And everyone who was able to travel to the US from China had to self quarantine for 14 days. Then on Feb 1 they announced they would stop processing visas in China from Feb 3rd until Feb 7th. Then on Feb 10th they announced suspension of regular visa processing in Chengdu, Guangzhou, Shanghai and Shenyang. That's it. Those are the restrictions for travel from China. There's also an obvious exception for shipping and transport of goods because that could never be shutdown. And then there has been a lot of hindsight and studies showing that those restrictions didn't actually do much, or were inconclusive, when it comes to preventing infection transmission in the US because of the hundreds of thousands of travelers that came before the restrictions were put in place, and that places like NY were seeded by travelers from Europe not China. Repeating Trump's lie about his foresight and banning travel from China doesn't make it a fact, and it also ignores how effective it was.

All of that aside, just in general trying to pretend that Trump has responded quickly or well to covid is insane on it's face. We've all been alive for the last 5 months. No amount of goal post shifting or hand waving is going to change that.

He declared the ban on the 31st went into effect the 2nd.....way ahead of everyone else. And now the thought is it didn't help? Come on give me a break. I don't proclaim the guy saved the world. In fact I couldn't care less about him and am more focused o the narrative the media has been portraying of this being the end all be all and their hypocracy. The story keeps changing, yet the focus is on how the guy isn't doing his job. All lies. Whether it was the 31st or the 2nd. Prove me wrong.

[Bomboclot416]

Also focusing on the word travel ban is just a terrible way of trying to win an argument. What else do you call not allowing people in from a specific place. Call it what you want. Don't care. But it's a fact you sited.

It wasn't a travel ban they just didn't let in people from China that weren't US citizens....come on gimme a break

[beanbag]

Also focusing on the word travel ban is just a terrible way of trying to win an argument. What else do you call not allowing people in from a specific place. Call it what you want. Don't care. But it's a fact you sited.

It wasn't a travel ban they just didn't let in people from China that weren't US citizens....come on gimme a break

Here are some things I've found weird when it comes to Trump and his desire to save lives.

Travel ban aside, he has basically told Governers to do what they want as far as restrictions, stated he wants testing to drop in an effort to juke the stats, and won't even commit to imploring people to wear masks. Why would he do those things if he cared about saving lives?

Also, I'm still curious to know where you go for information.

Thanks again in advance!

[Fairview4Life]

He declared the ban on the 31st went into effect the 2nd.....way ahead of everyone else. And now the thought is it didn't help? Come on give me a break. I don't proclaim the guy saved the world. In fact I couldn't care less about him and am more focused o the narrative the media has been portraying of this being the end all be all and their hypocracy. The story keeps changing, yet the focus is on how the guy isn't doing his job. All lies. Whether it was the 31st or the 2nd. Prove me wrong.

I "proved you wrong" by posting the actual restrictions that were put in place. You know that 10's of thousands of people still returned from China to the US after the "ban" was put in place, right? And they weren't actually screened at all, or followed up with to make sure they were quarantining? So tedious.

[dohboy_24]

Also focusing on the word travel ban is just a terrible way of trying to win an argument. What else do you call not allowing people in from a specific place. Call it what you want. Don't care. But it's a fact you sited.

It wasn't a travel ban they just didn't let in people from China that weren't US citizens....come on gimme a break

While fact checking might be considered dumb by some, a thesaurus can swiftly unravel ones feeble-minded attempts at wordplay and hand-waving...

Fact checking as an industry is fairly dumb, but this is a handy run down of the actual restrictions put in place:
https://www.factcheck.org/2020/03/the-facts-on-trumps-travel-restrictions/
https://www.cato.org/blog/timeline-list-us-immigration-actions-covid-19

So yeah that's not actually true. The United States didn't suspend travel from China on January 31st. They also never instituted a "travel ban" from China. On Jan 31st, the US announced that effective on Feb. 2nd, "all non citizens who were in China in the last 14 days, except for LPRs, spouses of LPRs or U.S. citizens, unmarried children under 21, siblings under 21 of U.S. citizens or LPRs under 21, child of U.S. citizens or LPRs, crewmembers, government officials, or those exempted by the Secretary of State or DHS." were going to be denied entry. And everyone who was able to travel to the US from China had to self quarantine for 14 days. Then on Feb 1 they announced they would stop processing visas in China from Feb 3rd until Feb 7th. Then on Feb 10th they announced suspension of regular visa processing in Chengdu, Guangzhou, Shanghai and Shenyang. That's it. Those are the restrictions for travel from China. There's also an obvious exception for shipping and transport of goods because that could never be shutdown. And then there has been a lot of hindsight and studies showing that those restrictions didn't actually do much, or were inconclusive, when it comes to preventing infection transmission in the US because of the hundreds of thousands of travelers that came before the restrictions were put in place, and that places like NY were seeded by travelers from Europe not China. Repeating Trump's lie about his foresight and banning travel from China doesn't make it a fact, and it also ignores how effective it was.

[beanbag]

Also focusing on the word travel ban is just a terrible way of trying to win an argument. What else do you call not allowing people in from a specific place. Call it what you want. Don't care. But it's a fact you sited.

It wasn't a travel ban they just didn't let in people from China that weren't US citizens....come on gimme a break

While fact checking might be considered dumb by some, a thesaurus can swiftly unravel ones feeble-minded attempts at wordplay and hand-waving...

Fact checking as an industry is fairly dumb, but this is a handy run down of the actual restrictions put in place:
https://www.factcheck.org/2020/03/the-facts-on-trumps-travel-restrictions/
https://www.cato.org/blog/timeline-list-us-immigration-actions-covid-19

So yeah that's not actually true. The United States didn't suspend travel from China on January 31st. They also never instituted a "travel ban" from China. On Jan 31st, the US announced that effective on Feb. 2nd, "all non citizens who were in China in the last 14 days, except for LPRs, spouses of LPRs or U.S. citizens, unmarried children under 21, siblings under 21 of U.S. citizens or LPRs under 21, child of U.S. citizens or LPRs, crewmembers, government officials, or those exempted by the Secretary of State or DHS." were going to be denied entry. And everyone who was able to travel to the US from China had to self quarantine for 14 days. Then on Feb 1 they announced they would stop processing visas in China from Feb 3rd until Feb 7th. Then on Feb 10th they announced suspension of regular visa processing in Chengdu, Guangzhou, Shanghai and Shenyang. That's it. Those are the restrictions for travel from China. There's also an obvious exception for shipping and transport of goods because that could never be shutdown. And then there has been a lot of hindsight and studies showing that those restrictions didn't actually do much, or were inconclusive, when it comes to preventing infection transmission in the US because of the hundreds of thousands of travelers that came before the restrictions were put in place, and that places like NY were seeded by travelers from Europe not China. Repeating Trump's lie about his foresight and banning travel from China doesn't make it a fact, and it also ignores how effective it was.

You realize words have context behind them, right?

The fact a synonym of a word you wanted the original word to mean is used doesn't actually mean the same meaning can be discerned from it. Specifically, the word restriction can take on a number of varying degrees of meaning.

[Bomboclot416]

Also focusing on the word travel ban is just a terrible way of trying to win an argument. What else do you call not allowing people in from a specific place. Call it what you want. Don't care. But it's a fact you sited.

It wasn't a travel ban they just didn't let in people from China that weren't US citizens....come on gimme a break

Here are some things I've found weird when it comes to Trump and his desire to save lives.

Travel ban aside, he has basically told Governers to do what they want as far as restrictions, stated he wants testing to drop in an effort to juke the stats, and won't even commit to imploring people to wear masks. Why would he do those things if he cared about saving lives?

Also, I'm still curious to know where you go for information.

Thanks again in advance!

So this statement has a few things that are incorrect.

#1. Fauci today stated that there was never an intent to reduce the number of administered tests for covid. Actually if trump were looking to skew numbers he would allow for the most tests to happen because it would reduce the mortality rate drastically. More positive people but much less death.

2. Trudeau allowed for the same independent governance of the provinces. The United States operates on a state by state basis. The government is there for support. Each state makes it own decisions and we saw how well those decisions worked out in places like New York.

3. I agree mask wearing is important don’t agree with him on that although I think it’s just him “trying to be the man” which is stupid.

You realize that death and disease has a direct correlation to poverty correct? The longer people are without money, work the higher the death and destruction.

[Bomboclot416]

Also focusing on the word travel ban is just a terrible way of trying to win an argument. What else do you call not allowing people in from a specific place. Call it what you want. Don't care. But it's a fact you sited.

It wasn't a travel ban they just didn't let in people from China that weren't US citizens....come on gimme a break

While fact checking might be considered dumb by some, a thesaurus can swiftly unravel ones feeble-minded attempts at wordplay and hand-waving...

Fact checking as an industry is fairly dumb, but this is a handy run down of the actual restrictions put in place:
https://www.factcheck.org/2020/03/the-facts-on-trumps-travel-restrictions/
https://www.cato.org/blog/timeline-list-us-immigration-actions-covid-19

So yeah that's not actually true. The United States didn't suspend travel from China on January 31st. They also never instituted a "travel ban" from China. On Jan 31st, the US announced that effective on Feb. 2nd, "all non citizens who were in China in the last 14 days, except for LPRs, spouses of LPRs or U.S. citizens, unmarried children under 21, siblings under 21 of U.S. citizens or LPRs under 21, child of U.S. citizens or LPRs, crewmembers, government officials, or those exempted by the Secretary of State or DHS." were going to be denied entry. And everyone who was able to travel to the US from China had to self quarantine for 14 days. Then on Feb 1 they announced they would stop processing visas in China from Feb 3rd until Feb 7th. Then on Feb 10th they announced suspension of regular visa processing in Chengdu, Guangzhou, Shanghai and Shenyang. That's it. Those are the restrictions for travel from China. There's also an obvious exception for shipping and transport of goods because that could never be shutdown. And then there has been a lot of hindsight and studies showing that those restrictions didn't actually do much, or were inconclusive, when it comes to preventing infection transmission in the US because of the hundreds of thousands of travelers that came before the restrictions were put in place, and that places like NY were seeded by travelers from Europe not China. Repeating Trump's lie about his foresight and banning travel from China doesn't make it a fact, and it also ignores how effective it was.

You realize words have context behind them, right?

The fact a synonym of a word you wanted the original word to mean is used doesn't actually mean the same meaning can be discerned from it. Specifically, the word restriction can take on a number of varying degrees of meaning.

Ok. What’s your point? Fighting a word?

There was a ban/restriction.

With the exception of us citizens and special circumstances no other travel was permitted. No one else did this until much later including Canada. So do you think he didn’t do enough or he did too much? Or are you just arguing my grammar cause you have nothing else.

[beanbag]

Also focusing on the word travel ban is just a terrible way of trying to win an argument. What else do you call not allowing people in from a specific place. Call it what you want. Don't care. But it's a fact you sited.

It wasn't a travel ban they just didn't let in people from China that weren't US citizens....come on gimme a break

Here are some things I've found weird when it comes to Trump and his desire to save lives.

Travel ban aside, he has basically told Governers to do what they want as far as restrictions, stated he wants testing to drop in an effort to juke the stats, and won't even commit to imploring people to wear masks. Why would he do those things if he cared about saving lives?

Also, I'm still curious to know where you go for information.

Thanks again in advance!

So this statement has a few things that are incorrect.

#1. Fauci today stated that there was never an intent to reduce the number of administered tests for covid. Actually if trump were looking to skew numbers he would allow for the most tests to happen because it would reduce the mortality rate drastically. More positive people but much less death.

2. Trudeau allowed for the same independent governance of the provinces. The United States operates on a state by state basis. The government is there for support. Each state makes it own decisions and we saw how well those decisions worked out in places like New York.

3. I agree mask wearing is important don’t agree with him on that although I think it’s just him “trying to be the man” which is stupid.

You realize that death and disease has a direct correlation to poverty correct? The longer people are without money, work the higher the death and destruction.

Hi, thanks for the response.

1) I understand what Fauci said, I am talking about Trump's multiple statements on wanting to slow the testing down and making it clear he was not joking in this regard, despite what his handlers have said.

2) I don't like the job Justin Trudeau has done here whatsoever. I'm just not sure why you brought it up because I don't recall mentioning him. I am asking about the poor decision to leave things in the hands of the States (and in our case, provinces). Also, why single out New York? Although Govenor Cuomo is a horrendous individual, there are States much worse off at this moment. Florida for example.

3) Don't you think a leader "trying to be the man" at the expense of public health is an absolute abomination?

I completely agree with you in terms of death and disease having a direct correlation to poverty. That is why I am I Socialist.

Also, where do you typically go for your news coverage? Sorry, if I missed that in your reply.

Cheers.

[beanbag]

While fact checking might be considered dumb by some, a thesaurus can swiftly unravel ones feeble-minded attempts at wordplay and hand-waving...

You realize words have context behind them, right?

The fact a synonym of a word you wanted the original word to mean is used doesn't actually mean the same meaning can be discerned from it. Specifically, the word restriction can take on a number of varying degrees of meaning.

Ok. What’s your point? Fighting a word?

There was a ban/restriction.

With the exception of us citizens and special circumstances no other travel was permitted. No one else did this until much later including Canada. So do you think he didn’t do enough or he did too much? Or are you just arguing my grammar cause you have nothing else.

I was specifically speaking about equating the word restriction with ban. They do not necessarily mean the same thing.

I also wasn't arguing your grammar at all, I was responding to Dohboy24 responding to Fairview. My response actually had nothing to do with you.

[Fairview4Life]

The United States has horribly bungled it’s response to the outbreak. Pretending there was a travel ban and it was early and Trump therefore did something good belies the actual reality of what happened and what is currently happening. You can point to Cuomo forcing nursing homes to take infected patients, which was indeed a disastrous decision in NY. But playing shell games to deflect from the corrupt and incompetent federal response doesn’t change what actually happened and what is currently happening in that country. It’s just **** absurd when positive cases have trended back up to over 30k/day and that is being driven by insane southern states that didn’t use their lockdown time to actually put testing and tracing measures in place or get anything under control. Just the desire to open back up to please dear leader and solely focused on a corrupt narcissists myopic scrambling for good polling numbers. **** ridiculous gaslighting to try and pretend otherwise.

[Bomboclot416]

He declared the ban on the 31st went into effect the 2nd.....way ahead of everyone else. And now the thought is it didn't help? Come on give me a break. I don't proclaim the guy saved the world. In fact I couldn't care less about him and am more focused o the narrative the media has been portraying of this being the end all be all and their hypocracy. The story keeps changing, yet the focus is on how the guy isn't doing his job. All lies. Whether it was the 31st or the 2nd. Prove me wrong.

I "proved you wrong" by posting the actual restrictions that were put in place. You know that 10's of thousands of people still returned from China to the US after the "ban" was put in place, right? And they weren't actually screened at all, or followed up with to make sure they were quarantining? So tedious.

More of the disease came from Europe right? Well as I mentioned in my the timeline shows trump restricting travel from Europe as well. I think the date was around March 14.

Like I said, such a focus on assigning blame to the guy yet he was amongst the first in the world restricting travel from Europe and China.

He is far from perfect, and I don’t believe the whole narrative on the virus in the first place. I think the infected are much higher then is being shown we just don’t realize it. Instead of a global mortality of 9% of current cases the number is more inline with 1-2 %. Way more in line with numbers like the flu. Media just loves a story and pushing fear.

[Fairview4Life]

Yes I believe I have already mentioned that you are consistently wrong. It’s all the same bull ****. Trump did everything he could by enacting his bans before everyone else even after huge criticism from the left wing press and democrats! He’s a truth telling hero, you see. But it’s not an actual problem anyway and all the reports are lies to defeat him because marxists are out to destroy the country with political correctness!

Whatever can possibly be thrown at the wall to protect the cult leader is going up there. Gotta protect dear leader.

[Bomboclot416]

The United States has horribly bungled it’s response to the outbreak. Pretending there was a travel ban and it was early and Trump therefore did something good belies the actual reality of what happened and what is currently happening. You can point to Cuomo forcing nursing homes to take infected patients, which was indeed a disastrous decision in NY. But playing shell games to deflect from the corrupt and incompetent federal response doesn’t change what actually happened and what is currently happening in that country. It’s just **** absurd when positive cases have trended back up to over 30k/day and that is being driven by insane southern states that didn’t use their lockdown time to actually put testing and tracing measures in place or get anything under control. Just the desire to open back up to please dear leader and solely focused on a corrupt narcissists myopic scrambling for good polling numbers. **** ridiculous gaslighting to try and pretend otherwise.

I agree. They could have been much more prepared, numbers of cdc employees are significantly lower and this is something that will unfortunately only increase in the future with globalization.


When I was talking partisan lines earlier it’s obvious that both sides are trying to use this issue to tell a story which is only making it worse.

Sadly, although the virus is real the vast majority of people won’t have a negative impact from it. The problem is even if a small percentage does it means a lot of death. But to shutdown a country for months has enormous consequences which history has taught from the likes of the Great Depression. Death, disease and despair that took forever to turn.

I understand wanting to open up the country and I’m sure there are many motives (show a roaring economy, votes for election, but possibly saving people from losing homes, kids dying of poverty related disease and hunger).

There is a smarter way of doing things, but the basis of the us is to allow the states to mostly self govern so if that’s the way the country is made you need to support regardless of your feelings. Federally there was certainly more work to be done but the constant onslaught by cnn and the likes is ridiculous and makes me not want to even watch the news anymore because it’s not the facts it’s an opinion of a few.

[Fairview4Life]

I am truly sorry you feel that way, but I have been told that facts don’t actually care about your feelings.

[dohboy_24]

You realize words have context behind them, right?

The fact a synonym of a word you wanted the original word to mean is used doesn't actually mean the same meaning can be discerned from it. Specifically, the word restriction can take on a number of varying degrees of meaning.

You realize you're making the point for me, right?

The connotation of the word "ban" can just as well fluctuate with the same extent as that of the word "restriction" and considering the root of both words express sentiments that are very similar if not semantically exact in meaning, it's just as common for one to say "travel ban" as "travel restrictions" in the context of these discussions and a moot point to the facts being discussed.

[Bomboclot416]

Yes I believe I have already mentioned that you are consistently wrong. It’s all the same bull ****. Trump did everything he could by enacting his bans before everyone else even after huge criticism from the left wing press and democrats! He’s a truth telling hero, you see. But it’s not an actual problem anyway and all the reports are lies to defeat him because marxists are out to destroy the country with political correctness!

Whatever can possibly be thrown at the wall to protect the cult leader is going up there. Gotta protect dear leader.

You are entitled to an opinion just doesn’t mean it’s right. Think I’m wrong but prove it with fact.

You tell me I’m wrong for stating that travel bans were put in place. You argue a few days and some bs exceptions to discredit the work. You argue that the bans didn’t work yet are calling the states opening up idiots for not locking down longer and smarter? So hold up....restricting travel from countries with hot pockets of disease isn’t good and didn’t help but locking down in the country for 3 more months is good? You are a walking contradiction.

Don’t let your hate of trump cloud your thoughts. I couldn’t give a damn about trump. I just see from day one when he was elected if it wasn’t one attack on him it was another (womanizing, Russia, impeachment and god knows how many other things) that make it obvious to me that one side has an agenda. The guy has fought less wars than any president in recent history (past 30 years). That’s a huge start for me and has earned a certain degree of respect and trust in him.

Doesn’t mean he’s a pandemic expert, doesn’t mean he’s an angel, but it shows that not everything is bad yet some people refuse to see that and just want blood.

[Bomboclot416]

Here are some things I've found weird when it comes to Trump and his desire to save lives.

Travel ban aside, he has basically told Governers to do what they want as far as restrictions, stated he wants testing to drop in an effort to juke the stats, and won't even commit to imploring people to wear masks. Why would he do those things if he cared about saving lives?

Also, I'm still curious to know where you go for information.

Thanks again in advance!

So this statement has a few things that are incorrect.

#1. Fauci today stated that there was never an intent to reduce the number of administered tests for covid. Actually if trump were looking to skew numbers he would allow for the most tests to happen because it would reduce the mortality rate drastically. More positive people but much less death.

2. Trudeau allowed for the same independent governance of the provinces. The United States operates on a state by state basis. The government is there for support. Each state makes it own decisions and we saw how well those decisions worked out in places like New York.

3. I agree mask wearing is important don’t agree with him on that although I think it’s just him “trying to be the man” which is stupid.

You realize that death and disease has a direct correlation to poverty correct? The longer people are without money, work the higher the death and destruction.

Hi, thanks for the response.

1) I understand what Fauci said, I am talking about Trump's multiple statements on wanting to slow the testing down and making it clear he was not joking in this regard, despite what his handlers have said.

2) I don't like the job Justin Trudeau has done here whatsoever. I'm just not sure why you brought it up because I don't recall mentioning him. I am asking about the poor decision to leave things in the hands of the States (and in our case, provinces). Also, why single out New York? Although Govenor Cuomo is a horrendous individual, there are States much worse off at this moment. Florida for example.

3) Don't you think a leader "trying to be the man" at the expense of public health is an absolute abomination?

I completely agree with you in terms of death and disease having a direct correlation to poverty. That is why I am I Socialist.

Also, where do you typically go for your news coverage? Sorry, if I missed that in your reply.

Cheers.

The links I posted above were from worldometer, Wikipedia, CNBC and I was trying to find an article today cnn made about numbers being much higher but it’s been taken down.

I mention Trudeau to show an appropriate comparison. The world is saying what a mess the United States is yet they took action much quicker then Canada yet Trudeau has been applauded for his handling. I think that’s a direct influence of media driving public sentiment.

I agree it’s ridiculous to posture and try and be the man especially when by just putting on a mask you can set a good example and hope people follow suit.

I never heard trump say he wanted to slow testing down. (Doesn’t mean he didn’t say it or I don’t believe you, but I know what fauci said in regards to the intentions of the president and it’s well known there was no love lost between the two so why lie and try and cover for the president)

[dohboy_24]

The United States has horribly bungled it’s response to the outbreak. Pretending there was a travel ban and it was early and Trump therefore did something good belies the actual reality of what happened and what is currently happening. **** ridiculous gaslighting to try and pretend otherwise.

How is it the opposing viewpoint to yours can always be so easily summed up as "pretending otherwise" or "ridiculous gaslighting" without evidence or facts to support your statements.

Case in point:

positive cases have trended back up to over 30k/day and that is being driven by insane southern states that didn’t use their lockdown time to actually put testing and tracing measures in place or get anything under control

Can you provide evidence and/or proof of the statement that positive cases have trended back up to over 30k/day as a result of the measures, or lack of measures being taken by the southern states?

Just the desire to open back up to please dear leader and solely focused on a corrupt narcissists myopic scrambling for good polling numbers.

Can you provide evidence and/or proof of your statement that the southern states desire to open back up was/is being driven by a myopic desire to please a corrupt and narcissistic leader focused entirely on re-election polling numbers?